64 replies to this topic

[dalsingh101]

Found this interview of a cool keshdhari producer/rapper then found out he was gay.




Just wondering what the score is with this? I know if someone like that appeared in my family they'd tell him to cut his hair straightaway if he was a poof.

You know what, I was thinking that now we have spread out in the more 'open' diaspora, we will have to deal with things that are usually kept undercover back home, like gayness, lesbianism, non Panjabi speaking 3rd generation Sikhs etc. This is really going to change the shape of the panth.

Edited by dalsingh101, 08 February 2011 - 03:09 PM.

[HSD1]

To be honest, what's the big deal with homosexuality? If people are born that way then who the hell are we to judge? Sikhs are so willing to tolerate all kinds of bad actions of non-sikhs and even from so called respected elders in our own community but when it comes to gays/lesbians it causes sikhs to get all upset and annoyed. Is it because homosexuals dont stand up to us and outwit us like those other groups I mentioned do? Homophobia is itself more prominent in anglo/abrahamic societies than many others. Some of us like to go on about 'victorian' values that have wormed their way into sikhi but only seem to apply that logic to things they personally disagree with.

As for Sikh Knowledge, the guy makes some great songs with Humble the Poet. The lyrics of Baagi Music and Singh With Me reflect a style of thinking that is way beyond anything expressed by our supposedly wiser older generation. Dont let homosexuality cloud your views of a person. If some sikhs talked about others actions due to their colour/caste/religion then many other sikhs would jump on them even though there may be truth in what they say. Why is sexuality an issue?

[dalsingh101]

I'm not being judgmental like that. I have nothing against poofters. Once when I was working in some racist company the only bloke that wasn't being an jackass was a gay man. I have no problems with them and think they can't help what they are generally (unless they where brought up in those famous posh boarding schools and were turned or groomed into being batty boys by older 'prefects', or so I have heard).

I was just wondering from a theological perspective? You know, being a Khalsa and gay.

I say this in a wider context of a lot of issues that aren't directly covered by the dharam, other examples being abortion. I mean I wonder what our Gurus would of made of them? Maybe they would have been really anti?


That's the thing with Islam, it covers a lot of stuff so they don't have to think about and make difficult decisions on certain matters.

As far as Islam is concerned you can't officially be a sullah and a poof. They are mutually exclusive. Even though a lot of those Arabs and those mountain wallay on the Pak/Afghan border dig that vibe apparently.

My point was if the pagh/dhara and being openly gay was an acceptable combo?

By the way, I'm sure plenty of 'uncle jis' were gay too, they just kept it undercover. Funny how we will be dealing with all this stuff in future and how it has been suppressed for so long.

Edited by dalsingh101, 08 February 2011 - 12:32 PM.

[HSD1]

I wasnt talking about you personally Dal, just the older community in general.

Quote

Once when I was working in some racist company the only bloke that wasn't being an jackass was a gay man.

Exactly. Sexuality doesnt come into judging how a person is on a moralistic level.

Quote

I have no problems with them and think they can't help what they are generally (unless they where brought up in those famous posh boarding schools and were turned or groomed into being batty boys by older 'prefects', or so I have heard).

Werent you a teacher once......?

Quote

I was just wondering from a theological perspective? You know, being a Khalsa and gay.

I say this in a wider context of a lot of issues that aren't directly covered by the dharam, other examples being abortion. I mean I wonder what our Gurus would of made of them? Maybe they would have been really anti?

I think these werent covered as they probably change with the politics of the time. Look at the west, turning its back on the parts of christism that didnt fit in with society gave them a bit more cohesion. Unfortunately for whitey, their search for hedonism has overtaken any kind of morality searching. Islam itself only compounded the collapse of middle eastern civilization in the middle ages, and thanks to islam the region has never recovered. Sikhs need to realise that these things werent covered for a reason.

Quote

By the way, I'm sure plenty of 'uncle jis' were gay too, they just kept it undercover. Funny how we will be dealing with all this stuff in future and how it has been suppressed for so long.

Sikhi's emphasis on the family life probably had something to do with this.

[dalsingh101]

Quote

Islam itself only compounded the collapse of middle eastern civilization in the middle ages, and thanks to islam the region has never recovered.

I know it's a tangent but if we are straight up sachiar (truthful) then we have to acknowledge sullay weren't always junglee pussoos as their culture seems characterised now. They had fine art (albeit using no images but calligraphy type stuff and patterns), weaponry, architecture, maths knowledge, astrology, libraries etc.

If Iraq (the then centre of Islamic civilisation) wasn't ass raped by the Mongols, maybe they would've been more advanced than now and not have lost their older preIslamic knowledge?

Maybe this is a subject for a separate thread?



In any case that rapper represents what we will have to deal with in future. We may as well face it.

Ha ha! You new gen mofos will have to deal with all this! lol @ u! Plus being Sikh and not knowing Panjabi....haha!

Edited by dalsingh101, 08 February 2011 - 12:50 PM.

[HSD1]

Quote

I know it's a tangent but if we are straight up sachiar (truthful) then we have to acknowledge sullay weren't always junglee pussoos as their culture seems characterised now. They had fine art (albeit using no images but calligraphy type stuff and patterns), weaponry, architecture, maths knowledge, astrology, libraries etc.

If Iraq (the then centre of Islamic civilisation) wasn't ass raped by the Mongols, maybe they would've been more advanced than now and not have lost their older preIslamic knowledge?

Maybe this is a subject for a separate thread?

This may have started the decline but we all know that when the euros got on their ships and started sailing around africa/america they would have no need to send trade through the middle east. As a result of lack of trade the region had nowhere near as much money to lavish on armies, research, arts and infrastructure. Hell, they didnt even have the money to maintain what they already had. We are seeing something similar in Europe today.

Quote

In any case that rapper represents what we will have to deal with in future. We may as well face it.

Deal with? lol, whats the issue? I think bigotted oldies are something that we youthful spirits will have to overcome.

Quote

Ha ha! You new gen mofos will have to deal with all this!

We'll do a damn sight better than your lot did.

Quote

lol @ u! Plus being Sikh and not knowing Panjabi....haha!

Lol all i have to do is concentrate on the reading and writing. You on the other hand have lost your youth. Now stop being so jealous and judgemental, this whole midlife crisis your having will pass one day. Just stick it out old man.

Edited by HSD 2, 08 February 2011 - 12:59 PM.

[kdsingh80]

Quote

To be honest, what's the big deal with homosexuality? If people are born that way then who the hell are we to judge?

This is the biggest question? There were/are lesbian Feminists Who openly asked women that for complete liberation they need to adopt Lesbianism and being a Lesbian is a choice.similarly there are cases of Jail inmates adopting Homosexuality because of Sexual starvation,now the question is do we need that this Sikhs will adopt this type of culture?

[chatanga1]

dalsingh101, on 08 February 2011 - 11:28 AM, said:

I know if someone like that appeared in my family they'd tell him to cut his hair straightaway if HE was a poof.

homsexuality has been around almost the same time as heterosexuality. for me it aint a problem, as my work colleagurs have asked many times, if sikhi tolerates gays.

Dal Singh Ji, why would your family insist on the guy cutting his hair straightaway? wouldnt they go down the "lets take him to a baba to get the bhoot out of him" route first?

And the way you have put "he" into "HE" looks like you trying to hide something.

Edited by chatanga1, 08 February 2011 - 01:53 PM.

[dalsingh101]

Quote

And the way you have put "he" into "HE" looks like you trying to hide something.

lol!! If I was a poof, I'd straight say it. I wouldn't be scared myself. I'm not trying to hide anything okay!! Before the rumour mill starts! That was a grammatical typo.

Now I think about it, I sort of respect that brother for coming out with it instead of hiding it. Canada seems really mellow. I don't think he could have got away with it here in the Ju Kay? But then it cuts both ways, like that mona comedian guy with the "Pag it!" joke in his video. A few years ago in the UK someone would have tracked him down and probably roughed him up for that.

Maybe it's a good thing that we can laugh at ourselves? Jews have been doing it for donkeys years with Mel Brooks etc. Even that Ali G bundha does it. Those Canucks seem to be at much more ease with themselves than JU Kay wallay. But then we are in the very belly of the beast itself so no surprise.

Quote

homsexuality has been around almost the same time as heterosexuality. for me it aint a problem, as my work colleagurs have asked many times, if sikhi tolerates gays.

I agree but we have to acknowledge that the Akal Takhat has already put out an anti gay thing about them getting married a few years back. Don't you lot remember? Maybe not, as you were in your nappies then? lol

Quote

Dal Singh Ji, why would your family insist on the guy cutting his hair straightaway? wouldnt they go down the "lets take him to a baba to get the bhoot out of him" route first?

I think they tried this route for other problems many many years ago and err...don't believe in its 'efficacy' anymore...lol

Edited by dalsingh101, 08 February 2011 - 02:27 PM.

[dalsingh101]

Quote

Lol all i have to do is concentrate on the reading and writing. You on the other hand have lost your youth. Now stop being so jealous and judgemental, this whole midlife crisis your having will pass one day. Just stick it out old man.

Yeh, but I had the benefit of immersion in the middle of real life first gen Panjabs and the language and culture in its raw form, warts and all. So - ha! For all the things f**ked up about them,some of those oldies were hilarious (the blokes anyway) in many ways. Especially their attempts at being cool and speaking English and the drunken pendu brawls. lol

Plus, I'm older and wiser now. Like a fine wine, matured just right. Special reserve, if you know what I mean. Whilst you are a cheap bottle of Bulgarian plonk, that thinks of itself as Champagne! Poor thing, don't worry, we all go through that obnoxious stage. You'll grow out of it when your brain fully develops.

[Mithar]

Judging from this thread, Sikhs of England seem to be very accepting of homosexuality. Living in England for 3 generation has made you into Goray/European in terms of your moral/ethical values.

[chatanga1]

dalsingh101, on 08 February 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

I agree but we have to acknowledge that the Akal Takhat has already put out an anti gay thing about them getting married a few years back.

that is slightly missing the point, as this topic is about being kesadhari and gay. Someone could be both, and still be married to a woman.

Sam-lingi anand karaj, i think overwhelming if not all of panth will abide by Sri Akal Takht Sahib on its edict.

[dalsingh101]

Mithar, on 08 February 2011 - 02:50 PM, said:

Judging from this thread, Sikhs of England seem to be very accepting of homosexuality. Living in England for 3 generation has made you into Goray/European in terms of your moral/ethical values.

No, I just think that in the wide scope of things that we need to resolve as a panth here in the UK, poofterism is pretty low on the agenda. I think the UK Sikh community is probably the most troubled of the diasporic communities in western countries.

Plus to be honest, I don't really want to be one of those people that just abuses poofs for no reason. Truth is that poof men are usually much better people than an ahhm goray - from my experiences anyway. Sure they can talk, dress and walk funny with their mincing ways but, more often than not, it's hilarious. Its like a bundha acting like a janani - you know that makes you laugh.

Anyway, I know a few 'uncle jis' are undercover fags. Being one and pretending not to be one is worse in my opinion.

Edited by dalsingh101, 08 February 2011 - 03:00 PM.

[dalsingh101]

Sam-lingi anand karaj - what is this?

[Maha Singh]

According to this site, it is possible lol

http://www.singhsabh...al.blogspot.com

Edited by Maha Singh, 08 February 2011 - 03:32 PM.