96 replies to this topic

[amardeep]

I just read the Amrit Sanchar account in Sarup Das Bhallas "Mahima Prakash". The devi episode is mentioned but nothing about the calling for heads or any panj pyare

[londondajatt]

SikhKhoj, on 12 May 2011 - 05:19 PM, said:

5. Were the Kakkaars given as we know them today? Or Trai Mudra as some Nihangs say (Kes Kach Kirpan). Or were Sikhs just ordered not to remove hair and keep weapons to defend the poor?

6. Did women get pahul? If so, were they ordered to keep the name Kaur? Did they wear Keskis / Dumalleh?

7. Did all Sikhs take pahul?

5. I have heard the rehat given by Guru was very simple.
Also about the kakkars thing, I know there is something that some sikhs bring up about the last page in some saroop of Dasam Granth having 5 kakkars written.
However, on one of these forums, there is someone who talks about the inclusion of this page accidentally and was not written by Guru ji. But I cannot seem to remember where the post was, it would either be on sikhsangat or on this forum.

6. Is the khanda a masculine symbol? Does khanda da amrit not only make Singhs and requires one to behave like a male, how can khanda amrit produce kaurs? Or is my logic flawed?

That is my thinking, that Khanda is a masculine respresentation, whereas kripaan is feminine. Those with ancient knowledge/gyaan can dvelve further.

When women demanded Amrit, did puraatan sampradaiye not start traditions using feminine symbol kripaan to give amrit like I have heard they do in Hazoor Sahib?

7. And obviously, the other sampradaiye show that not all sikhs could have taken khandeh dee pahul, especially those whose mission in sikh panth did not tally with kshatriya dharam.

[SikhKhoj]

Amardeep, could you summarise that?

I plan to make a table with year book and then words such as 5 pyare, date, Banis, so we can have a comparative study of all literature about the Khalsa

What do you say? Help me?

[SikhKhoj]

londondajatt, on 06 February 2012 - 03:43 PM, said:

5. I have heard the rehat given by Guru was very simple.
Also about the kakkars thing, I know there is something that some sikhs bring up about the last page in some saroop of Dasam Granth having 5 kakkars written.
However, on one of these forums, there is someone who talks about the inclusion of this page accidentally and was not written by Guru ji. But I cannot seem to remember where the post was, it would either be on sikhsangat or on this forum.

6. Is the khanda a masculine symbol? Does khanda da amrit not only make Singhs and requires one to behave like a male, how can khanda amrit produce kaurs? Or is my logic flawed?

That is my thinking, that Khanda is a masculine respresentation, whereas kripaan is feminine. Those with ancient knowledge/gyaan can dvelve further.

When women demanded Amrit, did puraatan sampradaiye not start traditions using feminine symbol kripaan to give amrit like I have heard they do in Hazoor Sahib?

7. And obviously, the other sampradaiye show that not all sikhs could have taken khandeh dee pahul, especially those whose mission in sikh panth did not tally with kshatriya dharam.

Nice reply but I want answer from an historic point of view. Prem Sumarg does mention getting khande di pahul if Im not mistaken, but sadly we havent been able to ascertain the year it was written it, estimates vary from 1701 AD to 1800 AD.

Yes, that 5 Kakkaar sahabd is in Persian and not written by Guru Ji, but by Bhai Nand Lal (apparently)

[amardeep]

I did not understand much of the language as it was in verse and not in prose. But there was nothing mentioned of panj pyare, it just said the Guru took amrit himself and then began to give khande di pahul to sangat after having assembled the sangat.

in the preface to Gurbilas Patshahi 10 (1751) by Kuer Singh it says that this is the first source to mention the sis bhet episode....Kuer Singh says his source is Bhai Mani Singhs katha (which also mentions the devi episode as well as passing of Gurgaddi to the Granth).

Edited by amardeep, 07 February 2012 - 06:17 PM.

[londondajatt]

SikhKhoj, on 06 February 2012 - 06:45 PM, said:

Yes, that 5 Kakkaar sahabd is in Persian and not written by Guru Ji, but by Bhai Nand Lal (apparently)

Hmm the post didn't mention Bhai Nand Lal; I think I found it through Googling, can the Admins find this post on this forum perhaps? Unless its not on here?

[amardeep]

Its written by Bhai Nand Lal the name Goya ocours