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  1. 4 points
    amardeep

    Is Sikhism a religion

    I think you need to spend some more time studying what Vedanta is. A lot of the things you ascribe to the Gurus can already be found in Vedanta, - that is why the Nirmale and others started to interpret Sikhi in this lense. This does not mean that Sikhs are Hindus – but it is a common framework to interpret reality. For instance, many people think that Sikhi rejects the Vedas because Sikhi puts naam and Brahmgian at the front while it limits the importance of the Vedas. This stance, however, is a key component of Vedanta!!! The Mundaka Upanishad divides wisdom into two categories: The higher and the lower. The higher form of wisdom is Brahmgyan while the lower is knowledge of Vedas, phonetics, grammar, etymology, meter, astronomy and the knowledge of sacrifices and rituals. This atittude towards Vedas is entirely in line with both Vedanta and Gurmat. In this regard, your understanding of Jup can most likely easily be found within the terminology of Vedanta and is not unique to Gurmat. And terms like karma, samsara, jeev, brahman, maya, prakrit etc are all from the Vedantic corpus of philosophy. Gurbani was revealed through shabads that came individually to different people at different times. If Guru Nanak in South India used the word Atma, it is expected that the Hindu would understand what this word meant without having to read 600 shabads of Guru Nanak (revealed in Northern India) to understand what is being said to him. Gurbani was revealed over centuries, - it does’nt make sense that only people who had studied all the shabads would be able to understand what they were being told when the Guru revealed shabads to them. Your approach seems to be heavily depend on logic. But Sikhi defies logic. This does not mean that Sikhi is all Disney world and mythology. But a traditional premise is that Sikhi breaks the make up of the mind. You say that Jup comes from the process of Jupi. You equate jup with jupi. This is very logical, that X is connected with Y and therefore through doing X you will attain Y. BUT the foundation of Gurmat through the Sri Japji Sahib is ਸੋਚੈ ਸੋਚਿ ਨ ਹੋਵਈ ਜੇ ਸੋਚੀ ਲਖ ਵਾਰ and ਚੁਪੈ ਚੁਪ ਨ ਹੋਵਈ ਜੇ ਲਾਇ ਰਹਾ ਲਿਵ ਤਾਰ . So here clearly the Guru is breaking common logic by going the other way and saying Soch does NOT happen through Sochai. And chup does not happen through chupai! This is a clear break with the way we understand logic and how Things are connected. Your idea that SIkhi fits with grammar, science and logic is fair to have but it does not have any tradition behind it. Whereas the Sampradays stretch back hundreds of years and that in itself Means their ideas have to be taken seriosly. You say that jupi happens through Listening ,Believing Accepting and Living. This is called shravan, manan, and nididhyasana in Vedanta and is a key component in understanding reality and transcending the self. Again, your use of grammar takes you back to a Vedantic mindset which the sampradays could easily have done through their traditions, uthankas etc. Again – there is NO way Gurbani discards the old meaning of these words. Gurbani is didactic – it is supposed to change your ways and by this , it implies that the orders given are understood by the people. If Gurbani says to do X it must be inferred that people understand what X means. And not that they have to study six hundred pages of philosophy and grammar to understand what is really meant. In your example, it means that the Panth was dillued for 300 years until Professor Sri Sahib Singh wrote his teeka. That does NOT make any sense and defies all logic of what a coherent, strong and independant religion is about.
  2. 3 points
  3. 2 points
    Dhan Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj Satguru Sache Patshah Ji, Dec 10.
  4. 2 points
    Dhan Sahibzada Zorawar Singh Ji, Nov 30.
  5. 2 points
    Many many Blessings to all, Dhan Guru Nanak Tuhi Nirankaar, Nov 23. https://youtu.be/a2BfEGbM1As
  6. 2 points
    tva prasad

    Sikhism & Suicide?

  7. 2 points
    Dhan Sri Bhagat Naamdev Ji Maharaj, Nov 19.
  8. 2 points
    amardeep

    Is Sikhism a religion

    Its not recycling - it’s continuing the eternal wheel of Dharam. The gurus consistent use of Vedanta testifies to a continuation of an earlier tradition. The presence of bhagat bani in the Guru Granth Sahib also testifies to people being able to achieve mukhti prior to Guru Nanak in 1469, which means that there is an earlier tradition that the gurus were continuing and adapting to the times. Good that you admit that you believe Sikhi was non existent from 1710 - 1950s and the panth has been deluded for the past 300 years. It shows your extreme point of departure You forgot to answer my question on where the gurus promoted the method of grammar in understanding gurbani. Bhai Gurdaas didn do that. Using gurbani tuks to interpret and explain Gurbani is a samprdaic tradition as can be seen throughout Kavi Santokh Singhs Garabganjani Teeka from the 1820s where he quotes extensively from the Anand Sahib, Asa Di vaar etx to explain the meaning of Japji sahib. He also uses grammar to explain some Tuks and why the verbs have a certain past Or present tense etc. Again, your idea that these things are new, logical and scientific is absurd - they’re a part of the sampradaic tradition!! The only difference is that the nirmale and others didn Chop off their feet while analysing and throwing the baby out with the bath water as present day missionaries do. Beautiful quote by Prof Puran Singh. Thanks for sharing. He is right In a way. Some nirmalas have taken things to far and you can also find the samprdaic Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale accusing the nirmale and Udasis of the same in his Gurbani Paath Darshan. The samprdayas are not perfect, they make mistakes and it’s good to have a panthic discussion on that. But it’s rather extreme to just reject it all, throw the baby out with the bath water and dismiss 300 years of tradition just because they might make a few mistakes here and there.
  9. 2 points
    MrDoaba

    Is Sikhism a religion

    When writing commentaries and making Gurbani interpretation there is a system, part of which is as follows: Vyakaran - grammar analysis. Nirukta - etymology analysis. Uthanka - historical context. And two types of Arth: Bhav Arth - outer layer, surface meaning, literal meaning. Antreev Arth - inner layer, deep explanations, metaphors, analogies etc. All this must be taken into consideration.
  10. 2 points
    amardeep

    Is Sikhism a religion

    It's also vital to note that Professor Sahib Singh's approach is an innovation in terms of Sikh tradition. No other scholar before him had done an entire commentary based on grammar alone. While this is praiseworthy, commendable and adds light to the glory of Gurbani, it is not a "principle" of Gurmat. If it was, you would have seen many more scholars prior to him interpreting Gurbani such. Grammar was important for the early scholars - you can find Kavi Santokh Singh in the garabganjani teeka using grammar in some verses, and Baba Ganga Ram was teaching grammar in the bungas of Amritsar during the Sikh raj - but the grammar was just a small component of many other methods of interpretation. Professor Sahib Singh's massive Work is indeed Unique, but you can't say his approach is part of a principle of Gurbani. It is rather an innovation - but a good one as it adds to the plurality and intellectual exercises of the Sikh scholars of history.
  11. 2 points
    Soulfinder

    Dhunda Vs Gurbani

    Veer ji the original youtube has been blocked but i have found the same track from Bhai Jaswinder Singh Jis facebook which i hope matches the youtube verson. Facebook media - 10155069925744786 ( 360p ).mp4
  12. 2 points
    Soulfinder

    Dhunda Vs Gurbani

  13. 1 point
    Khojidas

    Baba Binod Singh by Granth

    @Soulfinder that's the one. Gurpur prakash Granth by Sant Renn Singh (descendent of Guru Angad Sahib) so looks like this Granth was printed in 4 parts. Does anyone if its still available?
  14. 1 point
    tejikaur

    Japji Sahib English translation

    Gurfateh brothers and sisters God is wonderous i was searching something else and came upon this thread the translation started when I was 20 7 years later I have grown and learned and fallen deeper in love with my guru I had to leave for law school and now I am finishing my llm and just passed the bar guru mehr nal o am working on the translation and after doing a comparative study I find the best steek to be professor sahib singh jis I finished my llm soon and am hoping this translation finishes by next year at japji sahib and sometime in my lifetime with he love and prayer of my kaum I hope to translate Guru Granth shaib steek until then on YouTube search English nitnem katha tejkaran kaur and there is a audio translation of all five banis done by professor shaib singh ji I was 20-21 then so my presentation isn’t the best but pray I am hoping to finish this teek a project I have gotten lost in gurbani and am in love with guru jis teachings And thankful for the effort made by prof sahib singh ji I pray I can share them with the world
  15. 1 point
    Soulfinder

    Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs

    Thanks veer ji for sharing as Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji always hits the nail on the head.
  16. 1 point
    Soulfinder

    Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs

    Veer ji it is a great video that hits the nail on the head with all these fake missionarys by Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji. You are correct it does make sense that he Ghaghri is afraid of Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji no wonder he is never had any guts to face him till date.
  17. 1 point
    Soulfinder

    Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs

    ਢਡਰੀਆਂ ਵਾਲੇ ਅਤੇ ਇਸ ਦੇ ਸਪੋਟਰਾ ਨੂੰ ਮੂੰਹ ਤੋੜਵੇ ਜਵਾਬ
  18. 1 point
    amardeep

    Arabian Nights And Charitropakhyaan

    Though I doubt the Sikhs ever did this due to the sacredness of Dasam Granth , - there are some 'editorial comments' in large sections of Dasam bani where it states that "if the poets find any errors, please correct and improve upon this Work'. I assume this is a literary tradition of humbleness in Indian literature, but it opens up the possibility of open-ended writings that can keep being added to. I think this is why Pyara Singh regards the Panj Sau Sakhi as one such example as it contains many sakhis that deal with the invasions of Nadir Shah etc.
  19. 1 point
    paapiman

    Alcohol - The Cursed Drink

    Alcohol has been cursed by Shukaracharya (the guru of the demons). Please listen to Gyani Inderjeet Singh jee Raqbewale for the events which led to the curse. Bhul chuk maaf
  20. 1 point
    The following was explain by tenth master himself. Satguru jee proved to the sangat that Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is greater than Sri Raam Chandar jee and Sri Krishan jee. Note: Daas has condensed the information. The website can be accessed for more information, if anyone is interested. It is a long read but it has great information. Firstly, Sri Guru Nanak Dev Rai Bedi jee Maharaaj is a Pooran Tam Avtaar, while Sri Raam Chandar jee and Sri Krishan jee are Pooran Avtaars. Pooran Tam Avtaar is greater then Pooran Avtaar. Please see below: Quote 6.) Pooran Tam Avtar- This is the highest Avtar. This was Guru Nanak Dev Ji. All avtars are made of satogun but according to Gurmat the early avtars were created out of maya, and hence caught up in it. Guru Nanak Dev Ji however was a 100% mirror reflection of God, and hence he was not hampered by the obstacles which hampered the earlier avtars. Unquote [1] Next, Maharaaj uses five criteria and proves that Satguru jee is the greatest. Quote 1.) Shakti- Shakti is power. Ram Chandar displayed his power from an early age. When his mother went to worship an idol of her goddess. He moved the idol and took it’s place. Krishna too showed his powers to his mother, Devki. Knowing he used to have a tendency to eat dirt she forced him to open his mouth, and through it she saw the entire cosmos. Guru Nanak Dev Ji however did not give into the temptations of demonstrating his shakti. He even instructed his Sikhs to not give into the temptations of showing of these powers. When he was born, at the ambrosial hour (Amritvela) all the demi-gods came to worship him. They seated him on a throne and bowed down to him. They rubbed sandalwood into his skin and adorned him in various ways, all to show their devotion. They even did an ardass in front of him. That along with being the protector of humanity he should also remember the demi-gods. Mata Tripta Ji, Guru sahib’s mother awoke while the demi-gods were midway through their prayers. The demi-gods on seeing her vanished. At first Mata Ji thought she had been dreaming. But then she saw her child adorned like a prince. She came close to him. It was then, to prevent her from finding out about his powes and to conceal them Guru Nanak Dev Ji started crying, and seeing her child in distress she easily let the curtain of forgetfulness be drawn over her mind. Guru Sahib eschewed demonstration of powers and placed emphasis on bhagti. It is only the result of Bhagti one gets powers but these should not be accepted as being a sign, that Bhagti is complete. There is even more bhagti left to do afterwards. 2.) Viaktee- Viaktee is the form of being. The physical form. A glaring difference between Guru Nanak Dev Ji (Pooran Tam Avtar) and Ram Chandar/Krishna (Pooran Avtar) is their facial features. Guru Nanak Dev Ji grew a very beautiful and long beard whereas the Pooran avtars had none. Gurmat says that one of the biggest reasons for an individual’s desire to cut kesh is physical pleasures. The Pooran Avtars did not have any facial hair. When Ram Chandar left Ayodhya to marry Sita in Janakpuri, all the royal maidens were entranced by his beauty. On seeing this he told them that he will satisfy their desires in the Dwaper Yug. In the Dwaper Yug Krishna’s viaktee was one of lust. The maidens became the gopis and hence Ram Chandar satisfied their lust. Above is a mural depicting how Krishna stole the gopi’s clothing and hid with them, in order to watch the nude maidens. Ram Chandar and Krishna both kept youthful forms and as a result were not able to eradicate the cardinal sin of lust. Guru maharaj however let his body age as per Waheguru’s hukam and did not seek any physical pleasures. 3.) Pragya- Pragya is the name of a person’s knowledge of God. Ram Chandar had two masters in his life. Rishi Vashist. He spent 68 days with him in order to gain an understanding of creation. This is found in Vashist purana. (We will be putting up excerpts from this purana very soon). Ram Chandar then spent 8 days with Rishi Vishwamitar in order to learn Shastarvidya, the science of weapons. Ram Chandar and brother Lakshman do seva of Vishwamitar. Krishna’s spiritual master was Rishi Darbasha, who taught him the knowledge of God in 8 days, whereas his martial master was Rishi Sandeepan who taught him Shastarvidya in 64 days. Guru Nanak Dev Ji however was born learned from the start. He did not need any Guru or teacher at all. His Guru was the shabad and he was above the teachings of the vedant, upanishads and qoran etc. When his parents sent him to Pandit Gopal Panday in order to learn maharaj taught Panday the essence of Waheguru and creation. On the third day Pandit Ji told maharaj’s parent that he (Guru Nanak) was the creator of all knowledge and there was nothing he could teach him. Baba Kalu then took maharaj to Mulla Noor Deen, however the Guru gave an exalting discourse to the Mulla which changed his life. The other avtars adopted masters, but maharaj adopted no one as a master instead masters adopted him as a master. Guru Nanak Dev Ji at school with Mulla Noor Deen, his father and other students. Guru Nanak Dev Ji never had to use any weapons, his shastar was the shabad. However he still taught Shastarvidya to Baba Buda Ji, the shastarvidya given to him in sachkhand which was returned to him in his sixth form. No avtar in terms of Shakti, Pragya and Viakat can even come an inch close to Guru Sahib. 4.) Kartab- Kartab is the showing of one’s skills. In Treta-yug the age of Ram Chandar was 10,000 years! During this time Ram Chandar only showed his kartab in the 14 years he spent in exile. After 14 years of exile he went back to Ayodhya and made a promise, that under him no parent will lose their child. It was then that a Brahman came to him and asked him to resurrect his son or otherwise accept the title of a liar. Ram Chandar asked the Brahman how his son died, the Brahman replied that a shudra (dalit) was reading the scriptures and praising God thats why. Ram Chandar went to the residence of the Dalit, Shambuk and resurrected the Brahman’s son by cutting of Shambuk’s head and killing him. This account is found in both the Dasam Granth and the Balmiki Ramayan. By accident Ram Chandar fought against his sons Love and Kush. His sons injured or killed his entire army including Ram Chandar. Only due to the goodness of Sita he was brought back to life. Still Ram Chandar passed the reign of the kingdom over to his two sons. This was due to his attachment with his family. Krishna after killing Kans he placed his maternal grandfather named Ugarsain on the throne to rule the kingdom. This showed his attachment to his family. However Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji for the first 28 years stayed in the city of Sultanpur and worked in the granary. After doing this they went into the Beas River and went to heaven there. Here they adopted God as their only spiritual master. They were given the root incantation here and following which saved all of humanity with the knowledge of the Lord. They travelled far and wide doing this. They did not speak of any other demi god or prophet other then God. Guru maharaj and Salis Rai Jeweller, a devotee maharaj met on his journeys in India. Guru Nanak Dev Ji did not show any attachment to their sons but showed may feats of skill. Instead of installing one of their sons in their position they appointed one of their disciples. Guru Nanak Dev Ji met many evil kings such as Devloot, Lajvarad and Babur. Rather then killing them they gave them knowledge in order to make them understand the message of God and to help humanity. The demon Kauda, the thieves Bhumai and Sajjan were made to repent what they were doing and became saints. They made all the evil people good with the teachings they imparted. They saw no difference between social class, gender, age, etc and imparted the same message to all the people of the world. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in order to avoid many troubles showed much skill. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji did not show any less skill then any other incarnation. They actually showed greater skill then all others. 5.) Aayoo, or acts performed for the good of others. Ram Chandar lived for 10,000 years. Due to listening to the Brahmans they killed a person of a low caste. They also handed the reign of the land to his two sons. Krishna lived for 1,000 years. He believed Jadva to be an egotistical person due to this he got Rishi Darbasha to curse him so that he would die. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji was a king and a saint at the same time. In order to bring any other being back to life they never killed another. By bringing that person back to life they would give them the name of God so that they could save and bring back to life many other people. This is the same with the 3rd, 5th, 9th and 10th Sikh Gurus. The third Guru, Sri Guru Amar Das Ji whilst the spiritual master of the Sikhs for 22 years no one died in the village of Gobindwal. No matter if old or young no one died during the 22 years that Sri Guru Amar Das Ji was in the city of Gobindwal. No one was ill as well. This showed that the Guru’s of the Sikhs were greater then that of the incarnations. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji lived for 70 years and during that time travelled more then Ram Chandar and Krishna did. Ram Chandar and Krishna never travelled further then Indian and Sri Lanka. Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to Kashmir, Nepal, Bhutan, China, Tibet, Sikam, Burma, Africa, Arabia, Egypt, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Turkmenistan and Russia. They travelled to these countries and more all by foot. In the ballads written by Bhai Gurdas Ji it states the Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji actually travelled the whole world and met all the people of all nations. Guru Nanak Dev Ji saved that many souls that they cannot all be accounted for. In such a small life Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji helped an infinite number of people. They got the root incantation from heaven and spread it through the seven lands of India and all of the continents throughout the world. They taught all the people to meditate on the name of the one true Lord. They started the faith of Sikhism. They created the true congregation. They made other people meditate on the Lord. Unquote [1] [1] - https://sikhunity.wordpress.com/2014/01/13/pooran-tam-avtar/ The above clearly proves that Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is the greatest. Bhul chuk maaf
  21. 1 point
    paapiman

    Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs

    You don't believe in that historical narrative? You don't think that Sri Satguru jee can turn an illiterate person into a scholar in an instant with his grace? Bhul chuk maaf
  22. 1 point
    mrhsinghk

    Alcohol - The Cursed Drink

    Here is another but different Saakhi i found related http://kam1825.podbean.com/e/akhbars-previous-life/
  23. 1 point
    Hey Sat, come on.... you have been more than just an influence for me If my documenting can help just one person be a better sikh now or in the future, then it's worth the effort of putting this stuff into words. It's difficult to explain what the naad or shabad sounds like but i have looked around to see if i can find anything similar. I have heard a few binaural beat videos at some weird frequencies that are supposedly helpful in activating chakras. These get pretty close but you won't feel the depth or the decibel octaves. I read somewhere that it is the 'primordial unstruck sound' - meaning the sound and vibration from our Mool or origin. I did have my doubts at first for quite a while and i am not sure if i was connecting to it in the same way ? (it's difficult to express in words isn't it) I know it's just the very basic beginning stage, but amazingly and somehow you feel very familiar and at home with it. It's as if, your jeev or soul knows that it belongs at home with it. This is what gives that unexplainable feeling of comfort and feel as if you have found a long lost treasure that was always very close by ! Do you get this same kind of feel or you comprehend what I mean ? I am keen to know if Sant Waryam singh ji mentions something in his books, because i haven't ever read them just a few parts that have been posted on here and other sites. Controlling the thoughts is probably the hardest part because you have to try and concentrate to not think ! I TRY and just let the thoughts pass or just let them come and go without following them. Then i keep getting these short moments of real deep 'being lost' where i feel so connected with the naad, trikuti and silent jaap at the same time. (what i have been calling the hint of samadhi) It's as if they all blend in together. It invokes feelings of tears/joy/anand/bliss......and then before i know it, i'm out of it and realise that i am sat on my bed in my surroundings. Then I try again trying to make it happen and prolong it. I have to keep doing reality checks with myself, hoping that i am not getting attached to the wrong thing. I often worry that i may be losing my focus to Guruji because these feelings are pulling me ? It leaves me a little confused, which is why i felt i should share it on here Some days i look so forward to having just a few hours of sleep before i get up at 2am, the other night i was so keen that i got up at 1.15am and tried going back to sleep at about 4am (still had this unknown source of energy).
  24. 1 point
    This is taken from the book 'riddles of ram and krishna' by B.R. Ambedkar. Ambedkar ji cannot be blamed for writing this blasphemous literature all together. This is frustration of a person who was a victim of the caste system. The book was then banned. We have to understand that our dalit brothers have been so suppressed that they want to get off their identity even though we force them to be what they were born like. All i say is we Sikhs atleast shouldnt prmote any such ninda of Sri Ramchander Ji .
  25. 1 point
    Narsingha

    Nirmala Sampradaya

    "Narsingha's argument was that Sikhi was some sort of hinduism in minature with a division of labour between the Nihangs ( warriors ), Nirmalas ( Scholars ), Udasis ( ascetics ) and SewaPanthis ( social workers )" -Bikramjit Bikramjit, this is YOUR interpretation of the knowledge presented on the websites. Its clear you do not understand Sanatan Sikhi, and have some fear of being absorbed into the Hindu faith. Possibly you were bullied as a child by Hindus, or you base your Khalistani-esque Sikhi around 1984 and see all Hindus as enemies of the Sikh faith. We have even created a section for "kattarpanthis" who suffer from selective information absorption: http://www.sarbloh.info/htmls/epilogue_sikh.html Please refrain from assuming everyone sees information the same way you do. If you dont wish to listen to me, maybe u will listen to Guru Maharaj... ‘According to one's intellect one expresses it [the truth] in a myriad of ways.’ (Farladhari Sodhibans Bajja Waley Dasam Patshah Akali Nihang Guru Gobind Singh ji Maharaj, Treh Charittar 104, Dasam Guru Durbar) Nirmalas are seen as the intellectuals of traditional Sikhi, but this does not mean they are incapable of weilding weapons when there is a need for this. Not all Nirmalas are passive, just as not all Nihangs are warriors (within an army, there are many roles to be filled). Same goes for the Udhasis who are largely passive and non-violent, but even so, some great Udhasis fought beside Akali Nihang Guru Gobind Singh Ji's side when the call to arms was made. Indeed, the lineage of Akali Nihang Baba Durbara Singh Ji Sanatan Sikh Shastar Vidiya Akharah includes Akali Baba Gurditta ji Udasin (see http://www.shastarvidiya.org/htmls/akhara.html With regards to Amrit, within the Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa, Amrit is seen as an initiation into an Army. Anyone who took Amrit from the Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa, traditionally, had to be tested physically and mentally (and sometimes had to prove themselves worthy by serving the Khalsa Dal Panth by doing manual labour before they were given Amrit. Granted, today, this ideology has become relaxed and things werent as strict as they once were. The farla (loose piece of cloth at the top of the dumalla) was also traditionally only given after service to the Dal Panth of at least 14 years, and along with this came the title of "Akali Nihang"....this too has slipped and one finds many Akali Nihangs in India who have not been within Nihang Dals for 14 years let alone devote these years in service. These issues and many more will be highlighted in www.nihang.com. Nirmalas are considered as "Khalsa" too, but this defintion of Khalsa refers to the Satoghuni (purity of the soul) rather than the Rajoghuni (outwardly warrior/dynamic/energetic) Nihang warrior version. Sarbloh Guru Durbar explains this well, where non-warrior saints are referred to as Khalsa. lalleshvari can explain more regarding the Nirmala view on Amrit, and how Nirmalas perceive Amrit....it does differ to the Nihang aspects but as is tradition amongst Sanatan Sikhs, we do not go around fighting amongst each other :wink: Within Akali Nihangs, the kakkars are practical...briefly... kirpan/kard = lethal weapon, kara = lethal weapon, kachera = many uses according to kyshatria (warrior) maryada, kesh = shivswaroop/kaal roop/warriors of Chandi (see Chandi di vaar), kanga = to prevent dreadlocks (sign of passiveness/sadhus), kamarkasar = sign of being always ready for war+many uses, panj shastars = respect for Sarbloh, dummalley deh shastar = easy access to weapons, gupt weapons =weapons kept secret. Nihangs carry many weapons on their persons, not just a kirpan/kard (there will be a section on kakkars from the Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa perspective coming on www.shastarvidiya.org in the near future). If one wishes to read more, Baba Gurbachan Singh Ji Bhindrawaley's darpan explains the kakkars and their origins very well (and may shock the likes of Bikramjit when he realises where the kakkars actually come from ). Baba Ji himself was a Nihang Singh of the Budha Dal (the SAME sukha-drinking, chatka-eating Nihangs that Bikramjit considers to be "hindus"!!) ..within Nirmala Sampardah, these explanations and uses of kakkars may not necessarily match, but then again, Nirmalas are not expect to be at the front line or contemplate on Kaal as Nihang Singhs do. (..for anyone wondering about 1984 and Nihangs, www.nihang.com will explain this, so stick to the issue at hand). Mainstream Sikhs, who prefer to focus on differences rather than nuture similarities, may see this as a "conflict" between Nihangs and Nirmalas with regards to their ideology of Amrit, but amongst Sanatan Sikhs, this is simply the beauty of diversity of Sikhi. We, as Sanatan Sikhs, choose to build upon what is common, rather than fight on what is different. Every Sanatan Samparadah has its own forms of initiation....they take various forms...it does not mean they are conflicting with each other.
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