Gabbar

They were all made from the same thing and they will become the same thing. The point is, in the middle is what matters. After the body has gone, dust is dust my friend...

That is true, many events are similiar. But what I am saying is that sometimes a selfish view is taken and we need to look at other communities who have been affected by these types of attrocities

May the soldiers from all over the world who died bravely in this war rest in peace, They did a great seva for this world and it will not be forgotten. Rab Rakha

Is combining simran/kirtan with folk/bhangra tunes allowed?

Hello? Does anyone look after this thread or am i talking to myself? Please dont make get your attention by swearing.... that is the last thing I want to resort too.

Like i said before, dust is dust... The soul has left the body. The ashes should be thrown into a river somewhere, the nearest one maybe. We were made from dust, and we will become dust.

Not really, i was simply making a point, not arguing about it.

It doesnt really matter where ur ashes go in sikhi... as far as i know... u should throw them in a river... u dont have to go to india to do this. Water is water and dust is dust. They are arguing over dust. They need a reality check.

Whats the difference between ashes and dust? Same thing really... the soul has left... ashes is the same as dust, just as dust is the same as ashes. People being sued over dust... crazy! What is the world coming to.. jaae milaa thinaa sajanaa thutto naahee naehu ||25|| I am going out to meet my Friend, so that my heart will not be broken. ||25|| fareedhaa mai bholaavaa pag dhaa math mailee hoe jaae || Fareed, I was worried that my turban might become dirty. gehilaa roohu n jaanee sir bhee mittee khaae ||26|| My thoughtless self did not realize that one day, dust will consume my head as well. ||26||

With regards to this article in the first post, maybe this is one of the reasons why people back in the day... (i.e. Guru's time or even our grandparents generation actually... mid 1900's... ) got married at such an early age... but now-a-days, its usually around mid to late 20's before u get marreid and hence, get sexually active. What techniques are there to combat this urge of masterbation? This needs to be told so people can help themselves.

Good points there man.... You cannot die before your time.... One question to everyone tho about suicide... Is it suicide IF you go into a situation knowing you will be killed or there is a very high probability (i.e. over 90%) that you will die?

Hello? Where have the moderators gone? What do i have to to get there attention?

Guys. can i make a humble request to keep this thread serious so we can make progress. Thanks

Ok, I was reading the post about the sikhi camps and it has gone way off the topic and alot of people chatting crap so i thought i'd start a new topic...this time a bit serious and to the point. THe original post in that topic was: there are various sikh camps now run all over the world. they provide a variety of different functions... introducing 'newbies' to sikhi, providing access to information & different views from speakers, networking etc. i wanted to start a thread to get feedback from everyone who's been to a sikh camp (especially camps aimed at 16yrs+) & see what everyone thinks of them. 1. which camp(s) have u been to? I went to a BOSS one this summer what was good about the camp? They had nice different food, different activities on various days. We got to leant about sikhi and talks were in English, as probably they are all over the country. It seemed pretty well organised and the organisers had a plan for each day. There were lots of freebies to take away, which is always good! I really enjoyed the discussions as well!! It was good to talk to other people. 2. what was bad about the camp? Ok, the sleeping arangements werent all that... they were army bunkers. But I guess to accomadate a large number of people, it does the job. The arrogance and narrow-mindness of certain 'campers' there. I dont know what they come for, but it seems they come to preach. They impression that i got from this camp was they had two points of view... Your opinion and then the right opinion! Sad to say, i found it came mainly from the Dastar sikhs. They gave the impression they knew everything and when you go into a discussion with them, they would not see your point of view. They would simply tell you what they thought and thats it. They could not see the 'world issues' and could not see outside immediate sikhi. Again, I dont know why these people come to these camps, maybe they are bored or something but if they are not willing to talk and INTERACT with people, then you may as well stay at home and talk to the wall. Also, some of the sevadars were a bit arragont too. Take the following example, I was standing outside talking to someone of the opposite sex, one of the Sevadars looked at us and I caught him looking at us.... and then he came over and said.. 'Look, its getting late, everyone needs to be in their bunkers' I looked at him and thought, what a prat. I think he was jealous or something or wanted to show his authority infront of this person... i dunno. But what is his problem if I am standing outside chatting to someone, after all... isnt that one of the points of sikhi camp? To meet other people? Also, I saw one Singh getting told that he shouldnt wear a red Paag! What the..!!! Its upto him what colour he wants to wear. I think people like this were going round just showing off or something. One last thing, there were a good variety of topics, however, they seemed to focus a bit too much on certain topics (e.g. 1984) There were also alot of Khalistani's and some were the organisers promoting it.. which has nothing to do with people learinng what sikhi is. Can't really think of anything else but i'l post it up if i think of anything. 3. What improvements/suggestions can u give for future camps? I think the discussions should be longer. They only lasted about just over an hour... and it took about half an hour to get started!! Desi people, what do u expect! LOL! Maybe there could be more open-minded discussions there. I know you u cant control the people who go there but thats life. The price of the camp was fairly expensive too.. maybe you can get funding from gurdwara's etc? I'm not quite sure what the best way to limit arrogance is,,... its a shame that these creep into sikhi camps. Also, maybe there can be more interaction in the talks? This may keep people listening and interested. I also find you learn alot more when talking with people. Again, if i think of anything else, I will post it up 4. which types of speakers were particularly good / particularly bad? anything else u can think of? There were some good speakers there... i cant remember there names but one of them talked about Guru Nanak Dev Jee and it was a very deep and thoughtful discussion which I thought was very good. I think you should have more of these types of discussions there, especially at the camps aimed for 16+. Another good talk was on the ardaas and the stories behind each bit of the ardaas... this maybe a fictional talk. Speakers that were particularly bad was this guy who was a lawer or barrisster or something, and he was basically slating off the prime minister of india, Manmohan Singh. He had a go at his children and his life which I thought was a bit low coming from a sikh and especially low, as it was directed at another sikh! He was saying stupid things like, the prime ministers daughters are married to hindu's... so what if they are? Whats that got to do with Manmohan Singh getting India out of poverty? This talk was on again, 1984, and the talker seemed to have alot of hatred for the Prime Minister. When i approached him after the talk in order to explain to him that this is not a nice thing to do and to at least give the Prime Minister a chance as he had only been in power fora couple of months....he simply brushed me off by saying something like... 'we'll see then' Anyway, this was my experience of the camp and after telling my mates, they also confessed to me that this was their views of the camp as well so its not just me. Thanks for your time.

I have noticed that the first two replies to this topic did not see my point of view and hence did not agree it with. I also noticed that they were both Americans. I just want to say that do not let your pride get in the way, it is a dangerous thing. By the way, I did not say the situations were exactly the same, I said they were similiar in a sense... you need a open mind and from a top-level view. There is no evidence to support the claims of oil? It is just plain obvious! How are they going to get evidence, they are not going to tell you are they? Have you not seent the film Farenheight 9/11? It is all propaganda, they tell you what you want to hear... and because we are here sitting in the western world thinking we have got the best facilities and know everything, we think we are hearing facts.... WRONG! It is the same thing, propaganda! Regarding Bhindralwale, I was looking at the perspective of they both never came out and surrendered themsleves, hence, saving all them innocent civilians getting killed. "It will settle down soon, hopefully. " yeah right... course it will... after the Americans have killed every Iraqi and every person who dares to speak out against the Americans! And they would justify by saying he was a terrorist who saying he was linked to 9/11!!! "I do not agree with the war in Iraq, but what is done is done. " What is done is done?? What kind of attitude is that? It should not have been done this way in the first place! Should have been done through the UN! "When your own house is burning, it is hard to provide shelter for others." I'm sure the sikhs in that time weren't exactly living freely... dont be selfish and help other people. I also hope that the resisdents of Falluja defeat the Americans. And I hope they get free and get to leave in peace which is what they deserve.