jaikaara

Singh veer ji we are not lowering the Rehat, we are raising the importance of daswandh , in this case even for non khalsa guru premi sikhs who were asked by the Guru to perform their responsibility, we have to understand that the stress laid on is ..that the daswandh is not limited to the khalsa sikhs

Gur Fateh ji ! very good seva ..good to hear this

u missed the point Matheen it seems !

Guys I feel Prabhupad's philosophy is opposed to Sri Gita granth ji's philosophy. The Gita tells the humans to do karma. The iskon ideology asks you to depend on Sri Krishan ji for everything. A good version is of The Gita is of Gorakhpur Press. Another good one is 'Gita Rahasya' by Lokmanya Tilak.

TH is something i came across on the 'other' site Sehajdhari Khalsa Email to Friend Print Version Feedback Nearly 3 years after Baisakhi of 1699 Guru ji wrote letters (hukamnamas to some sahejdhari Sikhs - non amritdhari) on 6 February 1702 signed (characteristic authentic Nissan of tenth Guruji) by Guruji. The following is the text of one of these written to Sikhs presumably in Patna as the letter is preserved there. "Ek Oankar Satguru ji. Siri Guru ji di agaya hai Bhai Mihar Chand Karam Chand, Guru rakhega. Guru Guru japna janam saurega. Tusi mera Khalsa ho. Ik sau ik 101) rupiah haathi di phurmais hukam dekhde he sitabee hundee karai bhejni. Ar hor jo kichh Guru ke namit ka hovai so apai lai avna. Hathiar banh ke avgu so nihal hogu. Us di ghaal thai pavagu Guru naal rahgu. Guru ke navit ka hovai so horus kise no nahee dena ar masand, masandiay naal naahee milna, nahee mannanna, Jo sikh mile so mail laina. Vadheek dikkat naahee karni. Mera hukam hai sangat. Sammat 1758 miti Fago 10, satran Ath 8." This is its translation. Ek Oankar Satguru ji. This is the command of Siri Guru ji (for) Bhai Mihar Chand and Karam Chand Guru shall protect you. Remember and recite Guru your life shall become worthwhile. YOU ARE MY KHALSA. Your name has been proposed for arranging 101 Rupees for (procuring) an elephant. On seeing this command immediately send a draft, and anything else offered in the name of the Guru, you should bring with you. Those of you who will come adorning weapons shall be blessed, their efforts shall bear fruit and their loyalty to Guru shall be upheld. Anything offered in the name of Guru is not to be handed over to anyone else. And you should not socialise with a Masand or a Masand follower nor honour them. Any sikh who intends to join (sangat) should be admitted, you should not create too much hinderance. This is my command to the Sangat. Sammat(the Indian Bikrami calendar) 1758 Date Fago(Faggan the last month of the Indian year) 10 (Western calendar 6 February 1702) Lines eight 8. This letter is in the Harimandar Sahib Patna (Hukamname edited by Ganda Singh, Hukamnama No. 55, published by Punjabi University Patiala, 1967) Very important points that emerge from this Hukamnama are: 1. This is an actual document signed by tenth Guru ji nearly 3 years after the Baisakhi 1699 rather than some doubtful Rahitnama hence reflecting the actual view or attitude towards the sikhs to whom letter was wirtten. 2. The letter was written to two persons who from their name are obviously not Singhs but with 'Chand' surname hence not amritdhari. 3. The most odd thing is that Guru ji clearly says "Tusi Mera Khalsa Ho" ie You are my Khalsa". This is unusual in the sense that it means Guruji was not reserving the term Khalsa only for Amritdharis but for some Sahejdhari Sikhs as well. Read More:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6231 (Sehajdhari Khalsa) 4. Guru ji appears to be more concerned about by-passing the Masands for remitting the offerings directly to Guru ji rather than anything such as urge them to get baptised. 5. In terms of physical appearance (such as kakkaars etc) again Guruji is more particular about the Sikhs arriving with weapons on their person rather than fomally being baptised and bearing "Singh" surname. 6. In order to secure against any forgery Guru ji put his characteristic Nissan (usually brief Mool Mantar in his own hand) on the letter and even gave the number of lines of text in the letter as 8 at the end of the letter. This was the usual security arrangement. Comparison with numerous other such letters by Guru ji confirms that this is an authentic letter. 7. The rigid definition of a Khalsa that we are now given to accept does not seem to apply here. The main criteria for a Khalsa Guru ji appears to be emphasising is not to use the Masand channel to approach Guruji but to have direct connection with Guru ji. Indeed this is what the word "Khalisah" meant in the then existing usage of this term in the Mughal revenue administration of that time. Read More:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6231 (Sehajdhari Khalsa) Similarly there is another letter written to the Sangat in Dhaka (Bangladesh) addressed to Bhai Brindaban and Gulal Chand (ibid. Hukamnama 57) with almost identical text such as "Tusi mera khalsa ho" and commanding again 101 rupees to be arranged and coming with weapons on and not socialising with Masands. Source: Tapoban.org

its good if i am successful in getting it made , Sad part is i am not in Punjab

We also need to understand that Sri Ramchander ji has been accepted as a messenger of Parmatma. Refer to Sri Sukhmani Sahib, Waheguru doesnt appear at all. Parmatma is Ram, Gopal Gusaaiyan, Damodar. Every time you find something which you have connected to hindu 'ism' you get irritated, I dont know how much of Bani have you referred . We need to understand that the culture of Hindustan is common heritage. We are are the inheritants. The hindus do not have monopoly over Sanatan Dharam. Sanatan is eternal, neither hindu nor muslim.

This is taken from the book 'riddles of ram and krishna' by B.R. Ambedkar. Ambedkar ji cannot be blamed for writing this blasphemous literature all together. This is frustration of a person who was a victim of the caste system. The book was then banned. We have to understand that our dalit brothers have been so suppressed that they want to get off their identity even though we force them to be what they were born like. All i say is we Sikhs atleast shouldnt prmote any such ninda of Sri Ramchander Ji .

start practicing Jhatka guys ! i m looking for a iron smith to make me a good tulwaar for chatka somewhat like the nihangs carry

I make Sukha once a year during Hola Mohalla, we make it around 20 litres and distribute amongst those residing in my community . Its fun !

I request the sangat to stop accusations specially from HSD. We should mind our language and also understand that we r insulting a sikh woman. All that knowledge is dust when you cannot respect women. However scholarly a perosn maybe ifthis is the language which is used he is as lowly as a malechch , even a turak sounds better.

I agree with Chatanga ji that yes many hindus if not all ridicule sikhi and the Bana of Sikhi. They neither would want to do anything themselves and just want to downgrade our beliefs and faith. I veerji dont care about explaining anyting why kesh or why kirpaan. I just tell them will u question muslims who bow down 5 times and not 5 million times ? why just to the west and not to the north? Why should you question or ridicule me ? It is upto the Sikhs, if they find this just as a ritual or if they feel it is useless they would what they want. They want to preserve their culture, they want more sanskritisation, they want others to follow to them . The dreams they have about being 'vishwa gurus'. They boast about astra shastra technology in the days of the Good King Sri Ram Chander Maharaj. I ask them, where did yor technology go when the mughals attacked hindustan? why were you not able to use yor metallurgy and save yor women from being kidnapped by turaks and mughals ? Why did it take so many years of slavery ? First prove yorselves and stop questioning our kirpaans and kesh. Dont make khalistanis out of us , control the terrorism in yor hindu rashtra first and then dream like opium eaters.

I dont agree to the term 'fanatic' to be associated with Sikhi. Being religious doesnt mean to be fanatic. Wearing the Baana or keep flowing beards and 3 feet kirpaans are signs of wearing the religious pride.Fanatic the word itself contaradicts with Sikhi. The dictionary states the meaning of 'fanatic' as enthusiast, zealot, bigot, hothead, militant. Fanatic, zealot, militant, devotee refer to persons showing more than ordinary support for, adherence to, or interest in a cause, point of view, or activity. Fanatic and zealot both suggest excessive or overweening devotion to a cause or belief. Fanatic further implies unbalanced or obsessive behavior: a wild-eyed fanatic. Zealot, only slightly less unfavorable in implication than fanatic, implies single-minded partisanship: a tireless zealot for tax reform. Militant stresses vigorous, aggressive support for or opposition to a plan or ideal and suggests a combative stance. Devotee is a milder term than any of the foregoing, suggesting enthusiasm but not to the exclusion of other interests or possible points of view: a jazz devotee. The more a person strongly follows Sikhi , the more in him will be a sense of pride for his religion and he will not hate anyone. Becoming a extremist sikh cannot be compared to 'kharkoo' activity. When Sikhi 'thyself' doesnt preach hatred or elimination of other religions, How will a staunch Sikh would want to do so ?

Here is somewhat of an eye opener. Please go through the passage below. http://readerswords.wordpress.com/2006/10/14/dr-ambedkar-and-sikhism/ there is more to the relationship between Dalits and Sikhism. The founder of the Dalit movement Dr. Ambedkar had once himself seriously considered conversion to Sikhism at one point. His interest then waned, though the reasons are not known, and he finally converted to Buddhism with half a million of his followers. *** By 1935, Dr. BR Ambedkar’ s disgust with Hinduism and its caste system was complete. His patience at reforming Hinduism from within by securing for the untouchable castes the right to drinking water from public places, using metal utencils and receive education, was wearing thin. Earlier in 1929, he had advised his followers to embrace any religion that would give them respectability. Following this advice, some of his followers took to Islam. Referring to his own personal decision in the matter, Ambedkar said that unfortunately for him, he was born a Hindu Untouchable. It was beyond his power to prevent that, but he declared that it was within his power to refuse to live under humiliating and ignoble conditions. “ I solemnly assure you that I will not die a Hindu”, he thundered. He called for an end to the decade long struggles he had led for temple entry and which was brutally opposed by caste Hindus. Ambedkar’s call to the Untouchables to stop frittering away their energies over fruitless attempts and to devote themselves to carve out an honorable alternative for themselves shocked the nation, especially the caste Hindus. As to conversion, he said it will be done in five years and he would reconsider his decision if caste Hindus assured him by positive results. He added that he wanted to absorb his community into some powerful community and was thinking of embracing Sikhism. On April 13-14 1936, Dr. Ambedkar addressed the Sikh Mission Conference at Amritsar. He had earlier indicated that this would be his last speech he would deliver as a Hindu. The main feature of the conference, however, turned out to be the conversion of five prominent Depressed Class leaders of the Thiyya community of Kerala headed by Dr. Kuttir and 50 others from UP and Central Provinces to Sikhism. In May 1936, he called a conference of the Mahar community to which he belonged, and his abominations and the condemnation of Hinduism was biting, coarse and yet smashing and dissecting. He ended his speech with a quotation from the lips of the dying Buddha- he asked his people to seek refuge in Buddhism. This quotation from the Buddha led to speculations that Bhimrao was veering towards Buddhism. He himself, however, avoided a straight answer. A few days before, however, he had sent his son and nephew to Harminder Sahib as a gesture of goodwill towards Sikhism. They stayed there for over one and half months. By June of that year, Ambedkar after consulting his colleagues decided to embrace Sikhism- his friends and colleagues felt that he should seek the support of the Hindu Mahasabha leaders in their conversion to Sikhism, for the Mahasabha leaders believed that Sikhism was not an alien religion. It was an offspring of Hinduism and therefore the Sikhs and Hindus were allowed to intermarry and the Sikhs were allowed to be members of the Mahasabha. In his proposal, Dr. Moonje agreed to the inclusion of these neo- Sikhs in the list of Scheduled Classes and enjoy the benefits under the Poona Pact, if Ambedkar preferred to embrace Sikhism in preference to Islam and Christianity and that he agreed to counteract the Muslim movement to draw the Depressed Classes into the Islamic fold. Ambedkar said that he preferred to embrace Sikhism which offered less than social, political and economic power than Islam and less material attractions than Christianity (western nations). He favoured Sikhism in the “interests of Hindus”. Dr. Moonje and Dr. Kurtakoti (the Shankracharya) in giving their blessings obvioulsy chose the “least evil”. In choosing thus, they also showed their belief that Sikhism is another branch of Hinduism and that it owed the same culture and principles. Gandhi voiced concern over the proposed conversion, but Ambedkar continued to increase his contacts with the Sikh Mission. There was even a proposal to start a college in Bombay for the proposed neo- Sikhs. 13 of his followers who were asked to study the Sikh religion at Amritsar actually converted to Sikhism and returned to Bombay, where, writes Ambedkar’s biographer Dhananjay Keer, they were coldly received as they had only been asked by Ambedkar to study and not to convert. Soon, Bhimrao went on a tour of Europe. It seems after returning in 1937 his love for Sikhism had evaporated. He continued to talk of his proposed conversion though, and in 1955 along with half a million adherents went over to Buddhism. (Much of the above I had written in 1997, and as far as I recollect is mainly based on the notes I took from the wonderful biography of Dr. Ambedkar written by Dhananjay Keer.)

my experiments with sukhnidhaan tell me that yes it does increase concentration , yes tehre is a feeling of just the 'head' existing and ther rest of the body as a jsut a part you can drag along.Yes it is like a pain killer. HOWEVER, BEWARE IT HAS HUGE EFFECTS ON MEMORY.

Tony you are absolutely right. They blackmailed the leaders then to get their so called Pakistan(it should be naapakistan or piggystan hehehehe)They slaughtered thousands of innocent sikhs nad hindus . What USA is doing is trying to make a sherriff out of a dacoit. They still have to learn from 9/11 some more lessons maybe !

The comparison is very straight our veer pointed out the 'blunders' of the so caleld committee and here i have given a example how 'might is right' , u can let go a committee playing with Gurbani and in case opf differences an old main is shot ruthlessly. Giving examples of Massa Ranghar is absolutely out of picture here. The Beadbi he did was not just beadbi but atrocities.

these guys should suffer the way we did. I shall be happy too. I want to smile too at that firghtened face of that citizen who's paid his zakat to get the funds diverted to terrorists to kill me !!

I have been going through their website : http://www.islam4uk.com They want our hindu brothers http://www.islam4uk.com/non-muslims/62-non-muslims/90-why-hindus-should-embrace-islam Why Hindus Should Embrace Islam Introduction The terms Hindu or Hinduism are usually associated with individuals who follow a mixture of beliefs originating from the Indian Subcontinent. Religious practises include the worship of God via mediums such as idols, parents or saints through various complicated rituals approved by priests otherwise known as brahmins. Although, claims have been made connecting Hinduism with books such as the Bhagavat Gita or Vedas, little can be said about their authenticity given the fact that there are no legitimate chains of narration affirming the purity of these texts. Differences in religious practises between Tamil Hindu’s and Gujarati Hindu’s, for example, help to illustrate this fact. Re-incarnation: injustice? Re-incarnation is paramount to Hinduism, asserting the fact that disabled individuals are products of evil deeds performed in previous lives and consequently looked down upon, while healthier and more able individuals are assumed to be closer to the path of liberation (moksha) and deemed more reputable. Glen Hoddle’s (former England football manager) famous comments on this topic are a good example to refer to. Nationalism: proud to be Indian? Nationalism is neither despised nor dispraised but rather encouraged and viewed as something good. The preservation of India or Bharat generally remains an important issue among Hindu’s fuelling racism as well as restricting the religion to an ethnicity; the caste system although disapproved by the government openly flourishes, condemning dark-skinned individuals, with particular surnames, to a life of hard labour and ridicule, albeit at the expense of their supposed ‘evil deeds’. Free-Mixing: non-existent Segregation between genders is generally overlooked, especially between distant relatives, and tends to fluctuate given the trend of the society as well as compromise heavily in areas such as education i.e. schools, colleges and universities, for example. The beauty of the Hindu woman is often exposed in terms of her arms, hair and stomach and the Hindu man commonly reveals his private body parts in religious practises such as the Kumbh Mela. Secular: no system of life Hinduism, by its nature is a secular religion, providing no system of life for mankind to live under. Integration with democracy and man-made law are part and parcel of its composition and thus it is subject to manipulation and dilution. A call to embrace Islam Oh reader! Islam came to liberate mankind from the worship and obedience of the creation to the exclusive worship and obedience of the Creator (without intermediaries), it is a divine belief from which emanates a complete system of life (shari’ah), containing answers for everything you could possibly think of from tying your shoe laces to conquering the world! In addition to that, it is not enough for you to simply affirm the existence of God, or His right of worship, rather you must declare and accept His final messenger Muhammad (saw) and the Deen of Al-Islam which abrogates all other religions that have passed or are to follow: Allah (swt) says in the Qur’an, “The only Deen accepted by Allah is Al-Islam.” [EMQ 3:85] Oh reader! Muhammad ibn Qasim (ra) brought Islam to the Indian Subcontinent in the year 715 C.E. and indeed many responded to his call...isn’t it time you responded?

veer ji a huge applause for u , very well said, i m new to this forum and am very pleased to see the presence of Puratan Sikhs of the young generation here who understand things much better. I fail to understand, on one hand a mahant of our own Ravidassi Panth is brutally murdered on the basis that he was doing beadbi and on the other hand a management of a Gurudwara in Poland, correct me if I am wrong, edited the Ardas from Siri Bhagauti, is just let free, no action taken.Assasination is no answer, however shouldnt some lawful action follow.I feel editing the Gurus words is equivalent to blasphemy.Lets take steps to stop this gangsterism in the Panth.