dalsingh101 Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Charity aims to halt daughter abortions Kulwant Singh Dhaliwal was horrified to learn that baby girls were aborted A Cheshire businessman has set up a charity which aims to prevent families in India aborting girls. Kulwant Singh Dhaliwal became involved when he visited the Indian village where he was born and noticed most children in a school class were boys. He is now trying to help residents in Bir Rarke in the state of Punjab. Part of the charity's aim is to support families who might face the extra costs of raising a daughter. Mr Dhaliwal, from Appleton, Warrington, decided to help his village when he retired after selling a chain of 16 fashion shops in Greater Manchester. And he was horrified to discover that foeticide was the reason boys made up 70% of the children in the rural community which has a population of around 3,000. Parents would go to doctors who had ultrasound machines to discover their unborn baby's sex - and if it was a girl they would have it aborted. Many parents blame the dowry system as one reason why they do not want girls as they cannot afford to marry them off. Mr Dhaliwal decided to adopt the village and asked families not to abort their girls in favor of boys. Some success He said: "I told them all I would look after your daughters, I would pay for the education and health care, I would ensure that they had jobs and when the time came I would get them married off." He added since he started his project there are now more girls born in the village than boys. But this is the exception according to, Professor Sonia Balhotra, from the University of Bristol, who has just published a paper that shows each year in India around 500,000 girls are aborted because of foetal sex selection. Child Welfare India has over 100 staff who work in Delhi, Punjab and Haryana. Chief executive Deepa Bajaj said the government has developed some schemes to try to stop this practice and it is having some success. 'Big incentive' "One scheme gives cash to the mother if she gives birth in hospital as a way of tracking babies, another will give 100,000 rupees to a child who reaches the age of 18 and completes her education. "Money is a big incentive and many parents should realize that girls don't always cost money, they could actually provide much needed funds for the family in later life". And Mr Dhaliwal believes Indians living in the UK are also to blame by going back to India to find brides for their sons. "We go back and ask for too much money in dowry payments, we should not ask for anything at all. In fact we should be using our own money to help these families not crippling them with debt," he said. http://www.sikhnet.com/news/charity-aims-halt-daughter-abortions 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.Kaur Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Stop killing the Future of Kaurs http://www.4shared.com/dir/ZTuTiuoc/Stop_killing_the_Future_of_Kau.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted March 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Is this really simply down to dowry? Seems awfully backwards. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.Kaur Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 I don't think dowry is the only reason but it's one of the main reasons why people do this. Imagine how much money people spend on a wedding in India, even the middle class can easily spend 2 lakh rupees on a wedding. You pay for wedding clothes for the groom or bride, clothes for your close family members and poor people who come to your after the wedding, and new clothes for the newly wed, jewellery, people who make food (it's often people of lower castes who make samose, rotiyaan, daal and sabji etc.), mithai, those who play dhol at the jaago/maiyaan, bhangra dancers, granthis who do paath, buses for all the guests and then the dowry. Some families want jewellery, motorcycles, houses, furniture or even a ticket/visa to abroad. The list is looong, I could add so many more things but it would take too long. Now imagine a man in Punjab who has 3-4 daughters. If they all got a degree (bachelor or master degree) he has probably spend more than 10-15 lakh rupees on their educations. When they get married he knows he has to spend minimum 1 lakh rupees (and that's probably only for the dowry!) on each of them. Girls sometimes get killed if their family didn't give much dowry to the husband's family. This happen a lot, we just never hear about it. I think that's one of the main reasons why people get depressed/commit suicide/kill their unborn baby girls because of the culture. I'm not saying I agree with people who do this, but in some way I can understand why they are doing it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Apart from dowry one of the biggest reason is old age security.Daughters don't take care of their parents in India.It is not like that they don't want to but practically it is impossible for them to do so.Also society don't see these parents in respectful manner who take their daughters earning.Imagine a a poor farmer who has three daughter and he married them all .In all this course he has to take some loan but suddenly his health start failing then what? He cannot ask daughters to come and plough fields neither in other way he can ask money from them,so who is going to help him? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted March 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 What I find hard to grasp is how even a shred of common sense hasn't prevailed in our society about these things. It isn't too much to expect some sort of adaptation of cultural practices to lessen the pressure that leads to this type of thing. I have to say, even goray came out with the idea of setting fixed reachable dowrys when they were dealing with this issue post annexation. Am I the only one that is surprised with the way our lot seem to go round in circles on some of the most backward of issues? I know for a fact that soldiers who fought in WW1 noticed the marriage practices in Europe, and spoke of them favorably, yet still, we just don't progress? It's like we just accept the most retarded of practices with a shrug of our shoulders. And this one can't even be explained away by the straight lack of education (or penduness and whatnot) because we have urban classes doing the same shite as well. The mind boggles. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 (edited) Dhaaj and Len Dhen and the expenses during wedding are the main reasons for abortion. Just the wedding expenses amount to lakhs or rupees, then Dhaaj and the len dhen(where the girl's family start to give golden jewelry and suits to boy's family members) is another great expense. Kukaas/Namdharis have simple weddings and don't take Dhaaj which is why the problem of female abortion is not a problem amongst them. Sikhs need to go back to the basics and have simple weddings. The more they indulge in cultural traits which are against Gurmat the more they will suffer. Culture is good, but where ever culture starts to contradict Gurmat principals that aspect of ones culture should not be followed. It is a real shame and Laanat on any Amritdhari who takes Dhaaj and Lain Dhen during his wedding. If we Amritdharis cannot live by example then who will? Edited March 30, 2011 by Mithar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Kukaas/Namdharis have simple weddings and don't take Dhaaj which is why the problem of female abortion is not a problem amongst them How do you know namdhari don't have this problem? Is there any survey conducted.Namdhari list themselves as Hindu or Sikhs in census ,so it is impossible to identify that namdhari don't have this problem 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 And this one can't even be explained away by the straight lack of education (or penduness and whatnot) because we have urban classes doing the same shite as well. Practical and Real life is much more different than bookish life.All people need to start from their home to bring the change but unfortunately not 1% are ready to do it.People give Dowry because they want best for their daughter,the highest earning male from their community now obviously these type of men are in short supply so the only way is to offer dowry,O/W the option are settle for low earning man or your daughter will sit unmarried for life. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted March 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Practical and Real life is much more different than bookish life.All people need to start from their home to bring the change but unfortunately not 1% are ready to do it.People give Dowry because they want best for their daughter,the highest earning male from their community now obviously these type of men are in short supply so the only way is to offer dowry,O/W the option are settle for low earning man or your daughter will sit unmarried for life. Can you appreciate how backwards this all seems to someone whose grown up in the west? Again, I notice Indians by nature, just accept whatever shit happens around them as inevitable, no matter how messed up it is. This is a mindset problem (at least partially). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 30, 2011 Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Can you appreciate how backwards this all seems to someone whose grown up in the west? Again, I notice Indians by nature, just accept whatever shit happens around them as inevitable, no matter how messed up it is. This is a mindset problem (at least partially). Let me explain it to you with an example.If a Man is an IAS officer and he receives 10 proposals of arrange marriage then who will he marry if he decides to marry without dowry.Obviously he will go with the best looking girl,but what about other 9 girls,how will they receive these hi-fi husbands,the only option is their parents start bidding process to find highly succesful man for them. As far western mindset is concerned ,don't tell me you people don't give dowry.Is it because not the craze of visa that So many man just jump to marry a NRI girl so indirectly you people also contribute to this system.the only difference is it goes both ways Girls too marry for the sake visa to NRI men. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted March 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2011 Let me explain it to you with an example.If a Man is an IAS officer and he receives 10 proposals of arrange marriage then who will he marry if he decides to marry without dowry.Obviously he will go with the best looking girl,but what about other 9 girls,how will they receive these hi-fi husbands,the only option is their parents start bidding process to find highly succesful man for them. Well maybe it's time to stop approaching the matter like an auction then? As far western mindset is concerned ,don't tell me you people don't give dowry.Is it because not the craze of visa that So many man just jump to marry a NRI girl so indirectly you people also contribute to this system.the only difference is it goes both ways Girls too marry for the sake visa to NRI men. Well, seeing as the foeticide problem is strongest back home, why not empower yourselves to deal with it and not blame nris for it? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted March 31, 2011 Report Share Posted March 31, 2011 (edited) How do you know namdhari don't have this problem? Is there any survey conducted.Namdhari list themselves as Hindu or Sikhs in census ,so it is impossible to identify that namdhari don't have this problem Compared to the average Sikh, the Nadharis/Kukas are very strict and Pakkay in their principals. Have you seen their weddings? no matter how rich a Namdhari is, they have the simplest weddings. Both the bride and groom wear simple white cloths, no dhaaj, len dhen. Since they are much more strict than the average Sikh, they also do not do female infanticide. We may not agree with them on the Dehdhari Guru part, but they deserve credit where it is due. Edited March 31, 2011 by Mithar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zulu Posted March 31, 2011 Report Share Posted March 31, 2011 Compared to the average Sikh, the Nadharis/Kukas are very strict and Pakkay in their principals. Have you seen their weddings? no matter how rich a Namdhari is, they have the simplest weddings. Both the bride and groom wear simple white cloths, no dhaaj, len dhen. Since they are much more strict than the average Sikh, they also do not do female infanticide. We may not agree with them on the Dehdhari Guru part, but they deserve credit where it is due. True though it is changing, as one of my close frinds is a Namdhari who has played with many great Namdhari raagis such as Baljeet singh namdhari, he tells me about the 'new' breed of namdharis who now actually are wanting the big grand wedding, their satguru may have told them to have a simple wedding havan etc but now many want the weddings which are shown on tv and non namdharis have. Why would you want to change your practices just because you want to fit in todays society? The only reason Namdharis are strict is because their parents bring them up from a young age knowing about their history, ie kurbanis of the namdharis during british rule, the namdharis killed by canons etc, reading bani from a young age, learning saaj and raag(which they are amazing at!) where as normal sikhs dont have that luxury. Who here can genuinely say your parents did the same for you? wanted you to have a understand of your faith, and helped you to find your way to sikhi and taught you about it and explaining whats right and whats wrong? Punjabis are just greedy people and only care about themselfs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 31, 2011 Report Share Posted March 31, 2011 Well maybe it's time to stop approaching the matter like an auction then? Arrange marriage system is like give and take.You want something you have to give something.In a boy's case his career and his earning capability takes the major role while in Girl's case it is beauty and and character that are key factors followed by dowry.now if you just minus the dowry the key factor will remain beauty and character.Now there is no way to judge in the character in 2-3 meetings then beauty is going to remain the sole factor.So many girls these days delay their marriage to age 28 or more and start looking like aunties because of excessive workload,their salary's goes quite high upto that time so they want their husband's to be earning as high salaries as them and preferably in their field.On the other hand guys with handsome salaries of that age can easily marry a younger and more attractive girl if no dowry is involved.Now the theoritical solution is these type of women should start marrying guys with bad career and low salaries but in real life it is impossible to find a case like that.My own cousin went in marriage market late and she is now in late 30s.chances of her marriage are zero to none. So in other words Dowry and money plays a very important role finding a good mate for your daughter or sister and when the problem come's to personal level then people forget all theories and apply What is good for their near and dear one.They don't care what will be the impact of that on society. Well, seeing as the foeticide problem is strongest back home, why not empower yourselves to deal with it and not blame nris for it? Not at blaming Nri's.Just explaining how indirect dowry of visa plays a key role of finding best mate for them in India. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdsingh80 Posted March 31, 2011 Report Share Posted March 31, 2011 Compared to the average Sikh, the Nadharis/Kukas are very strict and Pakkay in their principals. Have you seen their weddings? no matter how rich a Namdhari is, they have the simplest weddings. Both the bride and groom wear simple white cloths, no dhaaj, len dhen. Since they are much more strict than the average Sikh, they also do not do female infanticide. We may not agree with them on the Dehdhari Guru part, but they deserve credit where it is due. Its good that they do simple marriage but how do we know that their is no female foeticide among them unless someone do a survey.Obviously no one is going to tell that he don't want a daughter and went for a female foeticide 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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