Satgyan-pujari Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 That above quote from KGM pretty much sums up when most Sikhs think of Nihangs. Just because you place them on some pedestal doesn't mean the rest of the Sikhs do. Did the Nihangs under Santa Singh not betray the Sikhs in 1984? You can spin the events of 1984 all you like but the cold hard fact is that he sided with Indira Gandhi against the Sikhs. You can go through life wearing blinkers with regard to this issue but acting like one of the three wise monkeys wont change the facts. Baba Santa Singh obviously had his reasons for the decisions he made, he may have thought that Darbar Sahib was not strategically or militarily an ideal location to confront the Indian army due to calculating the possible damage of this highly religious and sacred place of pilgrimage, or to put innocent worshippers and pilgrims in the line of fire. He also may have considered other facts resulting in his actions as Jathedar. Also he took the sewa of cleaning the Darbar premises after the attack and cremating the bodies of all the Shaheed Sikhs. and undertaking the controversial re-building of the Akal Takhat. Although Baba Santa Singh made his decisions, he did not think himself too big to ask for forgiveness and be labelled a tankayia, humbling himself infront of the Panth if they deemed his actions inappropriate. Surely a sign of a great man. What sewa Baba Santa Singh performed in his life and role as Jathedar, you or i could not perform in many lives. Stop insulting this mahpurush with your extreme one sided attacks on Nihangs. The last comment you made should be recited by yourself in front of a mirror as you may profit from your own words. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 (edited) If you had just accepted that you were misquoting KGM then there was no need to have gone through all of that. Also the apology and concession i made was to the wording of my original quote,accepting the criticism of Chatanga1 and yourself in the way that it could be open to interpretation and lacking clarity in the thought i wished to convey i.e, "...Blaming Nihang Singhs and Niddar Singh of the attack on Darbar Sahib 84, is the new low these people are prepared to stoop". This apology is in no way directed to KGM and should not be seen as a vindication of his highly ambiguous and insulting post, directed at all modern day Nihang practitioners of a puratan sampardaya. I still maintain he should clarify and explain the accusations and blame he is directing at this sampardaya in relation to the incidents surrounding 1984, and in any case apologize for the nindiya and insults contained in the post. Edited September 21, 2011 by Satgyan-pujari 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Pujari ji, I didn't make any recordings but people like Gyani Gurdev Singh Ji are easy enough to get in touch with in Southall, so things can easily be verified. As far as general Nihang beliefs vs Niddar Singh's beliefs are concerned, again Baba Surjeet Singh Ji and Baba Joginder Singh Ji can be easily contacted to set things straight. Infact, one of Niddar SIngh Ji's ex-students did post some recordings of Buddha Dal Mahapurkhs that refuted most of the claims made on the sites in question - think it was Kamalroop Singh, but it's been a long time. If MahaSingh ji has the recordings, then he should put them up. They are directed towards the webmaster of his sites. I've actually asked Niddar Singh about this before, now I'm 4000 miles away so it's not that easy. Matheen (i will use your full forum name out of respect) i don't doubt your meetings with these Baba's, i was just observing the fact that had you recorded these statements your claims would have been validated. If MahaSingh does have the said audio recordings, which i also don't doubt, then he has a stronger case in support of his evidence. Also to the last point you made it may help if you contact the webmasters directly to ascertain answers to your questions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zulu Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 25, 2011 Report Share Posted September 25, 2011 Baba Santa Singh obviously had his reasons for the decisions he made, he may have thought that Darbar Sahib was not strategically or militarily an ideal location to confront the Indian army due to calculating the possible damage of this highly religious and sacred place of pilgrimage, or to put innocent worshippers and pilgrims in the line of fire. He also may have considered other facts resulting in his actions as Jathedar. Also he took the sewa of cleaning the Darbar premises after the attack and cremating the bodies of all the Shaheed Sikhs. and undertaking the controversial re-building of the Akal Takhat. Although Baba Santa Singh made his decisions, he did not think himself too big to ask for forgiveness and be labelled a tankayia, humbling himself infront of the Panth if they deemed his actions inappropriate. Surely a sign of a great man. What sewa Baba Santa Singh performed in his life and role as Jathedar, you or i could not perform in many lives. Stop insulting this mahpurush with your extreme one sided attacks on Nihangs. Bro, Baba Santa Singh was not involved with the morcha from day 1 and neither were Dal Panth, organisationally. Why would he want to go to Darbar Sahib in the final stages of the morcha? Also Baba Ji did not cremate any dead bodies, neither did any Nihang Singhs with him. THe bodies were taken away from sweepers, who were forced by the Army and police to do it. They were allowed to keep any valuables they found on dead bodies as an incentive. Truck loads of bodies were burnt without identification, are you saying Baba Santa Singh was responsible for this? Also ravan sena did not relinquish control until they had cleared the place, and it was ready to bring in a repair team. Anurag Singhs book on this will tell you everything in detail. Baba Santa Singh went pesh, but it was the threat of SGPC recognising Balvir Singh as next leader of Dal Panth, that made him do this, as Balvir Singh has brought Dal Panth into disrepute, this was known by Baba Santa Singh that he would do this, and he tried his best to avoid it. True, Baba Santa Singh did a lot of sewa for Panth in his life, more than me, but he will not be remembered for it , but for his decision in 1984. Thats just the way of the world these days. I dont agree with what Baba Santa Singh did, but I wont disrespect him, and i know that you Nihangs dont agree with Sant Jarnail Singhs role, but you still disrespect him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 25, 2011 Report Share Posted September 25, 2011 (edited) i know that you Nihangs dont agree with Sant Jarnail Singhs role, but you still disrespect him. Don't make sweeping statements, not all Nihangs disrespect Sant Jarnail Singh ji. Edited September 25, 2011 by Satgyan-pujari 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 26, 2011 Report Share Posted September 26, 2011 Don't make sweeping statements, not all Nihangs disrespect Sant Jarnail Singh ji. apologies i meant nihangs on this forum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 apologies i meant nihangs on this forum. Still not all Nihangs on this forum dis-respect Sant Ji. Really, you seem too intelligent to make these kind of accusations. Please don't let your personal grievance cloud your judgement. Anyway which Nihangs on this forum have insulted Sant Jarnail Singh ji, please back this up with the quotes or retract the accusation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matheen Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 Also to the last point you made it may help if you contact the webmasters directly to ascertain answers to your questions. Satgyan-pujari, many have contacted the webmasters , even spoken personally, from day one (some before the site went live) but it didn't make any difference, nor were any answers forthcoming. Said it before, controversy sells. There are many posts, most of them made way back, by some of Niddar Singh's original students on this site to back up what Chatanga wrote. You'd be surprised at some of the stuff those lot got up to and the consequences their actions / behaviour had on a large number of young people trying to find their way in Sikhi. Anyway, this topic seems to have run its course but will leave it open for a few more days - until the next time I'm near civilisation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 30, 2011 Report Share Posted September 30, 2011 (edited) There are many posts, most of them made way back, by some of Niddar Singh's original students on this site to back up what Chatanga wrote. You'd be surprised at some of the stuff those lot got up to and the consequences their actions / behaviour had on a large number of young people trying to find their way in Sikhi. Anyway, this topic seems to have run its course but will leave it open for a few more days - until the next time I'm near civilisation. However posts made way back by a few individuals, is hardly justification to brand all Nihangs on this forum with accusations and insults. I am willing to listen to reasoned and intelligent debate, and to change my views in light of superior supporting arguments, however this cannot be achieved through harsh words and insults. We are all on a road of discovery and forums of this type are an invaluable tool to learn, discuss and with the Will of Akal Purakh bring us closer to Sikhi, which at the end of the day should be our only aspiration. WJKK WJKF Edited September 30, 2011 by Satgyan-pujari 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipledgeblue Posted November 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2011 The best response they could come up with in a different thread before locking it, the thread is about gatka lineage: http://www.sikhsangat.com/Index.php?/topic/62702-gatka-akharas-lineages/page__st__20 PAL 07 <p class="author_info" style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 15px; padding-right: 10px; padding-bottom: 15px; padding-left: 10px; width: 155px; float: left; font-size: 12px; text-align: center; "> Meethay Har Gun Gaavo Jindoo Too Members839 posts<p class="post_body" style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 10px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 185px; padding-top: 15px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; "> Posted 06 October 2011 - 10:48 AM As i stated earlier i am also learning Gatka but i forgot to mention my lineage which i am no way ashamed to hide, but you guys will definitely wish you was part of my school. The lineage is thus: 1. Akali Baba Yip-Man (who learnt directly from Akali Akaal Mahakal) 2. Akali Baba Bruce Lee aka Lee Jun Fan 3. Akali Baba Brandon Lee 4. Akali Baba Frank Dux (Undisputed Champion of the secret Kumatai) 5. Akali Baba Jean-Claude Van Damme 6. Akali Baba Jackie Chan 7. Akali Baba Jet-Li 8. Present Gurdev Akali Baba PAL 07 Sikh Kung-Fu Puratan Chandar Bansia Ganesh Akhara. I am yet to start my business as a martial arts teacher but i guarantee you next year i won't change the name of my Akhara as this is the proper lineage passed down to me. Trust me on this, but i am still in the process of creating a new religion so hand on tight if you wanna become my disciple. Jai Ling sorry i should have said WJKK WJKF Like This How Can I Enter God's Kingdom? What Words Sh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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