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Sat1176

Sweet Nectar Taste in Mouth From Simran

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I'm going to start a new topic for this sensation and see if we can document what the different meditation practices say it is. There are references to this phenomenon in Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji so we will accept it existence. Secondly I will confirm first hand as already stated in the experience topic that this sensation has been happening to me for quite a while. Initially it lasted for only a couple of days then went away, then it came back again and it stayed a bit longer and so on. Now it has got to the stage for the past month or so where I'm experiencing it all day everyday.

 

So let's start....

 

How do you know if you have Entered a state of meditation?

 

How do you determine, then, if you have reached a state of meditation? In fact, there are three responses that indicate this state of mind, and they are easily determined during or right after your Dahn Yoga class.

 

Firstly, sweet saliva pools in your mouth. This phenomenon occurs when you are relaxed and the water energy in your spinal cord and brain flows smoothly.

Conversely, anyone with nervous tension can probably remember having a dry mouth. This means that your mind was not able to maintain a meditative state and that water energy doesnt flow well in your body and brain. In fact, the incredible taste of the tea after class is due to the sweet saliva in your mouth produced by the Dahn Yoga exercise!

 

Secondly, your head becomes cool and your lower belly becomes warm. This is the effect of Water Up Fire Down, a phenomenon in which water energy from the kidneys circulates upward to the head and fire energy from your head and chest flows downward. This same phenomenon also brings warmth to your hands and feet.

 

Thirdly, a smile spreads across your face. This means that idle and negative thoughts and emotions have decreased and youve reached a positive state of awareness. This is reflected in your smile after Dahn Yoga classesa smile that is purely natural and authentic because it bursts automatically from your heart without thought or judgment.

 

If you have experienced these conditions after a Dahn Yoga class, it means that you did indeed enter a meditative state. These three ways of checking the state of your mind and condition will be a helpful reminder for you to bring focus and energy back to your body, your dahnjon, and your smile!

 

http://www.dahnyoga.com/community/news_and_articles_details.aspx?id=1764

Edited by Sat1176

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Many people in the west are now realizing that there are alternative ways to regaining health and vitality. One of those ways is a type of physical exercise called Qi Gong. Qigong is an ancient method of meditation that emerged from indigenous Chinese culture. This form of exercise can be traced back several thousand years. If one were to read Lao Tzu's works, even he mentioned that the 'ancients' practiced tu na (literally translated as inhalation of fresh air, while exhaling carbon dioxide). If you do the research, this will tell you that he was referring to Qigong!

Since these exercises came from Ancient Taoism, there is no specific way to meditate or do Qigong because this would violate the natural principals of Taoism. The ancients would study the body and found that the human body was a wonderful vessel that was capable of creating different kinds of energies and fluids within itself. If practiced correctly, Qigong/Meditation can cause the body to secrete what the ancients called "Jade Nectar" (a sweet fragrant saliva that comes from the upper pallet that is swallowed). Basically, when one has opened all the meridians in the body, the Pituitary gland will release it's very needed Growth Hormone. What most people don't know is that this hormone is what stops being released into our bodies as it did when we were children, and the aging process is unrestricted. That's why we get old, injuries do not heal, and well, you know the rest. Once the pituitary gland is working normally, old injuries will start to heal, some may experience their hair getting it's color back, loose teeth begin to get firm, and loss of wrinkles, the bone marrow will begin to grow, and many more benefits.

http://voices.yahoo.com/qi-gong-meditation-look-feel-614008.html

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http://www.meditationexpert.com/yoga-kung-fu/y_pre-samadhi_stage_of_ching-an_pliancy_lightness_peace.htm

Before someone achieves the state of samadhi, they always experience the state which Chinese call "ching-an," which means clear and peaceful. In Tibetan Esotericism, it refers to the stage of pliancy, and in Chinese Confucianism is referred to as "Springtime." I've been through and then lost ching-an several times myself, so I can verify all the following characteristics of the state which have been described by a variety of spiritual traditions. In a moment I'll relate my own experiences. Ching-an is so easy to recognize because the signs are unmistakable, and it's such a low stage of the cultivation path that I wonder why all the modern day gurus, Zen masters and others never mention it.

When restlessness and torpor both disappear, and the mind suddenly fixes on a single thing in the absence of sleep and restlessness, then lightness occurs. For some, this sensation begins at the top of the head, whereas for others it originates in the soles of the feet.

When lightness begins at the top of the head, the top of the head feels fresh and cool as if cream were being gently poured over. The Buddhists and Taoists call this "internal baptism." This sensation circulates around the entire body, the mind is rested, the body is relaxed, and one feels so soft and flexible that it often seems as if the bones themselves have dissolved. It is then natural for the body to become straight as a pine tree. The mind is clear and there are no feelings of restlessness or torpor in response to external surroundings. One experiences a natural state of joy. This experience of lightness, however, eventually disappears.

When lightness originates in the soles of the feet, one experiences sensations of either coolness or warmth, which move upward to the top of the head. It often feels as if this lightness moves beyond physical boundaries to penetrate the sky. The lightness that originates from the soles is much easier to retain than the lightness that originates at the top of the head. It does not disappear quite so easily.

Confucianists say that a person has the sense of spring when he has attained a state of quietude. Spring indicates feelings of warmth, growth, freshness, and joy. These feelings accompany experiences of lightness during meditation.

Lightness gradually fades when one is forced to deal with mundane affairs and cannot sustain his efforts to progress further. Thus, if possible, it is often best for a person who has reached this state to live alone in a quiet place.

Oftentimes one who continues to cultivate will notice that this phenomenon of lightness grows weak, but this does not mean that it actually fades away. On the contrary, if one remains in this state for a long while, the sensation of lightness will not appear to be as strong as it was at the beginning. It is very much like eating new food for the first time. In the beginning the taste is intensely fresh, but the continual eating of this same food day after day dulls the flavor and it will not appear to be nearly so refreshing as it was initially.

If one continues to maintain the state of lightness without interruption, then one's samadhi will become firm and stable. One will feel calm and clear. The ch'i channels throughout the entire body will undergo various changes, and the body will feel warm and harmonious and as if one is experiencing a strong internal orgasm. These feelings are difficult to describe but the Chinese often say that one is "internally touched by wonderful pleasures." A person can detach himself from worldly desires only by progressing to this point.

During the appearance of the state of ching-an, it's common for the pituitary gland to secrete a sweet tasting hormone that appears in your saliva, and which you should readily swallow. This sweet secretion is not an imaginary phenomenon because it can be objectively tasted by any third party who kisses you, and all the cultivation schools of the world are consistent in insisting that this sweet nectar secretion helps to banish internal illness and extend your longevity. The Hatha Yoga Pradipika says, "The yogi who drinks the pure stream of nectar is freed from disease, has longevity, and has a body as soft and as beautiful as a lotus stem." It also says, "It is like milk, ghee, or honey. Fatal diseases, old age and weapons are warded off [upon drinking it]. From [drinking this nectar], immortality and the eight siddhis or perfections will manifest."

Switching to a different cultivation school, the Taoist alchemical primer Tsan-tung-chi (Triplex Unity) comments,

These are just two minor references to this phenomenon as there are many more extensive references to this process in almost every cultivation tradition. In Medieval alchemist Michael Maier's Atalanta Fugiens, the 9th picture (emblem) describes the state perfectly ("Enclose the old man and the tree in a house of dew, and eating of its fruit he will be made young"). Even the Bible (Judges 15:19) may give a reference to the state when it says, "God clave a hollow place that was in the jaw, and there came water thereout; and when he had drunk, his spirit came again, and he revived."

The sweet nectar [sweet pituitary hormone] moistened their skin and flesh,
Their tendons and bones were soft and strong.
They expelled all the internal toxins from the body,
And constantly preserved their true energy [jing and real chi].
Having accumulated these effects over a long time,
Their bodies were transformed, and they became immortals [sages].

That's possibly ching-an once again.

The point is, over and over again you'll find this sweet salivary hormone secretion mentioned as among the very earliest stages of cultivation -- the pre-samadhi stage -- and if you are a biochemist or doctor seeking to unlock the secrets of anti-aging and longevity, this is the premier substance you should be working to isolate and then duplicate.

In fact, its existence should be a starting point of any multidisciplinary true cultivation, anti-aging, and mind-body research.

As another Taoist text, the Wu-jen p'ien (Understanding Reality), also describes this sweet salivary hormone from the pituitary gland:

You must remember that spiritual cultivation specifies two major types of medicine for the body's health and longevity: nei-dan, or internal medicine, and wai-dan, or external medicine. External medicines can be divided into three types: human, earthly and heavenly medicines.

Everyone originally has the medicine of immortality within.
However, they have lost their understanding and thrown it away.
When the sweet dew [the hormone] descends, sky and earth will be joined.
The place where the yellow sprouts grow is where k'an and li interact.
A frog in a well will say there is no dragon's cave.
How can a quail know about a phoenix's nest?
When the elixir is mature, gold will naturally fill the room [the stage of internal illumination due to the chi becoming full],
Why need to look for plants [special longevity herbs] or burn reeds [pray to
Heaven for longevity]?

The earthly medicines are things like plants and minerals which you ingest. The heavenly medicines are divine medicines and divine responses received when you work hard at your spiritual cultivation or you pray for heavenly help and have the merit to receive a response. Human medicine would include an activity like sexual cultivation with another which can help cure your body, balance your chi or help you with your cultivation in other ways.

The highest sort of medicine is none of these but internal medicine, which is your own jing, chi and shen. Your own jing, chi and shen are the top of all forms of medicine in existence.

For instance, the Can Tong Qi (Combining Similars Together) by Wei Bo-yang, details how to combine cultivation of the five elements of your body with medicines and cultivation principles of the I-Ching, Lao Tzu, astronomy and so forth. Within this text, he even tells how you can use the light of your own mind to internally look at your body inside. By focusing upon any diseased part and viewing it within through inner vision, in this way you can use your own shen to cure yourself.

As to this sweet salivary hormone, it, too, is just another example of your own internal medicine, or nei dan, and it will bring about all sorts of beneficial physical transformations.

This sweet salivary hormone is actually the famous "soma" of the Hindu Vedas, "ambrosia" of the Greeks," madya" (divine wine) of the Tantras, "sweet wine" of the Sufis, and "amrita" nectar of the Gods.

It is also the "grail wine" of the Medieval Christian mystics and the "fountain of youth" of European legends.

It's known in countless spiritual cultivation schools and you can find it mentioned everywhere not because it's been a popular symbol to pass along from school to school, but because it's such a low stage of achievement. It's a nondenominational stage of the cultivation path. Being such a low stage of achievement, all genuine spiritual schools have practitioners who go through it on the way to samadhi, and it's a stage of attainment which is unmistakable when it manifests.

In Taoist terms, this is the precursor stage to samadhi which corresponds to the transformations of jing to chi, and the opening of the jen-mai and tu-mai channels.

In Indian yoga and Esoteric Buddhism, it corresponds to the opening of the left and right channels, or ida and pingala channels.

In the Judaic tradition, the opening of these two chi channels is symbolized by the construction of the Boaz and Jachin pillars in the Temple of King Solomon. It's interesting that the reason the construction plans of this temple figure so importantly in Western spiritual literature is because the temple plans actually symbolize our physical body, and people who succeed in cultivation tend to discover this quite naturally.

The salivary secretions which occur during the stage of ching-an are unusually sweet, but this sweetness will also vary at times (as will the thickness or viscosity of this secretion) due to a predominance of what the Hindu schools call the five tattwas, or five elements.

Hindu yoga explains that an earth predominating tattwa would cause this secretion to be very sweet, a bit of excessive fire tattwa would make this sweetness a little bitter, and excessive air tattwa leads to a slightly acidic taste. You can actually taste the meaning of the "five elements" as this hormone takes on various flavors.

This is the theoretical explanation from the Indian cultivation schools whereas the explanations from the Chinese cultivation schools differ because they use a different medical system. Nevertheless, the idea is the same: the flavor and consistency of this hormone can and will change over time because of different cultivation and physical conditions. From my own experience it gets more refined the longer you experience the state, but at the initial stages it's more viscous than later. The sweetness intensity also varies as well.

I have experienced the sweet dew many times myself so as to be able to verify its actual existence, and from my own experience I can say that it will appear when you cultivate intensely, but if you stop your cultivation for several days then it will also disappear as well. There will be a momentum continuance for several days, but if you stop your meditation work altogether, the state of ching-an will disappear. You can cultivate to initiate this phenomena and then have it appear for quite some time, but you must continue cultivating if you want to reach the next stage of spiritual attainment.One of the big dangers to losing this stage is sex.

If you lose your jing because of sex, you'll lose the state and the refined chi that was responsible for initiating this stage. That's why you need to be celibate for at least 100 days to pass through this stage when it occurs. Then again you can also initiate this stage if you have sexual relations without orgasm/ejaculation and so "perform" that your chi ascends up your mai into your head to initiate the release of this hormone. While sharing the sweet saliva with your partner through kissing will help the other, don't think that this sharing is actually the crux of sexual cultivation.

If you think that swapping fluids is sexual cultivation then you'll think that absorbing chi or jing from your part is sexual cultivation. Gosh, so many authors on this subject out there and they're all wrong.

The purpose of sexual cultivation is simply to activate your chi and chi mai so that you experience a state of emptiness. It's simply another way to get there when you have a partner. If you really succeed in achieving emptiness through sexual cultivation, you can stand up and look at your body but you "won't be able to find your body." Your mind will become as big as your room, city, state or universe ... depending upon the stage of emptiness you reach you'll actually be able to feel the borders of these things with your mind ... and then you'll realize what it's like when a bit of chi goes through your central chi channel.

I can also confirm that it is much easier to generate this coolness stage of ching-an from the top of the head and have it proceed downwards than to proceed from the feet and go upwards. That's one of the reasons Buddha wanted people to perform the skeleton meditation starting with the toes and Christianity calls this the stage of cultivation the "washing of the feet." The head-borne ching-an is quite easy to produce if you combine certain chi-gong methods with skeleton visualization and breathing practices, but I never recommend these combinations to other people because they always get attached to them and think it's true cultivation whereas it's just expedient means.

There are so many cultivation methods you cannot teach to others because people who haven't cultivated a lot lack the wisdom to differentiate between expedient means and real cultivation, and because they would drop right into attachment. That's why many Tibetan monks are not introduced to "higher stag" teachings until 20 years of previous study and effort. The only time it's proper to teach someone these things is if they have high wisdom or you watch them every day and are there to tell them to stop the practice once you see they've achieved the outcome. Then you simply switch them to another practice without calling too much attention to the fact.

The propensity for misunderstanding and attachment is so great with these methods that I never like people to follow esoteric school teachings, nor does Master Nan. I can't tell you how many disasters we've both seen originating from Tibetan Buddhism, Taoism and yoga where people become too attached to all these form methods. I know so many methods to help someone make progress quickly but they are just too dangerous to teach because people have little wisdom -- no matter how much you try to warn them not to do this or that.

Master Nan was recognized as an enlightened master by the Hutuku of Tibet, so his stage of realization is far higher than any Rinpoche, most of whom do not have samadhi attainments let alone are enlightened. That means he's actually been certified as an enlightened master of the Esoteric school of Buddhism, and yet he never tells people to go that way. I'm the only student I know of whom he's ever taught concerning the esoteric schools, including demonstrating superpowers and the like.

Master Nan always tells me that in years of teaching in Taiwan and China he's never been able to find anyone he could teach this stuff, and that people who fall into the form schools end up producing habits of attachment that cut off their wisdom life. The danger, he says, is that they form habits that become barriers for life after life after life, so he never teaches those things to any students because they will cut off their wisdom life. It doesn't so much matter that you don't achieve enlightenment in this life as long as you don't cut off your wisdom life, because if you do, everyone else will pass you in two or three lives while you still remain attached to cultivating this body of form.

I cannot comment on his observations, but I tell you frankly that you cannot practice esoteric techniques at all unless you have a very good master, and most of the masters I've seen in the esoteric schools have actually produced barriers for their own cultivation because of these techniques that they use, especially the Tibetan Buddhists. They actually cling to methods that put a ceiling on their own possible attainments, and so you know in this life they will keep beating their head against the wall and never get the Tao.

Perhaps the answer lies in what Asvaghosha wrote in The Awakening of Faith, which is one of the highest literary sources for a discussion on our ultimate nature and how to reach it. The Awakening of Faith says, "It should be understood that Suchness is the foundation of [all ] samadhi. If a man keeps practicing it, then he will gradually be able to develop countless other kinds of samadhi. … [On the other hand] Those who practice the various types of dhyana (meditation) and samadhi which are popular in the world will develop much attachment to their flavors and will be bound to the triple world."

My own teacher says it's very hard to help these fellows ... even though they have attained samadhi! Of course that's the Tibet school and what you find in most of yoga today. As to most of the Tao school practitioners, nowadays they don't even make it that far.

Honestly. Seriously. Truthfully. I kid you not with what I've just told you.

Today modern science promotes DHEA, melatonin, human growth hormone, estrogen, progesterone and other hormone treatments for anti-aging purposes, but the sweet tasting hormone substance of ching-an should absolutely, without doubt, be the major focus of anti-aging hormone research.

You have to consider that samadhi attainments are the only thing that can lead to a healthy quality-of-life longevity, and this is the major hormone (amongst several) which initiates the physical transformations of the chi and mai which enable this to happen. Thus it represents a more direct relationship to the cures for illness, aging and mental imbalance than the piecemeal battles fought by this or that other hormone.

Furthermore, to understand this sweet hormone you must remember the consistency in its appearance across cultivation schools and the fact that every major cultivation traditional in existence, including schools which are thousands of years old and established on different continents, independently assert that this salivary secretion is responsible for anti-aging and anti-illness effects! Thus if people wish to do anti-aging and anti-illness research, the focus should be directed to identifying this hormone as well as the changes which it initiates in the biophysical organism.

This is the real youth-producing soma, or grail wine of the ancients.

Taoism offers abundant descriptions of the descension of this "sweet nectar" or "dew," and this particular cultivation achievement can often been seen in the illustrated European medieval alchemy books. It sometimes occurs to those who engage in the right sort of dual sexual cultivation--if the practitioners have cleaned their mai to a certain degree--and a very minor semblance phenomenon (lacking the factors of true sweetness or abundance) can also manifest to those who have relatively clean mai and who engage in prolonged athletic activities such as running. ... But don't jump to the conclusion that this substance is an endorphin, because it's not. It is a sweet tasting endocrine secretion, of a very unique nature, which only manifests as a result of the purificatory processes of cultivation.

Don't get the idea that it's all in your mind as well, because if someone were to kiss you they would definitely ask you why your saliva tastes sweet.

But the sweet dew is not the only phenomenon that occurs during ching an. When it happens, you'll also feel like a cool vapor -- similar to dry ice -- is bathing your limbs and body and floating upwards into the sky. You'll look around to see if it's air conditioning but it's ching-an. As it progresses even further, it will feel like your body is an empty sack of skin, and the bones inside have disappeared.

The feeling of physical coolness, mental lightness and emptiness, and secretion of this sweet saliva is a nondenominational stage which occurs along the path of preliminary approach to samadhi, and is commonly found in all genuine cultivation schools. Some religions call it the state of "blessedness" when it manifests, and some call it "baptism." In Tibetan Buddhism, when you achieve this state, that's a real empowerment rather than the symbolic ones the monks give you in ceremonies.

Why is it a nondenominational phenomenon? Because it always occurs when you're opening the chi channels in advance of samadhi attainments.

In terms of the "mind-body" terminology which is popular today, this is a purely naturalistic hormonal event which occurs when you cultivate the mind, and is physically responsible for biochemically initiating a whole series of other physical changes that lead to health and youthfulness. This hormone helps you purify your body in so many ways.

You can even find this phenomena described in an obscure school like Alexandrine Gnosticism where the "perfect man" descends into the "Virgin's womb" [the tan-tien or lower abdomen], removes the "impurity contaminating the firstborn of water" [the meditator cultivates to purify their jing seminal essence], washes himself [the chi starts to circulate all over the body] and drinks from the "living waters" [the sweet pituitary gland secretion descends].

The Taoist master Huan Yuan-chi said, "In terms of cultivation, when fire warms water, pure yang arises. When water cools fire, 'sweet dew' appears."

Now people often read ancient cultivation texts and think the descriptions within are merely symbolic or allegorical ramblings, but this particular phenomenon just goes to show they are often descriptions of the many physical aspects of the cultivation process which science has yet to discover.

People today say they're being rigorously scientific and pooh-pooh these descriptions as nonsense, but when you find the same phenomena described across different cultivation schools varying with time and place, you have to recognize that there must be something to the commonality of descriptions. Furthermore, since it's such a low stage of achievement, you can easily cultivate it to prove its existence for yourself. It's just that so few cultivate that they rarely achieve these states and if you don't cultivate you'll never experience it. How many times has science denied the existence of a phenomenon despite repeated reports of people experiencing it?

On this we must note that for five years Wilber and Orville Wright made scores of public flying demonstrations, but were derided and dismissed as a hoax by Scientific American, the New York Herald, the US Army and most American scientists!

It's true!

Even Thomas Edison was called a trickster -- despite an enviable track record of previous successful inventions and patents -- when he claimed he had developed the light bulb. The academics of his day derided Edison saying that it defied the laws of physics and therefore couldn't work. Therefore he must be lying.

You see, the very same condition holds true for the claims we're making of cultivation science. People do not cultivate these states themselves so they say they don't exist. They don't cultivate themselves so they say all these consistent commentaries and descriptions across religions are fictions, fabrications or lies. People just cannot accept these things because it's outside their range of experience and prior indoctrination.

Here's the short of it. If you want to experience these things you have to cultivate correctly to a certain stage of attainment and if you don't experience that phenomenon, it means your cultivation isn't good enough.

But people don't like to hear that ... "How can I not be good enough?" they say to themselves, "I'm the special one." A famous professor of education once explained it when he said we all admire sports stars and give them scholarships in college because we all know we cannot duplicate their feats, but we don't give the same admiration or respect to smart people who win academic scholarships because we all feel deep inside that we're just as smart.

Everyone feels they're smart or special. In fact, I cannot tell you how many intelligent people have told me they were enlightened or have seen the Tao and they hadn't opened up any chi mai at all. It makes me laugh, it makes me cry, it makes me sick.

Of course one day science will eventually attach empirical measurements and analysis to various gong-fu phenomena and say it discovered them, but you can find all these things openly mentioned and analyzed in the cultivation schools of the past. Nevertheless I guarantee that scientists will say they have discovered them. But I can only say time and again that the form and process of cultivation is a science whose principles have been clearly revealed in many spiritual schools, many of which have organized these phenomena into various stages of the path.

To prove these things you just have to cultivate yourself, so don't be waiting for science to catch up with the ancient findings and then say "Hey, they were right." In fact, the whole process of analyzing the esoteric changes of cultivation up to the stages of the first dhyana (if it makes it that far, which is unlikely) will probably require at least two to three to four hundred years of progress and investigation, and this is the next great evolution to be expected of the Western spiritual (and scientific) path.

So if you cultivate you will attain them and if you don't attain them, it simply means that your stage isn't high enough yet. It certainly doesn't mean they don't exist ... it simply means that your gong-fu isn't high enough.

To leap ahead and see the results that science will eventually confirm, you need but go back to the descriptions of cultivation phenomena already provided by Buddhism, Taoism, Tantra, alchemy and yoga. Furthermore, you can research the so-called legends of ancient cultures to find the relevant cultivation processes disguised within.

Thus no matter how the various cultures of the world try to disguise their descriptions of common cultivation phenomena, when you've experienced the relevant gong-fu and know the relevant theory, you'll be able to understand everything at a glance.

Edited by Sat1176

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IMO Brahm trancends any of the senses, to focus on tastes, sounds, sights etc is a distraction away from the truth of Brahm.

Agreed Bro, time to move on. Got some answers I was looking for so back on path.... Now will just learn to live with the sensation and not get to hung up on it. But if my white hairs turn black again I will let you know. hehehehehe ;)

Edited by Sat1176

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Maha Singh, Did you meditate without the Gurmantar and just focus on the breath or sit silently and just observe?

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You say "did" like its the past tense. Meditation should occur at every moment of your life, walking, sitting, standing, sleeping, breathing.

The Gurmantar is sung and praised forever and ever, it is through this singing that you open your heart and understand what Brahm is.

Smile! Enjoy life! Love everyone and everything, for everything is Brahm, infinte Love!

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You say "did" like its the past tense. Meditation should occur at every moment of your life, walking, sitting, standing, sleeping, breathing.

The Gurmantar is sung and praised forever and ever, it is through this singing that you open your heart and understand what Brahm is.

Smile! Enjoy life! Love everyone and everything, for everything is Brahm, infinte Love!

Because have noticed from your posts you say think nothing, desire nothing, go beyond sights and sound like it's easy. I'm inferring you have. Yes I totally agree this is the goal/state we are working towards, however learners like me on this path have not achieved such a state where by we can close our eyes and the mind sits perfectly still in peace or elevated bliss. After a few seconds we are bombarded with thoughts and need tools whether it be the gurmantar, anhad to bring the mind back from these vichars and more one pointed so we can push deeper within. If I left the mind to it's own devices I don't think it would sit still and would go thinking thought after thought.... Only other option as I understand it is to become the observer behind the mind and its thoughts which I'm guessing is like Waheguru himself. Long way off being like that. Just beginning to understand and grasp the fact that the true self is somewhere behind the body, breath and mind. Saying and actually experiencing are completely two different things.

Who said spirituality was easy. :unsure:

Edited by Sat1176

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Not every meditation session will be the same, nor will you achieve the stage of the journey as before. Your experiences since the previous time, and your current state of mind will have a big affect on how well you stay seated in a mindless state.

You have the tools to walk the path, but you must hold steadfast onto one particular tool. Do not jump from one facet to another (One day focussing on nostrils, next on sights and next on audibles), each tool will need to evolve into a stronger tool with heightened awareness.

Spend a long time honing your awareness, do not even expect anything special. Even when you experience something, ignore it, just sit and watch/listen, do not analyse or even try to understand it. When you try to contexualise what you are experiecing, your mind goes haywire and everything unravels like a dream. Just do it with Love and appreciate Creation for what it is, Life.

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Fair point Singh.

Sometimes experiences are so overwhelming that one can find it very difficult to deal with. You don't understand what you did that caused it, what is causing it. Take this topic, for weeks it became so intense that my mind was constantly drawn to this experience. I found it very difficult to pull my mind away from this sensation because every time I swallowed there was the intense sweet taste that my taste buds found difficult to ignore. I didn't know why it was happening except that it was a good sign and to keep on swallowing. Sometimes you just want a little more clarity so you can better deal with the situation. Now I have that it doesn't seem to bother me as much. I now think of it as a milestone confirming I'm on the right path which can be reassuring and even encouraging to move forward and beyond. Before it was eating me up inside and I was beginning to detest it and just wanted it to go away. Having knowledge of something can never be a bad thing in fact I am so happy I was determined to investigate it further because it has also shone a little more light on to the path ahead and also clarified and other concepts and practices that I had heard but didn't fully comprehend. My core will always remain the same which is to focus on the sound of the gurmantar or anhad.

Happy japping folks.

Edited by Sat1176

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In my view, it's ok to play around with experiences as long as you have Brahmn in the back of your mind. man Ram nama bedhiale jaise kanak kala chit mandialey. Sant Namdev ji says his mind was penetrated by Ram naam the way a gold smithing has penetrated the mind of a goldsmith! He describes a little boy flying a kite and talking to his friends at the same time. Although he was talking to his friends he kept awareness on the string, cheet su doru rakhialay. He describes the cows let out for grazing in the field. She goes many miles away but cheeet su bachra rakhialay, keeps her calf in mind. Similarly one can experience things and enjoy those experiences (or even detest them) whilst their consciousness has Brahmn in there.

Satt when I first saw the name of the thread, I thought you was experiencing sweat in saliva or something. LOL

Edited by BhagatSingh

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This is the only medical explanation I could find.

The symptoms that are being described point to a condition called ketoacidosis. The condition is typically benign, but it is important to pay attention to it if you are a diabetic. Diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA) is a condition caused by untreated hyperglycemia. If you have diabetes, it can present as a life-threatening condition for obvious reasons.

It is not terribly uncommon in individuals who don’t have diabetes. It often manifests when one is particularly dehydrated while still consuming a good deal of sugar in the diet. It is often accompanied by foamy saliva or rope-like saliva. It is generally accompanied by dry-mouth as well.

When talking about the presence of ketones (any of a class of organic compounds containing a carbonyl group, CO, attached to two alkyl groups, as CH3COCH3 or CH3COC2H5) in the body, it is important to think about a few things. Sometimes there is not enough insulin in your blood to deal with the sugar that is also in your blood. This condition is known as diabetes and is easily tested for by processing a clinical blood exam called an A1-C.

For those people who are not diabetic and still experiencing these symptoms, there are answers. When we deprive ourselves of nourishment and hydration, our body basically switches to starvation mode. At this point, a person’s fat supplies become the primary energy source utilized to keep things up and running. Instead of deriving energy from the nutrients we take in from food and water, the body turns the fat into the energy boost. As certain fats are released and used by the cells in the body, they are converted into ketones, which are utilized far slower than they are made. Consequently, ketones become increasingly concentrated in the blood and the levels begin to rise. At this point, because the system is not doing what it is supposed to be doing with food and water, the kidneys activate a mechanism to rid the excessive ketones through the urine. In cases where diabetes is an issue, one will find that glucose begins leaking into the urine as well. This is called renal glycosuria. When this happens, the kidneys are going to begin filtering the fluid you have in your body with a greater efficiency in an effort to expel the ketones in an attempt to regain homeostasis in the body. The problem with this situation is that there is no fluid coming in, so you add to the vicious cycle and further dehydrate yourself.

Ketoacidosis can develop very suddenly over the course of a few hours, depending on the condition of your body. It could take up to several days for it to manifest. While it is not life threatening for those people who don’t have diabetes, it can be a bad sign if you are insulin dependent. You need to look out for the signs:

Dehydration

Excessive thirst

Frequent urination

Occasional vomiting

Nausea

Drowsiness

**Sweet saliva**

Treatment of ketoacidosis in people who are not diabetic is fairly simple. Your body is telling you that you are eating or have been eating a lot of sugar (carbohydrates), but have not been taking in other nutrients in an effort to give the pancreas time to secrete enough insulin to offset the glucose intake. The best thing you can do for yourself is to drink lots of water. This may sound very trite, but we are organisms that are comprised of nearly 90% water. If we do not take in what we put out, the balance in the body is set off significantly. Don’t drink soda, juice, or any of these power drinks on the market. Drink water. Some of the sport drinks are okay, but your body doesn’t have to do anything with water as it is consumed. The more you mess around with liquid, the more tasks you give your body during a time when it needs simple tasks to complete.

The other part of remedying the issue is eating a good balanced meal. Take in some vegetables, meats (or equivalent proteins if you are a vegetarian), and some complex starches. Try to avoid sugary foods, particularly if the sugar is coming from sweeteners. There is sugar and then there is stuff like high-fructose corn syrup, which is going to the extreme.

As the body is rehydrated and has some fuel to use (besides fat), these symptoms are going to resolve on their own. You can test the efficacy of your endeavors by going to the pharmacy and asking for urine analysis strips, or more specifically, urine test strips designed to test for ketones in the urine. They can be purchased over the counter. If you are spilling ketones into the urine, you have an issue and if you cannot resolve it on your own, you need to see your doctor. There should not be any ketones in your urine, as a rule. You can also test your blood glucose levels. Most pharmacies around the country offer free glucose testing. It is always good to go in after having fasted for at least 12 hours so you can get a trough level of glucose in the blood. This number will tell you what your body is doing when it has gone 12 hours without food. With that information, you can better formulate how it is you can change your diet and your fluid intake. The condition will pass if you are vigilant and thorough.

For those individuals who have diabetes, either Type I or II, you need to seek out the care of a doctor should you experience this sweet spit situation.

When in doubt, always keep yourself well hydrated, whether symptoms are present or not. People are amazed at the medical trouble they keep themselves out of by staying well hydrated. Your target range should be no less than ten glasses of eight fluid ounces of water a day.

Note: If you are dieting and are losing more than three pounds per week, you are likely going to be spilling ketones in your urine. This happens when we lose weight, but especially so if we are losing weight because we are not eating. People with eating disorders like anorexia nervosa will have high ketone levels in both the blood and urine. Endeavor not to starve yourself.

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Sat

I dunno if taht applies to people experiencing this during meditation, where the meditator's diet or water intake has not changed.

They are saying that if you don't drink enough water and eat lots of sugars/carbs you will have sweet saliva and urine. Well no duh! lol

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I'm not so sure if I can rule it out as I've put on a lot of weight over the past year, especially around the mid section. My uncle doctor was telling me to loose it otherwise I'm setting myself up for diabetes plus I'm not a big water drinker and do have a sweet tooth. I don't think I'm dehydrated though. Whether I've taken too much sugar and my body is now having trouble coping might be possible.

Also mine manifests all the time even when I don't do simran. Although I am noticing it does calm down but one strong simran session and it's back. Let's just hope it's bhagati related and not medical. Might just get my blood sugar levels tested for peace of mind.

Edited by Sat1176

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I'm not so sure if I can rule it out as I've put on a lot of weight over the past year, especially around the mid section. My uncle doctor was telling me to loose it otherwise I'm setting myself up for diabetes plus I'm not a big water drinker and do have a sweet tooth. I don't think I'm dehydrated though. Whether I've taken too much sugar and my body is now having trouble coping might be possible.

Also mine manifests all the time even when I don't do simran. Although I am noticing it does calm down but one strong simran session and it's back. Let's just hope it's bhagati related and not medical. Might just get my blood sugar levels tested for peace of mind.

Oh ok that may be it.

I don't think I'm dehydrated

Lol that's probably why you say this:

I'm not a big water drinker

What may help is if you or your missus make lassi, shakanjvi, roo afza, kachi lassi, juice, etc everyday. It maybe easier to consume water in more tasty forms.

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I said because you can tell if your body is dehydrated if the colour of the urine is dark yellow.

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Just did a blood diabetes test and my reading is in the normal range. Phew.

Conclusion : must be experiencing amrit nectar from above.

Waheguru.

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The taste of keto acidosis is a little different and the sweet taste also has a slight bitter edge to it.

From what I know, there is also a distinctive smell of ketones from the persons breath that you can sense yourself and others can also smell if close enough !

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The taste of keto acidosis is a little different and the sweet taste also has a slight bitter edge to it.

From what I know, there is also a distinctive smell of ketones from the persons breath that you can sense yourself and others can also smell if close enough !

So what causes the sweet taste of saliva during meditation if it's not ketones?

And the articles that Sat posted talk about how this can be tasted by other people, so it's not the tongue experiencing sweetness, the saliva is actually sweet. But this needs confirmation. Have you guys got someone to taste it yet? :D

Edited by BhagatSingh

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So what causes the sweet taste of saliva during meditation if it's not ketones?

And the articles that Sat posted talk about how this can be tasted by other people, so it's not the tongue experiencing sweetness, the saliva is actually sweet. But this needs confirmation. Have you guys got someone to taste it yet? :D

This sweet taste during meditation is as mentioned in some of the posts above- It is NOT ketones but a chemical from the PIneal gland from what I know.

Strangely, I have been paying a little attention into this and been enquiring about it a little!

My kundalini yoga teacher mentioned it a few sessions ago and made reference to one of the long time students in the class.

This student is a hindu woman who has been meditating with devotion for over 25 years. She has had this sweet taste for many many years and she called it 'soma' from what I remember.

However, I couldn't help but notice that she looks extremely young ! I know that she is older than me and about 45 yrs in age BUT she looks as if she is only 25 max!

I know that some references have been made to this nectar being the fountain of youth and the anti-aging elixir...etc..

All I can deduce is that this nectar or amrit as we call it contains not just some sweet taste but much more complex hormones or something that we don't know too much about.

But I can definitely vouch that this woman I know does not look extremely young from some anti-aging products because you can tell she hardly has any cosmetics on. It is definitely the product of her devoted meditation.

I know this puts a whole new meaning to 'Amrit peevho sadha chir jeevoh' !!!!!!!

I have tried researching it a little and I find that reports and research gets a little mixed up and some are convinced that it is a chemical known as 5HT or some derivative from melatonin and serotonin. Others claim that it is some sort of opiate like endorphin or hormone but most believe it to be endocrine secretion rather than a hormone.

I read somewhere that aging is a process linked to calcification of parts of our body and funny enough, our pineal gland is not readily activated because of being calcified. This goes on further to the controversies of fluoride additions in water along with extra calcium that may not even be needed for healthy bones/teeth.

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The drips are definitely becoming more intense. Yesterday during simran this stuff was just falling down from the roof of the pallet. I think I have reached the stage where I just accept it and learn to enjoy it. Nothing much more one can do.

Bhagat Singh, I think we just have to draw the line what tests we can perform and post on here. Lol

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The drips are definitely becoming more intense. Yesterday during simran this stuff was just falling down from the roof of the pallet. I think I have reached the stage where I just accept it and learn to enjoy it. Nothing much more one can do.

Bhagat Singh, I think we just have to draw the line what tests we can perform and post on here. Lol

Just keep at it and persevere.

I admire and envy your dedication and devotion to Satguru with the effort you put into your simran.

You are certainly an inspiration to many of us on here.

Waheguru

Edited by Lucky

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