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Both of these books were the first one's I read some time back and well before any anhad experiences.

However, the dasam duar book left me confused since it differentiated between yogic sounds and gurmat sounds????

Now, that I do kundalini yoga, i perceive things much differently.

For quite some time my preconceived ideas about this whole sound/light matter were off tangent to the reality

The bandginama is a good book and covers most areas but doesn't go into too much details of jugtiees, techniques..etc.-which is probably why I never went back to it again. He has outlined the stages of simran and i deduce that I'm running around somewhere on the 2nd stage, although not in any solid order.

It's these stages that sometimes also confuse me, because at times I feel like that everything should be done in sequence and then other times I feel that I should proceed according to where I feel my ''personal comfort zone'' is.

They say that our thoughts are defined as either ''sequential' or 'cluster ' thoughts.

Majority are usually sequential where we get a thought because one had led to the other,, such as....We may think about an old friend because we had once watched some movie with them and then that particular movie got mentioned and we remembered the time when we watched it, and this leads to us thinking about that person, his family,his wedding..etc...

OR.... we start thinking about some one, some event every time we have a certain food, just because it triggers a certain event in the past where this food was being made or eaten...etc.....etc...-I think you get the idea ?

These are more than 80% of our thoughts that our mind initiates and processes itself following some worldly action.

On the other hand, 'Cluster' thoughts are just random, out of nowhere thoughts that fly in from all angles.

They say that these thoughts should be paid attention to since it is the subconscious or divine letting you know something ??

All the greats/enlightened one's like Einstein, Pythagoras et al ....had massive percentages of cluster thoughts.

Anyway, I have recently noticed that i seem to be getting more and more cluster thoughts every day, but i'm not getting any smarter ! :D

Maybe, it's the deep meditation and being more aware in the moment when going inwards?

I'm not trying to go off topic, but I think that if you take notice of some of these cluster thoughts then you may know what step to take next and whether it is the appropriate one for you.

I think at this 2nd stage of simran, there is no direct sequence of if you taste amrit ras first, then hear anhad naad, hear different melodies, be capable of ajapa jap, feel intense electrifying unexplainable anand,..vibrations around chakras...etc....etc..

I reckon they all happen in your own personal customised clusters or sequences by HIS kirpa and grace.

This is unlike the 1st stage where steps are taken in sequence with the jugtees that suit you like starting with baikhri jap,then madhma,.pasanti,..silent mental jap..etc..etc..

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In all honesty, I personally feel it has had the opposite effect to a road block !

It has made me realise that i have a very long way to still go and there is so much more. As an idea, I feel it is ONLY a fraction (1/10th) of the complete journey to sachkhand.

The only thing that can worry me at times is that I may feel that everyone thinks I'm becoming introverted and detached. But I am far from that because I feel much more in touch and attached with REALITY.

Hi Lucky,

just found a quotation of Kabir Sahib, which relates to your present condition. Mind and people may try to confuse oneself, but only the gentle and inspiring words of Saints and Gurmukhs, can assure us about our progress, so here it goes:

Kabir Guru ke bhaawate, doorahi se deesant.

Tan chheenaa man anamanaa, jag se rooThi phirant.

Kabir says who ever loves his Guru and is beloved of Guru is seemingly different from others.

His body grows thinner, and he seems to be absent minded, he is indifferent from this world (is absorbed in his inner world!!).

Good luck.

Edited by harsharan000

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I recognise the deep harmonic sound at the beginning of this track and then forward to 30 minutes to the main tuuuuu sound which to me sounds like a horn being blown.

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I recognise the deep harmonic sound at the beginning of this track and then forward to 30 minutes to the main tuuuuu sound which to me sounds like a horn being blown.

Wow !..... ... I never actually associated that with a horn sound, although i have encountered it in the background on numerous occasions !

I know we have the worldly descriptions to describe theses sounds but in reality you can only associate them if you step away from them and then try and link them.

I have mentioned the 'binaural sounds' a few times previously, and I'm certain there is a link between how they function on the brain in deep meditative states and how they can help align your chakras.

The anhad naad, I believe have to be followed and listened to in order to align these same chakras and help one to higher states.

I believe that the naad are also binaural(which means different beat frequency in each ear) and that they help one get into even further deeper meditative states.

However, one has to first get into very deeper states to start experiencing the naad in the first instance !

An important point to make is that one should NOT try to increase their vibrational energies by listening to these binaural technologies alone!... Since this is the same kind of Non-gurmat practices as some sadhus practiced back in the day.

We should only attempt with naam simran alone and not occult alternatives.

Edited by Lucky

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This one is the basic high pitched peeeee that one might hear even when not exposed to loud sounds. I may be wrong but this happens in the initial stages before hearing anhad as I used to hear it first.

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This is the ghungroo sound. I have only heard this sound once during simran. It was the most intense clear sound I have experienced during simran. The first time I heard it frightened me because I thought someone was standing behind me shaking these but I knew I was the only one in the house. Only lasted a few seconds because I had to open my eyes to see there was nothing around me. I will never forget that day.



Ang 356
You shall hear the vibrations of the tinkling bells, when your mind is held steady.
ghunghroo vaajai jay man laagai.
Edited by Sat1176

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I think I may have mentioned that previously on here ?

But, I know that I always described it as 'chaainey' chanakhing continuously without any pauses in between.

They happened quite a few times and carried on for ages, even after I opened my eyes and closed again !

Not been encountered recently though.

Some sounds are experienced just a handful of times, but some others like drums(many hundreds of them), thundering, continuous bell...have occurred much more frequently.

Seems to more subtle sounds lately and even some melodies that I just can't explain or describe... They have sounded quite rhythmic with voices in some foreign/alien/unexplained language !

I first heard lot's of these unrecognizable voices that you just can't replicate. At the time, I actually got a little scared/worried that I was stepping out of gurmat territory.

I later learned that part of the journey involves us passing through the other realms and worlds, and that it is part of the journey to Waheguru.

I don't think anyone should go try and look for these different sounds or encounters of other realms, because they just happen when you don't realize or expect anything. Most of the time, they probably occur in the background for quite a while before you actually realise them.....

I remember a few times that my focus was just in waheguru silent jap and being thought free, whilst some sound was happening for quite a few minutes that I didn't notice or acknowledge. Then, it was only when I stepped out a little, that I realised ''That was the sound of ..xxxx.....happening just then!!''

Edited by Lucky

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I also seem to be coming across more and more gurbani that is speaking to me about the anhad dhun/shabad/naad.

Especially Guru Nanak and bhagat Kabirji's.

There seems to be striking messages there, that I never quite picked up before !

meditation is in the music, and knowledge is in meditation. Become Gurmukh, and speak the Unspoken Speech. ||3||

Dhun meh Dhi-aan Dhi-aan meh jaani-aa gurmukh akath kahaanee. ||3||

ang 59

Know that from the vibration of the Word, we obtain spiritual wisdom and meditation. Through it, we speak the Unspoken.

gi-aan Dhi-aan Dhun jaanee-ai akath kahaavai so-ay

ang360

One who has obtained the Ambrosial Naam, the Name of the Immaculate Lord - his body enjoys the pleasure of spiritual wisdom. ||1||Pause||

amrit naam niranjan paa-i-aa gi-aan kaa-i-aa ras bhogaN. ||1|| rahaa-o

ang1061

The musical instruments of the body vibrate and resound.

baajeh baajay Dhun aakaaraa.

Edited by Lucky

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It's like the statement in the book

This is a classic example of how information about the sound current is hidden from plain sight. References in the literature are usually brief and obscure by design. An uninitiated reader can pass over these profound statements without realising what is being discussed.

Lucky, your beginning to appreciate the true inner teachings of Guru Maharaj and see what is written in a totally different guiding light. I went through a similar phase which is why the Meditation Experience thread had so many postings from Gurbani as I read through the angs. The various pangtis just popped out at me. I actually compiled my own Word document, which is now 280 pages, with all the guiding inspiring shabad's & pangtis that speak out to me relating to the inward spiritual journey. Makes searching now much easier. Obviously I didn't appreciate all that is written but hopefully one day I will come back and read again and more will shine through which didn't on the first parse.

Edited by Sat1176

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veer sat, when you are hearing these sounds , are you also able to listen to the Waheguru mantar Jaap? or is it just sounds alone.

Sometimes when I do simran the sounds can be heard in the background to my Waheguru jaap. All of sudden I become aware there is another subtle sound present between the silence or happening in the background. You might spot it between the pause of Wahe and Guru. If I'm doing jaap mentally then it's easier to identify when it occurs. It is not very loud so it takes some focus and effort to try and listen to it. It's like you trying to listen to a faint sound a few meters away.

Sometimes it just starts on it's own when I'm sitting or lying down. I've began to notice it is generally when my mind is free of thoughts and still. That is not to say I can't think or do other stuff when it's happening.

If it's very loud like the case when I heard the bells or the loud horn sound in the middle of the night which has woken me, then at that time you can't do anything because it feels like the sound is directly near you and some invisible thing is playing this sound right near your body or into your ear. The mind just attaches to it for the duration or until you try and break away from it so to speak because it's too loud.

Are you hearing something, Ragmaala ji?

Edited by Sat1176

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I think that one should do as much mental and silent jap as possible, with the sounds in the background.

Then you get to a stage where you make the mental adjustment to focus on the sound more, while at the same time, the silent jap is still happening.

Correlating the jap with breath and keeping your focus there to start with, is probably the easiest way to master this.

1st)- Get regular jap going- normal vocal, whisper, slight whisper to Silent.-OR -sometimes you may be ale to go straight into silent without doing any vocal or whisper.

2)-Then, keep focus on breath, whilst keeping mental jap going by doing ''wahe' on inhale and ''Guru'' on exhale.

3)- Make the breaths equal and try and keep that empty pause in between as Sat describes above.

This is when the naad should begin to be heard more clearer and louder.

4) Slow down the breath and imagine as if you are trying to go deep inside your own chest and heart.

5) Try and maintain this whilst listening to the shabad and you should find that the breathing gets quieter and quieter, while the breaths get longer.

6) Just keep trying to get inwards, deeper and deeper until you feel completely formless.

Absolute stillness and quietness is the key, whilst sitting comfortably.

Once I got settled and familiar in this method, I started trying to focus in between eyebrows, mental jap and listening to dhun at the same time !....But, I'm not sure if this was right approach or not, but it seemed like the appropriate route to take at the time.

Edited by Lucky

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Only point I will add to Lucky's list, that I only recently became aware of myself is to breath through the mouth when doing whisper/mental saas saas simran (i.e. inhale/exhale method). Benefit of this is it acts as a by pass of ida/pinguala of the nose and helps balance the two channels more quickly than breathing through the nostrils. Secondly you will begin to feel the sweet amrit taste in the mouth. It puzzled me for ages how comes I was experiencing this sweet taste so quickly with what I deemed was very little effort on my part. I got a habit of breathing through my mouth anyways so this habit coupled with a whisper/silent Waheguru simran very quickly results in sweet nectar taste being experienced. ;)

The rest is down to Waheguru's grace..

Edited by Sat1176

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Sometimes when I do simran the sounds can be heard in the background to my Waheguru jaap. All of sudden I become aware there is another subtle sound present between the silence or happening in the background. You might spot it between the pause of Wahe and Guru. If I'm doing jaap mentally then it's easier to identify when it occurs. It is not very loud so it takes some focus and effort to try and listen to it. It's like you trying to listen to a faint sound a few meters away.

Sometimes it just starts on it's own when I'm sitting or lying down. I've began to notice it is generally when my mind is free of thoughts and still. That is not to say I can't think or do other stuff when it's happening.

If it's very loud like the case when I heard the bells or the loud horn sound in the middle of the night which has woken me, then at that time you can't do anything because it feels like the sound is directly near you and some invisible thing is playing this sound right near your body or into your ear. The mind just attaches to it for the duration or until you try and break away from it so to speak because it's too loud.

Are you hearing something, Ragmaala ji?

nahi veer ji . I am not hearing anything. However other emotions are getting intense. For example,old childhood memories are popping up a lot, they create a feeling of nostalgia and can be distracting sometimes. or sometimes mind feels lonely/depressed. Then I have to read spiritual books/katha etc to bring it back to reality, its a constant tug of war. Hopefully this phase will pass away soon and can move on to more Anand in Bhagti.

Sometimes I listen to tanpura while doing path or listen to zen/flute/chinese music while doing moolmantar, its temporarily soothing or calming but not sure if its appropriate. what are your thoughts about this?

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nahi veer ji . I am not hearing anything. However other emotions are getting intense. For example,old childhood memories are popping up a lot, they create a feeling of nostalgia and can be distracting sometimes. or sometimes mind feels lonely/depressed. Then I have to read spiritual books/katha etc to bring it back to reality, its a constant tug of war. Hopefully this phase will pass away soon and can move on to more Anand in Bhagti.

Gurfeteh

Singhji its great that old memories are coming back, its a sign of spirtual progress. The deep rooted filth of the mind is being removed.

ਮੰਨੁ ਧੋਵਹੁ ਸਬਦਿ ਲਾਗਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਰਹਹੁ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇ ॥

Mann Dhhovahu Sabadh Laagahu Har Sio Rehahu Chith Laae ||

Wash your mind by attaching it to the Shabad, and keep your consciousness focused on the Lord.

39414 ਰਾਮਕਲੀ ਅਨੰਦ (ਮ: ੩) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੯੧੯ ਪੰ. ੧੧

Raag Raamkali Guru Amar Das

Also the emotions and feelings that are dancing for your attention are there only to distract you from Simran. The best way to overcome them is not to keep getting sucked into them by simply ignoring them, the more you ignore them the less power they will have over you.

Sometimes I listen to tanpura while doing path or listen to zen/flute/chinese music while doing moolmantar, its temporarily soothing or calming but not sure if its appropriate. what are your thoughts about this?

Remember the mind is tricky and is always looking to distract you from what you really need to do.

ਛੋਡਿ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਆਣਪਾ ਸਾਚਿ ਸਬਦਿ ਲਿਵ ਲਾਇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Shhodd Sagal Siaanapaa Saach Sabadh Liv Laae ||1|| Rehaao ||

Give up all your clever mental tricks, and lovingly attune yourself to the True Word of the Shabad. ||1||Pause||

2064 ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ (ਮ: ੫) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੫੧ ਪੰ. ੩

Sri Raag Guru Arjan Dev

ਦੁਖੁ ਕਲੇਸੁ ਨ ਭਉ ਬਿਆਪੈ ਗੁਰ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਹੋਇ ॥

Dhukh Kalaes N Bho Biaapai Gur Manthra Hiradhai Hoe ||

Suffering, agony and fear do not cling to one whose heart is filled with the GurMantra.

2065 ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ (ਮ: ੫) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੫੧ ਪੰ. ੪

Sri Raag Guru Arjan Dev

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This is the ghungroo sound.

http://youtu.be/Iq892afE1NA

Ang 356You shall hear the vibrations of the tinkling bells, when your mind is held steady.ghunghroo vaajai jay man laagai.

http://youtu.be/grMEnoFYDJo

Edited by Sat1176

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I haven't experienced anything for myself but still it feels good to hear about such mystical things.

They help strengthen faith in God & His creation.

Waheguruuuuu....

Dhan Guru Nanak Tuhi Nirankar....

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Great share veer.

Absolutely !

Thanks Namdhari veera, that was the most trusting and reliable video, that I really needed.

He was absolutely spot on and can also prepare us for the long journey ahead.

These naad that we are going through are just the lower stages of passing through the realms.

I remember namdhari veerjee mentioning that when the True Anhad toor is heard in its pure form, then there will be no thoughts to distract.

From what I gathered from the video,..the simran must carry on, and I assume silent jap/whisper.

He mentioned the 8th avastha stage that sant jarnail singh ji had approached (4.30mins), Does anyone know what stages he was referring to here ?

I needed the obstacle examples he mentioned, because lately I have been trying rom rom and have been experiencing the navel vibrations (not any pain though). Anyway i have been passing water like crazy for past few days and was planning to get my urine tested for glucose and ketones on Monday to check for diabetes !

(It's because One of the early symptoms of diabetes is passing excess urine and increase in thirst !)

Well, I'm gonna leave it for now after what he said and see if it gets worst or persists :D ...........pheewww !

Edited by Lucky

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He mentioned the 8th avastha stage that sant jarnail singh ji had approached (4.30mins), Does anyone know what stages he was referring to here ?

To read more about eight avastha, seventh stage- turiya (equilvanet to karam khand) needs to be understood:

1. Turiya nature (jevan mukht- dual consciousness- for understanding purposes (one is nirvakalap always attached to supreme consciousness, other consciouness is mind but satvic portion of mind to do worldly chores)
2. Turiya atit (no mind, all forms of mind -rajo/tamo/sato is destroyed - bedah mukht- no coming back from maha samadhi). Classic example- sri guru arjan dev maharaj shaheedi (guru avtar, along with shaheedi bhramgyani sikhs like- bhai mani singh ji, bhai taru singh ji, baba deep singh fighting with his sish off)*
To listen more about it, listen to sant jagjit singh harkhowale audio tape under gurmatveechar.com katha- man buddh atam folder, audio title- atma - last 14 minutes of parsang. This has been naturally double confirmed by other mahapursh katha as well.
*Turiya athis avash is described as following by sri ramana maharishi:
When even the subtle mind is destroyed, the experience of Bliss as such also ceases. He [she] is drowned and dissolved in the fathomless Ocean of Bliss and is unaware of anything apart. This is videhamukti. There is nothing beyond it. It is the end of all. ~ Sri Ramana Maharshi

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Thanks for that Neo ji.

I did come across that somewhere else recently along with other stages as well.

There is a lot of overlap and then because the stages can overlap quite a bit, some of them class the overlapped part as a stage itself.

The 7 planes of existence, 7 levels of consciousness, 7 chakras, 7 layers of subtle bodies or auric system...etc..

There always seems to be a lot of shadowing over each of them in terms of functions and grounds. However, I have not come across a simplified explanation where they have put them together to try and simplify.

I suppose that would be like trying to get all the religions together and simplify as One, which may even be possible with the main cores, when you study the mystics/esoteric layers of metaphors and parables or stories told.

going off topic.... may be another thread for looking into these layers again.

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In Giani ji's video above, another very important point he made was about the knowledge for abiysee and those on the atam marg.

There are countless references by scholars, docs, professors, phd dudes...etc..

But they have NOT done the practical.

So, when the practical seeker, seeks the guidance from these,...it quite often comes to a dead end !

The real answers and guidance for one's doing the practical is from the sant, mahapursh, gianis....etc.who have done the same practical themselves.

You can't be a car mechanic by just reading the manuals, can you ?

Edited by Lucky

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