albcan Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 idol worship is banned in sikhism educated hindus in the west who pray to status say they know the status have no powers but the image is to help them focus their energy towards the god their praying to now when Sikhs bow down to the guru granth sahib is that not idol worship if someone downloads the guru granth sahib on their laptop or iphone will you bow down to the lap top and iphone when you hear about mob mind set attacking gurdwaras cause they think the guru granth sahib has bin disrespected what are these guys going to do with people downloading the guru granth sahib off the internet and watching dirty videos and usually most those guys in the mobs are cowards who can only fight when they have a mob behind them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 you can download an image of ganesh and have the same result maybe bow and maybe not bow, set krishna as a wallpaper on a computer or phone same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albcan Posted April 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 I think its idol worship when someone bows n prays to a statue or a book or an image Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
das Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 (edited) Albcan, from the text of your topic, it does NOT seem like your intention of posting this topic was to bring about a genuine point that everyone in this world is doing Idol puja (as per the following) and very few understands the real meaning of Idol puja. Instead it seems like your real intention was just to prove that Sikhs do the idol puja and they are also fools. Please for your own sake, win your Maan/Mind instead of showing your debate strength here. Almost everyone in this world is doing Murti/Bott/Idol puja. What is Idol puja: Putting your concentration/Dhayan on the physical object (person or object or anything which has shape). There is another rule that the Soul will become what he/she is idoling. e.g The person having exclusive dhayan on money would lead the soul to take birth of snake. The person having exclusive dhayan on children would lead the soul to take birth of pig. The person having exclusive dhayan on wife would lead the soul to birth of prostitute. The person having exclusive dhayan on any demi-god would lead the soul to their corresponding regions. i.e to the max to the upper heavens in Casual/Brahmund region. The person having exclusive dhayan on Vedas could lead the soul to the corresponding region from where the Vedas came from i.e from the Sunna/Mental state/region. The person having exclusive dhayan on Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji would lead the soul to the corresponding region from where the Bani came i.e from the Sachkhand. The person having exclusive dhayan on Pura-Guru would lead the soul to the corresponding region from where the Guru came from (or upto the region where Guru has access to). So, based upon the above (you can very easily find the proofs for the above from any religious granths), you can say that the person putting his dhayan (puja) on Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji would take the person to the highest level of God which is Sachkhand. Whereas claim of "educated hindus in the west who pray to status say they know the status have no powers but the image is to help them focus their energy towards the god their praying to" means that they would be taken to their god's region which happens to cease at Causal/Brahmund region. Edited April 16, 2014 by das Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albcan Posted April 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 Actually I'm trying to point out sikh practises banned in sikhism I don't think sikhs bowed to the guru granth sahib in the 1700's and theory is that some time in the 1800's cause of sikhs being around hindus some of the sikhs who attended gurdwaras and went to mandirs and bowed would then take that tradition over to the gurdwara and bow to the guru granth sahib N some how sikhs started doing this with out questioning why I believe it became an unquestioned tradition I believe the gurus never wanted sikhs to bow down to the guru granth sahib and have a room built specifically for the guru granth sahib with ac and so on The gurus made it clear that rituals are empty an what sikhs do with the guru granth sahib is just that rituals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarjeet Singh_1737 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Bloody hell here we go on this merry-go round again. For a Sikh the Guru Granth Sahib is Guru and it affords teachings. For this reason he bows to it. No offence to anyone's sentiment but can an idol provide something similar? Would make more sense for a Sikh if muslims and Hindus bowed to their canons. And get over 'Hindu this, Hindu that.' Giani Gurditt Singh already tried that at Hazoor Sahib and failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 tried at Hazoor Sahib ?? Veera can you please elaborate ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarjeet Singh_1737 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 tried at Hazoor Sahib ?? Veera can you please elaborate ? I sure can, Gurditt Singh's argument hinged on two factors. One the Sargun aarti performed at Hazoor Sahib with lamps, in his opinion was an adoption of Hindu beliefs; and secondly Gurbani rejected it. When the Singhs of Nanded asked him to evidence his arguments, he cited the aarti shabad of Guru Nanak Dev Ji (Gagan Mai Thal...) stating that the Guru was criticising individuals who perform aarti, because nature bests them in it's own mode of aarti. Thus what was the need for the Khalsa to perform aarti? The Singhs argued back that the Shabad in fact praised the merits of desireless and selfless worship. One should be like nature in their performance of aarti. Desireless and humble. Gurditt Singh subsequently left Nanded categorising it as a hotbed of Hindu infiltration. His rationale was based on nothing more than superficial interpretations of Gurbani based on the reformist tracts of Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha and co. This thread too adopts his superficiality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 I am kind of just perplexed at the way we just term anything as Hindu without understanding why it is like that. India has its culture and ethos and there is a setup which has existed since thousands of years. If we question everything even names like Gobind and Hari will be under question . Dasam baani is argued upon, now if Guru Sahib will not refer to the deities here what else would He do ? Refer to Gabriel or Zeus ? It is they the hindu phobics who have this allergy not the Gurus . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarjeet Singh_1737 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) I am kind of just perplexed at the way we just term anything as Hindu without understanding why it is like that. India has its culture and ethos and there is a setup which has existed since thousands of years. If we question everything even names like Gobind and Hari will be under question . Dasam baani is argued upon, now if Guru Sahib will not refer to the deities here what else would He do ? Refer to Gabriel or Zeus ? It is they the hindu phobics who have this allergy not the Gurus . The Khalsa is above all this imbecilic sanataan and reformist garbage. And this same Gurditt Singh presented a so-called report to the SGPC in the 60's which argued that Damdama Sahib should be accorded the status of the Khalsa's 5th Takhat and not the Budha-Dal whose chalda-vaheer was the original Takhat. Edited April 17, 2014 by Amarjeet Singh_1737 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 and unfortunately his kinda mindset has crept into us. We just start comparing, and this comparison has gone to stupid levels . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Actually I'm trying to point out sikh practises banned in sikhism I don't think sikhs bowed to the guru granth sahib in the 1700's and theory is that some time in the 1800's cause of sikhs being around hindus some of the sikhs who attended gurdwaras and went to mandirs and bowed would then take that tradition over to the gurdwara and bow to the guru granth sahib N some how sikhs started doing this with out questioning why I believe it became an unquestioned tradition I believe the gurus never wanted sikhs to bow down to the guru granth sahib and have a room built specifically for the guru granth sahib with ac and so on The gurus made it clear that rituals are empty an what sikhs do with the guru granth sahib is just that rituals We have another clown "albcan" here ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albcan Posted April 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 OnPathToSikhi actually you are the clown so do not TRY to insult me Quick question yes or no If people download the guru granth sahib on to their cell phone or laptop or ipad would you bow down in front of that cell phone laptop and ipad and wrap it in blankets and make a room for it with ac If their is an app with the guru granth sahib n a dozen people download it would u bow down to all their cell phones?? Simple yes or no question If the if the guru granth sahib is downloaded onto a usb for someone to listen to ehen they drive to work would u bow down to the usb What's the diff between bowing down to the guru granth sahib the book and the guru granth sahib on a laptop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 OnPathToSikhi actually you are the clown so do not TRY to insult me Maybe I am .. Maybe not ... But you surely are! Quick question yes or no If people download the guru granth sahib on to their cell phone or laptop or ipad would you bow down in front of that cell phone laptop and ipad and wrap it in blankets and make a room for it with ac If their is an app with the guru granth sahib n a dozen people download it would u bow down to all their cell phones?? Simple yes or no question If the if the guru granth sahib is downloaded onto a usb for someone to listen to ehen they drive to work would u bow down to the usb What's the diff between bowing down to the guru granth sahib the book and the guru granth sahib on a laptop Were you living in a cave all these years? Technology has existed in other forms before. We have Gurbani in audio cassettes , record players before that. So by your definition every time someone passes a music shop then that person would bow to the music shop? You really are an idiot. It's all in the intent, the same intent with which your are asking these questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarjeet Singh_1737 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Maybe I am .. Maybe not ... But you surely are! Were you living in a cave all these years? Technology has existed in other forms before. We have Gurbani in audio cassettes , record players before that. So by your definition every time someone passes a music shop then that person would bow to the music shop? You really are an idiot. It's all in the intent, the same intent with which your are asking these questions. Explains why a few Singhs' worship their cars nowdays. All that audio... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarjeet Singh_1737 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 I think its idol worship when someone bows n prays to a statue or a book or an image Yet you contradict yourself by stating 'educated hindus in the west who pray to status say they know the status have no powers but the image is to help them focus their energy towards the god their praying to...' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Albcan why do you think Idol worship is wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albcan Posted April 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Why do sikhs bow down to the guru granth sahib?? Isn't it just a book with teachings of the guru granth sahib in it And sikhi is against such rituals But if ppl bow down to the book with the guru granth sahib written inside of it Then do they bow down to a laptop with the guru granth sahib downloaded on to it I think sikhi is against such rituals N it will be interesting to see as technology progresses if certain sikhs will continue to bow down to the guru granth sahib if its lownloaded on a laptop or will they look like hypocrites as they bow down to the book but not laptop Guru granth sahib is beautiful but at the same time these rituals sikhs perform when it comes to the guru granth sahib book are against the teachings of the gurus I think guru nanak would be against this behavior as he preached that such rituals are useless In the 1700's I've bin reading these rituals didn't exsist sikhs wouldn't bow down to the guru granth sahib book n saw this behaviour as a hindu ritual hence why they avoided bowing down Yet in 1800's slowly sikhs started copying hindus and went against the sikh teachings n started doing these rituals when it comes to the guru granth sahib Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Why do sikhs bow down to the guru granth sahib?? Isn't it just a book with teachings of the guru granth sahib in it And sikhi is against such rituals But if ppl bow down to the book with the guru granth sahib written inside of it Then do they bow down to a laptop with the guru granth sahib downloaded on to it I think sikhi is against such rituals N it will be interesting to see as technology progresses if certain sikhs will continue to bow down to the guru granth sahib if its lownloaded on a laptop or will they look like hypocrites as they bow down to the book but not laptop Guru granth sahib is beautiful but at the same time these rituals sikhs perform when it comes to the guru granth sahib book are against the teachings of the gurus I think guru nanak would be against this behavior as he preached that such rituals are useless In the 1700's I've bin reading these rituals didn't exsist sikhs wouldn't bow down to the guru granth sahib book n saw this behaviour as a hindu ritual hence why they avoided bowing down Yet in 1800's slowly sikhs started copying hindus and went against the sikh teachings n started doing these rituals when it comes to the guru granth sahib Do you know what "Guru" in Guru Granth Sahib Ji means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 Albcan you still haven't answered my question: why do you think Idol worship is wrong? Guru granth sahib is beautiful but at the same time these rituals sikhs perform when it comes to the guru granth sahib book are against the teachings of the gurus And you keep talking about Guru Granth Sahib without sharing anything from it. Where does it say that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAadmin Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 Enough of this monkey circus, topic is locked. Peace of advise to op- stop opening up meaningless threads and threads with mocking under-toning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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