singhstation Posted November 16, 2014 Report Share Posted November 16, 2014 Makhu (Ferozepur): In fresh confrontation between Sikhs from ‘Ek Noor Khalsa Fauj‘ group and Dera Sacha Sauda activists known as Premis, atleast 9 were injured in a clash on Sunday. The clash took place when Dera followers were going towards Mehmoodwala village to perform “Naam Charcha” which was opposed by the members of “Ek Noor Khalsa Fauj”. The Dera followers were stopped in between Jogewala and Mehmoodwala villages from going ahead which triggered the clash. The two groups hurled stones at each other. Swords were also brandished as the situation soon became tense due to the clash between the two groups. Sources said four members of “Ek Noor Khalsa Fauj” and five Dera followers were injured in the clash. They were taken to the civil hospital for treatment. According to some media reports, Some policemen also reportedly sustained minor injuries during the clash. Police fired shots in air to disburse those indulging in violence. Heavy police force was deployed as well. Deputy Commissioner DPS Kharbanda along with senior police officials held separate meetings with the two warring groups to normalise the situation. Both the sides demanded registration of case against each other. The Dera followers sat on a protest, demanding registration of an FIR against the other group. Eyewitnesses said the situation could have assumed alarming proportions had the administration not intervened at the right time. The Deputy Commissioner said both the groups have been advised to exercise restraint and respect the sentiments of each other. The injured, belonging to “Ek Noor Khalsa Fauj”, were identified as Mohkam Singh, Baaj Singh, Mangat Singh and Harnam Singh. Five “Premis” injured are Jarnail Singh, Major Singh, Gurmeet Singh, Kehar Singh and Kuldeep Singh. Source: http://singhstation.net/2014/11/9-injured-as-sikhs-dera-sirsa-men-clash-in-makhu/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 18, 2014 Report Share Posted November 18, 2014 There you go, some sikhs suppressing Dera premis. denying them a right to practice their faith. There is more to this than trying to suppress their faith. the "jam e insa" incidents has really riled some sikhs against this dera. it was the same with the nirankaris, who's guru claimed he was the "baja wala" guru. Its these pranks that make sikhs anti-deras, rather than their actual faith. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 19, 2014 Report Share Posted November 19, 2014 Sher as a promoter of the Vedas which even have been given lot of respect in Gurbani how can you side with such a Dera ???? If this is Kattarvaad so be it ..i have even conveyed to the rss and hindu organizations to not allow any activities of such a person who is hell bent on making himself equivalent to Parmatma..He had the guts to dress up as Guru Maharaj and do Amrit di Daat...how on earth could he even think of projecting himself equivalent to Guru Sahib ??? Sher the freedom of thought and speech you want to give him will cost you bitterly ..Dharam is not some cheap product to be sold in the market doing gimmicks ..Hindus have tolerance bu dont expect this from Sikhs ..by all means this man will be opposed ..by all means Balls to such Freedom which makes me a weakling ..which stops me from protecting the respecting of my Dharam..Please stop opposing for the sake of it . I might have my differences with Sant Bhindranwale's views but when i have to oppose such enemies of Dharam then by all means i will be willing to join hands with the sipaahis who are opposing this rapist. There you go, some sikhs suppressing Dera premis. denying them a right to practice their faith. Shame kattadvaadis shame. and the same moan about human rights! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 20, 2014 Report Share Posted November 20, 2014 Sher as a promoter of the Vedas which even have been given lot of respect in Gurbani how can you side with such a Dera ???? If this is Kattarvaad so be it ..i have even conveyed to the rss and hindu organizations to not allow any activities of such a person who is hell bent on making himself equivalent to Parmatma..He had the guts to dress up as Guru Maharaj and do Amrit di Daat...how on earth could he even think of projecting himself equivalent to Guru Sahib ??? Sher the freedom of thought and speech you want to give him will cost you bitterly ..Dharam is not some cheap product to be sold in the market doing gimmicks ..Hindus have tolerance bu dont expect this from Sikhs ..by all means this man will be opposed ..by all means Balls to such Freedom which makes me a weakling ..which stops me from protecting the respecting of my Dharam..Please stop opposing for the sake of it . I might have my differences with Sant Bhindranwale's views but when i have to oppose such enemies of Dharam then by all means i will be willing to join hands with the sipaahis who are opposing this rapist. Interesting discussion but I believe the Hindus and Moslems were hostile towards the early Sikhism for the same reason today Sikhs are hostile towards the dera. Do you think the Hindus felt bad when verses, concepts and ideas were taken from Hinduism and used in the new religion of Sikhism? Do you think the Hindus and Moslems were justified in being katarvaad towards Sikhs? Or is this just an issue of power, money and influence? Every visitor to the dera means less money and power for the established religions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 I don't understand as to what you are trying to convey...using concepts and aping actions are 2 different things ..Did Guru Sahibs dress themselves as Ramchander ji or Krishan ji ? Did Guru Sahibs hold dubious character like your Dera waala chor ? Just check his crimes and you will yourself know that you are acting devil's advocate . Interesting discussion but I believe the Hindus and Moslems were hostile towards the early Sikhism for the same reason today Sikhs are hostile towards the dera. Do you think the Hindus felt bad when verses, concepts and ideas were taken from Hinduism and used in the new religion of Sikhism? Do you think the Hindus and Moslems were justified in being katarvaad towards Sikhs? Or is this just an issue of power, money and influence? Every visitor to the dera means less money and power for the established religions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 I get your point but try to understand what you are pitching for ...the thing is in villages this is how things are opposed and this is done by everyone ..there are Arya Samaaji villages around Delhi and Haryana where they had differences with satpal a self proclaimed sant ..there were shootings and forcible evacuation...the Dera is using money and converting poor peasants...that too to enslave them....in my late teen days I have used force against Christian missionaries coming in our community to preach ...though peacefully...but the motive is to erase your existing belief . Just check that Dera wala's profile ...is there any crime where this thug is not involved . This is really disappointing post from you Jaikara. Are you suggesting that one should let someone get crushed by an oppressor because you do not agree with his/her faith? yes this is undiluted, obnoxious kattadvad! If RSS and other hindu orgs are suppressing ANY marginalised faith, I would oppose them too. every human being has a right to practice his/her spirituality the way he wants (of course it excludes the extremist ways e.g. ISIS model). who the hell these Ek Noor and Khalistan regiment *^#*@ kazis (patience ...sher patience!) are to stop them from conducting Naam Charchas? who has give them or you a licence to decide who would wear which dress? who told you which dress Maharaj wore? you want to oppose the DSS Baba, go to Sirsa and do whatever you like. Why bully poor, outnumbered 'chotti quam' villagers with your Bullets and numbers? Himmat a te bahadari Sirsa ch dikhavo, pind de dera followers nu dabana bahadari nahin badmashi aa. i know what to say next time you talk about human rights. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 That's fine I understand your point of view. Going after him illegal activities is perfectly legit should be pursued more vigouresly by those concerned. This is where the GOI needs to step up perhaps the feAr is that arresting him would turn into a 84 like situation or the Rampal situation. However, if you are going after him for copying certain practices from other religions well that is impractible to enforce. No government has the power and mandate to enforce belief or lack thereof. The fastest, easiest way is to chase him for illegal activities. Two issues that need to be seperated. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 As a Hindu how do you think I feel when another certain religion takes certain ideas, rituals, concepts and changes them around a little bit. Should I be offended that guru gobind Singh ji says he is directly related to Lord Ram, as a Hindu for those that believe in the dasam Granth. I can cite numerous other examples. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer are some other examples. Should I be offended? Chandi, Durga, Kali whatever you want to call her is considered a flesh and bone goddess in Hinduism. Who gave the authorization to downgrade her and compare her to a mere sword? Edited November 21, 2014 by Amandeep Hindustani 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 You have this confusion because you do not seem to have an idea of Gotra and Vansh. You will be offended if i say I am related to Krishan ji ..but the fact is that we the Bhatti Rajputs are Chandarvanshi and claim our lineage from Krishan ji . As a Hindu how do you think I feel when another certain religion takes certain ideas, rituals, concepts and changes them around a little bit. Should I be offended that guru gobind Singh ji says he is directly related to Lord Ram, as a Hindu for those that believe in the dasam Granth. I can cite numerous other examples. Again if you had any idea of what the Sanatan Culture was you wouldnt have this confusion ..Idol Destroyer ..Most Hindus are idol destroyers too..they have idols made for worship and what they call visarjan is nothing but destroying the sargun saroop..since if you refer to the Vedas ..they do not approve of idol worship..in ancient times there were no Mandirs..they mandirs have come into existence much later. ' Downgrade her to a Mere Sword !!!! ' Dont even say that in front of a traditional Rajput ..The Sword is our Chanddi..Our Durga Mai...go to Rajasthan the older generation or even the traditional sword makers refer to the Sword not as talwaar ..She is Bhawani .. Traditional Rajputs do not worship idols of Bhawani..She is the Sword.. Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer are some other examples. Should I be offended? Chandi, Durga, Kali whatever you want to call her is considered a flesh and bone goddess in Hinduism. Who gave the authorization to downgrade her and compare her to a mere sword? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 You have this confusion because you do not seem to have an idea of Gotra and Vansh. You will be offended if i say I am related to Krishan ji ..but the fact is that we the Bhatti Rajputs are Chandarvanshi and claim our lineage from Krishan ji . Again if you had any idea of what the Sanatan Culture was you wouldnt have this confusion ..Idol Destroyer ..Most Hindus are idol destroyers too..they have idols made for worship and what they call visarjan is nothing but destroying the sargun saroop..since if you refer to the Vedas ..they do not approve of idol worship..in ancient times there were no Mandirs..they mandirs have come into existence much later. ' Downgrade her to a Mere Sword !!!! ' Dont even say that in front of a traditional Rajput ..The Sword is our Chanddi..Our Durga Mai...go to Rajasthan the older generation or even the traditional sword makers refer to the Sword not as talwaar ..She is Bhawani .. Traditional Rajputs do not worship idols of Bhawani..She is the Sword.. That is fine. But we are not talking about Rajputs here. They are Hindus, therefore, they can represent Chandi in whatever manner they choose. That is not my concern. I'm talking about the new niara panth. Who gave them permission? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 It's ironic that I see pictures of Bhindranwale with a silver arrow in his hand. Do you know where that comes from? Its history, significance and meaning in Hinduism? It is absolutely aping of another avatar in the Sat Yuga. Should I be offended? Since you are Rajput, you probably know the story of Mt. Abu in Rajasthan when the Rajputs were given Kysteria status along with the Khanda, Kesri Bana, singh surname and told to defend dharm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 Just like Abrahamic religions Judaism Christianity and Islam have the same source so too Religions born in India will have the same source. So Chandi Bhagouti Bhawani have satkaar in Sikhi. The Panth is Niara and will be Niara ..permission you said ? From whom ??? From those dhongi pujaaris in Benaras ? I woudlnt even want to call them Brahman..PaarBrahm di Upaasna karan waala Brahman hundha hai ..Brahman Varan hai jaat nahi... Khalsa is the True Kshatri Dharam...This Neo Hinduism is only making Hindustan divided and weak. Shakti heen Bhagti naal kuch haasal nahi hona Maalko. That is fine. But we are not talking about Rajputs here. They are Hindus, therefore, they can represent Chandi in whatever manner they choose. That is not my concern. I'm talking about the new niara panth. Who gave them permission? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 What he did ..i do not agree to..and there aremany Babe and Ladies who are carrying trishools doing the same thing ..I call it Beadbi... It's ironic that I see pictures of Bhindranwale with a silver arrow in his hand. Do you know where that comes from? Its history, significance and meaning in Hinduism? It is absolutely aping of another avatar in the Sat Yuga. Should I be offended? Since you are Rajput, you probably know the story of Mt. Abu in Rajasthan when the Rajputs were given Kysteria status along with the Khanda, Kesri Bana, singh surname and told to defend dharm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 I am not aware of this ...please share and enlighten us. Since you are Rajput, you probably know the story of Mt. Abu in Rajasthan when the Rajputs were given Kysteria status along with the Khanda, Kesri Bana, singh surname and told to defend dharm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Chandi, Durga, Kali whatever you want to call her is considered a flesh and bone goddess in Hinduism. Who gave the authorization to downgrade her and compare her to a mere sword? who gave you authorization to make images of her made out of dirt and soil? is that better than a sword? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koi Posted December 3, 2014 Report Share Posted December 3, 2014 Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer are some other examples. Should I be offended? Chandi, Durga, Kali whatever you want to call her is considered a flesh and bone goddess in Hinduism. Who gave the authorization to downgrade her and compare her to a mere sword? How can you say you respect Chandi, when you clearly don't know what Chandi is? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted December 4, 2014 Report Share Posted December 4, 2014 This is not the first time i am hearing this from a Hindu ...time and again Hindu view of Shastars is just like its something to just make fun about..they will unsheath the Shastar anytime will play around ..I use to do it too..my dad was furious when he saw it and he instructed me to do tilak with my blood before i put my Sri Sahib back into the sheath. who gave you authorization to make images of her made out of dirt and soil? is that better than a sword? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koi Posted December 4, 2014 Report Share Posted December 4, 2014 Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer are some other examples. Should I be offended? Chandi, Durga, Kali whatever you want to call her is considered a flesh and bone goddess in Hinduism. Who gave the authorization to downgrade her and compare her to a mere sword? Please explain how Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer offend you, assuming you know what they mean and their context? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 Context? If you are going to use that excuse then please give the dera mukhi the same opportunity. Perhaps he has a context excuse as well? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 How can you say you respect Chandi, when you clearly don't know what Chandi is? And you do? And if did know you wouldn't be running around Hindu institutions with assumed names looking for a little gyan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 who gave you authorization to make images of her made out of dirt and soil? is that better than a sword? My own dharm gave me permission. Who gave you permission to use a deity from my religion? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koi Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 Context? If you are going to use that excuse then please give the dera mukhi the same opportunity. Perhaps he has a context excuse as well? The dera mukhi has committed crimes which would be considered deplorable by any standards. However, understanding the meanings of the Guru's Bani is important (lest you be offended! ). So I ask you again: A) what do you understand by Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer, and why do you find it offensive? Would be happy to continue this on a new thread if you deem it more appropriate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 The dera mukhi has committed crimes which would be considered deplorable by any standards. However, understanding the meanings of the Guru's Bani is important (lest you be offended! ). So I ask you again: A) what do you understand by Kishan Bishan, I'm the idol destroyer, and why do you find it offensive? Would be happy to continue this on a new thread if you deem it more appropriate. As I said earlier in this thread. You need to separate his alleged illegal activities from his religious activities. And also understand that in India charges or allegations are also framed by vested interests. Now, in terms of his religious activities it is alleged that is copying, modifying or changing around sikh tenents, rituals and teachings. Just as you did with the earlier religions. As for the "idol destroyer" I'm taking that literally. Of course you have the "context" argument. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amandeep Hindustani Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 As for the "Kishan Bishan" thing I can't even say anything similar about Govind or Govinda because even those are the names of Shri Krishan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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