OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 There are countless forms of Waheguru. Wrong. What does it mean to be a form? as you are one. Where does Waheguru fit into your experience of being a form? For me it means to be a human. Waheguru helps me being one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Wrong. For me it means to be a human. Let me reword my questions since you are giving me that same "I am human" answer. What does it mean to be a human? And where does Waheguru enter into your experience of being human? Waheguru helps me being one. Waheguru helps you be a human? How does He do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Waheguru helps you be a human? How does He do that? By helping me believe in only One True Formless Waheguru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 By helping me believe in only One True Formless Waheguru. What does it mean to believe in Waheguru? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 What does it mean to believe in Waheguru? You mean the One True Formless Waheguru? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Yes Cool. What does it mean to believe in Waheguru? It means to immerse oneself in Waheguru's name, in Gurbani. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 What happens when one is fully immersed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 (edited) What happens when one is fully immersed? Then one is one with The One. Edited November 27, 2014 by OnPathToSikhi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 What happens after you become one with the One? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 What happens after you become one with the One? If there is still an expectation of something 'happening' after one is one with Waheguru, then that would be desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 What happens after you become one with the One? In reality, you(I) become zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 True. I am not talking about expectation however, I am talking what actually happens. So what happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 True. I am not talking about expectation however, I am talking what actually happens. So what happens? That is for the person to find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 True. I am not talking about expectation however, I am talking what actually happens. So what happens? In reality, you(I) become zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Have you found out? What did you find? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 Have you found out? What did you find? That is an ongoing process. Now that we have some basic mutual understanding and you are agree that there is only One True Formless Waheguru and there are no 'forms of Waheguru', let us come back to the discussion. I am going to put forward a few words in context of sidhu's speech. Help me figure out the co-relation. Guru Arjan Dev Ji, krishan, arjuna from mythology & Waheguru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amar_jkp Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 (edited) Page 98, Line 9 ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਸੰਗੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਮੁਰਾਰੇ ॥ गुरमुखि संगी क्रिसन मुरारे ॥ Gurmukẖ sangī krisan murāre. The Lord Krishna becomes the Gurmukh's Companion.Guru Arjan Dev Page 338, Line 17 ਭਗਤਿ ਹੇਤਿ ਅਵਤਾਰੁ ਲੀਓ ਹੈ ਭਾਗੁ ਬਡੋ ਬਪੁਰਾ ਕੋ ਰੇ ॥੧॥ भगति हेति अवतारु लीओ है भागु बडो बपुरा को रे ॥१॥ Bẖagaṯ heṯ avṯār lī▫o hai bẖāg bado bapurā ko re. ||1|| Because of his devotion, Krishna was incarnated in his home; how great was the good fortune of this poor man! ||1||Devotee Kabir Page 469, Line 15 ਏਕ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨੰ ਸਰਬ ਦੇਵਾ ਦੇਵ ਦੇਵਾ ਤ ਆਤਮਾ ॥ एक क्रिसनं सरब देवा देव देवा त आतमा ॥ Ėk krisanʼn sarab ḏevā ḏev ḏevā ṯa āṯmā. The One Lord Krishna is the Divine Lord of all; He is the Divinity of the individual soul.Guru Angad Dev Page 718, Line 19 ਸੰਤਾਂ ਮਧੇ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਆਛੈ ਗੋਕਲ ਮਧੇ ਸਿਆਮ ਗੋ ॥ संतां मधे गोबिंदु आछै गोकल मधे सिआम गो ॥ Sanṯāʼn maḏẖe gobinḏ ācẖẖai gokal maḏẖe si▫ām go. The Lord of the Universe, Govind, is within His Saints; Krishna, Shyaam, is in Gokal.Devotee Namdev Page 727, Line 18 ਹਮ ਚਿਨੀ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹ ਸਾਂਵਲੇ ਬਰਨਾਂ ॥੩॥ हम चिनी पातिसाह सांवले बरनां ॥३॥ Ham cẖinī pāṯisāh sāʼnvle barnāʼn. ||3|| You are my Lord King, like the dark-skinned Krishna. ||3||Devotee Namdev Page 1082, Line 16 ਸਾਵਲ ਸੁੰਦਰ ਰੂਪ ਬਣਾਵਹਿ ਬੇਣੁ ਸੁਨਤ ਸਭ ਮੋਹੈਗਾ ॥੯॥ सावल सुंदर रूप बणावहि बेणु सुनत सभ मोहैगा ॥९॥ Sāval sunḏar rūp baṇāvėh beṇ sunaṯ sabẖ mohaigā. ||9|| He assumed the beautiful form of the blue-skinned Krishna; hearing His flute, all are fascinated and enticed. ||9||Guru Arjan Dev Page 1191, Line 14 ਦੀਨਾ ਦੀਨ ਦਇਆਲ ਭਏ ਹੈ ਜਿਉ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨੁ ਬਿਦਰ ਘਰਿ ਆਇਆ ॥ दीना दीन दइआल भए है जिउ क्रिसनु बिदर घरि आइआ ॥ Ḏīnā ḏīn ḏa▫i▫āl bẖa▫e hai ji▫o krisan biḏar gẖar ā▫i▫ā. God is Merciful to the meekest of the meek; Krishna came to the house of Bidar, a devotee of low social status.Guru Ram Das This tukk makes it absolutely clear that Krishna was an incarnation of waheguru Page 1390, Line 8 ਦੁਆਪੁਰਿ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਮੁਰਾਰਿ ਕੰਸੁ ਕਿਰਤਾਰਥੁ ਕੀਓ ॥ दुआपुरि क्रिसन मुरारि कंसु किरतारथु कीओ ॥ Ḏu▫āpur krisan murār kans kirṯārath kī▫o. In the Brass Age of Dwaapur Yuga, You were Krishna; You killed Mur the demon and saved Kans.Bard Kal-sahar If any doubt left i would quote from Dasam Granth's Krishna Avatar. In Sikh religion, there is no condemnation of any Avatar o prophet and there is no attempt to give the deficiencies of any person. This is the advice: God is above death and birth and is worthy of adoration. Prophets are all working in His will. Fish, Tortoise, Vairah, Lion, Bawan (Dwarf), Budha, Parasram, Ram Chandra, Krishna and Kalki. In Dasam Granth the Tenth Master has rendered the story of Bhagauti in Vernacular. "There is no other desire, O Lord, only wish to fight for Dharma." (Krishna Avatar) In the same way previously Allah was the name of an old idol. The English word 'God' was used by Teutons to mean Dieu. When Teutons adopted Christianity 'God' came to mean the Eternal. Jehovah is also such a word, which is used by Jews to designate God, but it was the Name of a special god of Assyria. In the same way there are numerous names in other religions. Edited November 27, 2014 by amar_jkp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) That is an ongoing process. Yes and what have you found in the ongoing process? Now that we have some basic mutual understanding and you are agree that there is only One True Formless Waheguru and there are no 'forms of Waheguru', let us come back to the discussion. ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਨੈਨ ਨਨ ਨੈਨ ਹਹਿ ਤੋਹਿ ਕਉ ਸਹਸ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਨਨਾ ਏਕ ਤੋਹੀ ॥ You have thousands of eyes (mouth, hands, feet, nose) and You have no eyes. You have thousands of forms (bodies, statues, shapes, idols, mountains, lakes, trees, planets, stars) and You have no form. Waheguru has countless forms, simultaneously He has no form. It's not one or the other, it's both! Your body is Waheguru's body and your consciousness is Waheguru's consciousness. Feel it. It's not an objective, this is a subjective answer that can only be felt internally. I am going to put forward a few words in context of sidhu's speech. Help me figure out the co-relation. Guru Arjan Dev Ji, krishan, arjuna from mythology & Waheguru. Of course I'll help. Go ahead, describe the co-relation. Edited November 28, 2014 by BhagatSingh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Waheguru has countless forms, simultaneously He has no form. It's not one or the other, it's both! Wrong again! I don't think you even contemplate on what our Guru says. It is all ONE. Creator & The Creation. All ONE. Of course I'll help. Go ahead, describe the co-relation. I will sure per my understanding. Let us see what you have go to say first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Wrong again! I don't think you even contemplate on what our Guru says. It is all ONE. Creator & The Creation. All ONE. Yes it's all One. What does does it mean "It's all One"? That means that everything is Waheguru, everything is a part of Him. What about all the forms? All the forms all the eyes, mouth, hands, feet, nose, bodies, statues, shapes, idols, mountains, lakes, trees, planets, stars, etc, these are all forms of Waheguru. What happens when you find out? What does it mean to be a human, a form of Waheguru? What does it mean to be One with Waheguru? What have you found in the ongoing process? What does it mean to believe in Waheguru? First I see His forms, then I look inside and see Him there as formless projecting Himself as Bhagat Singh, then I look outside again and see Him in all the forms, appearing as the forms themselves, no distinction. Waheguru appears to me as form, wherever I look. He looks back through His forms. Then it feels like it is Waheguru looking outside, looking inside, looking around everywhere, looking back at Himself like multi-dimensional mirror. What a game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Yes it's all One. What does does it mean "It's all One"? That means that everything is Waheguru, everything is a part of Him. What about all the forms? All the forms all the eyes, mouth, hands, feet, nose, bodies, statues, shapes, idols, mountains, lakes, trees, planets, stars, etc, these are all forms of Waheguru. What happens when you find out? What does it mean to be a human, a form of Waheguru? What does it mean to be One with Waheguru? What have you found in the ongoing process? What does it mean to believe in Waheguru? First I see His forms, then I look inside and see Him there as formless projecting Himself as Bhagat Singh, then I look outside again and see Him in all the forms, appearing as the forms themselves, no distinction. Waheguru appears to me as form, wherever I look. He looks back through His forms. Then it feels like it is Waheguru looking outside, looking inside, looking around everywhere, looking back at Himself like multi-dimensional mirror. What a game! What about all the 'forms'? Still ONE. A game indeed! A game of love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Now do you accept that kameena sidhu was wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 On the contrary. Have you not been paying any attention to any of the Gurbani quoted in this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnPathToSikhi Posted November 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Have you not been paying any attention to any of the Gurbani quoted in this thread? I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts