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5 Pyare: selected by the Guru?


SikhKhoj

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Haha unlike you who just keep mentioning unnamed scholars and unnamed sources (which probably dont even exist you crappy liar) I actually name the people I take information from so people can read up on the arguments..... But if taking information from someone Means that im up their arse,-  does it mean that your head is up all those unnamed scholars and professors arses as well? Indeed your head has been up in many arses by now then. You are indeed a little mental piece of shit.

I humbly bow for all the times you've enlightened me - you are indeed a Blessing to this World. May it be that millions more are blessed with your guidance and superior knowledge.

Edited by amardeep
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I'm going to throw this in the mix:

I think they run riot with these tenuous links with past figures in India. It's a cultural thing.

I mean, looking at certain puratan manuscripts, it appears as if it was quite a commonly held belief that Baba Nanak was a reincarnation of Raja Janak a few centuries ago. But this seems to have been an idea that has been jettisoned by the Sikh masses today. 

​I seriously doubt it. In Guru Granth Sahib it is quite clear that Guru Nanak Dev ji is the incarnation of Hari. Any other other theory is a misunderstanding of this.
Are you sure you are reading them correctly?

Oh okay, so caste is such a powerful thing that it stuck with them across incarnations......

Now that DOES sound like Hinduism rather than Sikhi to me.

Well "sound like hinduism" is not a good reason to reject anything. The concept of Atma "sound like Hinduism" but is a crucial concept in Guru Granth Sahib.
Guru Nanak Dev ji being an incarnation of Hari "sound like Hinduism" but it's mentioned again and again in Guru Granth Sahib.

Now Paapiman has presented no evidence. Caste is not evidence of reincarnation.

But hypothetically It is quite possible that caste is carried over to some degree. Especially if you consider that reincarnation maybe a method of learning and advancement of a soul. So the soul might want to pick a similar environment to advance in. If you change environments now it has to spend time learning the environment rather than focusing on its own purpose.

Funny how no good people from Europe or Africa was reincarnated as an important Sikh. Looks like this whole reincarnation thing is quite restricted geographically. 

I wouldn't say it is restricted geographically... rather people from one geographical region or culture want to reincarnate back in to that region and culture. Where would you want to reincarnate to after you die? In some random culture you've never even heard of before? whom you can't even identify with?

So for this reason as well caste maybe preserved as that individual may want to do the same kinds of things as they did in previous births. It's goes against the idea that caste is oppression, doesn't it? Does someone actually like being a Ghumeyar, potter? Of course!

And often times when there is evidence of reincarnation you can only look so far until you find a match between the dead person and the newborn. So it's the nature of evidence itself that is restricted as well.

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if I remember correctly, Rattan Singh Bhangu does specifically mention that Hari took incarnation into the Khashatriya caste in all four Yugas (when talking about the present day avatar of Guru Maharaj). Maybe the authors of the past used "caste status" as a way of making links between different joons.

 

Maybe the all-knowing and all-intelligent Sikhkhoj can expand on this - may we all be blessed with his knowledge. If we make any errors then Thank God he will be here to assist and correct us. Considering that the Panth Prakash is low level for him - it should be piece of cake for him to confirm...If he does'nt want to help then he is just an arrogant piece of shit as always.

Edited by amardeep
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if I remember correctly, Rattan Singh Bhangu does specifically mention that Hari took incarnation into the Khashatriya caste in all four Yugas (when talking about the present day avatar of Guru Maharaj). Maybe the authors of the past used "caste status" as a way of making links between different joons.

Maybe but Hari took incarnation as a Brahmin in Satyug. He came a small, midget-like and was known as Vaman.
But in Treta and Dwapar I think He needed to come as a Kshatriya, Ram and Krishna, and be in a position of power in order to influence. Those are the most popular, the Kshatriya ones because I think we love His forms that can kick some ass lol.

Lol the idea of Bhagat Namdev reincarnating as a warrior to kick ass is enticing lol. ;)

Edited by BhagatSingh
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Paapi, stop being a hypocrite. If you assume Hindalis wanted to destroy Sikhi, wouldn't Koer Singh perhaps distort Sikhi too? He was from a Hindu background and bhought a lot of Hindu interpretation of Sikhi as is evident from his work. His previous name was Vishan Daas..

​I did not say all Hindaliyes were bad, but you cannot deny the fact that some were pretty bad and caused problems for the panth. I don't know too much about Baba Koer Singh jee.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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Ive enlightened you many times you dog, you don't deserve my superior knowledge phuddua

Im just going Sikhkhoj style :) For some weird reason he prefers a rough debate with insults along the way

​Relax guys. Please use this energy to fight the demons in the mind and enlighten cyber sangat with more knowledge. There is already enough hatred and violence in the world.

Bhul chuk maaf

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And it is funny that you yourself said 'it is a little anti gurmat but see this', are you blind? To justify Koer Singh and Baba Gurbachan Bhindranwale you go against Gurmat? Shame on you.

I said --- 

Quote

There is one clue. It might be a little anti-gurmat. Their castes were the same.

Unquote

 

It might be anti-gurmat to some people. Check out, what Dalsingh wrote, after that:

 

Now that DOES sound like Hinduism rather than Sikhi to me.

​Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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Now Paapiman has presented no evidence. Caste is not evidence of reincarnation.
 

​The granths, where it is mentioned have been provided. I don't doubt a scholar-saint like Srimaan 108 Sant Gyani Gurbachan Singh jee Khalsa Bhindrawale.

 

ਦੇਖਹੁ ਪਸਾਰਿ ਨੈਨ ਸੁਨਹੁ ਸਾਧੂ ਕੇ ਬੈਨ ਪ੍ਰਾਨਪਤਿ ਚਿਤਿ ਰਾਖੁ ਸਗਲ ਹੈ ਮਰਨਾ ॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Behold, with your eyes wide-open, and listen to the Words of the Holy Saints; enshrine in your consciousness the Lord of Life - remember that all must die. 

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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Bhai Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale was a mere human. He told what he learnt or read. He was wrong on Guru Har Rais 8 marriages or Muhammad stealing Quran from a Sadhu after killing him (no historical proof besides some dubious account in Bansawlinama).

 

- ​Seventh master having 8 wives is mentioned in Sri Gur Sooraj Prakash Granth

- Gyani Gyani Singh jee has mentioned that master had 4 wives, each wife brought one servant along with her.

Seventh master having 8 wives is also mentioned in Gur Bilas granth by Shaheed Srimaan Baba Mani Singh jee Maharaaj

- Bansawalinama is a historical account, which mentions about Prophet Muhammad. One cannot say that everything in that book, is incorrect. 

Anyways, let's stay on topic.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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- Suraj Parkash also says Ragmala is not Bani, do you believe it?

- Mehima Parkash, by Guru Amar Das Jis descendant, says Guru Har Rai had one wife.

- Bansawlinama claims something about Muhammad 1100 years after Muhammad. Thats the most unreliable account possible, especially because no other earlier source talks about it.

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- Suraj Parkash also says Ragmala is not Bani, do you believe it?

​We both know that some historical accounts have been tampered. So, there is no point in debating too much about sources.

Gurbani is above all historical accounts. Satguru jee having 8 wives is not against Gurmat.

- Bansawlinama claims something about Muhammad 1100 years after Muhammad. Thats the most unreliable account possible, especially because no other earlier source talks about it.

​Are you 100% sure that there is no mention about Prophet Muhammad and the sadhu, in any other source, anywhere in the world?

Bhul chuk maaf

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Weren't you eager to help with getting a Sikh book translated? Lets get in touch with the society?

​A Sikh book? No. I'm interested in getting older Sikh manuscripts and granths translated.

But perhaps if we did it separately it might be better. You see, I'm a thicko, and your superior knowledge is shining through your posts, and I feel I would only be holding you back.

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  • 3 years later...
On 6/15/2015 at 2:29 AM, SikhKhoj said:

I'm messing around with Paapi who thinks its god giften gyan. I.e. antaryami. While I continue saying that these Babay just reiterate what they read without usually analyzing the sources.

Khalsa mool mantar states the previous lives of the panj pyare. 

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