Charitropakhyan etc written by Court Poets (historical)

[Crystal]

http://www.sikhscholar.co.uk/2013/06/sri-dasam-granth-sahib-at-sri-akal.html?m=1

[chatanga1]

Chatanga I refuse to argue with you anymore.

You know people CAN disagree about things which have no definitive proof, without you needing to denegrate them and be rude because you feel your position is the correct one (and somehow think that's not Ego)

That's all I am going to say.  You can rant all you want. I'm done.

Satkirin

Stop banging on about the same arguments when you have had your answers then. This is more or less all you have been doing for the last year here.

[OnPathToSikhi]

 

You give the Guru nothing!

Before anyone starts reading too much into it just want to point out, we have nothing to offer the Guru other than our 'head'.

[chatanga1]

Before anyone starts reading too much into it just want to point out, we have nothing to offer the Guru other than our 'head'.

Yes I know that thank you please, and it went through my head as I wrote it. I was thinking more from the approving aspect. Satkiran feels  Guru Sahibs' words need her approval, or thinks she can give Guru Sahib credit for something.

That is not acceptable for a Sikh to do or say. That is like saying that everything they did wasn't correct. Guru Sahib upheld Dharma, there was nothing they did wrong or useless.

[OnPathToSikhi]

Chatanga paai saab ji, agree with your views. Me, in fact have been going over some of the topics and am utter loss of words the way some of the members here have been carrying out the discussion. Sometime it feels like a bunch of teenagers trying to shout each other off. Most are so self centered and fueled by their own ego. Unfortunately I cannot say much on the historical technicalities, but some of the view being put forward seem outright irrational.  Even on panthic so called 'issues' some things don't make sense. When we have  'Sikh women fighting for equal rights'. This statement sounds an oxymoron to me. Not saying we do not have social injustice or crimes against women (within Sikh panth as well), but that is what those issues are - Social issues. I would think most of us are accustomed to the western mindset where we see everything in a structural view from top to bottom. And that causes a problem on how we set our own expectations. And then we try to bring that perspective and ideas in Sikhi. People tend to forget that there are no 'structures' in the Sikh panth. Everyone 'reports' to one supreme Waheguru. There is no 'ladder' to climb. For both men or women. You only have spiritual 'ladder' to bring you closer to Waheguru.

Also, It is a shame when we have people here trying to 'define' who is a Sikh. In my view anyone who says he/she follows and tries to live by the teachings of Sir Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj, can be called a Sikh. Being Sikh is not a 'stamp'. When you are a 'learner', each person has his/her own pace. The amritdhari are the Khalsa initiated Sikhs. Those who know what it means to give their head to the Guru. Those who know how to serve the Sikh panth and the humanity, with their head in their palm. For their own convenience people cannot meet the higher spiritual standards of being a Amritdhari Khalsa Sikh, and then want to redefine what it means to be a Sikh.

For people who oppose Dasam Bani, I would say you are better off. It is not for the faint hearted and neither for anyone who does not fully understand the teachings of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Apologies to all for going off topic. Just wanted to say a few words.

[Xylitol]

Oral tradition is valid as evidence. It is our panth’s oral tradition, coming from more than one unbroken lineage of teachers, that all of Dasam Granth Sahib ji is Gurbani. Despite the existence of numerous lineages of teachers, there is not one single contradiction to this point of view. 

 

Additionally, oral history can have great integrity. So much so, that even the supreme courts in Canada have recognized native oral traditions as providing a substantial evidentiary basis for native land claims. ie. White-owned courts have acknowledged that natives can make a claim on land controlled by whites based on oral evidence alone!!

 

The oral history is of course in addition to the internal evidence within Dasam Bani that corresponds perfectly to the teachings in Guru Granth Sahib ji and other evidences as well. 

 

The bottom-line is that the Dasam Granth Sahib’s status as Gurbani IS and has always been the accepted belief of the Khalsa. As the interlopers, the ones who are challenging the accepted belief of the Panth, it is incumbent upon these people to present evidence of their assertions. They have made numerous posts on this forum but I have not seen any actually step forward to provide any substantial evidence for their claims. Anybody can criticize, anybody can say this or that isn’t Bani, but where is the evidence that actually goes beyond mere conjecture?!?!