Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
paapiman

Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Dev jee is greater than Vishnu jee/Shiv jee/Other Deities

Recommended Posts

The above clearly proves that Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is the greatest.

Bhul chuk maaf

Okay, agreed that Guru Nanak Dev Ji was highest of the high; He is the greatest. But the real question is: Are you following Guru Ji's instructions/teachings in real sense? You're born in Sikhism and therefore its easier for you to follow Guru Ji's teachings (no resistance from society, family etc.). If you still don't follow the real core teachings of Guru Nanak Dev Ji, then having Guru Nanak Dev Ji as greatest have NO benefit to you. Think about it.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a problem in your methodology. You select five criteria and then proceed to show how the Guru was superior in each. But what if you chose some other criteria where the Guru "was not superior"? What happens then? Being selective wont get you anywhere.

Bro, it is not my methodology (Daas is not a scholar). The information is from a website. 

Anyways, Sikhs should not have any doubt that Satguru jee was greater than other avtaars.

Do you know of any criteria, which can prove that Satguru jee was not superior to the other avtaars?

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Each avatar comes with a specific purpose and mission according to the context they manifest in. Krishna was pooran according to the context he manifested in and the Sri Satguru was pooran according to the context they manifested in. 

Bro, your point makes sense. Previous Avtaars had the required powers, according to the need of the times. But the fact cannot be changed. Kaljug is the most dangerous yug, in terms of vices. Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is the most powerful avtaar, that has ever walked this planet. Satguru jee's mantars are the most powerful ones and can be used in any yug, to attain the highest possible state of mind.

There might be people out there, who will claim that Sri Krishan jee Maharaaj is the greatest. We need to be ready to counter their claims.

Bhul chuk maaf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maalko the same Gurbani praises the Avtars too..this very comparison is ignorance...Philosophically it can be said that Akaal Purakh ji sent his messengers to guide humanity . Who the hell are we to compare their energies ? Are we even the charan dhur of any of these avatars ? If you just want to keep pumping your ego and arrogance then it is a different play ..has any hindu ever used such comparision?

Personally i am more attached to Guru Gobindsingh sahib ji Maharaj ..it would be absolutely foolish to prove his greatness over other Gurus and avatars ..just like to a child his parents are the best so also to us our Gurus are the best and to others who worship other Gurus and avatars they would be the best.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.

Also, why the hell you're so desperate to show the world (other religions) to counter-act their claims? The real point is: What you've achieved by following Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Think about yourself, in dargah, your Spiritual achievements will be measured and not your debating skills (debating on topics which are all illusion).

Exactly. I beleive sant maharaj ji talks about it in jutta shah divan. In my own understanding, the reason that student with 100% faith and student who surrenders completely, will reach higher spiritual stage despite even physical guru is not pora because inner real jot of everything from absolute (not relative but absolute point of view) including adhura guru not poora guru is ONE AND SAME,  when physical guru is not poora yet student bairaag is genuine, inner force- inner guru within all of us- which is non dual undivided one pure consciousness(Jot) of all draws seeker as mass magnet draws a small neddle. But in order for that to happen to seeker, seeker has to have full faith, surrender unequivocally to higher power, be totally receptive, give up doer ship, efforts, just be in silent space(quiet mind) for spontaneous flash spark/drawing-grace/recognition of real self.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.

Bro, Baba jee says that the person, who has full faith in a false guru, will eventually meet a true guru. There is no way that he can attain liberation, as per Gurbani.

Two conditions have to be met to attain salvation: 

- The disciple needs to have 100% faith in his guru

- The Guru has to be pooran (like SSGGSJ)

We are so lucky that we know, who the true guru is.

Do you want our sisters and brothers to go to a false guru?

Do you want to be selfish?

What is wrong in creating awareness? No one has used any derogatory language against previous avtaars.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 If you just want to keep pumping your ego and arrogance then it is a different play ..has any hindu ever used such comparision?

 

Are you sure paaji that Hindus don't do comparisons? Check the link below:

http://www.esamskriti.com/essay-chapters/Why-Sikhism-is-not-a-separate-religion-1.aspx

Bhul chuk maaf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Avatarvaad is not based on some competition on who is the greatest. Each avatar comes with a specific purpose and mission according to the context they manifest in. Krishna was pooran according to the context he manifested in and the Sri Satguru was pooran according to the context they manifested in. I find this "my Guru is greater than your Guru" business a bit too childish.

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.

Also, why the hell you're so desperate to show the world (other religions) to counter-act their claims? The real point is: What you've achieved by following Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Think about yourself, in dargah, your Spiritual achievements will be measured and not your debating skills (debating on topics which are all illusion).

Maalko the same Gurbani praises the Avtars too..this very comparison is ignorance...Philosophically it can be said that Akaal Purakh ji sent his messengers to guide humanity . Who the hell are we to compare their energies ? Are we even the charan dhur of any of these avatars ? If you just want to keep pumping your ego and arrogance then it is a different play ..has any hindu ever used such comparision?

Personally i am more attached to Guru Gobindsingh sahib ji Maharaj ..it would be absolutely foolish to prove his greatness over other Gurus and avatars ..just like to a child his parents are the best so also to us our Gurus are the best and to others who worship other Gurus and avatars they would be the best.

Exactly. I beleive sant maharaj ji talks about it in jutta shah divan. In my own understanding, the reason that student with 100% faith and student who surrenders completely, will reach higher spiritual stage despite even physical guru is not pora because inner real jot of everything from absolute (not relative but absolute point of view) including adhura guru not poora guru is ONE AND SAME,  when physical guru is not poora yet student bairaag is genuine, inner force- inner guru within all of us- which is non dual undivided one pure consciousness(Jot) of all draws seeker as mass magnet draws a small neddle. But in order for that to happen to seeker, seeker has to have full faith, surrender unequivocally to higher power, be totally receptive, give up doer ship, efforts, just be in silent space(quiet mind) for spontaneous flash spark/drawing-grace/recognition of real self.

Do you guys know, that the above explanation (proving first master is above other Avtaars) was given by Satguru Sri Guru Gobind Singh jee Maharaaj himself, to his Sikhs?

Bhul chuk maaf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do you want our sisters and brothers to go to a false guru?

Do you want to be selfish?

What is wrong in creating awareness? No one has used any derogatory language against previous avtaars.

Bhul chuk maaf

Bhaji, availability/opportunity and benefit-from-that-opportunity is different. i.e If you've got the opportunity, it doesn't mean you'll the benefit from it.

e.g If you happen to have a Well in your house and there is a fire in your neighborhood (including your home); and then you're going out to create awareness among the follow neighbors but not getting the real work done (i.e pull the water from well and extinguish fire first in your house and then move on to another house). It would be foolishness if you did not took advantage of the availability of the well. That well's importance is ZERO if You didn't took advantage of it.

e.g A blind man cannot help another blind man. i.e it would be foolishness-with-good-intention-but-without-knowledge (and not awareness) for the blind person to tell the other blind person the path to somewhere where neither we've done nor we've seen. Same way, we cannot help other if we're still incapable.

So, again take the advantage of being born in Guru Nanak's ghar and achieve something and then help others. Otherwise, you're bound to create problems in other people's Spiritual life along with yours. e.g Not all students are at the level where they need world level professional coach; some can learn from seniors, some can learn from local professionals etc. etc. Same way, not everyone is ready to puran Guru. You cannot expect to reach the top/ceiling/roof without the smaller lower steps. Each step has its own importance. Everything is dependent, understand the working of this universe.

Edited by das

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

. e.g Not all students are at the level where they need world level professional coach; some can learn from seniors, some can learn from local professionals etc. etc. Same way, not everyone is ready to puran Guru. You cannot expect to reach the top/ceiling/roof without the smaller lower steps. Each step has its own importance. Everything is dependent, understand the working of this universe.

Paaji, your points above make sense, if we were on a non-Sikh forum. Here, most of the people, if not all, should be aware that the Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is the greatest guru of all time.

Anyone born in a Sikh family, should be ready for a pooran guru. That is why, they have been given birth in a Sikh family by God. One does not get birth in a Sikh family, with ease.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you sure paaji that Hindus don't do comparisons? Check the link below:

http://www.esamskriti.com/essay-chapters/Why-Sikhism-is-not-a-separate-religion-1.aspx

Bhul chuk maaf

This article has nothing which shows the Gurus in lesser light ..it is his understanding that nothing is different between Puaratan Mat of the Sanatan and Khalsa ..there is a video on youtube which has a clipping of Nihang Baba Tirloksingh ji wherein he says Jugo Jug Atal Khalsa ...Ramchandar ji and Kirshan ji Maharaj are said to believed to be Khalsa yoddhe too...or check out the videos of Nihang Ba ba Balli singh ji  he connects the Devte giving the kakkars ..kachera Hanuman ji to milya ..Kara Shiv ji to..

 

I even though am born a hindu  clearly understand the distinguishing line ..where Sanatan and Khalsa Mat goes ..Sanatan Mat sampradays conclude that their deities are the Supreme goal and see Akaal in them and the Puratan Mat of the Khalsa recognizing the Avatars denies them being Akaal concludes that they are sewadars of Akaal and have limitations . The Supreme goal is Param Parmatma Akaal Purakh sahib ji . 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sangat jee: Please listen to the audio clip below by Gyani Thakur Singh jee. Gyani jee proves (using an analogy) that the worship of Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is the best, as compared to the worship of other deities.

Worship of Sri Hans jee is like white silk.

Worship of Sri Ram Chandar jee is like red silk.

Worship of Sri Krishan jee is like yellow silk.

Worship of Sri Kalki jee is like black silk.

Worship of Satguru Sri Guru Nanak Rai Dev Bedi jee Maharaaj is like Silma Sitara.

 

Please listen after 13.50 min:

http://www.gurbaniupdesh.org/multimedia/04-Katha/13-Giani Thakur Singh Ji (Patiala Wale)/Katha Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji/CD09(Ang0620-0747)/0680-Ang-0646-Pankti-01.mp3

 

What is Silma Sitara? Please have a look below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jdfONuQELY

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You can find similiar references in the Puratan Janam Sakhi. The idea is to convey to the reader that Guru Nanak is the yug avatar of this age continuing the line from Rama, Krishna etc... Its not a competition of who is the highest.

Edited by amardeep

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, paapiman said:

Bro, a river cannot compete with an ocean. No one can compete with the Almighty Waheguru.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

An ocean does'nt need to prove to the river that it is greater.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...