SHASTAR PUJA

[Guest Javanmard]

How do you individually perform shastar puja. Shastar puja is mentioned several times in Chaupa SIngh Rahitnama and is part of puratan maryada. how do practice it?

[Narsingha]

Have a gander at:

http://www.shastarvidiya.org/video/video.html

Shastar Pooja begins with Shastar Namaskaran (salutation to weapons). This takes the form of physical movements (exercises, training), and vocal (jakaras, salutations to Mahakaal, Durga, Shaheed warriors of the past, jungi bolas, Savayas and Dohras from Dasam and Sarbloh Guru Durbar, insults to enemies, etc.).

Each movement has a deeper spiritual meaning that is designed to focus the mind towards Bir Ras (warrior essence), and is not simply done for the sake of it.

:wink:

[J.Singh]

narsingha,

i can appreciate the respecting/worshiping of shaster...for its the protector of a warrior. Its a similar concept to the samurai, who also greatly revered their shasters...

However, my question is still unanswered:

Do Nihangs worship (Pooja) Chandi/Durga Deity (albeit in a different form - shasters, as opposed to stone idols)?

lalleshvari,

check out the shastervidya website videos, it shows the trainees perfoming this pooja...

[Narsingha]

Please see: http://www.sarbloh.info/htmls/epilogue_sikh.html

[Hari]

My own personal view on Chandi/Mata is that She also represents Mahat, higher mind.In many cultures and spiritual traditions, the higher mind, Mahat has been personified as a female entity.If we look at one of Chandi's myths, there is one where she fights a buffalo demon.I think it's name is Mahish, please correct me if I'm wrong.

As I see it the buffalo demon represents the ahankar, lower mind.Animal mind, hence it being represented by an animal-demon.The ahankar is both animalist and demonic (attracted towards ignorant pursuits).

Now, the Goddess is the Mahat.In the myth we have the Goddess slay the demon after numerous attempts.The Mahat slays ahankar after numerous attempts too.Again and again, ahankar gets the better of us, but in the end it is always slayed.

In Japu Ji Sahib we have the following Slok:

Pavan Guru.Pani Pita.Mata Dhart Mahat.

Now "Mata Dhart Mahat" can mean "The Great Mother is the Earth" or "The Mother is the Earth/Buddhi".

In many cultures around the world, the Mother is the Earth and the higher mind, the Bibek Buddhi.Many cultures have given Buddhi a femenine face.They say that Buddhi has a womb too, which can give birth to good children, ie good thoughts.The seed is Atma, Pure Consciouness.

However Mahat usually ends up prostituting Herself to bad men, ie ahankar.She ends up giving birth to bad children, ie bad ahankari thoughts.

Ahankar is the bad khasm, Atma the good Khasm.Meet with the good Husband and you'll gain the favour of the Father (Parbrahm).

From kuchajji to Suchajji.

Just my thoughts anyway.

[J.Singh]

thanks for the link.

However this seems to have created more questions than answers.

in your post you state that:

Chandi pooja within Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa takes the form of learning Shastar Vidiya and respecting Sarbloh

On your site:

...do not worship any deity but Ekh Nirankar Akal Va-eh Guru, the three Sikh scriptures, Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa Panth (Spiritual Way), Udhasi, Nirmala and Sevapanthi Sikh Panth and the Shastars

These comments appear contradictory.

On one hand ONLY Akal Purkh is worshipped, however on the other, nihangs also participate in Chandi pooja (worship), with shasters rather than idols.

can u pls elborate?

btw, are you going to add a search engine on you site?

[Narsingha]

What do u think Chandi represents?

[Gupt Singh]

even if chandi represents weapons, its still not right to worship anything other than akal purakh, obviously

[tSingh]

Gurfateh

KS, how is worshipping chandi NOT worshipping Akal Purakh?

[tSingh]

Gurfateh

There seems to be double standards among certain Sikhs on this issue.

When you happen to quote 'Deh Siva...' shabad, they are the first to state 'ah but Siva in this situation is not the deity Shiva but just another name for God', yet often these same people denounce Chandi Di Var as deity worship! Perhaps they should make their minds ups!

I perceive Chandi as a manifestation of an aspect of the formless Nirankar, and worship therefore of Chandi is worship of Akal Purakh.

[Gupt Singh]

the deh siva.......does actually refer to god, in kabiobach benti chaupai theres a line that goes something like "they erroneously call mahadev the eternal SIV"

by worshipping a weapon......that is as bad as the hindus, becuz the hindus claim they are worshipping a facet of gods personality/virtues......so really there is little difference in my mind.....mayb sum1 can convince me otherwise

how do nihungs do shahster puja anyway? bow to it - yeh thats orite....bt do they do nyting else?

[Guest Javanmard]

well in Deh Shivaa, shivaa does not mean Shiv but Shivaa the feminine aspect of God, Shakti. Shivaa (with long aa at the end) is the feminine of Shiva. Sanskrit does help my friends. Sometimes grammar gives you the right answer without having to rely on stories that one has heard about some baba some where in some pind. Grammar is clear and objective!

[Hari]

lalleshvari:

well in Deh Shivaa, shivaa does not mean Shiv but Shivaa the feminine aspect of God, Shakti. Shivaa (with long aa at the end) is the feminine of Shiva.

Yes, lalleshvari is correct.Shiv-aa is Aad Shakti; "aa" = to come from.

Shivaa = that which comes from Shiv; Shakti/Durga/Chandi/Mother/Maya

[J.Singh]

Narsingha

I presume u imply that Chandi represents shasters (am I correct)?

What do u think Chandi represents?

I think it represents the ‘mythical’ deity durga (hence I state chandi/durga)-

My reasoning for this is the tuk from chaupai (pranvo ad ekankara…):

“charan saran jeh basat bhawani [chandi]â€

"goddess chandi takes her shelter at his feet"

ur opinion pls

JtSingh,

I perceive Chandi as a manifestation of an aspect of the formless Nirankar, and worship therefore of Chandi is worship of Akal Purakh.

Can u pls explain (with bani if possible) as to why you perceive Chandi as a “manifestation†of Akal Purkh?

Thank you

[Gupt Singh]

well in Deh Shivaa, shivaa does not mean Shiv but Shivaa the feminine aspect of God, Shakti. Shivaa (with long aa at the end) is the feminine of Shiva. Sanskrit does help my friends. Sometimes grammar gives you the right answer without having to rely on stories that one has heard about some baba some where in some pind. Grammar is clear and objective!

lol.....i dont live in a pind i live in london......and my "story" was made by me.....regardless of whether its siv or shiva the intention is still the same just like raam is used 4 god in SGGS or chandi is used as a metaphor for divine light in every human fighting the desires in chandi di var....doesnt actually mean that guruji even remotely CARES about shiva...theres some gurbani where guru gobind singh says "i do not acknowledge ganesha, nor krishna as importnat " or something like that

[Guest Javanmard]

Sorry hari but when you're referring to aa as to come your refering to the verbal root (mula). I was actually refering to aa as the feminine ending. See A Sanskrit Grammar for Students by McDonnell (oxford University press) under the chapter declentions.

[tableji]

doing pooja of the guru granth sahib ji is enuff for me

[Guest Javanmard]

so you disregard Guru Gobind Singh's statements about shastar being Guru as well?

[tableji]

no i didnt say that

[Hari]

Sorry hari but when you're referring to aa as to come your refering to the verbal root (mula). I was actually refering to aa as the feminine ending. See A Sanskrit Grammar for Students by McDonnell (oxford University press) under the chapter declentions.

I understand what you say.I was using my own understanding of Shakti in my explaination, which was quite silly in hindsight.But I have affection for these kinds of imagery for the Divine.

And does not Shakti come form Shiv?

Kaali Mata...

[Hari]

doing pooja of the guru granth sahib ji is enuff for me

If you consider yourself a Singh then it is mandatory for you to do Shastra Puja.

Understand when I say that you have to do Shastra Puja if you are a Singh.Are you a Singh?

Don't answer me.Answer to yourself.

[Hari]

This is for all those "Singh" out there who refuse and even mock Shastra Puja:

"As(i), Kirpan, Khando Kharag, Tupak, Tabar ar(u) Tir.

Saif, Sarohi, Saihati - yahai hamarai Pir!!" (Shastra Naam Mala, Guru Gobind Singh)

Guru Gobind Singh himself worshipped Shastar.

[tableji]

i didnt mock it, and i didnt say i refuse it. im a simple singh, who has a very basic rehit, e.g naam simran, nitnem etc, and ive only been into sikhi properly the last year or so, so im stil learning. bt ive come across this shabad wen i was doin santhia n it hit me!

maas maas kar moorakh jhagarrae giaan dhhiaan nehee jaanai ||

The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom.

bt then the next line asks "What is mass??"

koun maas koun saag kehaavai kis mehi paap samaanae ||

What is called meat, and what is called green vegetables? What leads to sin?

gai(n)addaa maar hom jag keeeae dhaevathiaa kee baanae ||

It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering.(metaphoric, not literal)

maas shhodd bais nak pakarrehi raathee maanas khaanae ||

Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night.

farr kar lokaa(n) no dhikhalaavehi giaan dhhiaan nehee soojhai ||

They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom.

naanak a(n)dhhae sio kiaa keheeai kehai n kehiaa boojhai ||

O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people? They cannot answer, or even understand what is said.

a(n)dhhaa soe j a(n)dhh kamaavai this ridhai s lochan naahee ||

They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts

maath pithaa kee rakath nipa(n)nae mashhee maas n khaa(n)hee ||

They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat.

eisathree purakhai jaa(n) nis maelaa outhhai ma(n)dhh kamaahee ||

But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh.

(How many of u can truthfully say that u dnt do that above??)

maasahu ni(n)mae maasahu ja(n)mae ham maasai kae bhaa(n)ddae ||

In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh.

giaan dhhiaan kashh soojhai naahee chathur kehaavai paa(n)ddae ||

You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar.

baahar kaa maas ma(n)dhaa suaamee ghar kaa maas cha(n)gaeraa ||

O master, you believe that flesh on the outside is bad, but the flesh of those in your own home is good.

jeea ja(n)th sabh maasahu hoeae jeee laeiaa vaasaeraa ||

All beings and creatures are flesh; the soul has taken up its home in the flesh.

abhakh bhakhehi bhakh thaj shhoddehi a(n)dhh guroo jin kaeraa ||

They eat the uneatable; they reject and abandon what they could eat. They have a teacher who is blind.

maasahu ni(n)mae maasahu ja(n)mae ham maasai kae bhaa(n)ddae ||

In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh

giaan dhhiaan kashh soojhai naahee chathur kehaavai paa(n)ddae ||

You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar.

maas puraanee maas kathaeba(n)aee chahu jug maas kamaanaa ||

Meat is allowed in the Puraanas, meat is allowed in the Bible and the Koran. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used.

jaj kaaj veeaahi suhaavai outhhai maas samaanaa ||

It is featured in sacred feasts and marriage festivities; meat is used in them

eisathree purakh nipajehi maasahu paathisaah sulathaanaa(n) ||

Women, men, kings and emperors originate from meat.

jae oue dhisehi narak jaa(n)dhae thaa(n) ounh kaa dhaan n lainaa ||

If you see them going to hell, then do not accept charitable gifts from them.

dhae(n)adhaa narak surag laidhae dhaekhahu eaehu dhhin(g)aanaa ||

The giver goes to hell, while the receiver goes to heaven - look at this injustice.

aap n boojhai lok bujhaaeae paa(n)ddae kharaa siaanaa ||

You do not understand your own self, but you preach to other people. O Pandit, you are very wise indeed.

paa(n)ddae thoo jaanai hee naahee kithhahu maas oupa(n)naa ||

O Pandit, you do not know where meat originated.

thoeiahu a(n)n kamaadh kapaahaa(n) thoeiahu thribhavan ga(n)naa ||

Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water

thoaa aakhai ho bahu bidhh hashhaa thoai bahuth bikaaraa ||

Water says, ""I am good in many ways."" But water takes many forms.

eaethae ras shhodd hovai sa(n)niaasee naanak kehai vichaaraa ||2||

Forsaking these delicacies, one becomes a true Sannyaasee, a detached hermit. Nanak reflects and speaks. ||2||

On reflection of myself, i aint worthy or ready to do things like wear bana or dumala.

And plus i havnt got to dasam or sarbloh banis yet, but am plannin to get santhia of those 2

[Hari]

Don't worry tableji, I wasn't directly accusing yu of mocking anything to do with (Nihang) Singh maryada.You are still learning, like me.

Never stop learning.And look upon the whole world as Guru de Sikh.

[Guest Javanmard]

Chaupa SIngh Rahitnama says that a SIngh has to do shastar puja and should not take his shastar with him when doing his needs. yes shastar puja even just in the simple form of matha tek is part of rahit!