BhagatSingh Posted May 1, 2016 Report Share Posted May 1, 2016 7 hours ago, paapiman said: Did Baba Banda Singh jee Bahadur wore red clothes? Red and Green are forbidden colors for the Khalsa. Notice the only one wearing blue clothes are the Turks and Pathans. This one also features Mai Bhajo ji. (notice she is not wearing a turban) Akali Phula Singh ji wearing red and green - (notice the ear-rings as well) Both pieces are from 1800s. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted May 1, 2016 Report Share Posted May 1, 2016 12 hours ago, BhagatSingh said: The above might be an artist rendition. Red and Green colors are not worn by Nihangs. Green is very dear to the Muslims (favorite color of Hazrat Muhammad saab). Is there any other evidence present to suggest that Sikhs used to wear red clothes in battle fields? Four primary colors of the Sikhs are Orange, Dark Blue, Black and White. This can be easily proved, if one looks at the colors (of clothes) prevalent in the sampradas. Nihangs - Dark Blue and Orange Nanaksar - White and Black Rara Sahib - White DDT - White and Dark Blue Nirmale - Orange Sevapanthis - White Bhul chuk maaf 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 1, 2016 Report Share Posted May 1, 2016 4 hours ago, paapiman said: The above might be an artist rendition. Red and Green colors are not worn by Nihangs. While it is true that Nihangs wore mostly blue. They did not shy away from other colours. 4 hours ago, paapiman said: Four primary colors of the Sikhs are Orange, Dark Blue, Black and White. Sikhs do not shy away from any colour. These are all from different artists - 'Ten Gurus' by Bhai Puran Singh artist, from 1882. Maharaja Ranjit Singh's court (1850) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted May 2, 2016 Report Share Posted May 2, 2016 The thing with artist's is they never live the reality of which they draw..most paintings are just with strong emphasis on imagination and personal fantasy which they cannot personally manifest/live... so even early paintings,i take with a pinch of salt because it's just an expression.. rather then look at a picture/painting, personally its more advisable to talk to those who have kept to the tradition/rehat of the tenth master from day dot... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 2, 2016 Report Share Posted May 2, 2016 58 minutes ago, samurai said: The thing with artist's is they never live the reality of which they draw..most paintings are just with strong emphasis on imagination and personal fantasy which they cannot personally manifest/live... so even early paintings,i take with a pinch of salt because it's just an expression.. rather then look at a picture/painting, personally its more advisable to talk to those who have kept to the tradition/rehat of the tenth master from day dot... Well it's like as you say ... the thing with those people from the tradition is that most of them don't live the reality of which they profess to believe. A lot of what they will say is also from their imagination. Traditions change over time and the later practitioners practice things that are different from how they were a long time. A lot of times they forget why they do it or where it came from. Sometimes they will tell you that it came from one place when it didn't. For example - The Nihangs will tell you that the dumalla comes from Sahibzada Fateh Singh ji. That's what they told me anyway. However this is not the case, the dumalla existed during the times of Guru Arjun Dev ji (who says - ਮੈ ਗੁਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਉਚ ਦੁਮਾਲੜਾ ॥) and even well before Guru Arjun Dev ji. Everything must be taken with a pinch of salt if you are serious about the study of any field. Everything must be questioned and answers must be sought after. If however your focus is not on the study but on other things, then you can forget the salt and go with whatever you think is right. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai Posted May 2, 2016 Report Share Posted May 2, 2016 @BhagatSingh..have you done any paintings of Vishnu?? If so, can you share?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 2, 2016 Report Share Posted May 2, 2016 @samurai I am working on it. This cropped close-up is all I am sharing for now - And this sketch - 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 On 5/1/2016 at 5:48 PM, BhagatSingh said: Sikhs do not shy away from any colour. The Rehatnama (Tankahnama) by Srimaan Baba Nand Lal jee Maharaaj, clearly prohibits Sikhs from wearing Dark red clothes. Quote ਸੂਹਾ ਪਹਿਨ ਲਏ ਨਸਵਾਰ|| ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜਮ ਕਰੈ ਖੁਆਰ||੧੦|| Unquote[1] [1] - http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/62016-wearing-red-clothes/ Bhul chuk maaf 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 @paapiman Where's the rest of the paragraph? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 14 hours ago, BhagatSingh said: @paapiman Where's the rest of the paragraph? Bro, have a look below. Ref: Rahitname by Piara Singh Padam Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 @paapiman Makes sense. But why? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuriousSeeker Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 25 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: @paapiman Makes sense. But why? I'm not sure....only thing I've heard is this, but not sure how credible.... http://kam1825.podbean.com/mobile/e/why-you-shouldnt-wear-red-clothing Haven't paid much attention to colors personally. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 32 minutes ago, CuriousSeeker said: http://kam1825.podbean.com/mobile/e/why-you-shouldnt-wear-red-clothing Thanks for the link bro. @BhagatSingh - Colors have a definite effect on our minds. Sri Satguru jee knew, which colors would have a negative impact. This was discussed before on this forum. Quote "Social psychologists with an evolutionary bent are in love with the color red. Women wear red, according to this view, as a sexual signal to attract men (e.g. Elliot et al., 2012). In non-human primates, females show they’re ready to mate by displaying red on their bodies, including face, chest, or genitalia." [1] [1] - https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201212/is-red-the-color-sexual-desire Unquote Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 @CuriousSeeker@paapiman Yea that's why the bridge-groom specifically wear red on weddings. However, we must also consider that it may not just be about certain "thoughts" or "states", since red is an attractive colour even when it causes no thoughts. Anyway maybe puratan Singhs were insulting Banda Singh ji by saying he wore red? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 16 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: Anyway maybe puratan Singhs were insulting Banda Singh ji by saying he wore red? Have a look below. Quote In Baba Banda Bahudar Singh Ji's Jeevan..If we read our history, at the time of baba banda singh bahadur...When Baba Banda Singh and other singhs were arrested by mughul after long time, the mughuls changed the ''Guru Da Bana'' of Singhs and on purpose they put red clothes on Baba Banda Singh Bahudar and other singh and were laughed upon by mughul....There must be a kaaran WHY on purpose mughuls only choose red colour and do basti and laugh on gursikhs..... Unquote[1] [1] - http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/62016-wearing-red-clothes/ Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 @paapiman Yea I heard that story that they put on red clothes. 1. Banda Singh ji's Imprisonment But I have also heard a different story, where they dressed him as this big emperor and they imprisoned him and ohda jaloos kad ditta, put him on display throughout the villages, just to make themselves look big. This version does not mention clothing colour. 2. Panth Prakhash on Banda Singh ji Read Panth Prakash, he says Banda Singh ji wore Ambar colour, as opposed to Neel. Ambar is interpreted as Red by scholars. That said Panth Prakhash trashes Banda Singh ji and I would not recommend anyone take these parts seriously. Take it with a grain of salt. 3. Mughals Wore Blue Before Us You gotta remember Mughals were already wearing blue before Singhs arrived on the scene. They were really into indigo dye and blue dress, due to the rarity of blue colour in their lands. So Singhs often dressed in colours different from blue, so that they could tell which man belonged to which army. Imagine Mughals and Singhs both wearing blue in the same battle. It would be chaos, we'd all be killing our own men. 4. The Rise of Blue Amongst Singhs Nihangs rose during the times of Maharaja Ranjit Singh. At this time, we were no longer fighting the Mughals, who were dressed in blue. Who were we fighting? Who was our main enemy at this time? The British. We were fighting Red Coats. So now Nihangs wore blue and could wear blue without causing confusion. Blue would set apart the Nihang army from the British Red Coats. We wore blue because of the British, who were wearing Red in the battle. I believe it was at that time, that red was discouraged amongst our people. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 56 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: 2. Panth Prakhash on Banda Singh ji Read Panth Prakash, he says Banda Singh ji wore Ambar colour, as opposed to Neel. Ambar is interpreted as Red by scholars. Ambar - Punjabi (ਅੰਬਰ) or English word? 56 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: 4. The Rise of Blue Amongst Singhs Nihangs rose during the times of Maharaja Ranjit Singh. At this time, we were no longer fighting the Mughals, who were dressed in blue. Who were we fighting? Who was our main enemy at this time? The British. We were fighting Red Coats. Nihangs trace their origin to Sri Satguru jee. They were prominent in the Panth, before Maharaja Ranjit Singh jee. During Maharaja Ranjit Singh jee's times, Sikhs/Punjabis were fighting Pathans, Afghans, etc. Sikhs had a treaty with British. Bhul chuk maaf 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 4 minutes ago, paapiman said: Ambar - Punjabi (ਅੰਬਰ) or English word? ਅੰਬਰ Quote Nihangs trace their origin to Sri Satguru jee. They were prominent in the Panth, before Maharaja Ranjit Singh jee. Not as much. They became "a thing" during Maharaja Ranjit Singh's time. What I mean is that the dastaar boonga, blue clothes, droopy farla, certain parts of their maryada, etc... basically what they do nowadays.... all of that started during Maharaja Ranjit Singh's time. Quote During Maharaja Ranjit Singh jee's times, Sikhs/Punjabis were fighting Pathans, Afghans, etc. Sikhs had a treaty with British. Not sure if Afghanis were into blue. But the Nihangs definitely fought the British a lot as well. They hated the British and thus Red coats. Which partly (keyword - partly) explains the rise of blue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 Regarding the color blue in various 18th century sources http://www.sikhnet.com/news/neela-bana-blue-uniform-nihang-singh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 Quote We wore blue because of the British, who were wearing Red in the battle. I believe it was at that time, that red was discouraged amongst our people. That's wrong. Here are some contemporary pictures of the Anglo Sikh wars. As you can see the Sikhs are wearing red: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted June 2, 2016 Report Share Posted June 2, 2016 22 hours ago, amardeep said: Regarding the color blue in various 18th century sources http://www.sikhnet.com/news/neela-bana-blue-uniform-nihang-singh Bro, do you know what happened to that website ( www.NihangSingh.org )? Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted June 2, 2016 Report Share Posted June 2, 2016 @paapiman What do you make of the Singhs dressed in red in the above paintings by British artists? Maharaja Ranjit Singh had his army trained under British officers and they adopted the British red dress as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 2, 2016 Report Share Posted June 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: @paapiman What do you make of the Singhs dressed in red in the above paintings by British artists? Maharaja Ranjit Singh had his army trained under British officers and they adopted the British red dress as well. Even more historical clangers foo!. They weren't trained by 'British officers' they were trained by Napoleonic officers. And some segments of the Sikh army had blue uniforms too - like the cannoneers. Your memory is going dude. lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhagatSingh Posted June 2, 2016 Report Share Posted June 2, 2016 @dalsingh101 Read the discussion. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 2, 2016 Report Share Posted June 2, 2016 56 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said: @dalsingh101 Read the discussion. I have. I'm just pointing you straight on a few clangers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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