paapiman Posted November 17, 2017 Report Share Posted November 17, 2017 Warning: Sexually explicit material below. Daas will kindly request sangat, below the age of 25 or people who are greatly affected by Lust, to stay away from this discussion. Please forgive me for being explicit. Request to Mods/Admins: - Please do not allow Guest posts in this topic - Please do not tolerate any insults of Gurbani - Please do delete any off-topic posts Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2017 Please read the Charitar: Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 Good work bro. I have had a look at this translations first of this and can see one or two places where Bindra's efforts are not up scratch but in this case they do not deflect from the central message of the charitar. I will post up my own translation soon. On reflection of this, what we see a man pretending to be something he is not. He is a trader who boasts of bravery. Why would he feel the need to boast to his wife of bravery? Also the word "banik" means trader, i dont know why this has been translated as moneylender. I feel here that the trader is trying to prove his own worth to his wife. Obviously being a trader he will make a half-decent living so money would not be a problem for them (just like for the King and Queen) but there must be something there where the trader feels he has to make up tales about his bravery to keep the interest of his wife. She obviously knows her husband! She knows her husband is committing no acts of bravery and wishes to put him in his place. The woman devises and plan to test the mans claims shows him to be a weak man. But the translation mentions a tattoo even the the word "khodan" means to carve. I think here it means the woman left him with a visible scar rather than a tattoo as such as it mention that she has a knife with her. The act of taking his clothes off and being carved with a knife symbolises how he was humiliated and totally under the control of the woman, which symbolises the the orginal story. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 (edited) Maybe the message is: Both are pretending to be something they're not. The minister is in that way saying: You the king and your queen are both pretending to be something you are not. The preceding charitars deal with a righteous king, - so now the minister is slamming the king for not being rightous but pretending to be so Edited November 20, 2017 by amardeep 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 10 hours ago, amardeep said: Maybe the message is: Both are pretending to be something they're not. What do you think the woman is pretending to be? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 She dresses like a warrior male 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 One of the most accurate explanations of western women. It pretty much nails the difference in behavior and psyche 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 3 hours ago, amardeep said: She dresses like a warrior male I don't see that myself as she only did it once and that was to expose the falseness of her husband. Also the carving of a bird onto his backside seems to be a living punishment for the husband. As long as he is alive he will have to suffer that humiliation of his cowardice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 What do birds symbolize in Indian literature 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 Could it be that the minister is saying the Rani is tryin to teach you a lesson 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 (edited) On 21/11/2017 at 6:15 PM, amardeep said: What do birds symbolize in Indian literature Initial thoughts are bihangam - free, or not restricted in any way. Good question though. Needs researching. Edited November 23, 2017 by chatanga1 Spelling errors. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 16 hours ago, amardeep said: Could it be that the minister is saying the Rani is tryin to teach you a lesson Yea that is possible. Revenge for the destruction of her (Chitarmati) father's Kingdom. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 16 hours ago, chatanga1 said: Initial thoughtsw are bihangam - free, or not restricted in any way. Good question though. Needs researching. Bihangam can refer to a Brahamchari (Celibate). It is possible that the wise minister is trying to convey the message that your son is a celibate, which would further imply that he did not commit the act of rape. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 16 hours ago, amardeep said: What do birds symbolize in Indian literature The wings of the bird do metaphorically represent different ideas. Bani/Bana Seva/Simran For a king, could it represent Justice/Courage? For a great King, both are necessary for a successful rule. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 17 hours ago, amardeep said: What do birds symbolize in Indian literature One of the Psalms in the Bible talks about the nature of birds. Quote Like a bird protecting its young, God will cover you with His feathers, will protect you under His great wings; Unquote[1] [1] - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm+91%3A4&version=VOICE So it is possible that the wise minster is trying to tell Chitar Singh that even birds protect their young ones, but you are hell bent on killing your own son. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 On 22/11/2017 at 10:58 AM, paapiman said: Bihangam can refer to a Brahamchari (Celibate). It is possible that the wise minister is trying to convey the message that your son is a celibate, which would further imply that he did not commit the act of rape. it is possible. What do you think about it being carved into the mans backside? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 1 hour ago, chatanga1 said: it is possible. What do you think about it being carved into the mans backside? It is interesting to note that the Tattoo was carved on the backside, which won't be easily visible to the trader, until he looks into a mirror. Maybe the wise minster is trying to tell Chitar Singh that some things (in this case the charater of your wife) are not easily visible/comprehended. You need assistance of a tool to view/understand them. The way Nirat Mati carved a tattoo on the trader's backside, the same way your wife (Chitar Mati) had done a deed behind your back, which you haven't seen/comprehended. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 On 11/20/2017 at 7:02 AM, amardeep said: Maybe the message is: Both are pretending to be something they're not. Nirat Mati has pretended to be a solider and in doing so, she has been able to prove that her husband is a coward. Maybe the wise minster is giving an interrogation tip to Chitar Singh, that he will have to pretend to be someone else to figure out the truth. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 4 hours ago, paapiman said: It is interesting to note that the Tattoo was carved on the backside, which won't be easily visible to the trader, until he looks into a mirror. Maybe the wise minster is trying to tell Chitar Singh that some things (in this case the charater of your wife) are not easily visible/comprehended. Yes this is something that only the man would be able to see (although and his wife would have known about it. ) So its looks at possbily saying that this punishment for you is something only you know about and the person who did it to you. Could this allude to the fact that only the Queen and the Prince knew the truth? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Dudes i love your analytical skills 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 14 hours ago, chatanga1 said: So its looks at possbily saying that this punishment for you is something only you know about and the person who did it to you. Could this allude to the fact that only the Queen and the Prince knew the truth? Another possible interpretation: The wise minster is trying to draw a comparison between the trader's wife (Nirat Mati) and Chitar Mati. Nirat Mati has pretended to be a solider, likewise, Chitar Mati has pretended to be someone else (a victim rather than the mastermind). Now, because of that it has resulted in a spot (represented by the tattoo) on Hanuwant Singh's character. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 14 hours ago, amardeep said: Dudes i love your analytical skills Just imagine bro, how deep can the Vidhya Martands (Baba Mohan Singh jee, Pandit Jagjit Singh jee, etc) of the Panth take these Charitars. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted November 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 In general, IMHO, this Charitar has a very important teaching for women/ladies looking for their soul mates (and otherwise). Most women are possibly attracted towards brave/courageous men. They need to be cautious from impostors who falsify/exaggerate their personal experiences. Some men might pretend to be macho in front of women in order to attract their attention, but they might just be cowards. Bhul chuk maaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 11 hours ago, paapiman said: In general, IMHO, this Charitar has a very important teaching for women/ladies looking for their soul mates (and otherwise). Most women are possibly attracted towards brave/courageous men. They need to be cautious from impostors who falsify/exaggerate their personal experiences. Some men might pretend to be macho in front of women in order to attract their attention, but they might just be cowards. True. It makes me think what was the need for the man to be arrogant. His wife would have loved him the same if he was true to himself. She had to take on another roop to bring him back to reality with a sharp lesson that he would always remember. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 11 hours ago, paapiman said: Just imagine bro, how deep can the Vidhya Martands (Baba Mohan Singh jee, Pandit Jagjit Singh jee, etc) of the Panth take these Charitars. yeah bro, I'm begining to think that there is a lot more to Charitars than meets the eye. it the subtleties that you need a hawk-eye for. Otherwise you are just skimming the story. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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