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Difference between Guru and Sat Guru in Gurbani?

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I wanted to know from sikhawareness daie vidvans - siri tsingh, siri lalleshvari, siri amritpal veer ji, siri vishnu baba drawof ji, siri baba challenge-everything sian etc,

is there any difference between Guru And Sat Guru in gurbani?

what context they are used in??

Please post quotes to differentiate between two terms from gurbani and also post quotes from gurbani if you think they are same.

Thanks in advance.

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Guest Javanmard

I believe in the religion of Love, whatever direction its caravans may take, for Love is my religion and my faith - Ibn 'Arabi

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Here is kulbir singh from tapoban take on this:

Here is an article written on this subject, couple of months ago:

Vaheguru’s created his own Guru-form and this Guru-form is called Satguru. According to Gurbani this word “Satguru” has been used as an adjective with only Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee (and his successors up to Siri Guru Gobind Singh jee Maharaaj). Gurbani does not recognise any other entity to be Guru. Only Guru Nanak Dev jee is Satguru:

SABH TEY VADDA SATGUR NANAK, JIN, KAL RAAKHI MERI||

(Greatest of all is Satguru Nanak who has kept my honour in this dark age of Kalyug).

JIN NANAK SATGUR BHETIYA, TINA MILIYA HAR SOYEE||

(Only those ones whom Satguru Sachay Paatshah Guru Nanak Dev jee has met, meet Vaheguru)

Only Vaheguru is capable of having someone meet him or reach him. In order to accomplish this huge task he formed his own Guru-form and from the beginning of this creation kept the honour of Bhagats, through his Guru-form. When we read Bhataan de Saviyyay, we become surprised reading that Satguru jee kept the honour of Panchaali (Drupadi), Sudaama, Prahlaad and Ganika. Physically, these personalities existed long time before the advent of Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee but still Bhatts insist that they were delivered by Satguru jee. Read the following pankiti:

AB RAAKHO DAAS BHAAT KEE LAAJ||

JAISI RAAKHI LAAJ BHAGAT PRAHLAAD KEE, HARNAKHASH MARAY KAR AAJ||

FUNN, DROPADI-LAAJ RAKHI HAR PRABH JEE, CHHENAT BASTR DEEN BAHU SAAJ||

SODAMA APDA TAY RAKHIYA, GANIKA PARHAT POORAY THEH KAAJ||

SIRI SATGUR, SUPRASAN KALYUG HOYE, RAKHO DAAS BHAAT KEE LAAJ||

O Satguru Raamdaas Sahib jee, right now save my honour. Save my honour as you saved Bhagat Prahlaad jee’s honour by killing Harnakash with your sharp nails. Then you kept the honour of Dropati and did not let the evil Kauravs strip her naked. You saved Sodaama from great difficulty he was embroiled in and also fulfilled all wishes of Ganika. O Satguru jee, now I implore upon you to get pleased on me and save my honour in this dark age of Kalyug.

The whole of Saviyye Mahalle Pehlay ke show us how the bhagats who existed before Satguru Nanak Dev jee are now singing praises of Guru Sahib.

Before 1469 Satguru jee – the Guru form of Vaheguru – kept honour of selected bhagats in all ages but in Kalyug he appeared physically to restore bhagats to Sach Khand. In this dark age, it was a must for Satguru to come in physical form and this physical form of Satguru is called Guru Nanak Dev jee.

Satguru jee being the Guru-form of Vaheguru himself is totally one with Vaheguru. This is why there are pankitis in Gurbani that instruct us to see no difference in Vaheguru and Satguru. Whatever is the power if Vaheguru, same is the power of Satguru. There is no difference. They are same. His Guru-Form is merged in him.

All other gurus are fake except for the Guru-form of Vaheguru – Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee and his ten forms up to Siri Guru Gobind Singh jee Maharaaj. All ten paatshaahees (Gurus) became Gurus because of presence of the Guru-Jyot in them. When Guru Jyot passed on to Guru Angad Dev jee or when Guru Jyot became active in Guru Angad Dev jee, Guru Nanak Dev jee who too was full of Guru Jyot, still matha-tekked to Guru Angad Dev jee. The sangat followed suit.

Presently the Guru Jyot resides in Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee and Guru Khalsa Panth as a whole. Where ever Five Tyaar Bar Tyaar Khalsa jan Gursikhs assemble in the presence of Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee, this Guru Jyot becames active in them.

The fake dehdhaari gurus of our times are nothing more than mortal beings. They are only deceiving themselves. One of the fake gurus was a professional working in Europe when he found out that he had been declared a Guru. He used to trim his beard and was just a worldly person. All of sudden he became a guru and has a following of countless ignorant people.

Charan Singh Grewal one of previous gurus of Radhasoamis writes that when he was selected for the role of Guru, he was not at all aware of it. He was a lawyer who used to tie his beard at that time. He was very reluctant to become a Guru but he had no choice since he was declared a Guru by Jagat Singh. If they had been real Gurus they would have experienced the presence of the Guru-Jyot within them. After becoming the so-called guru of Radhasoamis he opened up his beard to get a holy countenance.

Many of these gurus including Gurinder Singh Dhillon did not start giving Naam for long time after they became guru. If Guru Jyoti had come in them, they would have started giving Naam right away.

When Siri Guru Harkishan Sahib jee left his physical body, according to the will of Vaheguru, the Guru-Jyoti passed on to Siri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib jee. Siri Guru Harkishan Sahib jee himself said Baba Bakale i.e. he was referring to Siri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib jee. At amritvela, after the Guru jyot had become active in Siri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib jee, a special glow came on his face. His mother, Mata Nanaki jee immediately recognised the glow and knew without saying that he had become the Satguru. Modern fake gurus are lost. They have no Guru-Jyoti in them and are misleading their chelas. May Vaheguru give them Bibek-Budh and they may stop misleading people.

I urge you Khoji jee to give up this bhambal-bhoosa of Bhamvar Gufa and Sahansar-Dal-Kanwal. Come to Satguru jee and these Bhanwar Gufaas and Sahansar-Dal-Kanwals will be licking your feet.

Daas,

Kulbir Singh

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SABH TEY VADDA SATGUR NANAK, JIN, KAL RAAKHI MERI||

(Greatest of all is Satguru Nanak who has kept my honour in this dark age of Kalyug).

JIN NANAK SATGUR BHETIYA, TINA MILIYA HAR SOYEE||

(Only those ones whom Satguru Sachay Paatshah Guru Nanak Dev jee has met, meet Vaheguru)

Where can i find above tukks in Gurbani... it would interesting to read the whole shabad rather than a line taken out of context...

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Woah... very very very very very interesting post...

N30, ur a blessed man... you have knowledge profoundly deep...

Anyway...

Could someone please (Please please please please!) help me find this TUKH....

Guru te Sat Guru Dhoneh Kareh (and it goes on from there!)...

There is a difference...

I shall eloborate later...

I'd really appreciate the help!

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