gupy

Can anyone help me find or send me translations of : - popular bhajans sang by Pt Jasraj - The bhajans of teh Dagar brothers Or does anyone know of a site or forum that could help me Many thanks

this daal is fantastic!

so any answer to the question???

why do you people get so emotional aboutt this question? Answer his question, not deform his character. I'm interested to actually hear some answers here!

what is naad yoga?

kelari: would u know what Bhai Baldeep Singh is up to? Any recordings or videos to be released?

is it possible for a video of the talks to be uploaded in the future, or some transcript?

hopefully the evidence (CCTV, injuries and eye witness accounts) will be enough for prosecutions to take place. I hope that it does go all the way and a just punishment is given to these lunatics.

learn the vaaja? Didn't know any 'learning' was involved

kelari, are there any recordings of rabab and or pakawaj I could find?

also check out: http://www.gurmatsangeet.org/

Firstly let me say that this 'raising of awareness' is great, and much over due. Thanks to the hard work of the naamdhari Sikhs we have been kick started into a revival of Gurmat Sangeet and Raag sangeet. However we are only taking a small glimpse at Gurmat Sangeet. There are still major issues to consider in todays revival efforts. As we are coming from a background of zero knowledge of Raag, then we must understand that as an audience we are very much rock bottom, therefore as a consequence we haven't the ability to really look closely at the revival attempt. For instance, can any revival attempt (Naamdhari, Surinder Singh, etc...) be sure that what they are doing is reviving? Yes they are using Raag to sing shabads, however where have they learnt that knowledge from? Is it a genuine source of Gurbani Kirtan? With regards to the instruments, are these rived instruments a good approximation of the original? A good example is Surinder Singhs attempt to revive the Sarindha, it can be easily seen that he has modified the original. In short what i'm saying is, well done and best of luck with those who have started the revival, however as we progress theres some very serious issues that will need to be addressed. We are thankfully coming out and finally saying that the performance of Shabad kirtan outside raag is unacceptable, however we have just started something that is a long long line. AT least now we can see it, tho it may be just on the horizon as yet.

carrot, horse, cart, .... anyone else get the jist???? lol

excellent stuff By the way i doubt thats a 'tabla' more liekly a Jori which is particular to the Gurus court, it is slightly different. If you want to listen o the difference listen to Baljeet and Gurmeet Namdhari, whose table ji plays Jori/pakavach in shabads like 'Meri Abai'. This is only a tip of an ice berg, the thing to consoder most isn't the instruments but the singing itself, can any of us imagine real Druphad style? Would we even appreciate it being so uneducated in the Guru s music, and then you can appreciate the taanti saaj, jori, pakavach etc. At one time the whole of India came to Darbar sahib as the hub for musical excellence, now we have nothing but two 'Kungerees and a tabla'. And also don't forget that even though the 5th guru complosed his own music, the styles and majority of saajs are apart of a much greater heritage. To learn the Gurus sangeet we must be more open minded in our approaches. For example jsut liek in the indian musical world today, alot of the great ustads are musslman.

JKD... lol Let me tell you about some crazy ass Nihungs back home who would laugh at this stuff. Those boys work in very E A S Y to understand terms, This is my shotgun.... this is you dead. Bang goes JKD. (and ermmm, mixed in with a bit of the unmentionable good stuff, its a definite success!)

Wow... No sex hey.... I thought we meant to be Singhs?

Yes i would agree, the accounts are mind blowingly insightful. The book gives an outlook of the 19th century that was severly missing, one which should help paint a clearer and more honest picture of the Khalsa. Although many accounts contain bias (as some are written by enemies/foes of the Khalsa), the consistency of the points raised legatimise the the overall themes of the accounts. I have no doubt that the image of the Khalsa potraited in these first hand accounts wil be difficult to read for more puritanical readers. However for those impartial historians, this is a truely a must read text. And i agree with beast, it's very 'heavy' reading...

i've read it... the guys just posting an opinion, whats the problem???

Sounds like Parmjit handled it pretty well then... So Liono what Besharam are u on about ???

In this case we can argue, as many do, that religion is in essence away of affirming a moral code on a set of people. In real life use this is the main use of religion around the wrold. What better way to impose social rules than the fear of God or hell or rebirth etc... So then you can argue that each of the religions/prophets/gurus/saints are relative and contextual. Therefore not universal. This is why I disagree with the quoted statement, as it is too simplistic. Therefore I would conclude the notion of 'sin' is a man made concept very distant from the theology of 'God', however it is a simple way of explaining deeper understandings of concepts such as Karam, Dharam, Duality and ekta. Just like 'baptism' is now a widespread word used for amrot sanchaar, as is the falsity with using sin with regards Indian understandings.

sin is a relative term, so why define it in the context of Bani that warns against duality? What is good, and what is there that is bad? What is Kharam?

this is a difficult subject, because theres many ways of interpreting the veneration Guru had for Devi (as is apparent in Dasam Granth). His coice of personifying certain aspects of what we call Waheguru as devi is surely one that you could argue is unique to Guru Gobind Singh, as opposed to the earlier Gurus. In short this is a paradox, and ultimately, yes Guru ji affirms that nirankaar is the highest as he states in the concluding parts of many of his works. However practically (for the Khalsa) the use of such personifcations are priceless. The most important thing to note in our discussion is the fact that todays Khalsa is not the same one that the bani was intended ofr, hence it probably is the case that such works are more or less irrelevant to the 'evolved' Khalsa we adhere to today.

The label 'sanatan Sikhi' is mostly a contemporary label. However it is used to distinguish between what santanist would call the 'revisionist'/ Tat Khalsa form of today and that which existed before hand. So although the label is contemporary, the ideals are certainly not, they are as you would put it 'ancient'. The word sanatan howvever does appear in some places, e.g. Kabirs bani. In short, if you wish to reference sanatan Sikhi, then evry source pre-20th century you'll find it. Only the label itself will be missing, but as stated that is just a requirement of the circumstances we find ourselves in.

can somebody put up a video for download after the event ??? Thanks!!!

so to sum up are we saying we have two bases of opinion: 1. Sex is only for procreation, in which case contraception should not be used (unless for medical reasons relating to mensuration etc...). 2. Sex is for more than procreation, in which case contraception is fine. If their is another posibility please state it. Also i think this boils down to your definition of wrods such as Kaam. What is Kaam??? Again relative to the above options: 1. Kaam is the act of sex when procreation is not in mind. I.e. kaam is basically all sex without the 'pratical intention' of having a children. 2. Kaam is sexual desire, where as sex with a legitimate partner is not a 'lust' because it is an expression of love for the other. (feel free to expnad on this one!) Last q - is there a difference between (again relative to original two options) 1. Sex 2. Making Love. (My opinion : option no.2 all the way ...) But what do you think ???