kamalroop singh

http://neo-sikhism.blogspot.com/ How can a Sikh use this kind of language while describing the holy Shahids? Is this neo-Gangstar Sikhism what we wish to portray to the world, and the youth? If a non-Sikh had written this, what would be the response? http://www.shindasingh.com/blog/2009/05/11/another-badass/ I’ve already shared one Badass with everyone, now it’s time to drop another. I’m going to go out on a limb here and assume that the majority of my readers aren’t exactly experts on Indian history, so it’s probably a safe assumption that you’re not familiar with the story of the Sikh martyr Baba Deep Singh. Well, it’s time to get educated — because this dude is one of the most hardcore freedom fighters to ever live, and a guy so extreme balls-out in his insatiable quest for vengeance that something as inconsequentially-trivial as being admin cut decapitated couldn’t stop him from crushing his enemies to death with his nutsack.

Barinder Singh Ji, family is a real blessing, because the sparkle, innocence, and anand in the eyes of a child, are like the Darshan of Akal Purukh. I feel very very grateful to have a large family where children are always around.....they are the future. Your right in these moments, we reflect, and all the politics, intellectualism, dissolves away...........and we feel alive once again! Akal!

So are you saying that in the difficult episodes and wars in the life of prophet Mohammed, and Imam Ali. When their families were killed, murdered etc, it was outside the will of God?

Dear Bahadur Ali Shah, from my limited understanding of the holy Qur'an. Is that a human should surrender to the will of God. All things that happen on Earth are the will of God. Including religious diversity, and cultural differences. As for reconcilation of faith, nobody can make even a leaf move, all is his divine will. It was his will that a Sikh, Buddhist, and Muslim would walk around the Sri Darbar Sahib together. The reconciliation is His, nobody can claim it; no man or religion. It is His alone. In the Qur'an the Prophet Mohammed states: 2:113 Furthermore, the Jews assert, "The Christians have no valid ground for their beliefs," while the Christians assert, "The Jews have no valid ground for their beliefs" - and both quote the divine writ! Even thus, like unto what they say, have [always] spoken those who were devoid of knowledge;" [93] but it is God who will judge between them on Resurrection Day with regard to all on which they were wont to differ. [94] Al - Baqara: 2:21 O manKIND! Worship your Sustainer, who has created you and those who lived before you, so that you might remain conscious of Him Al-Baqara (The Cow) 2:20 The lightning well-nigh takes away their sight; whenever it gives them light, they advance therein, and whenever darkness falls around them, they stand still. And if God so willed, He could indeed take away their hearing and their sight: [12] for, verily, God has the power to will anything. 2:116 And yet some people assert, "God has taken unto Himself a son!" Limitless is He in His glory! [96] Nay, but His is all that is in the heavens and on earth; all things devoutly obey His will. 2:117 The Originator is He of the heavens and the earth: and when He wills a thing to be, He but says unto it, "Be" -and it is. 2:148 for, every community faces a direction of its own, of which He is the focal point. [123] Vie, therefore, with one another in doing good works. Wherever you may be, God will gather you all unto Himself: for, verily, God has the power to will anything. Al-Imran (The Family of Imran) 3:19 Behold, the only [true] religion in the sight of God is [man's] self-surrender unto Him; and those who were vouchsafed revelation aforetime [12] took, out of mutual jealousy, to divergent views [on this point] only after knowledge [thereof] had come unto them. [13] But as for him who denies the truth of God's messages - behold, God is swift in reckoning! Al-Imran (The Family of Imran) 3:85 For, if one goes in search of a religion other than self-surrender unto God, it will never be accepted from him, and in the life to come he shall be among the lost.

http://kamalroopsingh.blogspot.com/2008/12...re-all-one.html

Read the article again: 'According to the new analysis, published in today's issue of the journal Nature, the two skeletons are around the same age: about 40,000 years old.' i.e. the cremated one and the buried one. Whether people bury, burn, etc. All of it ends up as dust. This is fact. In the words of Guru Nanak: in Raag Aasaa on Pannaa 466 ma 1 || First Mehla: mittee musalamaan kee paerrai pee kumihaaar || The clay of the Muslim's grave becomes clay for the potter's wheel. gharr bhaa(n)ddae eittaa keeaa jaladhee karae pukaar || Pots and bricks are fashioned from it, and it cries out as it burns. jal jal rovai bapurree jharr jharr pavehi a(n)giaar || The poor clay burns, burns and weeps, as the fiery coals fall upon it. naanak jin karathai kaaran keeaa so jaanai karathaar ||2|| O Nanak, the Creator created the creation; the Creator Lord alone knows. ||2||

thats a fair point, scholars do change their positions........but this is quite a radical change, would you agree?

Did you not write this in Sikh formations titled: Francisco Jose´ Luis THE KHANDA AND THE DHULFIQAR Sikh–Shi’a parallelisms and crossings in history and text, concept of the Divine Guide and sacred chivalry Sikh Formations, Vol. 2, No. 2, December 2006, pp. 153–179 The meeting of the Shi’a and Sikh traditions in text and history If one were to compare the main sources of Sikh scripture (Adi Granth or GuruGranth Sahib, Dasam Granth and Sarabloh Granth), it would probably be in the Dasam Granth that one would find most references to Shi’a Islam. However, such references in the Dasam Granth need to be understood in the context of the work entitled Bachitra Natak. Along with the Charitropakhyan,3 this work forms one of the largest sections of the Dasam Granth. The term Natak indicates that this work should be read as a play (natak). The sixth section of the Bachitra Natak deals with Guru Gobind Singh’s own story. As a narrator he places the context of his birth on earth in a much larger divine and cosmic context, here told in a kind of Vorspiel im Himmel.4 Guru Gobind Singh narrates how he was meditating in a place called Hemkunt and how the Divine ordered him to take birth in this world. The Timeless Being (Akal Purakh) recounts how different beings were sent by Him and strayed away from the right path by having their followers worship them. Although different names are quoted, such as Gorakh, Dattatreya and Shiva, I want to focus here on two names: Ramananda and Mahadin. Ramananda is said to have been sent by God but to have gone astray: Then Hari sent Ramanand who assumed the garb of the bairagi, around his neck he wore a wooden rosary, he too did not know the love of the Lord [Prabhu]. (BN VI, 25) The importance of this verse is that for Sikhs, Ramananda wasn’t just one of the leaders of the Bhakti movement in Northern India. He is one of the bhagats (devotees) of the Guru Granth Sahib. The term bhagat in the Sikh religious canon designates those contributors to the Guru Granth Sahib apart from the Sikh Gurus. They are viewed as external witnesses and announcers of the path of the Sikh Gurus. If the Gurus can be compared to the sun, the bhagats would be the planets rotating around it. Their status is similar to that of the hujjat in Shi’a Islam who is a witness and proof of the Imam. The bhagat partakes of the sanctity of the Guru without having an equal status. A literal reading of the verses quoted earlier about Ramananda does in this context appear to be not only surprising but also contradictory: how could Guru Gobind Singh criticise Ramananda when he himself gave the final shape to the Adi Guru Granth Sahib and thus recognised Ramananda’s status as a bhagat? To appreciate this verse it is helpful to read it as an allegorical text. It would appear, then, that the Ramananda of the Bachitra Natak and the Guru Granth Sahib may not be the same person. In the Guru Granth, Ramananda is one of the bhagats whereas in the Bachitra Natak, he represents a religious movement that, like all the other movements described in this section, was originally inspired by the Divine but has gone astray because of an exaggerated emphasis on the exoteric 1 54 SIKH FORMATIONS Downloaded By: [swets Content Distribution] At: 15:06 5 December 2008 and a deformation of the original teachings.5 The same accusation is made about the character Mahadin, about whom the text says: Whatever great beings the Lord [Prabhu] created, they created their own paths, then the Lord [Prabhu] created Mahadin and gave him the kingdom of the Arabia [arab des], he too created a path and circumcised all the kings, he had all recite his own name and had none meditate on the true name. (BN VI, 27) Many translators of this passage have translated Mahadin as Muhammad, thus interpreting this verse as an accusation against the Prophet. It is unlikely, however, that Mahadin is one of the many names of the Prophet6 or even a proper Arabic word. The Vars of Bhai Gurdas, on the other hand, clearly mention the Prophet by his name and the verse here is far from being negative: He has created many beloved ones such as Vyasa of the Vedas and Muhammad of the Kateba [Abrahamic scriptures]. (BGV I, 4) Muhammad is here addressed as a beloved of God and one thus wonders how Guru Gobind Singh could criticise the Prophet. The use of the word Mahadin serves here as a hint to the reader: he/she is supposed to understand that this is a persona, a character, a representation, and not the Prophet himself. As in Ramananda’s and the other characters’ case, what is here being criticised is the occultation of the esoteric, the true core of religion by its external manifestations, the exoteric. When the exoteric/ zahir completely covers the esoteric/batin we are left not only with an empty shell but also with an idol. In one of his key works on Iranian Islamic philosophy, Henry Corbin presents and discusses the thought of the 18th Iranian philosopher, Molla ‘Abdorrahim Damavandi (Corbin 1981, 358–64). He highlights an important theme in Damavandi’s thought: the idea of theophany and the concept of idol and icon. Prophets and Imams as well as the universe are in varying degrees manifestations of the Face of God as affirmed in the Qur’an:7 theophany serves a purpose as an icon, an image that serves as a window to access the Divine, and a channel through which divine light is transmitted. The distinction between the two-dimensional icon and the three-dimensional idol is fundamental here. The icon as a window lets divine light flow whilst the idol traps that same light in its confines. This is, in many ways, what is being represented in this section of the Bachitra Natak. Theophanies, icons of the Divine through which the world could perceive the Divine, once burdened by the weight of excessive exotericism, become idols masking the Divine. In the case of Mahadin it is a reference to the shari’a bound religiosity of Sunnism and exoteric ithna’shari Shi’ism as the verse refers to circumcision and temporal power. It is interesting to notice that the last persona in this

Dear N3O, I am not labelling all Nirmala's as traitors. However KEY nirmala works were employed by the Singh Sabha to change the Khalsa Maryada. That is a fact. When Phoola started to do his crimes against humanity, Buddha Dal issued a statement. What books have the nirmale ever written, correcting the mistakes of Narotam Sahib? Why was it that Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Ji was criticised by Narotam, and now readily used by the Nirmale? Have you read the pages written by Narotam on the subject? All the best, Kamalroop Singh

1. That is recorded in Nirmala literature 2. See various Sant literature, too many to quote that state meat is a sin, with distorted interpretations that even go against the katha from the Taksals, of Guru Granth Sahib Ji. 3. Agreed. 4. Many Nirmale Sants sided with the British, and Patiala rulers, against the Khalsa Panth. Can this be explained in a few words with the evidence, no. It will probably take at least 30 pages, minimum to explain all the evidence. Use your research skills, and study what Sants were present in Patiala. While Baba Hanuman Singh and 30,000 Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa were bombarded with Canons. By a combined force from Jeend, Nabha, Sangrur and Patiala. All of whom were British allies. Then unceremoniously cremated or buried and a Gurudwara built over the top, to cover up the crime! Poetly called Dukh Niwaran Sahib. Then after this the attempts to create the Nirmala Buddha Dal. Plus all the baseless nonsense in the works of Pan.Tara Singh Narotam, against the maryada of the Dal Panth. At Hazur Sahib after this battle Baba Prahlada Singh performed Jhatka on one of the leaders of the Nirmale, because they had betrayed the Khalsa. If the Nirmale were not with the British, why is it in their literature, we find the first references to: 1. That Rag Mala is not Bani (Gurpratap Suraj Granth, Narotam, Cunningham told to him by a Nirmala) 2. Certain portions of Dasam Granth Sahib Ji is not bani (See Cunningham, see Narotam) 3. Sarbloh Granth Sahib was written by Sukha Singh Giani, and or given to Sukha Singh by an Udasi. (Narotam, Padam) All of the above points were taken up by Kahn Singh Nabha, Singh Sabha, and Bhasauria. The Nirmale in order to survive sold out the Guru Khalsa Panth. Why is it that the above were all written in colonial times? Why is it that nowadays, Nirmale even quote their own existence out of Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Ji? The Khalsa Panth have a beautiful, poetical description of the Nirmale, however I will not state it here................

Morghe Sahar: 1. It's an illustration not an icon because it is not being used in worship. A manglacharan is not worship? See "religious ritual invocation", BLACKBURN 1991, p. 120 Therefore, as the three Deva's feature in the mangalcharan, which is a religious ritual of invocation. The author is praying to his Isht Devas. The three particular Isht Devas are found illustrated in my previous post, clearly as an Icon. The three Devas in question are found together, in the form of Idols, in Hindu temples.

Ok then the Nirmala manglacharan in question is referring to a popular "Hindu" icon or murati of Ganesh, the Devi, and Saraswati.

What word would you use to describe the references to Hindu mythological characters in Nirmala literature, that are used to teach Gurmat? This is an icon, of the manglacharan by Pandit Gulab Singh Ji: http://www.indiavilas.com/wldofind/images/...axganesara4.jpg Yes there are words in the manglacharan, and in the texts, but what are they referring too? Let us take it further: Devi, is represented as the feminine Divine. The i, meaning female, Dev, meaning Divine. Therefore it creates an image.............therefore in my view it is an icon. It symbolises something......a form............. all the best

If the liver helps to metabolise creatine, to creatinine. Then this would also explain why those predators that eat the liver, are bigger than the ones that don't get it. Where did I state meat is necessary for Bir-ras? Creatine in meat definately could improve a persons strength. Who are the vegan powerlifters? What medals do they have? What are their diets? How many supplements are they on? Before laboratory synthesis, the only place you could get this was from meat. If creatine is completely synthetic, its even more worrying. Read the point about isolating essences from plants, and balance. All the best.

I didn't bring the term Iconic, into debate. Sant Tirath Singh quoted one line out of neo-sikhism.blogspot.com. So we are all arguing over one line and the term iconic. I have defined what I meant by iconic. I.e. the semsiological use of language, and analogous usages, that come from Hinduism. I totally agree Hindu is a modern construct. However some people who believe in Mahalakhsami are definately "Hindu". As for the Shakta Tantra tradition definately, but is it fair to confine Maha Lakhsami to this tradition in modern terms? In terms of the exegesis, from what I understood if it, Maha Lakhsami represents the multiplicity of God, e.g the ability of the same entity to morph into unlimited forms and attributes. Therefore on point 3. we agree. Sant Tirath Singh Ji, the copy employed by me of the Adhiatam Ramayan by Pandit Gulab Singh Ji, is illustrated with a depiction of Shiv Ji. However this may have been added in by the scribe rather than the writer.

Creatine is found in meat. It helps in gaining strength and muscle mass. Most creatine supplements comes from liver and meat. The amino acid used in synthesis of the creatine mainly comes from meat. High predators often fight over the liver, if they move in packs. The liver contains creatine and makes them bigger, than the rest of the animals. This happens in the case of Lions (Singhs) Sant Jarnail Singh was not against the Maryada of Jhatka. See the Taksal Rahit. Baba Ji was an exception to the rule, I accept there are exceptions. Banda Bahadur was another exception. As for Babbar Khalsa, can you give me examples were they had to fight, where it may have involved physical strength. What makes you think Prem Sumarag wasnt written then? You can't obtain Jhatka, you have to do it. Avtar Singh Brahma was a Nihang Singh. Go and talk to the Biddhi Chand Vale Singhs. They will tell you how much Baba Ji believed in the maryada. Like the Babbar Khalsa, and Dam Dami Taksal. The Nihangs also sought justice against those police, and army people, who raped, killed, tortured, the innocent people of Punjab. Baba Nihal Singh Hariyavela is One example. Baba Jaimel Singh Akali, "Rab Da Kuttha" is another example. He lived in Delhi and fought against the Indian goverment after the disrespect to the Adi Guru Granth Sahib by the Narakdharis. Baba Kharag Singh was the mit Jathedar of Buddha Dal, I have no idea if he was involved in 1984. But he was poisioned and murdered. At that time Baba Santa Singh was putting pressure on the police to release all the captured Singhs, and the Dal suceeded many times in releasing the Singhs of Dam Dami Taksal, and Babbar Khalsa. Even though those organisations had labelled Budda Dal as government agents. We have an audio recording that clearly shows that Baba Santa Singh was not a government agent. The Buddha Dal was threatened by the GOI on many occasions. We will be putting up this and all the other material ASAP. All the best.

Sadhu Sant Baba Jagjit Singh Ji Harkowal is a staunch vegetarian. I liked the story and believe Naam can beat even those who are stronger. However that is about the power of Naam. Not about whether eating meat, or not eating meat is related to Gurmat. Passive people and ascetics do not eat meat.....simple. Like the Buddhist and Jains. Do you remember the story of Banda's followers and Fateh Darshan, and the paper that floated with the Gurus Fateh on it At that time, the Bisnoi, Vaishnava, Bandai Khalsa were defeated by meat eaters in Wrestling. E.g the Dal Panth, again due to the power of Naam from the Guru. Then the Bandai Khalsa still did not accept the Marayda, and a battle took place. The Khalsa Dal Panth emerged as the victors. Gajh Ke Bullavey Nihal Ho Javey Shaheed Singho Man Nu Paveh Sat Sri Akal! All the best.

So you are saying that Pandit Gulab Singh Nirmala work is outside of the framework of "accepted" Nirmala literature. From my limited understanding, I always though of him as a key Nirmala, writing Key Nirmala texts.

Matheen Kushti Schools in India take meat also. They are not all vegetarian. You are having to take a supplement to gain strength. As you are well aware creatine levels are very high in meat, and low in vegetables. Where is the creatine from that you take? How was it synthesised? Is it a lab product, or from animals? Those chemicals that have been used to synthesis the creatine, can you be sure that they are not from meat? The Jathedars of Buddha Dal have practiced Jhatka, the same Jathedars I have seen Akali Baba Nihal Singh bow down to. Akali Baba Kharag Singh, used to be second in charge of Buddha Dal, used Jhatka, 20 to 30 male Goats in a day, to feed the Dal. Ask Akali Baba Nihal Singh about the Jivan of Akali Baba Kharag Singh, he will tell you, that rarely a Soorma, a living Shahid was born like Baba Kharag Singh Ji. N30: Do not be impatient. Slowly and surely I will show the evidence. I did not say all Sants, and Sadhus are fake. Baba Nand Singh definately was a great Mahapurush and Baba Isher Singh, both were not gristi, both were vegetarian. My point being the original tradition of the Panth was those that had renounced the world were vegetarian. Those that were gristi were not. Read Gur-Tirath Sangre, and other Nirmala texts for proof. As well as countless other accounts of Jhatka, that are beyond the scope of web boards. Look in the rahitname, prem sumarag, gurvilas. Look at the accounts of the Gurus hunting, in Bhai Gurdas vara, Sri Dasam Granth Ji, then look at the injunction about meat in Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Ji, then read Rag Malar ang 1289-90 Guru Nanak Dev Ji, in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Maharaj is clear those that renounce meat are sanyas, e.g Sadhus. As for Sants and Sadhus who came out of the British Army, that was not what was in my mind...... the Nirmale of Patiala were the focus of my attention. The movement for the Nirmala Buddha Dal started there. Scotland Yard is not the intelligence agency of the UK. It works with terrorism, with the police etc. Fauja_Singh: Namdharis also do not wear a Sri Sahib. Something found in vegetarian, passive, nirmala movements of the Past. Infact Nam-dhari's call themselves Sant-Khalsa. Mehta Chowk is a Taksal. In all Taksal's meat is prohibited. As learning, instead of physical activities like horse riding etc, are the aim. Again this fits my hypothesis. I have clarified Sadhu and Sant on the blog. Sants are seekers of truth, or those merged into truth, or those who remember God with each breath. A Sadhu renounces. In the Sikh Panth the distinction is no longer made much, so I made a mistake. I am sorry. Sant Isher Singh was not married, hence he was a Sadhu. Nirmala Buddha Dal and the attempt to make it and its history is known both to the Nihangs and Nirmale, the court papers are in Patiala in the archives. Prem Sumarag Granth has a very early Sammat. Randhir Singh placed it in Guru Gobind Singhs life. Mcleod has had to concede that the text is 18th century as well. Due to the excellent work By Gurinder Singh Mann of Leicester. It is on the internet search for it. All the best, Kamalroop Singh

Do you take protein supplements, sports supplements, vitamins?

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N30 looks like your going have to start another thread! Dietary intake and the insulin-like growth factor system: effects of migration in two related populations in India and Britain with markedly different dietary intake. Public Health Nutr, 8(6), p. 620-7. Migration is associated with lower total, but not free testosterone levels in South Asian men. Clin Endocrinol (Oxf), 67(5), p. 651-5. Impact of migration on coronary heart disease risk factors: comparison of Gujaratis in Britain and their contemporaries in villages of origin in India. Atherosclerosis, 185(2), p. 297-306. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/328796.stm http://www.positivehealth.com/article-abst...?articleid=1603 http://www.citymayors.com/health/heartdisease_uk.html "University's Dr Deepak Bhatnagar. "Along with the rest of the population they should strive to maintain a healthy diet high in fruit and vegetables, whole grains, fish and poultry and low in fats and refined sugars. Specific efforts by both men and crucially women to take more exercise are also needed." " Some fake "Sants" were definately agents of the British. There is alot of documented evidence to show this. The evidence will come surely and slowly. Please be patient. A Sadhu and a Sant are different practices and maryada's all together.

Where is Saraswati or Ganesh used in this context in Gurbani? The Ist Dev's mentioned in the Nirmala texts are not invoked or mentioned in Adi, Dasam or Sarbloh Granth Sahib. Infact instead of the Devtas, the Guru's invoke, Vahiguroo, Sri Akal, Sat Guru etc. Hence the mangalcharans, and main body of early Nirmala literature, is Vedantic. Guru Gobind Singh appears, after Ganesh, after Devi etc. If there is difference in other primary source Nirmala literature please englighten me. I am here to learn and to share.

Sant Tirath Singh Ji, Mahakal, has been represented as an Icon, in two dimensions, by Pan. Tara Singh Narotam. Therefore semiotically the word, Mahakal is an icon itself, to Narotam Sahib. Let me expand further, the Nirmala Sikhs use symbols from Hindu mythology, to explain Sikh principles. However compared to Dasam or Sarbloh Granth, or even Guru Granth Sahib, there is a greater emphasis on: Saraswati, the Devi, Ganesh and Ram. In the invocation would you argue it is invoking an attribute of God? Or an image of Sarawati, etc? I would add here that in my opinion, the Nirmala scriptures speak for themselves, they are based on Vedantic philosophy and style. By the way in tradition the Mangalcharan is the teaching itself. As knowledge comes from the Ist Dev. Furthermore in the Nirmala scriptures the teaching involves, Hindu symbology, imagery, stories and examples. Icons do not have to be Idols, or Images. All icons comes from words, and more importantly what words actually mean, as well as what they are analogous to. Icon: "representation that stands for its object by virtue of a resemblance or analogy to it" All the best, Kamalroop Singh Sant Kamalroop Singh Ji, you can't seriously expect me to believe that a mangalacharan is the same as an icon?! Mangalcharans are not designed to 'teach' you something, they are exactly what they say they are, an invocation. A 'two dimensional representation' is not a mangalcharan. Surely everyone knows that traditionally prior to study one begins with a mangalacharan to sarasvati. That is not the same as 'teaching through hindu icons'.

I have examined the Mangals very carefully in Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Ji, Maya Lakhshami, in terms of exegesis of the scripture, is not Maya Lakhshami in the Hindu sense of the word. It is talking about an attribute of God. As for Nirmala scriptures, Bahadur Ali Shah, and Tirath Singh are the Nirmala scholars. I cannot claim to be an expert, they both have years of experience. However compared to most others Sikhs, I can truely say that I have had exposure to the main scriptures, at least. Mokh Panth Prakash, Pan Gulab Singh Nirmala, taken from a folio from an extant manuscript, has a mangal to Saraswati, then the Devi, then Ram, then Parmatma, then Guru Gobind Singh. Here are the first few lines: Please change to Gurbaniakhar font. <> sÃsiq sRI gxyswX nm:] Dohrw] dvImwqwswrdwsrdieMdsmhws] bMdopdpMkjsdwkrosumiqpRkws]1] sMkrCMd] gxnwQdwsinvwiemsqbMdnwpgDwr]kirXochoaurrwmkojsudyhubuiDaudwr] Ik Oankar Svasati Ganeshaya Namah. Dohra. Devi Mata Sarda Sarad Ind Sam Has. Bando Pad Pankaj Sada Karo Sumati Prakash.1. Sankar Channd. Gan Nath Dasani Vai Mastak Bandana Pag Dhar. Kariyo Cho Or Ram Ko Jas Dehu Budh Udar. This scripture is the Vedantic arguments against Buddhist and Jain doctrines. The mangal's in Nirmala literature are different in style to those in Dasam Granth Sahib Ji, and Sarbloh Granth Sahib Ji. In my opinion they are iconic, in terms of Durga and Saraswati. This does not surprise me considering that the Nirmala Sampradava is a school based around interpreting Indian Sanskrit scriptures, into Gurmukhi. This was started by Guru Gobind Singh himself. To break the hegmonic domination of the Brahmans. Therefore texts that have the manglacharan in Braj, are translations of the original Sanskrit mangals, in Granths. This could be one argument to support the claim that Nirmala's are Khalsa, and not a Vedantic School. All the best, Kamalroop Singh