Bane

This a a great page to learn The Devanagari alphabet http://www.anu.edu.au/asianstudies/hindi/alphabet/

at what expense are we producing this type of technology, i think the costs will eventually become too great.

at what expense are we producing this type of technology, i think the costs will eventually become too great.

Nusrat is Good but please watch these qawwali's by Aziz Mian, he is amazing, he has more of a pure qawwali style then Nusrat, he is also much more spontaneous when he gets imbued with divine love he goes crazy he reels off his Urdu at full speed, he was also a very good poet. http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...amp;q=aziz+mian Eri Main to Prem Deewani mera dard na janai Ko http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...amp;q=aziz+mian Jo ve terey Fakir hotey hai voh aadmi benazir hota hai http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...amp;q=aziz+mian Yeh hai Maikhada Yah ha Rind hai.

There is a time and place for every tradition to be functional. When a tradition is uprooted and forcibly planted in foreign soils the tradition becomes corrupted. That is why I strongle believe that we must seek to understand the society we are engaged in NOW. We must do this to make full sense of the traditions we follow. Like the above post described the corruption of an Aghori tradition which may be an acceptable path for a very limited minority from where the tradition originated. CG Jung talking about Kundalini said that westerners have to careful of poisoning themselves when getting involved in south asian religious traditions, specifically he meant Kundalini but it also can be applied in a wider way. Some traditions can be uprooted and put into new soil with little effect (Sikhi) but others will just rot and die (Aghora) My view is that remembering death is very good human attribute, Guru Maharaj instructs us to be aware of death at all times. If a Sikh reads about Aghora and it helps him think about his impending death in a positive way then it is useful. Because we live in a world which has allowed us access to many mystery traditions which can affect us psychlogically and release immense amounts of shaktee in a person, following one of these erroneously can have fatal effects. That is why i'm so glad we have a Guru to follow who can show us the path.

Guru Nanak Sahib as a man was a limited personality, like I said he was nirgun "God" contracted and limited so he could give average people a means to salvation. To ask if Guru Nanak Sahib is creator of the World from the Indian perspective is absurd because as a man he was enveloped in the covering sheaths of maya, which allowed him to function on this plane of existence. You could then say Guru Nanak Sahib was the same as everyone because we all are limited by Maya. But this is externally, Internally Guru Nanak Sahib knew all this and he identified perfectly with the Timeless Creator. Identifying fully with the creator means you are in effect God, but because you are still in a living Body you have to carry out your Karma and be enveloped in the limiting sheaths. So there are normal people enveloped in maya in the covering sheaths, then there are a very few people who live in maya but do not associate themselves with their bodies, their full concentration is on God, awake or asleep. These people have to live within the confines of their body for a certain time to finish their Karam. Then there is the totality of "God" that an individual cannot fully conceive whilst being limited in maya by the covering sheaths. "God" had to limit himself to become Guru Nanak Sahib. Whilst Guru Nanak Sahib was functioning as a Human Being how can also be creator of the world? Guru Nanak Sahib was the creator creation and dissolution of the world, and he was also Guru Nanak Sahib. Akaal Purakh is timeless, beyond time, this also has to be kept in mind. The acts of creator creation dissloution are "ongoing" on a macrocosmic and microcosmic scale.

The word God can be misleading when trying to understand Indian religions. God is traditionaly in the Judaeo-Christian tradition seen as seperate from his creation. But in most of the non-dual traditions of India God himself creates and then pervades his creation. There are differing degrees of non-duality, Sikhi Sidhant is centred Around Ik Oamkaar. IK is absolute non-duality. From IK creation is spawned. This creator is his creation. The point of the above is that to say Guru Nanak Sahib is "God" from the Indian Tradition point of view is not wrong. Neither is saying you are God or that stone is God. It all depends on the purity of yourself, If a person is free from maya he can see God in everything so he can say this is God that is God. But he would never call himself God. If a person is entagled in thoughts of past & future his mind is not pure enough to receive the grace of "God" which always with him. For this person he does not see God in every place but experiences events as seperate from him. This is the totality of God. God can also be split up into nirgun and sargun which is with qualities and without qualities. The aim of spiritual practice is to go from sargun to nirgun, from the changing to the changeless, impermanent to permanent. Guru Nanak Sahib had to live in manifest reality to teach us the path to the unmanifest, the way I look at it is that Nirgun "God" contracted himself and limited himself, to provide humanity with a guide that could release them from bondage. This contraction and limitation can be called maya, it also has many other names. Guru Nanak Sahib was special he was sent from Akaal Purakh for a special mission to provide an option for ALL people for a means to become immortal, and escape the world which is pain.

According to sikhi you must use the buddhi part of your mind, discriminating intellect, to destroy bad thoughts (bad in the sense of not god centred.) This is done through shabad veechar and naam simran. I use my mind to read, and I use my mind when I work. The mind is a tool. I use my intellect to try to instruct my mind on what is real and unreal, and to focus my senses on naam simran. I don;t know whether i am my mind or something else, all i wish for is to be able to have the strength to repeath gods name. Does your mind not feel enjoyment and non-enjoyment. If you are not your mind why do feel that you are not enjoying posting as much you were before. What part of you has changed, so now you feel as though you are not enjoying posting. Only the mind could be that fickle, If you are not the mind, you have to be beyond these emotions. HDW please do not leave the forum you do post some good links. I admit I may have purposely been forthright in some of my earlier posts, but like i said it's not personal. There is no need to throw a tantrum because people disagree with you. I thought you was a broad minded individual, but now I see that any small infringement upon your area of beliefs, results in personal attacks and tantrums, this is not the sort of behaviour i expect from someone who reguraly posts some quite informative posts. Without the grace of the Guru you cannot do anything, please believe this for your own benefit, he himself binds and liberates. These statements of yours are not helpful, from the point of view of limited individuals 99.9% of people there is an ego which has to be destroyed only when it has been "destroyed" does a liberated souls realise that there was nothing to destroy. Where is your compassion. one last point regarding those things you said about I am not trying to reserve a seat in sachkhand and I just follow my heart. There is one saying that i am particularly fond of "the louder they spoke of their honour the faster we counted the spoons"

and then you say how can you point out or recognise my "screwy thinking" when you don't bother to read my posts. I have not made personal comments about you, or intended to insult you, but you continue to disrespect me. First by misunderstanding what I wrote in a post. Secondly by saying my mind is twisted and then saying I have screwy thinking. PLease enlighten me of my screwy thinking, as I have stated previously we are here to learn. PLease do not just make offensive statements without backing them up Its funny how supposedly broad minded people cannot accept people who think differentlyy from them. Instead of treating them with compassion or showing them why what they are saying is wrong, they insult that person by saying his mind is twisted or he has screwy thinking. HDW has consistently failed to understand me and has made no effort to try. He even admits that he didn't read much of my post and still makes judgements about me. Do you review a book after you have just read half of it, anyone who did would be ridiculed. I have no personal agenda against HDW, he seems like a good bloke, but his responses to my in essence pointless point has been dis heartening. Like I said we should question each other on this forum its the only way to learn. I can't stand this agreeing with everything, people should dis agree. But I am saddened that because of my dis-agreement with HDW he began to make insinuations against me, he began to question ME, not what i wrote. You do not know me, all you know is what I write, i can choose to be what i want in the form of the written word, you should argue against my words not against me personally. But you cannot even do me the small service of reading what I write.

What Agenda? You don't seem to be able to discuss these adult topics in a reasonable way. And you seem to have purposefully mis-represented the point I made about mother sister wife - what you wrote "mom = wife = sister , look at how twisted your mind is. Of course they are equal beings but that doesn't mean you would have the same relation with them." Is exactly what I was trying to point out to you how absurd it would be to say there is no seperation. I never mentioned anything about equality what are you talking about. Look at what i wrote and read the part in Bold. OBVIOUSLY THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE Read brother, read. I demand an apology for this quote, it is a reaction of anger due to the misunderstanding of my point. Can you accept your error my brother. Please brother look deep in your heart and search for the truth, i have nothing against you. I like to discuss that is all. I made some criticism of your response, and instead of replying in a constructive way you try to say that i've got some agenda. Don't get offended its a mutual learning process, discussing, both parties learn if they are cooperative. If you are not your mind made self show me some compassion, why are you saying i have a twisted mind. People like you should not be affected by emotions (mental modifications) what does it matter what i say to you. You should be trying to help me seeing you have effaced your false ego successfully.

I was not making any judgements on why or why not you post, i do not have the right to do that. But I have the right to discuss statements you make on this forum because that is the whole point of a discussion forum. Don't justify your reason for posting, if you want to post, then post - do what resonates in your heart. the reason for writing what i did is pseudo-mystical statements like "there is no seperation" irk me. You may have had some experience which leads you to believe this But if we accept this statement then there is no difference between mother wife and sister obviously there is a big difference - but your statement: there is no seperation implies this. Are you trying to imply that i am trying to reserve a seat in Sachkhand or follow some scholars interpretation of Sikhi. Because you wrote this below where you quoted me. Just because someone questions something you say you begin to get defensive and start to judge the other person. I find this quite rude. Also you write "i go with what resonates in my heart" - in the reply to my statement, why write this at all if you did not mean to imply that I do not follow my heart, and follow some sort of religious dogma or something. My personal reason for believing that "knowing" God nowadays is impossible is 1. Due to the numerous amounts of sense bombardment we have thrown at us each day, the only way to negate this is to drown it in the love of God. In more peaceful times a seeker could know God because there would be less distractions. 2. The danger of false ego modification or pseudo knowledge. Which is knowledge that the Ego takes over for itself when the knowledge is fed in through the senses. Genuine experience of knowing something in this world is almost all the time mixed with thinking you know something because you have read it in a book or someone told you. True knowledge in internal, but external knowledge is useful because it can trigger the internal knowledge in a person. But 99% of the time a person takes in external knowledge and accepts it and thats it. This is why VEECHAR is important. Most people have pseudo feelings these days, in my experience, genuinely they cannot feel any true emotion, they feel what they THINK they should feel. In kaliyug God can only be realised through love.

The above statement is valid. But as lovers of God we Sikhs follow the path of devotion to Akaal Purakh. In Kaliyug devotion is the surest and safest way to reach the formless. Knowing the unmanifest source of innumberable universes is the achievement of a lifetime, but as the saints of Bharat have observed the path of jnana is dry it is compared to the sun which burns, Whereas Bhakti is the cooling sweet light of the moon. Jnana is quicker as it burns all sanskars, it burns you. The path of Bhakti is slower but half the fun is getting there. HDW if there is no seperation why are you writing on this forum why are you here. I agree there is no seperation at an unmanifest level but there has to be a degree of seperation at manifest level to allow you to live your life. The aim of life is to be aware of this mystery whilst still retaining a small sense of Ego otherwise, if there is no seperation, you are gone, back from where you came.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=89...amp;q=aziz+mian

I shouldn't have directed those assumptions towards you I apologise. I respect your achievements and respect people who work hard. Your posts are very informative, even though you come across to me as arrogant your right its my personal problem and should not have been said.

I never said "that one should dismiss the textual reference" There should be a mutual coming together of textual sources with the reality we live in. This is my point. Relying solely on textual sources to live your life is to put it bluntly seriously Naieve because you are dismissing the fact that the manifest world, maya, changes continiously. Not just day to day but also over long periods of time. A certain sadhana may be suitable for sat jug but not kaliyug. Modern academics seem to like have everything spelt out for them, too rooted in objectivity for my liking.