dalsingh101

Couldn't find the meaning of ਵਲਵਲਿਆਂ anywhere? what does the following phrase mean? ਵਲਵਲਿਆਂ ਦਾ ਹੁਲਾਰਾ In a wider context: ਪਰ ਏਥੇ ਧਾਰਮਿਕ ਜ਼ਾਹਰਦਾਰੀ ਵਧ ਜਾਣ ਕਰਕੇ ਇਹ ਲੋਕ ਗੀਤ ਵੀ ਦਇਆ, ਸੰਤੋਖ, ਪਿਆਰ, ਕੁਰਬਾਨੀ ਆਦਿਕ ਦੇ ੳੇਚੇ ਇਨਸਾਨੀ ਵਲਵਲਿਆਂ ਦਾ ਹੁਲਾਰਾ ਦੇਣੋ ਰਹਿ ਚੁੱਕੇ ਸਨ। In a literal translation of the above, I've come out with: But due to the spread of ceremonial/overt displays of religiosity [as opposed to true dharam] these musical folk traditions had ceased imparting the humanitarian xxxxxxxxxx of kindness, contentment, love sacrifice and so forth. If I had to guess, I'd say the missing words/phrase refers to 'reverberation of values/principles' or something like that?

Am I the only one who starts to feel like the thickest of 'planks' whenever grammar starts to get discussed? Adjective, noun, accusative case, flannah, timka....nouns, tenses, arubh, garubh... hee hee If I consider myself at all intelligent, confronting that subject brings me back down to earth with a painful thump...... God shine nadaar on me to learn this stuff soon.

Nineteenth pauri: Overall Meaning: ਅਸੰਖ ਨਾਵ ਅਸੰਖ ਥਾਵ ॥ Asankh Naaw Asankh Thaaw. In the creation of the timeless being, there are infinite names of species and items, residing in infinite places and interspaces ਅਗੰਮ ਅਗੰਮ ਅਸੰਖ ਲੋਅ ॥ Agnam Agnam Asankh Loa. There are so many worlds, which are way beyond any person's grasp Word By Word: ਅਸੰਖ -Asankh -uncountable, infinite ਨਾਵ - Naaw -The names of the infinite species, the names of the infinite beings and all of the infinite items and things in the Timeless Being's creation, ਅਸੰਖ -Asankh -uncountable, infinite ਥਾਵ - Thaaw-places/interspaces ਅਗੰਮ -Agnam-something which resides beyond someones reach, that thing/place where no one can reach, the ungraspable, that which is beyond hold and beyond grasp ਅਗੰਮ -Agnam -Agnam-something which resides beyond someones reach, that thing/place where no one can reach,the ungraspable, that which is beyond hold and beyond grasp ਅਸੰਖ -Asankh-uncountable, infinite ਲੋਅ - Loa-planets, worlds, galaxies, places where there are beings and things ਅਸੰਖ ਲੋਅ-Asankh Loa- Infinite planets, infinite galaxies which are the homes to infinite beings and things In a Nutshell : In the creation of the Timeless Being there are infinite species of beings and objects with infinite names belonging to Infinite places. Within Creation, there are so many worlds (planets) which are far beyond a person’s reach (no human can reach there in a lifetime). *note in this stanza, there is discussion of the mud that in this creation of the Almighty Lord there are s0 many beings and creatures, so many species with so many different colors and names. There are so many that even using the word infinite (Asankh) is a mistake. However, all of this is the image of the Timeless being. There is no place that is not the image of the Timeless being. Whatever thing we see, it brings forth the presence of the Timeless Being. A Little Deeper: Guru ji tells us that in the Creation of the Timeless Being The amount of species and objects with their different names are countless. How can a person possibly list them all? How can we know the limits of this huge vast creation that God has made? The amount of regions where these species and beings and objects are found is countless. There are so many different universes upon universes. Although science is still looking for life in other galaxies, here Guru Nanak Dev Ji proclaims that there are an infinite amount of worlds with an infinite amount of life forms. This number is countless and beyond our imagination. Such is the vastness of what God has made. We humans are like frogs stuck in a well. We do not know what is outside the limits of what is seen. Guru Sahib tells us that there are countless worlds that are beyond the reach of human beings. There are so many species of different colors and forms and names in so many different planets . The number of these planets too is countless. Even still all this is God’s creation and God is present in each and every molecule of it. There is no place which God is not. All of this creation is in the power of the Timeless Being who made it and controls all. Overall Meaning: ਅਸੰਖ ਕਹਹਿ ਸਿਰਿ ਭਾਰੁ ਹੋਇ ॥ Asankh Khih Siri Bhaaru Hoei.. Oh but even to describe them as asankh, even to describe them as infinite, we put weight on our heads ( meaning there are so many bhavans and species even calling them infinite is an understatement . ਅਖਰੀ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਖਰੀ ਸਾਲਾਹ ॥ Akhree Naamu Akhree Saalaah.. (Even though the word infinite is inadequate and there is no word big enough to describe God's creation), it is through the way of letters that we are able take the name of God and we are able to praise God Word By Word: ਅਸੰਖ -Asankh -uncountable, infinite ਕਹਹਿ -Khih-to say, to describe (whichever person says) ਸਿਰਿ -Siri- on the head, on that persons head, on top of that persons head ਭਾਰੁ -Bhaaru-weight, great weight, heaviness ਹੋਇ - Hoei- happens, is, ਅਖਰੀ -Akhree-through letters ਨਾਮੁ -Naamu- The Naamu of the Timeless Being ਅਖਰੀ -Akhree-through letters ਸਾਲਾਹ - Saalaah-praise, extol In a Nutshell : (But) whichever person tries to take the written account and uses the word Asankh, upon that person’s head is weight meaning they are making this mistake that even the word Asankh is not enough. Even the word infinite is too small and narrow to describe the expanse of creation. Although we can't describe creation and there isn't even a single word adequate enough to describe it, still it is by the way of letters we can take God's Naam and it is through letters that we praise God. We make letters into words and that is how we understand. A Little Deeper: Guru ji just told us that there are infinite life forms, beings and objects in infinite places, there are so many infinite places, there are infinite planets upon planets where these things are present . Mahraj explains that there are so many even to say the word infinite is a mistake. Even by calling these planets infinite we bear the weight on our head that we have underestimated God's creation. Even though no one can describe the vastness of God's creation, still through letters we are able to take the Naam of God and it is through letters that we can praise God and creation and that is why we use the word Asankh or limitless. Overall Meaning: ਅਖਰੀ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਗੀਤ ਗੁਣ ਗਾਹ ॥ Akhree Giaaanu Geet Gun Gaah.. It is by the way of letters that we can discuss of God's divine knowledge. It is through the use of letters we can sing the song of the Lord ਅਖਰੀ ਲਿਖਣੁ ਬੋਲਣੁ ਬਾਣਿ ॥ Akhree Likhnu Bolanu Baani.. It is by the way of letter Word By Word: ਅਖਰੀ -Akhree -through letters ਗਿਆਨੁ -Giaaanu -divine knowledge ਗੀਤ -Geet -song ਗੁਣ ਗਾਹ-Gun Gaah- Gun is virtue Gaah is those who sing- So those who sing God's Virtues-acquaintance of God's virtues ਅਖਰੀ -Akhree- through letters ਲਿਖਣੁ -Likhnu -writing/written ਬੋਲਣੁ -Bolanu -speaking/spoken ਬਾਣਿ ਲਿਖਣੁ- Baani Likhnu- the writing of words, the writing of speech, the writing of language ਬਾਣਿ ਬੋਲਣੁ- Baani Bolanu-the speaking of speech, the speaking of words, the speaking of language ਬਾਣਿ - Baani- words, speech, language In a Nutshell : It is through letters that one can get acquainted with God's song and virtues. It is through letters that language is written and spoken. (For this reason the word asankh has been used). A Little Deeper: It is by the way of letters that we can talk of God's divine knowledge and we can sing the song of the Lord. It is through letters that written and spoken languages are made. We have words to describe objects. We have spoken words which we say and words which we write; these words are made possible by different letters and different sounds. Letters are a means of telling of God. Letters are the means of making all words and languages. It is through letters and sounds made by letters that we comprehend what is around us. Overall Meaning: ਅਖਰਾ ਸਿਰਿ ਸੰਜੋਗੁ ਵਖਾਣਿ ॥ Akhraa Siri Snajog Wkhaani.. It is through the way of letters that a person’s destiny is explained. ਜਿਨਿ ਏਹਿ ਲਿਖੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਸਿਰਿ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ Jini Eayhi Likhay Tisu Siri Naahi.. The Lord who has written this destiny, has no such destiny over his* head. Word By Word: ਅਖਰਾ ਸਿਰਿ -Akhraa Siri- By the way of the letter ਸੰਜੋਗੁ -Snajog- the written account of destiny ਵਖਾਣਿ - Wkhaani- (can) be shown, (can) be told, is able to be explained/told ਜਿਨਿ -Jini- (referring to that Timeless Being God) who ਏਹਿ -Eayhi - this letter of destiny ਲਿਖੇ -Likhay - wrote, has written, ਤਿਸੁ -Tisu - That Timeless Being God ਸਿਰਿ -Siri - on the forehead of ਤਿਸੁ ਸਿਰਿ-Tisu Siri - Upon the head of God, the Timeless Being ਨਾਹਿ -Naahi-negation word, is not, can't be, (in this sentence this is referring to the written account of the Timeless Being, God.) In a Nutshell : It is through letters that a person’s destiny is written. That Timeless Being who wrote the letter of the destiny of all beings, upon that beings head is no letter, (meaning no human can write the written account of God) . A Little Deeper: Everything is through letters. It is through letters that one’s destiny becomes told or explained. Here Guru ji tells us that God is beyond destiny. No one can write rules which bind God the way that humans are bound. God is free from such entanglements. God is not bound by letters the way that humans are. God is not bound by language or any such thing. God has no destiny. Through the way of letters a human’s account, a humans destiny is written . God writes the destinies of all but no one can write the destiny or account of God who is beyond such rules. There is no destiny over God's head which makes God act a certain way. God is the only one who is free. Overall Meaning: ਜਿਵ ਫੁਰਮਾਏ ਤਿਵ ਤਿਵ ਪਾਹਿ ॥ Jiw Furmaaeay Tiw Tiw Paahi.. The way that God gives his divine order, that is the way that beings relish their destiny ਜੇਤਾ ਕੀਤਾ ਤੇਤਾ ਨਾਉ ॥ Jaytaa Keeta Taytaa Naaou .. All of Creation which God has brought forth is the embodiment of the Naam. Word By Word: ਜਿਵ -Jiw- the way (that) ਫੁਰਮਾਏ -Furmaaeay- God gives the hukam, God gives the divine order ਤਿਵ ਤਿਵ-Tiw Tiw- (in that) way ਪਾਹਿ - Paahi-to put on/to receive/put on/receive/enjoy/relish ਜੇਤਾ -Jayta-however much/ how much ਕੀਤਾ -Keetaa- the world which God has raised, creation which God brought forth ਜੇਤਾ ਕੀਤਾ-Jaytaa Keeta- however much of the world God has made/ however much of the universe God has created and raised/brought fourth ਤੇਤਾ -Taytaa-that much of ( The Timeless Beings made world/Universe) ਨਾਉ -Naaou- Naam, the image of the Naam, The embodiment of the Naam *note: In English there are two words, substance and property, the same way in Sanskrit there are the words Naam and Gun so............ the word Naam(form/embodiment) is substance and the word Gun is property . Whenever any being or thing's " Naam" is given , the meaning of this is that it is equal to their/it's face (shakal). When we take that Naam, that being/existence/ force comes infront of our eyes. In a Nutshell : In whichever way God brings forth the divine order, in that way the beings relish their destinies. This entire world which we see, that was made by The Timeless Being, all this is his image (Iehu Wisu Sansaaru Tum Daykhday, Iehu Har Kaa Roopu Hai, Hari Roopu Nadree Aaaeiaa). A Little Deeper: The way that God runs his hukam is the way that this universe moves. Everything is in the power of the Naam, of the Hukam. There is no place that God has made which is not subject to the Hukam. There is no place which is empty of God. Here Guru Ji tells us that God is in all of creation. God is infused in each and every single particle of the created universe. Everything we see is God. Here Professor Sahib Singh Ji mentions the concept of substance and property. The word Naam means substance. God is the substance of all. All we see is God. When we see the created world, we see God before our eyes. God is in each and every place. Gurbani teaches us that the way fragrance is within a flower, a reflection is within a mirror, fire is within wood and ghee is within milk, God pervades each and every universe controlling all. Overall Meaning: ਵਿਣੁ ਨਾਵੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਕੋ ਥਾਉ ॥ Winu Naawai Nahee Ko Thaaou. Even though creation expanse is infinite, still there is no place without the presence of the Naam ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਣ ਕਹਾ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ ॥ Kudrti Kwan Khaa Weechaaru. What strength do I have to describe the creation of the creator Word By Word: ਵਿਣੁ - Winu-without/devoid of/empty of ਨਾਵੈ -Naawai - The Naam ਵਿਣੁ ਨਾਵੈ-Winu Naawai- devoid of the Naam, without the Naam ਨਾਹੀ -Nahee -negation, is not, can not be ਕੋ -Ko -any ਥਾਉ - Thaaou-place, space ਕੁਦਰਤਿ -Kudrti- power, strength ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਣ-Kudrti Kwan - which power? which strength? Kudrateh is a feminine word so this is it's an adjective. ਕਵਣ -Kwan- which one/which ਕਹਾ -Khaa - I tell/I say ਵੀਚਾਰੁ – Weechaaru - describe/give discourse/tell of ਕਹਾ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ -Khaa Weechaaru - I describe/ I say / I tell of In a Nutshell : There is no place empty/devoid of the embodiment/form of The Timeless Being (meaning whichever place or thing we see, that is the image of the Lord, all of creation, every single universe, each and every particle by particle, is the image of the Lord). Oh Lord what strength, what power do I have to describe all that you have made. A Little Deeper: Oh what power do I have to describe your creation God. What strength do I have to describe the size and greatness and beauty of the universes and spheres? How do I describe nature? What power to I have to fathom the little and big things you have made? The things which are in your control. Everything is so big and we humans are so tiny how can we describe God? Overall Meaning: ਵਾਰਿਆ ਨ ਜਾਵਾ ਏਕ ਵਾਰ ॥ Waariaaa Na Jaawaa Eayk Waar. I can't even once be a sacrifice to you. ਜੋ ਤੁਧੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸਾਈ ਭਲੀ ਕਾਰ ॥ Jo Tudhu Bhaawai Saaeee Bhalee Kaar. Oh Lord, whatever pleases your will, that doing, that action, that work is good Word By Word: ਵਾਰਿਆ -Waariaaa- sacrifice/to be a sacrifice ਨ -Na-negation word/can't ਜਾਵਾ - Jaawaa- to go ਵਾਰਿਆ ਨ ਜਾਵਾ-Waariaaa Na Jaawaa- I can not be a sacrifice, ਏਕ -Eayk -one ਵਾਰ - Waar-time ਜੋ -Jo -whatever, that which ਤੁਧੁ -Tudhu- you ਭਾਵੈ -Bhaawai- pleases ਸਾਈ -Saaee -that ਭਲੀ -Bhalee -good ਕਾਰ - Kaar-work/doing/action ਸਾਈ ਕਾਰ -Saaeee Kaar-that action, the work, that doing In a Nutshell : I am not worthy, not able, of even once sacrificing myself to you .Whatever seems good to you, that doing, that work is good(meaning it is good to live in your divine will). A Little Deeper: God is grandest of the grand and the creation is a masterpiece beyond limits! I can not once even sacrifice myself to you Lord, you are so great. What you have created is so great ! That which makes you happy God, that alone is good. Everything that God does is good and everything has a purpose. God runs this world through his divine hukam and his hukam is always the best for all, It keeps all in harmony and equilibrium. Whatever makes God happy is best for all. Overall Meaning: ਤੂ ਸਦਾ ਸਲਾਮਤਿ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ॥੧੯॥ Too Sadaa Salaamati Nirankaar.19. O Nehrankaar, O formless being Lord , you are eternal and never-ending , you are the one who will always exist.19. Word By Word: ਤੂ - Toon-you ਸਦਾ -Sadaa-always,forever ਸਲਾਮਤਿ -Salaamati-eternal/never ending/always existent/never dying/one who will always exist and live on ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ -Nirankaar - Oh Lord, Oh God, Oh Formless Lord In a Nutshell So what strength do I have do describe the creation of the creator? Oh timeless being , I am not capable of being a sacrifice to you even once! Meaning my power (strength ) is very limited, Oh Formless Lord! You are never ending ! You will always remain eternal! Whatever seems good to you, that doing, that work is good (meaning it is good to live in your divine will).19 A Little Deeper Oh God whatever pleases you is good . Whatever you do is always good. You keep creation in harmony and everything happens for a reason! Your will controls all, life, death, birth, the rock cycle, water cycle, phases of the moon, development of beings, all these are in your divine hukam. You keep the universes in equilibrium through your grand hukam. Your hukam is always for the best. Whatever makes you happy is good. You play this world drama yet remain unattached. Oh formless Lord, you will live forever, you are beyond the limits of time! This world drama may end but you will always exist! God will always exist and create worlds and planets and things beyond our imagination! God is grander than anything and his creation is limitless! Whatever makes you happy God, that alone is good, you are never-ending never dying and beyond any shape or form! Grammar Note Kudrti Kwan (ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਣ),the word Weechaaru ('ਵੀਚਾਰੁ' ) is masculine. If the word Kwan is it's adjective, that this is also masculine and it’s form is Kwanu ( 'ਕਵਣੁ'). Kudrti ('ਕੁਦਰਤਿ') is feminine, so the word Kwan 'ਕਵਣ' is it's ('ਕੁਦਰਤਿ'/Kudrti's ) adjective. In order to understand the masculine and feminine forms of the word Kwan ('ਕਵਣ') look at Pauri 21-ਕਵਣ ਸੁ ਵੇਲਾ, ਵਖਤੁ ਕਵਣੁ, ਕਵਣ ਥਿਤਿ, ਕਵਣੁ ਵਾਰੁ। ਕਵਣਿ ਸਿ ਰੁਤੀ, ਮਾਹੁ ਕਵਣੁ, ਜਿਤੁ ਹੋਆ ਆਕਾਰੁ।21। Kwan Su Waylaa, Wakhtu Kwanu, Kwan Thiti, Kwanu Waar.. Kwani Si Ruti, Maahu Kwanu Jitu Hoaaa Aaakaaru.21. In Pauri Number 16,17,and 19 'ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਣ ਕਹਾ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ' ( Kudrti Kwan Khaa Weechaaru) is written but in Pauri 18 instead of this line, 'ਨਾਨਕੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਕਹੈ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ' ( Naanaku Neechu Kahai Weechaaru) is used. If we understand the words infront of both of these then too the meaning comes out to be the same, " What is my power? What description can I, poor Naanak, possibly give? The word Kudrti is found in the Guru Granth Sahib to mean strength/power in many different places for example (੧) ਜੇ ਤੂ ਮੀਰ ਮਹਾਪਤਿ ਸਾਹਿਬੁ, ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਉਣ ਹਮਾਰੀ। ਚਾਰੇ ਕੁੰਟ ਸਲਾਮੁ ਕਰਹਿਗੇ, ਘਰਿ ਘਰਿ ਸਿਫਤਿ ਤੁਮਾਰੀ।੭।੧।੮। (ਬਸੰਤ ਹਿੰਡੋਲੁ ਮਹਲਾ ੧)। Jay Toon Meer Mhaapati Saahibu, Kudrati Koun Hamaaree. Chaaray Kunt Slaamu Karhigay, Ghari Ghari Sifti Tumaaree.7.1. 8.(Basabt Hindolu Mahlaa 1) (੨) ਜਿਉ ਬੋਲਾਵਹਿ ਤਿਉ ਬੋਲਹਿ ਸੁਆਮੀ, ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਨ ਹਮਾਰੀ। ਸਾਧ ਸੰਗਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਜਸੁ ਗਾਇਉ, ਜੋ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਕੀ ਅਤਿ ਪਿਆਰੀ।੮।੧।੮। (ਗੂਜਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫)। (2) Jiou Bolaawhi Tiou Bolhi Suaaamee, Kudrati Kwan Hmaaree. Saadh Sangi Naanak Jasu Gaaeiou, Jo Prabhoo Kee Ati Piaaaree. 8 .1.8 . (Goojree Mahlaa 5) Grammer put simply- Here Professor Sahib Singh Ji Brilliantly explains why the meaning of the word Kudrati in the last four pauris is ‘strength’ and not the other meaning nature. The word Kudrati is found to mean both strength and nature in different places throughout Gurbani. Once again we see how every little letter is so important when we interpret Gurbani. Here Prof Sahib Singh Ji has used the rules of grammar and masculine feminine/noun/adjective agreement to show that the meaning of Kudrati in these lines surely is strength. Also when we take in consideration that in Pauri 18 Naanaku Neechu takes the place of Kudrati Kwan, this enough is proof that Guru Sahib is refering to strength here not nature. Kudrati Kwan means what strength/power do I have. Naanaku Neechu means I poor, lowly, powerless Naanak, how can I possibly describe, the meaning of the word Kurdrati is power or strength as Professor Ji has truly shown us. Pauri Explained - Guru Ji tells us that creation is limitless. We humans are like a frog stuck in a well. We know nothing exept that which surrounds us. Science ponders about life on other planets today, Guru Ji tells us that not only are there beings on other planets but here are infinite lifeforms on infinite planets. New lifeforms come and old ones die out. Such is the play of the Lord, so much bigger than out own imaginations. Guru ji tells us that even to say these planets are infinite is inadequate. Even to say that these lifeforms are infinite is inadequate. Even though we can’t fathom God or creation, we can through the way of letters sing God's praises. We use letters to form the word Asankh meaning infinite. We use letters to praise the Lord and it is only through letters that we can take his name. Language is built on different letters which make different sounds. This letters are sometimes spoken and other times written. It is only through these letters that we can ravish God. It is through the way of letters that one’s destiny is written and unfolded. God gives the commands for destiny, but there is no one to give a command to God. The whole seen world is bound by letters but there is no letter which can bind the Lord. All of the universe we see is under control of God and bound by the letters of the Hukam. Only the one Lord is free from destiny. The way that God gives his order is the way humans enjoy and receive, God does not need anyone's consent. God does not face the rules of karma. We humans have our deeds written but God has no lekha. God alone is not subject to any rules. This pauri starts by talking about how huge creation is. It can seem so vast and maybe to some scary when we read it. We feel small lost and lonely, but In the last lines Guru ji tells us that no matter how big creation is, God, the Naam is in every particle of it. All of creation is the form of God. Professor Sahib Singh ji describes metaphysics, and talks about substance and properties of a substance. Every substance has different properties. Guru Sahib tells us that God is the substance for everything that is made. All the infinite planets and lifeforms; they all are part of the same one Lord that we are part of .There is no atom, no heart, where God is not. All of creation is united through the one universal Lord. This pauri reminds us that God is everywhere and nearest of the near. From the beginning God alone existed. There was no other to speak of. If only one thing exists how can you find anything else to make another. Where there was no wind, no water, no earth, no darkness, no light, no fire, no beings of so many forms, there was God alone. All of creation stemmed from God and even now we are all part of God. The way that foam and waves are not separate from water, they rise up and then merge with the ocean, is the same way that humans are all part of Ikoangkaar. Guru ji ends by telling us once again that he has no strength too describe the greatness of creation and can not even once be a sacrifice to God. Once again Guru Sahib says, Whatever you do God is good, you are the everlasting eternal Lord.

It's true. Why drag God into bewakoofi of our own making...... I tell you, we have never looked like such a sorry bunch of pendus ever before. Here's hoping for grace to transcend the corporate ditch we're in.

I can't help but ask. Is God punishing our quom?

I heard there are undercover AIDS problems in Panjab too. Probably more so now we have so many smackheads, some of whom probably 'shoot up'.

It's grim, so keep strong and keep your spirits up whilst/after watching.

Documentary on nasha abuse in Panjab:

Colloquial term: ਸਿਰੇ ਚੜ੍ਹਦਾ ਜ਼ੁਬਾਨੀ ਯਾਦ ਹੋਣ ਤੇ ਭੀ ਜੇ ਇਸਦਾ ਪਾਠ ਕਰਨ ਵੇਲੇ ਸੁਰਤ ਹੋਰ ਪਾਸੇ ਖਿੰਡ ਜਾਏ ਤਾ ਪਾਠ ਘੱਟ ਹੀ ਸਿਰੇ ਚੜ੍ਹਦਾ ਹੈ, ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਇਕੋ ਲਫਜ਼ ਦੇ ਕਈ ਵਾਰੀ ਆਉਣ ਕਰਕੇ ਪਾਠ ਅਗਾਂਹ ਪਿਛਾਂਹ ਹੋ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। When I checked a dictionary I got the following: ਸਿਰ ਚੜ੍ਹਨਾ - to be overbearing; to go to one's head Still makes no sense, especially with the use of the word ਘੱਟ before it? It seems to refer to the ability to 'keep a track' so to speak?

Thanks. Guess I was being a bit lazy. lol

Thanks bro. I realise that I had totally got the wrong end of stick with that sentence but think I am okay now.

Thank you bhai ji. Can you (or anyone) explain what is meant by maatras in a way that I can understand?

Try this: What is the exact meaning of the word ਸੱਦੁ in the context below? ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੀ ‘ਬਾਣੀ’ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਭਾਵੇਂ ਮੈਂ ਇਹ ਪਹਿਲਾ ਟੀਕਾ ਪੇਸ਼ ਕਰ ਰਿਹਾ ਹਾਂ, ਪਰ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਹੀ ਲੀਹਾਂ ਤੇ ਕੀਤਾ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਜਪੁ ਜੀ, ਭੱਟਾਂ ਦੇ ਸਵੈਯੇ, ਆਸਾ ਦੀ ਵਾਰ, ਸੁਖਮਨੀ ਤੇ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ ਸੱਦੁ ਦੇ ਟੀਕੇ ਕਰਨ ਵਿਚ ਵਰਤੀਆਂ ਗਈਆਂ ਹਨ।

You're beautiful brother!

That is a dodgy position Zulu. I know some people will try and make out like Sikhs used false (Dutch) courage to fight using this argument. Some may have but I'm even more sure that many fought out of faith and conviction in their cause, especially in the early 1700s. We have a NEAR contemporary account of a nihang who didn't take sukha leading the storming of some Afghan fort in NWFP for example. Nah, their effects are totally different on humans - and even these vary from individual to individual.

Not sure about that. Literally it seems to translate along the lines of 'spiritual angle'??? Here is another contextual usage: ਇਸ ਔਖਿਆਈ ਨੂੰ ਦੂਰ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਕੁੱਝ ਟੀਕੇ ਜਾ ਚੁੱਕੇ ਹਨ, ਪਰ ਖੋਜ ਕੇ ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਵਾਲੇ ਵਿਦਿਆਰਥੀ ਦੇ ਦ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ-ਕੋਣ ਤੋਂ ਉਹ ਤਸੱਲੀ ਬਖਸ਼ ਸਾਬਤ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋਏ। It seems to go along the lines of[??]: To remove these difficulties some commentaries (teekas) have been produced, but the ਦ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ-ਕੋਣ of the students who have studied, have not been blessed with firm conviction. Where's a desi brother when you need him? lol

You know, if the British establishment ignore this because of their 'Indian interests', we need to hook these guys up loudly and publically and embarrass the hell out of them. This is serious. If it was some other Muslim nation they'd be all over it with a megaphone.

Okay. On the off chance: Anyone come across this compound word before? ਦ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ-ਕੋਣ Here it is in context: ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਦਾ ਖਾਸ ਧਿਆਨ ਰੱਖਿਆ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ ਕਿ ‘ਬੋਲੀ’ ਦੇ ਦ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ-ਕੋਣ ਤੋਂ ਵਿਦਿਆਰਥੀ ਹਰੇਕ ਮੁਸ਼ਕਲ ਲਫਜ਼ ਤੇ ਉਸ ਵਿਚ ਦੱਸੇ ਭਾਵ ਨੂੰ ਠੀਕ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਸਮਝ ਸਕੇ। Help appreciated.

Lets try and make sure that the western media actually run with this story once it is verified.

Some interesting points at first glance: No reference to kesh. No reference to proscribed groups (like Ram Raiya, Dhir Malis, Masands etc.) Pre Khalsa Nitnem (Japji Sahib, Rehraas and Kirtan Sohila) No direct reference to Pahul although the term Khalsa is widely used No reference to drugs/drink prohibitions No reference to bujjar kureits Could this be a very early pre Khalsa rehat that has been adapted post 1699? It does appear to be a very early one?

Giani Ditt Singh's Durga Parbodh please!

That's not how I heard the sakhi. Prior to Bachittar Singh dealing with the elephant another bigger Singh was asked to deal with it but apparently lost his nerve and scarpered. Then Bachittar Singh stepped up on the Guru's order. Well, reading the surviving rehats it doesn't seem like they are uniform in their instructions. They have obviously evolved. I posted a reconstruction of what purports to be the oldest surviving one last night. This one brings up lots of questions which I'm sure we'll be discussing sooner or later. I'm beginning to suspect that where we materially differ in our views is in regard to the perceived nature of the personal struggle Sikhs would have gone through in keeping discipline. I have no doubt that many Sikhs where inspired enough to act with with the highest level of discipline and faith. But where I think we differ is that you don't seem to think some Sikhs may have possibly struggled with their discipline from time to time and lapsed, I think this is highly likely and believe that one of the significant purposes of a rehat was to lay out instructions on how to deal with such matters. I would tend to agree with you there but you you seem to be linking drinking solely to excesses of people in power, I don't think this is true and I'm sure cheap equivalents of 'desi' was available to common man too. That's not acknowledging the above scenario where people who weren't big shots may have drunk or taken drugs. Like nihangs for example, they never had ANY pretensions to royalty and where more like 'monk foot soldiers' but even they were known to take stuff. I hear you but our lot are conservative mofos and wouldn't speak of this stuff in their literature. It's like we only know of drinking in the latter part of the 1700s from contemporary white man accounts. Our own accounts from that period remain generally silent about it. Haarrrhh!! Your punches are as effective as this "man's" would be! (Imaginably): Seriously though, I see nothing to make me change my mind about the second half of the 1700s as a very likely contender for the emergence of drinking and bhanging. I may have a dig round to find some old quotes to shed more light on the matter. As previously stated, none of what I am saying is to betaken as an excuse to excess on Bacardi and coke or "biskey", like our guys frequently do.

Okay. Found this reconstruction and translation of the oldest surviving formal 'rehatnama' (as in a post 1699 Khalsa code of conduct). It claims to be more accurate than the McLeod one. It's from an essay entitled 'The earliest manual on the Sikh way of life' by Karamjit K. Malhotra. Page 1 of the attachments given here describe how the author reconstructed the text i.e. what manuscripts she used (I presume it is a she from the middle initial?). For the khojees out there. (I've also posted the related endnotes). Enjoy. Taken without permission from: 5 centuries of Sikh tradition. Essays for Indu Banga. Eds. Reeta Grewal & Sheena Pal. Is this the closet known surviving rehat to Guru Gobind Singh ji's time?