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suleman is a spirit trapped in this world who searches for mukti. he possesses a body and then through the vessell speaks to the sangat at rara sahib in the presence of sant ishar singh ji rara sahib. the incident has been written about by sant waryam singh ji in their books and many people from the villages around rara sahib were witness to this incident. it is worth listening to!!

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well he said in his tape he would have to be reborn for 10 more lifes before he gets mukti.. this means if we assume he lives an average life of 80 years, we can say 800 years more.. or put it upto 1000 years approximate. So it will be the year 3007,

ahh.. so the end of the world is certainly not coming in the next 1000 years ! wonder wat it will be like.

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Nah, you're way off. He took his first birth while Sant Isher Singh Ji was alive. Gurdeep Singh may have passed away from what i've heard. (BTW, he could recall his past when very young, and had a mark on his sareer that Suleman said would be proof that it was him.)

It's not worth dwelling on. Sant ji only let him speak to sangat so we could learn lessons from what he said. The main thing was to use this life wisely - our time is limited and shouldn't be wasted.

Jeevan Mukti can be attained by anyone by following Maharaj Ji's teachings and with their kirpa. Time spent arguing with fools over meat and other divisive issues can be used for simran.

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  • 8 months later...

This whole episode poses too many questions, which I'm sure have been raised several times (from the language used by the "ghost" which is modern Urdu with certain words borrowed from English, although he was supposedly from a much earlier time period and the assertion that he met Guru Nanak Dev Ji, but he knew only Sant Baba Isar Singh was powerful enough to save him...)...of course, I will get accused of being too caught up with analysis, but these are natural questions that come to mind when hearing such stories.

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I didn't notice any words borrowed from English?

But I've heard that Ghosts are able to learn and observe like us, which might explain why Sulemaan knew such perfect Urdu.

Hearing this tape actually makes my faith in Sikhi even stronger. Sant Ishar Singh Jee was Jaani Jaan. I'm sure he would have known if it was real or not.

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We can speculate all we want on matters concerning what a Ghost can and cannot do - not for me to say, however working with the assumption that this incident is real, I cannot get my head around the fact that Suleman was trapped until Sant Baba Ishar Singh came to the Earth to 'free him' - implication being that despite meeting Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the latter (Nirankar himself) was not 'powerful' enough to help Suleman, only Sant Baba Ishar was...maybe someone can help with understanding this issue.

Thanks,

Niranjana

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That's not the implication at all. The implication is that he had to pay off his debt still. And that the debt would be paid off enough that through kirpa he would be freed in Baba Isher Singh ji's time.

Either that, or Guru ji felt that seeing such an incident would help people develop greater sharda .

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"That's not the implication at all. The implication is that he had to pay off his debt still"

So you are basically saying that Guru Nanak Dev Ji was not powerful enough to free him, since some tempory 'debt' was enough to prevent Guru Sahib from assisting.

"And that the debt would be paid off enough that through kirpa he would be freed in Baba Isher Singh ji's time".

Suggest we consider the dates once again.

"Either that, or ...seeing such an incident would help people develop greater sharda"

Or equally, seeing such things will raise doubts about the means by which some people are drawn into spiritual/religious practice - i.e. via fear and superstition.

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If you listen to the tape, he says it was Guru Nanak Dev Ji themselves who told him he still had some time to do - it was Guru Ji's hukam. He also says that for him, there is no difference between Guru Nanak Dev Ji and Sant Isher singh Ji.

It's got nothing to do with Guru Ji being powerful enough or not - in his eyes, it was Guru Nanak Ji who freed him. We don't know what sharda he had when he first met Guru Ji.

In the same way, those who have faith in Guru Granth Sahib Ji get what they ask for straight away, others leave empty handed. Yet Guru Ji is all powerful.

Or how we all do various Ardasan to Waheguru - if they don't get answered straight away the fault is with our level of faith, not with Waheguru.

Luckily, there are still people around (some very educated) who witnessed the events first hand and confirm what happened.

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"Luckily, there are still people around (some very educated) who witnessed the events first hand and confirm what happened"

Being 'very educated' does not necessarily mean anything in of itself.

It is very common to find 'very educated' surgeons, lawyers, doctors, engineers in the West who get duped into following the likes of Sai Baba.

(For the record, I am not comparing Sai Baba with Sant Ishar Singh, the reference is made solely with respect to so-called 'educated' people).

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Sorry, I should maybe have written "sceptical" ior "parhe -likhe" instead of "educated".

Fact remains that many, many people witnessed the events. Including the family of the possessed boy who finally found peace after several years of suffering.

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Maybe if you actually read the book or listen to the tape properly you can discuss this without coming off like an ignoramus.

edit: before you reply, the keyword is 'properly'. You clearly have not listened to it/read it with any real understanding.

The fact that you assume Guru Nanak's hukam to Suleman as implying a lack of power in Guru Sahib says more about your sharda than anyone else's. Suleman went to Guru Sahib and was given the jugti by which he could get mukti, nothing comes for free; serving his sentence changed from a punishment to part of his bhagti. If he hadn't gone to Guru Nanak in the first place he would still be in the cycle of birth.

'Je ko bachan kamawe santan ka, so gurprasadi tariyai'

You go to Guru Sahib, do ardas, get a hukamnama and follow it. To sit around and whine that becuase you're not getting something right now means that the Guru is not powerful blah blah is inane.

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Sorry to go off the topic, but I have heard the Singh (ex-Suleman) is now living as a 'typical' Punjabi in Canada(? correct me if I am wrong), and not indulging in bhagti etc. Just thought I'd mention it, I suppose the onus was on Suleman to make the most of his opportunity!

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Sorry to go off the topic, but I have heard the Singh (ex-Suleman) is now living as a 'typical' Punjabi in Canada(? correct me if I am wrong), and not indulging in bhagti etc. Just thought I'd mention it, I suppose the onus was on Suleman to make the most of his opportunity!

well the story does go 10 lives, so it seems hes starting from pretty much scratch.

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"You go to Guru Sahib, do ardas, get a hukamnama and follow it. To sit around and whine that becuase you're not getting something right now means that the Guru is not powerful blah blah is inane"

Thanks for your sermon, however it is you who have misunderstood the situation, particularly with your closing comment:

"To sit around and whine that becuase you're not getting something right now means that the Guru is not powerful blah blah is inane"

a) I am not whining

B) certainly not complaining about what I'm 'getting' or not 'getting'

c) in no way am I suggesting that Guru Sahib is not powerful

You are simply unable to read simple english without reacting in an emotional rage - your response above is clearly indicative of a 'straw-man' fallacy, where you have constructed an argument that I never presented and then proceeded to knock that down.

Save your sermons for the unconverted.

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... I cannot get my head around the fact that Suleman was trapped until Sant Baba Ishar Singh came to the Earth to 'free him' - implication being that despite meeting Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the latter (Nirankar himself) was not 'powerful' enough to help Suleman...

i.e. you fail to see that Suleman was given the jugti to get mukti by Guru Sahib and rather see the situation as some sort of ploy to imply that Sant Isher Singh is more powerful than Guru Sahib.

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No offence to anyone but a humble doubt just got raised in my mind ?

Please explain the following tuk with reference to Suleman's story . This is just an honest question , I am not try to imply anything, (And I have the utmost respect for True Saints, They are Rab da roop)

:

" Guru Nanak Jin Sunya Pekhya Se Fir Gharbaas Na Parya Re "

Does that mean who ever has seen and listened to Guru Nanak Dev Ji will not come in the cycle of life and births ?

WJKK WJKF

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  • 2 years later...

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