Jump to content

Nihangs..hinduism??


Recommended Posts

From what i gather,nihangs model themslelves upon hindu warriors,and accept all teachings within dasam granth (although some argue much of dasam granth has been tampered with by hindu extremists)

Are the nihangs then accepting,they are hindus in roots? Since they look down upon the mainstream khalsa i.e us 'mainstream sikh' and call us sheep,etc (and that they are the gurus army) doesnt this conclude we are breaking from guru jis message? Doesnt this also conclude that we are wrong is seeing sikhi as a seperate entity,and that guru ji was infact,only remodelling hinduism,and perfecting what was in existence many years prior to the khalsa?

Sangats views please. WJKK WJKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From what i gather,nihangs model themslelves upon hindu warriors,and accept all teachings within dasam granth (although some argue much of dasam granth has been tampered with by hindu extremists)

Are the nihangs then accepting,they are hindus in roots? Since they look down upon the mainstream khalsa i.e us 'mainstream sikh' and call us sheep,etc (and that they are the gurus army) doesnt this conclude we are breaking from guru jis message? Doesnt this also conclude that we are wrong is seeing sikhi as a seperate entity,and that guru ji was infact,only remodelling hinduism,and perfecting what was in existence many years prior to the khalsa?

Sangats views please. WJKK WJKF

you see nihangs are called "Ladla Khalsa" by guru ji... but however its sad today how they ignored.. its entirely because its been geeting screwed over time to time by british then rss aand unfortunately sikhs within our panth... really hope nihangs flourish like flowers and spread their shastar vidiya around someday......

Also since nihangs been broken into fragments by british and our people thats why you see bunch of fragments not accepting hindu roots but being more freindly with hindu tradition so they take part in it...

However just because nihangs do accept hindu traditions that doesnt mean nihangs accept rss propaganda too...they are good blokes with skills.. but if hindu extermist try to screw the panth then they will raise the swords.. thats what they are given the swords.. thats they praise mirri-pirri sword...sword of khalsa... lots of nihangs got shaheed in 84.. that just describes it.. they certainly not there to divide the panth but it seems like it because mainstream sikhs are makin fun of em... ie. jhatka, bhang.. thats all their tradition...when someone talks about nihangs.. first mainstream sikhs has to say.. oh those crack-heads... gimme a break... its sad to see whats happening in the panth these days... :cry:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The nihangs are probably true to the word sikh as u could get, they wear the bana, they keep shashtars with them at all times and they read the bani with full vigour!!

Even though I might not agree with everything they do... 1) the drinking of maha parshad as I concider it as a form of intoxicant. and 2) the killing of animals in the name of God.

Also my belief in the Dasam Granth is of very high importance, as bani's such as Jaap Sahib, Akaal Ustat, shabad hazare p10, etc,etc come from the dasam granth :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gurbani says that the Khalsa is the lotus flower and the hundu's are the roots of the flower.

But yet it still says that hindu is unna (blind) and muslim is kana (one eyed).

This does not mean they can not reach god. Anyone can. As long as they love and fear god. Without Guru Nanak Dev Ji's Gurmanter and Mool Mater they can not go into Sach Khand only see Sach Khands door. Not allowed to be entered.

Khalsa was already on its way form Sat Jug.

You do not need to read from Dasam Granth or Sarbloh Granth. Just go to your local Gurdwara and read Guru Granth Sahib Ji and all the answer are there for these types of questions. This is much easier because every one has access to to Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

If anybody has the time in there life to travel india then do so. But mainstream sikhi will confuse you. Go past Punjab south,, past Hazoor Sahib. and see all the dharamsala and Gurdwaraset up by guru Nanak Den Ji.

You will be totally confused with that sikh reht and mainstream sikh reht.

If you can not then got to any Sant Dera in Punjab. If you can not even do that then read Guru Granth Sahib Ji and that will differently confuse you with mainstream sikhi.

Gurbani says hindus are our roots and we are their lotus.

This is Kal jug the Satguru for Kalj Jug is only Satguru Nanak Dev Ji.

Yes Ram and Krishna are Gurus but only in the other jugs not in Kal Jug.

We must respect Krishna Hamnuman Shiva Brahma but rss and ppl like that must not forget. That Khalsa panth is the lotus flower.

Sakhi.

Bhai Mardana and Guru Nanak Dev Ji came to a place before a village. Guru Ji said that we must rest here for the night. Bhai mardana say why don't we go into the village. Guru Ji replies we will rest here

There were many sants in the village. All got angry at this Sant outside the village. They sent a messenger with a bowl full of milk. There was so much milk that the milk was spilling out of the bowl. Guru Nanak Dev Ji replied by putting a Lotus flower on top of the milk in the the bowl.

All this means is,Yes there are Sants(the milk) in the bowl(village/world). But Guru Nank Dev Ji(the Lotus) is higher.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji was representing us sikhs and the sants in the village were representing hindus.

But do not think that we do not have to respect them. Respect we must give. Because we are now representing Guru Nanak Dev Ji.

But once again, if you meet a rss and he says that Satguru Nanak Dev Ji was a hindu then there is nothing wrong with that . Why should we say that Satguru Ji is not thier Satguru Ji. Because he is everyones Satguru.

Remember this is Kaal Jug and the Satguru of this time is Satguru Nanak Dev Ji.

Sat means truth true.

Guru means teacher. bringing from gu (dark) in to ru (light).

Please think about this.

Which of the following names are sikh names and with are hindu names:

Nanak, Angad, Amardas, Ramdas, Arjan,Hargobind, Har Rai, Har Krishn, Tegh Bahadur, Gobind Rai.

Sodhi surname was given to SatGuru Gobind Singh Ji from the khasetrees (hindu warriors).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gurbani says that the Khalsa is the lotus flower and the hundu's are the roots of the flower.

But yet it still says that hindu is unna (blind) and muslim is kana (one eyed).

This does not mean they can not reach god. Anyone can. As long as they love and fear god. Without Guru Nanak Dev Ji's Gurmanter and Mool Mater they can not go into Sach Khand only see Sach Khands door. Not allowed to be entered.

Khalsa was already on its way form Sat Jug.

You do not need to read from Dasam Granth or Sarbloh Granth. Just go to your local Gurdwara and read Guru Granth Sahib Ji and all the answer are there for these types of questions. This is much easier because every one has access to to Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

If anybody has the time in there life to travel india then do so. But mainstream sikhi will confuse you. Go past Punjab south,, past Hazoor Sahib. and see all the dharamsala and Gurdwaraset up by guru Nanak Den Ji.

You will be totally confused with that sikh reht and mainstream sikh reht.

If you can not then got to any Sant Dera in Punjab. If you can not even do that then read Guru Granth Sahib Ji and that will differently confuse you with mainstream sikhi.

Gurbani says hindus are our roots and we are their lotus.

This is Kal jug the Satguru for Kalj Jug is only Satguru Nanak Dev Ji.

Yes Ram and Krishna are Gurus but only in the other jugs not in Kal Jug.

We must respect Krishna Hamnuman Shiva Brahma but rss and ppl like that must not forget. That Khalsa panth is the lotus flower.

Sakhi.

Bhai Mardana and Guru Nanak Dev Ji came to a place before a village. Guru Ji said that we must rest here for the night. Bhai mardana say why don't we go into the village. Guru Ji replies we will rest here

There were many sants in the village. All got angry at this Sant outside the village. They sent a messenger with a bowl full of milk. There was so much milk that the milk was spilling out of the bowl. Guru Nanak Dev Ji replied by putting a Lotus flower on top of the milk in the the bowl.

All this means is,Yes there are Sants(the milk) in the bowl(village/world). But Guru Nank Dev Ji(the Lotus) is higher.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji was representing us sikhs and the sants in the village were representing hindus.

But do not think that we do not have to respect them. Respect we must give. Because we are now representing Guru Nanak Dev Ji.

But once again, if you meet a rss and he says that Satguru Nanak Dev Ji was a hindu then there is nothing wrong with that . Why should we say that Satguru Ji is not thier Satguru Ji. Because he is everyones Satguru.

Remember this is Kaal Jug and the Satguru of this time is Satguru Nanak Dev Ji.

Sat means truth true.

Guru means teacher. bringing from gu (dark) in to ru (light).

Please think about this.

Which of the following names are sikh names and with are hindu names:

Nanak, Angad, Amardas, Ramdas, Arjan,Hargobind, Har Rai, Har Krishn, Tegh Bahadur, Gobind Rai.

Sodhi surname was given to SatGuru Gobind Singh Ji from the khasetrees (hindu warriors).

Gurus have rejected hindu rituals But i do agree when you said khalsa foundation was planned in satyuga...

Your theory does make sense..However not many hindus wll like it... you said satguru nanak is their satguru too but it was gurus who saved em in kalyuga...You see satyuga, dwapar and traita yugs there prophets and avatars were there to fight with the oppression and teach peace...in kalyuga our gurus were there to fight with opression and spread peace...since we are in the kalyuga theoritically they should be following gurus and gurus principles since they owe us a lot...

but stuff it does make sense...whether you prefer sikhs were hindus... or hindus are sikhs theory.....both way it does make sense.. however both parties wont agree.. so same old propagand..spread hatred against each other...so why bother veer??

i m sure you heard of 96 crore sakhi in sau.. where guru ji himself said khalsa shall be 960 million ...i guess that be the end of the kalyug...who knows that will be include half hindus, chrisitians converted to khalsa saroop.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

bhaji when u talk abt 96 kror khalsa......that doesnt nessesarily mean as in amritdhaari......but as in rightous and pure dharami ppl.....of any faith.......who will get together and fight against the tyranny and oppression of this kal jug (dusht, maleash)........

and the gal about sikhis roots......far as i under stand is that the same truth that was in sat jug was the same truth (sat) that was in the other two jugs and is the same truth now in this kal jug.........this word hindu was used by the invading turks to describe the ppl of the indus........but within india there were many small dharams.........

the truth is the same truth as in the vedas and shastaras and sutras but in this kal jug guru granth sahib is the nichor of all these religious texts.........everything has to be made more effecient and time effective as we have less time to do vaheguroos bhagatee as in past jugs.....and we have more distractions and obsticals.......but as guru nanak dev jee is the avtaar of this jug so were krishan and ram of their respective jugs who we respect and consider our ancestors not as hindu gods etc.........guru nanak dev jee taught the same truth as did ram and krishan......but obviously with changes to certain practices which have been very affective in other jugs but would take too long in kal jug......so maharaaj just taught us a different technique of doing bhagatee for this jug.........

i do not consider ram or krishan or durga as hindu.......but our ancestors and hindu are these fanatical rss ppl.......the rest of the so called hindus are our brothers/relatives........as they just still believe in the old ways......but by segregating and putting up walls and hating..... we will only push them away and they will never have the chance to see to realise that sikhi is the same as what the vedas and shastaras and sutras teach but is more affective in this kal jug than some of the old ways are that they are still using.......

Link to comment
Share on other sites

..... we will only push them away and they will never have the chance to see to realise that sikhi is the same as what the vedas and shastaras and sutras teach but is more affective in this kal jug than some of the old ways are that they are still using.......

That is a dangerous statement my Sikh brother. The question remains as to what you hope to accomplish by teaching Hindus that Sikhism is just a faster more time effective way of Hinduism? Do you wish to convert them?

That leaves a dangerous precedent. Because as we all know Sages, Gurus, Holy Men have come throughout Indias long history and will continue to do so. Who can predict the future? What if God sends another Prophet?

What if 100 years from now a person is born into the Sikh community and says "Listen, Sikhs I have a faster more time effective way of reaching WaheGuru, its the same thing as whats written in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib but more adapted to todays time!"

What would be your reaction?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank You.

We cant go into some matters, especially full charge. Telling a person from another faith that you have a better way to God is a big "No"

And that is were the root of the problem lies. We would not have religious violence in the world today if people stopped taking this attitude. Instead of using the word "religious debate" which sounds combative, we should use the word "Interfaith discussion"

But back to the discussion. We Hindus believe that whenever the sacred law diminishes, then God himself sends a person or sometimes comes himself to regenerate the faith. And we believe people like Nanak, Buddha, Mahavira and others were doing this.

The diminishing of faith will rapidly increase in the Kaliyug, in which we are living. And there will be more Prophets, Gurus, Sages. Most of these men will be forgotten but some will become famous and religions will be spawned after their ideals.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

indian bhaji maaf karna for making it souding like sikhi is the best and everyone else sucks........that was not my intention.........it was actually the contrary......i was trying to explain to my sikh brothers that we should not be ignorant and discredit our ancestors......because there is alot of fanatisism creeping into sikhi......ppl blatently denying that ram and krishan, shiv etc did not exist and were hindus so they are nothing to us.......i was just trying to put the point across about how there is no difference in whta sri ram ji, sri krishan ji and guru nanak dev were teaching..........which was truth which has been true since the before time and begining of time and during the ages and now and it will remain so in the future.........

the coming of guru nanak dev ji in this kaljug and him being the avtaar of this jug is written in the vedas..........many so called religious leaders will come and go in the kal jug and they all may be very chardi kala and speak the truth.......like there are many roads in to the city of london.........some are longer and shorter and some are quicker........but they will all get u there in the end and all that maharaaj and vedas say that in this jug guru nanak dev ji is avtaar as ram and krishan were the avtaars in their respective jugs.........but not saying that all other spiritual personalities are fake or not of any value........because there is sooo much diversity on this earth......ppl have different tastes views opinions and thus different paths will suit different ppl ..........i am not saying we are the best and everry one else is going to hell .......but the contrary......all paths will get u there.........i do dont claim that i represent the sikh panth.......but these are just my own personal opinions.......and i dont have a monoply on the truth......truth is every where........

at the heart and core of every dharam there is the same truth! hatred is spread by men............becuase the size of the vessal god has given us to collect knowledge is very small and no single person can claim to know every thing as the ocean of knowledge is too vast to fit into our small vessals.........

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so its fair to say we are part of that group of hindus? (i wont say hindus because this term,as mentioned,isnt really representative of all the different beleifs)

was satyug only evident in india? how come this line of truth doesnt exist anywhere else? was the koran and jesus/moses,etc etc all truth??

i agree we should respect all faiths,but since a hindu cannot be defined,then its untrue to say were are hindus in root.

p.s where is that quote from?? (we are lotus,etc)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Firstly the idea of totally removing Vishnu Krishan Maharaj, Sri Raam Ji and the so called hindu gods from sikhi is stupid, simply because the Gurmantar "Vaheguru" according to Bhai Gurdas Ji, represents,

Va - Vaasdev

He - Hari (as in Hari Krishan - Krishan mahraj)

Gu - Gobind, (possibly refers to Guru Gobind Singh Mahraj)

Ru - Raam (Sri Raam Chandar mahraj)

In the jaap of these names we refer to the avtar as a supreme physcial living form of gods light, obvbiously not God God as in the big original one God which everything is a part of, coz we cant even contemplate or comprehend AKAAL (GurbrAKAAAL)

Sikh_fauge mentioned hindu not being defined and he is quite right, coz hindu is actually a collection of religions and beliefs, on a geographical basis. However over time it has become custom to call any belief which originated from beyond the indus river as HINDUISM. (This is probably why certain ppl refer to sikhi as a part of hindusim).

Im not into any of that interfaith crap that all religions are one, as i believe each is its own, but God is one, so the truth will have many similarities.. Someone stated in an earlier post that the truth is only in sikhi, well thats crap, coz if you look at other religions you will see alot of common aspects, just as every human is different yet we all have similar features.

Example, The so called day of judgment/ armageddon return of christ, coming of kalki avtar and mehdi avtar, The return of the massiah, the return of Imam Mehdi, all these are similar views shared by sanataan sikhi (the four sampardava), Hinduism, Judaism Islam Christianity, and certain types of budhism.

Obviously over time segregation externally and internally have caused beliefs and ppl to seperate destroying all that which was similar between them.

I could carry on but im sure u can find many points to pick on and disagree with, so feel free. but hopefully some1 readin this post will be able to see with a more open mind, INSHALLAH !! and please feel free to research the points further and reply..

Im sure some1 will write a book one day, coz i cant be bothered. !! :twisted:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Va - Vaasdev

He - Hari (as in Hari Krishan - Krishan mahraj)

Gu - Gobind, (possibly refers to Guru Gobind Singh Mahraj)

Ru - Raam (Sri Raam Chandar mahraj)

Bring me bhai gurdas ji verse from either guru granth sahib ji or his sakhi when did he claim that??

From what we know.. its this

"Vahe"- Wonderful

‘Gu’ = Darkness/Ignorance

‘Ru’ = Light/ Enlightenment

'Guru' = brings one from darkness into light (removes ignorance)

and what i m claiming.. i also got it from sarbloh.info

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think n30 is right. His "version" always seems a little better. But thats not the point.

This is my belief, and it sounds the same as n30...the description is one of the oldest in the hindu texts...the rig veda...

This is a development of sounds that is part exclamation of ecstacy:

Wha......or Wahe

and Guru: That which take us from darkness to light

Gu: from darkness

ru: to light

All together we have the ecstasy of "that sacred sound" which is the vehicle to transports us from our small self to the "all self" or God.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:twisted: I said I would post the Var of Bhai Gurdas, Its the first var pauree 49,

Pauri 49 (Vahiguru mantr)

Satijugi satigur Vasdev vava Visana namu japavai. (1-49-1)

Duapar satiguru hari Krishan haha hari hari namu japavai. (1-49-2)

Tete satigur Ram ji rara Ram jape sukhu pavai. (1-49-3)

Kalijugi Nanak gur Gobind gaga Gobind namu alavai. (1-49-4)

Chare jage chahu jugi panchain vichi jai samavai. (1-49-5)

Charo achhar iku kari vahiguru japu mantr japavai. (1-49-6)

Jaha te upajia phiri taha samavai. ||49||1|| (1-49-7)

Pauri 49 (Vahiguru mantr)

In Satyug, Visnu in the form of Vasudev is said to have incarnated and ‘V’

Of Vahiguru reminds of Visnu. The true Guru of dvapar is said to be

Harikrsna and ‘H’ of Vahiguru reminds of Hari. In the the treta was Ram and

‘R’ of Vahiguru tells that rembering Ram will produce joy and

happiness. In kalijug, Gobind is in the form of Nanak and ‘G’ of Vahiguru

gets Govind recited. The recitations o f all the four ages subsume in

Panchayan i.e. in the soul of the common man. When joining four letters

Vahiguru is remembered, the jiv merges again in its origin.

So I guess vaheguru Gurmantar is deeper then just Wonderful, Guru..

And if thats the case for the gurmantar, maybe the whole of Gurbani has a deeper meaning as well as its face value.?? I guess thats why u need prampara and Bhai Gurdas Ji Vaara as a key to understand the Paradox which stems from the BeejMantar, Ek Onkar,

:D :twisted:

Lol, So I wonder if Bhai Gurdas Ji is also RSS ????

Link to comment
Share on other sites

WHATS THE PAGE NUMBER BOY??!!

oh bhao! bande vangoo nee bolnaa oundhaa! ???

hes given u the reference!..........if u bothered to read the post

Var of Bhai Gurdas, Its the first var, pauree 49,

the transliteration and translation have both been provided what more do u need u pindoo!

salaa boy daa buchaa lagdhaa!!! :evil:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pls dont use vulgarity on the net...dont treat khalsa brothers like that...

just give him the page number..that should be ok.. this thread is already observed very closely..we dont want to lock it ..we want the convincing results..

After all we are all sons/daughters of guru gobind singh ji maharaj :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:twisted:

There is no need to use insulting language on the net, calling my boy in capitols is represented as SHOUTING on the net. !! Also the word boy can easily be taken as offensive.. You keep asking for a page number well depending on what copy you have of Bhai Gurdas Jis Vaars It will change, as some have translations etc, Some are just the vaars but split accordingling. and others have all the vars, so I provided the Pauree number and the precise location within the Pauree which would be allow you to find the precise location of the text I referd to. !!

as you have proven to be completely impotent

here is the direct link using sikhitothemax.com

http://www.sikhitothemax.com/PageASP.asp?ShabadID=5590

and before u mention to me that sikhi to the max says page one and thats all u wanted, sikhi to the max says page one throughout the Vaars, and to every pauree !! because the vaars are not found on pages but according to pauree !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

wjkk,wjkf

answering ur question in ur earlier post about what the RSS r:

the RSS r not sikhs;

RSS stands for 'Rashtriya Sawayamsevak Sangh'. they r a hindu-nationalist organisation, clearly NOT sikhs.

they r dangerous ppl who distort sikhi, trying to merge it into hindu rituals.

below is an extract i got from www.akj.org:

it may b a little long but i have taken & compied the most important parts, plz take the time out to read it.

Shame of Bradford Vaisakhi - Sikhs are hindus - Sewa Atta (president of Leeds Rd Gurdwara )...

... In what was a pre-planned move the route of the nagar keertan which visits all Gurdwaras in Bradford, was deliberately changed only 36 hours before the nagar keertan. The route changed was specifically done by Sewa Atta, president of Leeds Rd Gurdwara to ensure that the nagar keertan stops at the Hindu mandir of bradford...

...It should be noted this is not any normal mandir, but what is commonly known as the most right wing Mandir in Uk...

...During the Nagar keertan, yesterday, these same RSS fanatics were allowed to put floral necklaces around the Panj Pyares, even though in their own literature, they state the milk of a cow is higher than amrit from the Panj Pyares. They then did Hindu jakaras, "Ram Ki jai",...

...Then most shamefully of all they were allowed by Sewa Atta and his cohorts to sprinkle water and petals over the Sahib Siri Guru Granth Sahib...

...The RSS leaders were grinning wide for after many years of trying they finally managed to get the Nagar keertan to come to their militant mandir creating a Precedent...

origin: forum :Disgusting and sad (if true)

[a later post in this forum confirms this to be true.]

wjkk,wjkf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...