Kala Afghana And His Cronies

[singh2]

I put this post in a wrong section. This is the section where it should belong to

Kala afghana hails from a Village Kala afghana in Gurdaspur. He joined police as a constable in Punjab police after attaining 8th grade education. His medium of instruction was urdu. He retired as a Sub-inspector after serving full time till retirement.

During militancy days he was deployed at darbar sahib Amritsar to spy on activities of Sant Bhindrewale. During attack on Golden Temple Sant ji was killed and kala afghna who pretended to be Sant ji's friend remained untouched. He was whisked away to Canada by making him to jump bail in a bribery and stealing case in which he had been convicted.

Till then he never wrote even one page of paper on any subject leave aside sikh theology. He was employed as a Granthi at Victoria, BC by unsuspecting

sikhs. there he made advances to a sikh bibi who was like his daughter. he was kicked out of that job. Gurudwara sahib committee did not take any action against him as they did not want good name of Gurudwara to be tarnished in public. Kala fghna was a rogue cop. very innocently he got a written paper from committeet hat there is non case against him. Later taking cover of that letter he sued Gurudwara sahib that he was falsely accused of misconduct. He lost the case and judge implicated him in case of moral turpitude.

Suddenly books started appearing in his name one after the other . In all 10 books came in the market in a period of 5 years. It was a very big work that needed about 40 people on full time basis. His main thrust of attack was on dasam granth sahib and he writes that Guru Gobind singh did not write any bani at all.The purpose of his writing were to confuse sikhs and take them away from Amrit of Guru Gobind singh ji.

While kala afghhna has been marginalized as Sikhs ignored his books and he was excommuicated. But there are some of his staunch chelas who keep on surfacing from time to time to misguide sikhs. For them kala afghana's blasphemy against dasam granth is justified. For them kala afghana is a neo Guru.

Sangat is requseted to contribute their views about this heretic so that he and his backers are exposed as supporters include many unknown faces such as owner of globalsikhstuides site who is continuously sihs by writing lies on his website.

[singh2]

There is one man raghbir singh samagh who appears in doctored videos interviewing anti Gurmat persons of this kala afghna/IOSS/MIssionary school of thought.

here is what kala afghana said in an interview with him in torotnto. This was about panthic rehat maryada

On March 26, 2006, Gurbaksh Singh Kala Afgana was

interviewed by Mr. Samagh of Gurbani Vichar program.

Among several questions asked was the question about

Rehat Marayada of SGPC as finalized in 1945. kala

Afgana asserted it very forcefully that the maryada of

SGPC is infact formulated only by 3 or four people. He

did not mention their names but was stressing the fact

that it is not a Maryada that all Sikh organizations

had input in as is mentioned in the Introductory pages

of the Rehat Maryada published by SGPC.

This way Mr Kala Afgana is alleging that the long

drawn process of formulating the Rehat Maryada, as

described in it, is not true. Since there is a

historical record of all the proceedings and meetings

of Raho-Reet Committees and input of various Panthic

organizations and individuals, it is Kala Afgana who

is spreading his own lies to discredit this Rehat

Maryada that is believed by majority of Sikhs to be a

very well thought out document to create some harmony

amongst all sections of Sikhs.

Now we have darshan ragi to praech such anti sikh views.

[Mithar]

Sometimes I think that people like Kala Afghana are the creation of the Indian government to confuse Sikhs. While the Sikhs are fighting amongst each other, they won’t be able to unite against real external threats. He is a senile old man, how did he manage to writes so many books in such a short period of time? Who was helping him? These are questions we need to know.

From the videos I have seen of him, he does not seem like a very intelligent man unlike Ghagha or Darshan Ragi. He seems like a man with mediocre intelligence level and with very mischievous facial features. Not the kind of man I would want trust to buy a car from.

[singh2]

Sometimes I think that people like Kala Afghana are the creation of the Indian government to confuse Sikhs. While the Sikhs are fighting amongst each other, they won’t be able to unite against real external threats. He is a senile old man, how did he manage to writes so many books in such a short period of time? Who was helping him? These are questions we need to know.

From the videos I have seen of him, he does not seem like a very intelligent man unlike Ghagha or Darshan Ragi. He seems like a man with mediocre intelligence level and with very mischievous facial features. Not the kind of man I would want trust to buy a car from.

of course they are the creation of GOI. Intelligent sikhs will understand this when ethey connect dots. But others will blindly follow him and his

chelas like Globalsikhstudy man who does not abc of what is insdie Dasam granth and is delivering video lectures on heretic site singh sabha canada as an expert. then we have some doomchhalas who follow them blindly.

[Mithar]

Sad thing is, in the west I have seen some very education Sikhs becoming Kala Afghanists. My uncle is a medical doctor and he is a firm Kala Afghanist. I pity these people who ruin their entire janam in such anti Sikh ideologies. A Sikh is strong because he has firm beliefs in Dasam Bani, Naam Simran, Amritvela. These are the three things that Kala Afghanists disassociate Sikhi from. Without these three things what type of Sikhi is left in a Sikh?

[singh2]

Sad thing is, in the west I have seen some very education Sikhs becoming Kala Afghanists. My uncle is a medical doctor and he is a firm Kala Afghanist. I pity these people who ruin their entire janam in such anti Sikh ideologies. A Sikh is strong because he has firm beliefs in Dasam Bani, Naam Simran, Amritvela. These are the three things that Kala Afghanists disassociate Sikhi from. Without these three things what type of Sikhi is left in a Sikh?

An educated person does not translate to a good sikh. With education people develop ego. Here is another educated sikh Jasbir mann who was caught with his briefs down in a debate on dasam granth sahib. He claims to be an authority on Dasam granth sahib and does not know what is in dasam granth sahib.His website full of lies misleads scores of younng sikhs on Dasam granth.

Read his knowledge about Dasam granth sahib from the following posts

Jasbir singh Mann writes as below that means Dasam granth was written by Atma Ram Nirmala in Patna. This was done by British

and was imported to punjab in 1860. We have to tolerate such type of nonsensicle information on regular basis as some ignorant

are taken in his mischievous propaganda.

Jasbir singh mann writes

Please note Malcolm account clearly accepts services of Nirmala Atma Ram @

Calcutta who helped him to understand Sikh History.Chhand 201(Ek samey Sri

Atma Uchrio) in Akal Ustit & Four Chhands 126-130( din Ajab Atma Ram) in Gian

prabodh written by Atma Ram indicates his involvement in creation of Dasmi

Patshahi Granth and Mahants at Patna sahib promoted this granth.

Rebuttal by our group memeber

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/learning-zone/message/49396

Dear Dr Jasbir Singh Ji Mann:

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh Hai:

In above you are writing: "Gianprabodh written by Atma Ram".

This you are saying because of Chhand 201 in Akal Ustatt, and Four

Chhands 126-130 in Gianprabodh.

I would like to submit that this evidence you have provided is

baseless and without any serious thought behind it. The reason is

that:

1. The Akal Ustatt Chhand 201 begins with

Aik samaye Sri Atma Uchryio Matt seo bain||

Sabh Partap Jagdees ko kaho sakal bidh tain||

Ko Atama saroop hai Kaha Srisht ko beechar||

Kaun Dharam ko karam hai, kaho sakal bisthaar||....

This part of Akal Ustatt is filled with most fundamental questions

of life. It is expressed in dialogue form. The first line indicates

that it is a question being posed by Soul (Sri Atma) to

the "Intellect" (Matt). The first question is: Describe all the

details of Power of God (Jagdees ko partap). Second line asks the

question: What is nature of Soul (Atma da Saroop ki hai?), and How

did this world came into existence (Kaho Srishat ko beechar). Next

question is; What are truly religious actions (Dharm ko karm kya

hai?). The next part asks questions about what is Life and what is

death? What is heaven and what is hell (Swarg-Narq)...

To save space I am not including more details. Now, because the

word "Sri Atma" appears in this chhand and, the word Atma Ram

appears in Gyan Parbodh, you claim it is written by nirmala Pandit

Sri Atma Ram Ji.

Let us look at Gyan Parbodh part that you indicate i.e. Chhand 126

to 130: I am reproducing all four chhands below, with meanings to

follow:

Anchhijj tej, aajaan bah|| Rajaan raj, sha-haan shah||

Uchryio Atma Pratma sang||Utbhujj saroop, abgitt abhungg|

Eh kaun ahey Atmaa saroop||Jeh amit tej,atbhut bibhoot||

Pratma Baach:

Yeh Bruhm ahay Atma saroop|| Jeh amit tej abgitt akaam||

Jeh bhed bharm nahi karam kaal|| Jeh satr mittr sarba dyal||

Dobyio na bubbay sokhiyo na jayey||Katyio na kattey , na baryio

brayey||

Chhijjay na naik,sat shashtr paat||Jeh satr mittr nahi jaat paat||

Sattr sahuns sat sat prghayey|| Chhijjai na naik, khandyio na jayey||

Nahi jarrey naik pawak majhaar|| Boray na sindh, sokhai na

bayaar||130||

Meanings:

Praise that entity who's power & glory never diminishes, that

Waheguruji's arms reach all places. He is the king of kings, and He

is the loftiest of all rulers. (Chhand 126)

One day the individual soul (Atma) addressed the Higher soul (Sri

Waheguru ji's Shakti). That power of higher soul is

always "Creative" (Utbhuj), unboundable into forms and

unfragmentable, and asked:What is natue of this individual soul? Its

glory is supposed to be infinite, and its substance is so

wonderful? (Chhand 127)

The Higher Soul (Pra-Atmaa) said:

This individual soul is infact Bruhm saroop, that is Jyot saroop

Waheguru's part. Its glory is without decline, and it is desireless

& unboundable. It does not discriminate (it is unbiased), neither it

is subject to time and actions. It does not have any friends or

foes, and is always merciful to wards all. (Chhand 128)

It cannot be drowned or soaked with anything, neither it can be cut

or burnt. It cannot be pierced by athousands of weapons.It does not

have any enemy or friend and it does not align with any body.

(Chhand 129)

If thousands of enemy join tgether and attack it with various

weapons, it still cannot be broken, or fragmented. It would not burn

in the fire, and it cannot be dried by the winds/air.. (Chhand 130)

Now, my dear Dr Jasbir Singh Ji, please explain where is this ghost

of Atma Ram in these both texts that you gave evidence of???

May I further ask the question: How is any part of this writing in

contradiction to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji?? how does it mislead

anybody?? or How many Sikhs went in the wrong way due to their faith

in this bani??

Is this Bani not exactly as:

Jal nahi doobey taskar nahi leivei, bhahe na sakkay jalleyor Satguru

Arjan Dev ji??

Is it any different from : Awadh katyio na jaat prem rass charn

kamal sang. Davan bandhyi na jaat bidhay mann dars mag. Pawak jaryio

na jaat . Neeer na sakas borr chaleh har panth mag|| Nanak rog dokh

agh moh chhiday har naam khag||.

Regarding this conclusion you drew (That Pandit Atma Ram wrote Gyan

Parbodh in Dasam Granth), I am reminded of the namdhari assertion

that Guru Sahibji wrote in Rehraas Sahib that Sikhs must go and live

at Sirsa, as in Sant Sajjan Bhaeye SARSAY, pooray Gur te janii.

Therefore Kukas have another sub-headuarters in Sirsa.

If we follow thi logic, then the Shabds in Sri uru Granth Sahib Ji

such as: Atma Raam na poojni doojjai keon sukh hoeye (angg 1415)

WOULD BE WRITTEN BY THE SAME Atma Ram Nirmala!!

Also, your attempt to conclude that having respect and regard for

Sri Dasam Granth would diminish respect of Sri Guru Granth Sahib, is

absolutely without merit. just ask your own heart, and also reflect

on the Sikh historical horizon,f that ever happened? Infact Guru

Piareys derived great inspiration before going on military campaigns

from the Sri Dasam Guru ji's bani. In particular an AmritDhari Sikh

cannot question thi own father's bani because Panj Piareys in Guru

form ordained this. Thi fundamental violation shall cause a

bottomless hole, Rasatal toa for a Sikh.

S. Avninder Singh Mangat has presented formidable argument to

counter your British conspiracy theory. Why were Kukas not promoted

because they were in the forfront to challenge the Guruship of Sri

Guru Granth Sahib? Ther is no use cutting and pasting withot editing

garbled stuff each time this discussion comes up even if

unintentionally, as it happened this time when S. Jagpal Singh

tiwana ji posted news about my visit to the Gurdwara sahib in

Halifax. many solid questions have been asked and evidence

presented, but you are maintaining a stance as if it is a personal

prestige issue. I say this because you have really presented this

Atma Ram argument without looking at the original. You have been

using the single line of Sarb Loh's introductio as well without

merit. The question that why S. Baghel Singh dinot install dasam

Granth in Delhi Gurdwaras is of same category. Nobody can tell what

he installe or not or which Granthis did he appoint from which place

etc. These are all lame arguments. I respect and thank you for your

kind attention.

Please, also note that Iam not a Doctor of anything. I hope you used

Dr in front of my name by mistake.

Thanks and Charhdee Kalaa.

harkinder Singh

London Ontario Canada

Edited July 29, 2009 by singh2

[singh2]

Kala Afghana's (KA) views on different issues (taken from 'Bipran ki Reet to Sach da Marg')

* Bhog & Guru Granth Sahib: Doing bhog of Deg in presence of Guru Granth Sahib is manmat according to KA.

* Sri Amritsar Ishnan: KA states that the holy water of the sarovar should NOT be referred to as Amrit.

* Washing our Feet: KA criticizes the practice of washing our feet before entering Darbar Sahib or our Gurduara Sahibs.

* Amrit Vela: KA states how can you call a particular time of the day Amrit-Vela when so many evil things happen around the world at that time.

* Bhai Veer Singh Ji: KA criticizes Bhai Veer Singh Ji for making anti-Gurmat statements expresses disappointment about his works.

* Bhai Veer Singh Ji, Baba Sri Chand Ji: KA accuses Bhai Veer Singh Ji of lying about Baba Sri Chand Ji, and refers to such writers as "Sikhi day Vayree" (enemies of the Sikhs).

* Amritsar Sarovar: KA implies that there is no basis behind the belief that partaking ishnan in Amritsar sarovar will wash away one's sins. He states that it has nothing to do whatsoever with the Gurbani verse : "RamDaas Sarova Natai || Sabh Utray Pap Kamatai||

* Baba Deep Singh Ji's memorial: KA argues against the need for a memorial for Baba Deep Singh Ji where Baba Ji's severed was laid to rest. He refers to this as idol worship. He questions even whether Baba Ji's severed head had fell at that particular place.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit: KA questions the historical reference that (1)Amrit could revive the dead (the Panj Piarays).(2)Amrit could rid one of previous sins.(3)He states that this kind of belief will convince an Amritdharee to committ further sins.(4)He states that Guru Gobind Singh Ji never accepted the Panj as his Guru (Appay Guru Chella)(5)KA states that the reference to Guru Gobind Singh of reviving the Panj Piyarays after cutting their "sees" are pure lies.

* Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale: KA states that Baba Jarnail Singh Ji committed acts that brought about the current downfall of the Panth. Baba Jarnail Singh Ji desecrated Sri Darbar Sahib when defended and fortified it. By giving shastars and motorcycles to the Sikh Youth, he (Baba Jarnail Singh) made us into murderers and robbers (dakoos). KA states that even after Baba Harnam Singh also joined in, their Panthic wishes were never fullfilled. He questions their sincerity and wonders if they were are all "bhekhee" (charlatans).

* Khanday-Batay da Amrit & Sweet Pittasay: KA states that to consider that sweet Pittasay were to be used in preparation of Amrit is a maha-Paap (enormous sin) since it implies that : (1) Dasam Patshah must have understood Naam-Amrit to be bitter. (2) Dasam Patshah had forgotten the Pittasay and his mistake was corrected by Mata Jito Jee. States that this Pittasay eposide is a myth and was made up by the enemies of this faith.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & 3 Banees of Dasam Patshah: KA ridicules reference to Jaap Sahib, Swaiyay, and Chaupai Sahib as Banees recited during Amrit-Sanchar.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & 5 Banees: KA states only the Banees in Guru Granth Sahib were part of the Amrit-Sanchar ceremony. To consider that other three (Jaap Sahib, Swaiyay, and Chaupai Sahib as Banees) were read by the Guru Gobind Singh Ji is utterly direspectful to our SatGurus.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & reviving of the Panj Piyaray & Shakti: KA ridicules the concept of Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & reviving of the Panj Piaray & the divine powers (Shakti) of Amrit. He also referrs to Amrit-dharees as "Papian di Santaan" (offspring of sinners)

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & Patits: KA states that was responsible for making Sikh children cut their Kes, smoke tobacco, and become Patits. States that for Sikhs, becoming a Singh is a "bharm" (superstition) of the mind. He also states that those who consider Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit as becoming "Guru-waley" (inititation into Sikhism) are mistaken.

* Amrit & Naam: KA states that calling Amrit Naam is BrahmanVaad.

* Jao Tao Premo Khellan… & Baba Deep Singh: KA ridicules the use of this tuk in reference to Baba Deep Singh deed of fighting with his sis on his palm.

* Adultery & Bhai Randhir Singh: KA states that Bhai Randhir Singh Ji wrote that Adultery was allowed in the Rahit.

* Charan-Amrit: KA ridicules that Sikh tradition of Charan-Amrit that existed until Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit replaced it in 1699. He refers to it as a Brahmanic ritual.

* Panj Piaray & Guru Gobind Singh Ji: He states that Guru Gobind Singh Ji never accepted the Panj as his Guru (Appay Guru Chella)

* Panj Piaray & Amritdharis: KA ridicules Panj Piaray & Amritdharis, tells story of a man who was so fed up with Amritdharis that he cut his Kes and never kept them again.

* Anand-Karj: He ridicules the Panth Parvan Anand-Karj Ceremony. Lables the Anand Maryada as based on Brahmanic Rituals.

* Bhai Randhir Singh: Labels Bhai Randhir Singh as a "Bipree Agent" (an agent of the Brahmans)

* Bhai Randhir Singh, Bhindranwale & others: Ridicules Bhai Randhir Singh, Bhindranwale, and other Mahapurakhs for having belief in Chitar-Gupt, Dharam-Raaj, Jums, Narak/Surag, and the afterworld.

* Khanday-Batay, Amrit & Mantar: States that the water put in a sarovar or bowl (Khanday-Batay) can never be called Amrit. Nor can anyone blow any Mantar (WaheGuru) in water and turn it into anything powerful (Amrit). He credits the Brahmans for creating such a belief.

Unquote

kala afghana ideology is embedded in the propaganda being carried out by ragi darshan , Singh sabha canada, IOSS , jasbir Mann , Sikh bulletin, institute for understanding sikhism and missionaries.

[The Khalsa Fauj]

Kala Afgana made some blunders which caused his downfall. It would have been best if he admitted those mistakes.

People don't read Sant Saajan Bhaye Sarsay quote properly.

Proper way to read is

Sant Saajan Bhaye Sa-Rsay

Sarsay isn't about sirsa, it is Sa-Rsay meaning uttam russ.

[singh2]

Kala Afgana made some blunders which caused his downfall. It would have been best if he admitted those mistakes.

People don't read Sant Saajan Bhaye Sarsay quote properly.

Proper way to read is

Sant Saajan Bhaye Sa-Rsay

Sarsay isn't about sirsa, it is Sa-Rsay meaning uttam russ.

The poster knows that it is not about sirsa. he is equating the knowledge of so called self made

scholar Jasbir singh mann by posing him a counter question.This shameless Jasbitr Mann goes on repeating the same

thing when he is called by so called singhsabha Canada for delivering a lecture on Dasam bani.

It is amazing to see how some people can stoop to so lows.

[The Khalsa Fauj]

Inder Singh, what are you talking about? What are you on about? I am really confused. You don't like proper pronounciation of Gurbani?

[Koi]

Kala Afghana's (KA) views on different issues (taken from 'Bipran ki Reet to Sach da Marg')

* Bhog & Guru Granth Sahib: Doing bhog of Deg in presence of Guru Granth Sahib is manmat according to KA.

* Sri Amritsar Ishnan: KA states that the holy water of the sarovar should NOT be referred to as Amrit.

* Washing our Feet: KA criticizes the practice of washing our feet before entering Darbar Sahib or our Gurduara Sahibs.

* Amrit Vela: KA states how can you call a particular time of the day Amrit-Vela when so many evil things happen around the world at that time.

* Bhai Veer Singh Ji: KA criticizes Bhai Veer Singh Ji for making anti-Gurmat statements expresses disappointment about his works.

* Bhai Veer Singh Ji, Baba Sri Chand Ji: KA accuses Bhai Veer Singh Ji of lying about Baba Sri Chand Ji, and refers to such writers as "Sikhi day Vayree" (enemies of the Sikhs).

* Amritsar Sarovar: KA implies that there is no basis behind the belief that partaking ishnan in Amritsar sarovar will wash away one's sins. He states that it has nothing to do whatsoever with the Gurbani verse : "RamDaas Sarova Natai || Sabh Utray Pap Kamatai||

* Baba Deep Singh Ji's memorial: KA argues against the need for a memorial for Baba Deep Singh Ji where Baba Ji's severed was laid to rest. He refers to this as idol worship. He questions even whether Baba Ji's severed head had fell at that particular place.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit: KA questions the historical reference that (1)Amrit could revive the dead (the Panj Piarays).(2)Amrit could rid one of previous sins.(3)He states that this kind of belief will convince an Amritdharee to committ further sins.(4)He states that Guru Gobind Singh Ji never accepted the Panj as his Guru (Appay Guru Chella)(5)KA states that the reference to Guru Gobind Singh of reviving the Panj Piyarays after cutting their "sees" are pure lies.

* Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale: KA states that Baba Jarnail Singh Ji committed acts that brought about the current downfall of the Panth. Baba Jarnail Singh Ji desecrated Sri Darbar Sahib when defended and fortified it. By giving shastars and motorcycles to the Sikh Youth, he (Baba Jarnail Singh) made us into murderers and robbers (dakoos). KA states that even after Baba Harnam Singh also joined in, their Panthic wishes were never fullfilled. He questions their sincerity and wonders if they were are all "bhekhee" (charlatans).

* Khanday-Batay da Amrit & Sweet Pittasay: KA states that to consider that sweet Pittasay were to be used in preparation of Amrit is a maha-Paap (enormous sin) since it implies that : (1) Dasam Patshah must have understood Naam-Amrit to be bitter. (2) Dasam Patshah had forgotten the Pittasay and his mistake was corrected by Mata Jito Jee. States that this Pittasay eposide is a myth and was made up by the enemies of this faith.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & 3 Banees of Dasam Patshah: KA ridicules reference to Jaap Sahib, Swaiyay, and Chaupai Sahib as Banees recited during Amrit-Sanchar.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & 5 Banees: KA states only the Banees in Guru Granth Sahib were part of the Amrit-Sanchar ceremony. To consider that other three (Jaap Sahib, Swaiyay, and Chaupai Sahib as Banees) were read by the Guru Gobind Singh Ji is utterly direspectful to our SatGurus.

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & reviving of the Panj Piyaray & Shakti: KA ridicules the concept of Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & reviving of the Panj Piaray & the divine powers (Shakti) of Amrit. He also referrs to Amrit-dharees as "Papian di Santaan" (offspring of sinners)

* Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit & Patits: KA states that was responsible for making Sikh children cut their Kes, smoke tobacco, and become Patits. States that for Sikhs, becoming a Singh is a "bharm" (superstition) of the mind. He also states that those who consider Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit as becoming "Guru-waley" (inititation into Sikhism) are mistaken.

* Amrit & Naam: KA states that calling Amrit Naam is BrahmanVaad.

* Jao Tao Premo Khellan… & Baba Deep Singh: KA ridicules the use of this tuk in reference to Baba Deep Singh deed of fighting with his sis on his palm.

* Adultery & Bhai Randhir Singh: KA states that Bhai Randhir Singh Ji wrote that Adultery was allowed in the Rahit.

* Charan-Amrit: KA ridicules that Sikh tradition of Charan-Amrit that existed until Khanday-Batay-da-Amrit replaced it in 1699. He refers to it as a Brahmanic ritual.

* Panj Piaray & Guru Gobind Singh Ji: He states that Guru Gobind Singh Ji never accepted the Panj as his Guru (Appay Guru Chella)

* Panj Piaray & Amritdharis: KA ridicules Panj Piaray & Amritdharis, tells story of a man who was so fed up with Amritdharis that he cut his Kes and never kept them again.

* Anand-Karj: He ridicules the Panth Parvan Anand-Karj Ceremony. Lables the Anand Maryada as based on Brahmanic Rituals.

* Bhai Randhir Singh: Labels Bhai Randhir Singh as a "Bipree Agent" (an agent of the Brahmans)

* Bhai Randhir Singh, Bhindranwale & others: Ridicules Bhai Randhir Singh, Bhindranwale, and other Mahapurakhs for having belief in Chitar-Gupt, Dharam-Raaj, Jums, Narak/Surag, and the afterworld.

* Khanday-Batay, Amrit & Mantar: States that the water put in a sarovar or bowl (Khanday-Batay) can never be called Amrit. Nor can anyone blow any Mantar (WaheGuru) in water and turn it into anything powerful (Amrit). He credits the Brahmans for creating such a belief.

Unquote

kala afghana ideology is embedded in the propaganda being carried out by ragi darshan , Singh sabha canada, IOSS , jasbir Mann , Sikh bulletin, institute for understanding sikhism and missionaries.

So... What DOES he believe in?

[singh2]

So... What DOES he believe in?

He believes in disintegrating sikh religion and make us to shed our keshas so that there is no sikh identity left.

Many of his chelas say that openly including so called heretic singhsabha that was strted by a notorius character

in USA.

[singh2]

Inder Singh, what are you talking about? What are you on about? I am really confused. You don't like proper pronounciation of Gurbani?

fajji

You were also promoting the theory of Jasbir Mann on various forums. Do you understand that he is wrong?

[The Khalsa Fauj]

We can discuss Dasam Granth during live talk. I don't want to get into debate online again. Jasbir Singh Mann could be wrong on certain things related to Dasam Granth. It depends on level of study of Dasam Granth. He should study Dasam Granth in more depth. Just like all of us here.

[singh2]

Singh sabha movement had done some good things for sikhs. But it had its demerits also.It killed sikh scholarship.

Then we had so called missionaries who were good for nothing. They misinterpreted sikhism and since they never sacrificed for sikhism they had no fighting spirit. lacking spirit of struggle they interpreted Gurbani as it suited them.

Missionaries were followed by kala afghna whose writings also fall in the same category. Those who read and follow those

have no reading habits and follow idiotic writings of kala afghna as scholarly works.

Edited July 30, 2009 by singh2

[The Khalsa Fauj]

I don't mind your above comment because I haven't read Sikh Phulwari in years and haven't read books of kala afgana. You can try all you cheap shots you want. I suggest you come to Toronto for live talk and help out Davinder Singh in his struggles.

[Mithar]

Let us please not connect the original Singh Sabha movement with Canadian Kala Afghanist "Singh" Sabha. The original Singh Sabha was a success because of Singhs like Sant Attar Singh Mastuanaywalay, Giani Ditt Singh, Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh, Sant Sundar Singh, Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha, Prof Sahib Singh, Bhai Vir SIngh Jee. All of these men were beleivers of Dasam Bani. The missionaries were started during the 60s if I'm not mistakened by Delhi Sikhs. The missionaries beleive in science. They do not beleive that anything outside of the laws of physics is possible. They are way too rational. Although their beiefs are different from that of Kala Afghanists, but the missionaries are also fast turning into Kala Afghanists themselves. Many Missionaries are now proud Kala Afghanists, Inder Ghagha being an example of this.

[singh2]

They are way too rational. Although their beiefs are different from that of Kala Afghanists, but the missionaries are also fast turning into Kala Afghanists themselves. Many Missionaries are now proud Kala Afghanists, Inder Ghagha being an example of this.

How can they know physics without studying it? Their academic qualifications do not go beyond matric? Most people believe that missionaries helped in writing of kala afghna books.

[Koi]

Dhan Dhan Sri Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji

Dhan Dhan Sri Dasam Guru Granth Sahib Ji

Dhan Dhan Sri Sarbloh Guru Granth Sahib Ji

[Guest Realtime Intelligence]

That looks like the Hand of CIA not the Indian intelligence agencies who do not benefit in any way by creating a rift between the Sikhs. From what is going on in India it is easy to conclude that certain powers in the US are working towards breaking, subduing and dominating India. The weakening of Sikhs helps the Christian Missionaries who have been involved in large scale conversions in Panjab.