Meditation - My Experiance, Am I Allowed To Share?

[Raju]

"Tundra".

[Sat1176]

53 minutes ago, Raju said:

"Tundra".

Huh????? Care to elaborate?

[BhagatSingh]

12 hours ago, Sat1176 said:

I'm not sure yet whether I need to spend more time in this lost awareness state or pull back a bit and try and remain conscious but with a still mind (I'm not even sure if that might be possible). It's not in ones power when they nodd off and may be a natural response to a still mind. Once I was sitting in my local gurdwara and a the guy sitting next to me, was doing bhagti during the divan. I observed the same thing happening to him. Every so often his head would begin to drop and as it fell he would slowly lift it up again only for it to happen again. Some of the other sangat sitting around him thought he was nodding off and laughing but I believe there is more to this than meets the eye.

Trying to find out more...

I think he could also have poor posture or an imbalance in the muscles. If the muscles in the back of the neck give in like that means there is too much load on those muscles.

That I can see in myself also.

So the idea is to take some of the load off the muscles in the back of your neck and use other muscles as well. Keeping a good posture naturally accomplishes this.

Going into samadhi means letting go of the attention in the body and withdrawing it. So you cannot compromise this. Strengthening, stretching neck muscles and creating balance in that region is key.

Ps which gurudwara do you go to?

[Sat1176]

7 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

I think he could also have poor posture or an imbalance in the muscles. If the muscles in the back of the neck give in like that means there is too much load on those muscles.

That I can see in myself also.

So the idea is to take some of the load off the muscles in the back of your neck and use other muscles as well. Keeping a good posture naturally accomplishes this.

Going into samadhi means letting go of the attention in the body and withdrawing it. So you cannot compromise this. Strengthening, stretching neck muscles and creating balance in that region is key.

Ps which gurudwara do you go to?

Watch this video @BhagatSingh

Swami ji says a stage will be reached where even the surti, attention will not even remain.

Quote

Simran will only go up to a point. Surti only goes up to a point. Even the awareness/surti dies. Atma does not die.

Surti should not remain. It should be used to cross the 9 rivers and then let go. Don’t expect it too remain.

Been waiting for a long time to reach this stage bro, just pray with Guru's grace it can be sustained and advanced.

Another person who actively talks of sunn is Bhai Sewa Singh Tharmala in his books. Have a read of "Forgetting the Way of Love" available in the downloads section if your interested.

[Sat1176]

5 hours ago, Sat1176 said:

Another person who actively talks of sunn is Bhai Sewa Singh Tharmala in his books. Have a read of "Forgetting the Way of Love" available in the downloads section if your interested.

Some relevant passages from the book.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji gives us the example of day and night where he tells that our mind enters this body and begins playing during the day and when our body goes to sleep at night time our mind goes home to Sunn (house of mind). Sunn is the stage in which our body is sleeping (resting) and our minds are in their subtle appearance. When our mind enters this body, we use our earthly knowledge and with our thoughts we assign good and bad qualities to others. By doing this we are foolish. We no longer see Godly qualities of others and in this way we create good and bad thoughts. By creating this discernment we think we have wisdom. And by acquiring material wealth in this world, we think that we are rich and others are poor. We build religious places like Gurdwaras, Temples, Mosques and Churches where we sing praises of God, but we do not recognize real house of Truth that is our body. Our body is the real temple, Gurdwara, Mosque or a Church. This real temple within our body is known as Hari Mandir. Truth resides in the Hari Mandir. He also lives outside our body. By not recognizing God, we start to hate others and attribute no respect for their lives and do not hesitate to behave badly.

At night when we go to sleep, our game in the visible world comes to an end. At this time, we lose our duality and forget about caste, creed, and qualities of others. During sleep, our subtle body comes to reside in the Sehaj Ghar (house of our mind). In the Sehaj Ghar we forget about the material body, our family, our home and society.

This subtle body is our real appearance and our true home. Being able to rise above duality is important so that the mind can
recognize its true home.  

When our mind is in the body, our body stays connected to our breath and we take different thoughts. But, when we sleep our body is still breathing, but we are free from our thoughts. We don’t recognize where our mind goes when we are sleeping. Guru Nanak Dev Ji taught us that the house of our mind is invisible and formless. Those that understood Guru Nanak’s teachings were able to go to their home and leave behind duality. Those minds that were able to go home were able to free themselves from entanglements and were able to achieve happiness and joy in their lives.

Our body is made up of 5 elements and these elements have relation with the body parts and senses. The relation between mind and body is made during day time and is disconnected during night time. At night the mind goes to his house known as Sunn or Agam. Sunn is also known as Sehaj Ghar. In the morning, the mind leaves Sehaj Ghar and enters the body and starts to use the body parts and senses.

divas raat du-ay daa-ee daa-i-aa khaylai sagal jagat.
Day and night are the two nurses, in whose lap all the world is at play.

First, they told us how to connect the body by controlling the pawan through the use of the Gurmantra (chanting the word). When the mind is in control it will go to its house known as Sunn. The mind stays in its home for a period of time and then returns to this world. Most of the people do not know where the house of mind is and where the mind hides.

First, we have to teach the mind through love. If the mind still does not understand , then we have to discipline it with the Gurmantra. Through the Gurmantra the mind will learn to go to Sunn. But after going to its home, the mind will cheat us again by leaving it. We cannot rely on the mind and must learn to control it so that it will hear the Anhad-Bani in the Sunn and receive the refuge of Naam. In Gurbani, we have been given the example of a snake. If you try to capture or kill a snake it escapes by entering a hole in the Earth. We would be wrong to presume the snake is dead if we cover the hole. The snake merely hides and finds a way to exit and comes back again. Like the snake, the mind goes home but keeps finding ways to escape. In this way, the mind continually cheats us by leaving Sunn. Moreover, the mind intentionally acts deaf and does not listen to Naam.

For this reason, during prayer we should try to keep the mind in the body. If the mind stays in the body we can take it to Sunn. Despite their hard work in meditation most members of the congregation cannot control the mind. Those who don’t join the congregation really have no chance of controlling their minds. The reason the mind leaves Sunn is because it takes advice from the five subordinates from Kaal thinking they are his friends. It accepts them as friends and does not want to leave them. In reality, however, they are on the opposite team of the mind. They trick the mind into wasting its precious wealth (breath) in thoughts. Our pain and suffering is caused by our thoughts. When we waste our breath, the mind is devastated. In order to keep the mind away from thoughts, we have to meditate and contemplate on the divine word of God.

We have to repeatedly try to enter the body. We can do this by connecting to the air by meditation using the Swaas Graas simran technique (meditation with every breath) followed by the Rom-Rom (meditate with every heart beat) technique. When our mind enters the air it will also enter the body. If we can keep the mind in the body then we learn about the three qualities of Maya. At this point, the mind will enter the 4th state and the 9 doors of the body will close and the 10th door will open. We must learn to love and contemplate the divine word of God because the mind has been out of control for many ages. We should spend less time talking about this world and more time contemplating the divine word of God. We must learn to contemplate the divine word during all of our activities and not just staying in thoughts.

By meditating and listening to our own voice our mind will stay away from thoughts. Once the mind is free of thoughts it will enter Sunn. With enough guided practice the mind will go to Sunn very quickly. When the mind tries to exit Sunn we must do more meditation to chase it back to its home. Typically the mind begins to dream when it goes to Sunn. However, with guided meditation we will begin to control our thoughts and not enter in dreams thereby staying awake all the time. When the mind cheats us again, we will have to follow the same techniques to search for it.

When Guru Nanak Dev Ji had a discussion with those Sidhas, he told them that you sit in the Sunn and the mind can go out of the Sunn anytime. They were connected to playing music by instruments. Guru Ji told them that their mind was cheating them. Guru Nanak taught them that they should stop listening to music from outside. They should listen to the divine word from inside and get connected to it. He further advised them they should take their mind out of the body with the divine word but not fly their bodies.

Play that harp (inside the body), Yogi, which vibrates the unstruck sound current (Anhad Shabad), and remain lovingly absorbed in God.
(SGGS 908)

Guru Nanak Dev Ji gave the divine knowledge to the Yogis. He told them how their mind cheats them. By doing simran or meditation, the mind goes to Sunn (state of sleep). Once mind goes to Sunn, our body does not move. When the mind enters this body, then our body can move and walk irrespective of its weight. When the mind leaves this body, the body cannot move or walk.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji has told us a way for devotion which is different from other ways. This has been explained in Gurbani as.

tarai gun maytay cha-uthai vartai ayhaa bhagat niraaree.
Eradicating the three qualities of maya, dwell in the fourth state. This is the unparalleled devotional worship.
(SGGS 908 )

When we go out of three qualities of Maya (by stopping thoughts), our mind goes to Sunn (house of mind). While staying in Sunn, we will listen to the divine word of God from which we were disconnected after our birth. When we connect to the divine word, our true devotion starts. It has been explained in Gurbani as.

gurmukh bhagat jit sahj Dhun upjai bin bhagtee mail na jaa-ay.
The Gurmukh practices that devotional worship, by which the celestial music wells up; (SGGS 245)

The mind functions because of the air. Once the mind gets separated from the air and goes to the 10th door also known as Sunn, (house of mind) the air has connection with only the body.

When our mind sits in the Sunn (also known as Thir Ghar, Nij- Mahal, Gagan or Sehaj Gufa) Truth will wake it up by his divine sound.

Dhun upjai sabad jagaa-i-aa.
The celestial melody of the Shabad wakes the mind up. (SGGS 1039)

Sunn Samadh Anhad Tey Naad
In the Deepest Samaadhi (Sunn), and the unstruck sound of the Naad is there. (SGGS 293)

[hsingh6]

Absolutely awesome....speechless

[Rock]

@Sat1176  You can also try using a bairagan or something as a chin-rest to prevent your head from tilting forward.

Tundra basically is like a sleep but of deeper quality. I have not personally experienced it only heard that advanced teachers can help you recognize it.

@Raju   Can you elaborate on Tundra concept ? Have you personally experienced it. Thanks.

 

 

[Sat1176]

@Rock funny you should mention Sant Baba Nand Singh ji because recall now seeing a photo him in a similar position. Looks like his head has also dropped.

[Rock]

22 minutes ago, Sat1176 said:

@Rock funny you should mention Sant Baba Nand Singh ji because recall now seeing a photo him in a similar position. Looks like his head has also dropped.

also in the following Samadhi pic Baba Ji is resting His head on Bairagan.  

 

[Sat1176]

LOL I think a bairagan is getting too hardcore. Lets just see how it goes.

[Rock]

5 hours ago, Sat1176 said:

LOL I think a bairagan is getting too hardcore. Lets just see how it goes.

Baba Sat Singh ji brings a bairagan home, spreads asana of deer skin, wear white chola & white turban and start samadhi. Whole family especially wife gets worried lol.

 

[Sat1176]

1 minute ago, Rock said:

Baba Sat Singh ji brings a bairagan home, spreads asana of deer skin, wear white chola & white turban and start samadhi. Whole family especially wife gets worried lol.

 

She was already reminding me the other day we are gristi. Lol

[Sat1176]

Today as I meditated and headed toward the same state I experienced an involuntary movement. My arm lifted up and extended out like it had experienced an electric shock.

[Sat1176]

http://www.chopra.com/ccl/whats-the-significance-of-sensations-during-meditation

Spontaneous movement of hands and head

Question: Sometimes in meditation my hands (particularly my right hand) will
rise on its own accord and begin to rotate at the wrist. I have had other sensations as well – my head will turn and feel pushed over either my right or left shoulder as
far as it can stretch. The movements feel very strong and powerful, though slow and almost methodical. I haven’t (yet) become alarmed by the movements, because they are not painful (the stretching  is almost pleasant like yoga) but they do seem to keep  me from meditating regularly. Is this something I should avoid and it is helpful for me to resume my meditation practice? If I feel these sensations coming on, should I end my meditation immediately or somehow direct my mind to “talk my body out of” these movements? What is going on? Thank you.

Deepak’s response:
As the mind settles down in meditation, the body follows it in terms of getting deeper rest, softer breathing, and lower metabolic rate. And whenever the body gets an
opportunity for profound rest, it takes that opportunity to clear away whatever old tensions and traumas there may be stored away from the past. Typically these stresses
are physically released during meditation with little perceptible movement, but sometimes, when the  conditioning or stress is imprinted more deeply, then you  may experience periods of more pronounced or exaggerated physical movement in meditation while the body is being healed.

This is perfectly normal. Just make sure that you maintain a neutral attitude throughout the process. Neither do you want to resent or be afraid of the sensations, nor do you want to indulge in them by thinking that the more it happens the better the release process is. If you glorify it in that way, you run the danger of promoting it beyond its natural need. Once the conditioning has been cleared, the movements will stop on their own.

- See more at: http://www.chopra.com/ccl/whats-the-significance-of-sensations-during-meditation#sthash.YTeSRZhh.dpuf

[hsingh6]

sat veerjee,

Bairagan is soooooooo comfortable that it is hard to describe. your back stays totally erect with little effort, the arms are relaxed and you can really really sit for long hours. dont take my word for it, just try it.

best

[HisServant]

Had a very different experience today. This was close to the end of a 2 hour Simran session

My mind got absorbed into the focus and my entire body started vibrating extremely fast and hard. It was so intense that it was like being on a roller coaster. I started hearing these very deep sounds, I think somewhat like thunder- its hard to describe. A few other sounds but I can't really describe them. 

They were getting louder and clear as the focus started to become deeper but I lost it a little while later. 

I think curiosity is a big problem for me. I start to analyze what's happening and I lose it. Should just let it happen. 

[Lucky]

On ‎4‎/‎30‎/‎2016 at 6:19 AM, HisServant said:

I think somewhat like thunder- its hard to describe.  

Sound as if an aeroplane is so close above your house and about to come into your roof?

ਗੋਬਿਦੁ ਗਾਜੈ ਸਬਦੁ ਬਾਜੈ ॥

Gobinḏ gājai sabaḏ bājai. .. 

It's as if the skies open and it thunders when Gobind(Lord of the universe reveals himself)   .... You getting close kid!...  This thundering doesn't have to happen,.... but it can happen... when you hear the Lord's voice.   Gurbani says that it Thunders and roars with the Voice of Akaal purakh and then It will rain with amrit when the message comes down to you!

You have to Note  that this is also exactly the same way that Moses heard the 10 commandments. The old testament bible gets translated as Moses climbing the Mountain(Sinai) and then experiencing the thunder and rain with the voice of God and a Hukam of 10 commandments. But I'm 100% sure that the mountain is a metaphor for the peak he climbed whilst meditating deep inside antarghat and reaching the internal peak to where he had raised his consciousness.  In reference to this, there is a similarity in sikhi from what I gather, and that is a HUKAM direct from Akaal Purakh can definitely be heard if you are lucky enough.  Next time just hold on sit tight and don't wander, just let the Mind continue listening.

 

 

 

 

 

[Sat1176]

The  Embodiment  of  the  Lord  of  the  Universe  roars  like  the  thunder-cloud.

ghan garjat gobind roop.  

Singing  His  Glorious  Praises  brings  peace  and  bliss.  Pause

gun gaavat sukh chain.  rahaa-o.  

The  Sanctuary  of  the  Lord`s  Feet  carries  us  across  the  world-ocean.  His Sublime  Word  is  the  unstruck  celestial  melody.  

har  charan  saran  taran  saagar  Dhun  anhataa  ras  bain.   

The thirsty traveller`s consciousness obtains the water of the soul from the pool of nectar.  

pathik pi-aas chit sarovar aatam jal lain.

Servant Nanak loves the Blessed Vision of the Lord; in His Mercy, God has blessed him with it.  

har daras paraym jan naanak kar kirpaa parabh dain.  

Ang 1272

[HisServant]

22 hours ago, Lucky said:

In reference to this, there is a similarity in sikhi from what I gather, and that is a HUKAM direct from Akaal Purakh can definitely be heard if you are lucky enough.  Next time just hold on sit tight and don't wander, just let the Mind continue listening.

 

 

 

 

 

I must admit one thing... I was very very scared when it was happening. Did not know what I was falling into. 

[HisServant]

Something new again today. Was doing saas saas and then the sound of waheguru in my mind automatically started matching my heartbeat for a few moments 

maybe a minute or two. Felt very pleasurable. Eventually I got caught up with what was happening and it ended. 

 

These days doing jaap silently/whispering has been very effective. I might spend a few days experimenting with this. 

[Lucky]

That's good stuff HisServant.

I think you are very ready for further development. I recommend that you spend more time doing silent and real antarghat jap.  You should either be very close or are probably already hearing some anhad.

The hardest part now is to just stay in "sehaj".  You don't want to think too much about advancing either because the mind will try and convince you. Sit calmly, be steady and have the attitude of enjoying going deeper and deeper inside yourself.

 

Just to add, - staying in sehaj is done by keeping full dhyian on Dhun(Dhun meh dhyian, dhian mai janiya.....). listening to the sound of jap. ...........Just at the beginning when you are trying to settle down, attention is put on your physical - in terms of breath, posture, balance/settling....then afterwards, take attention off these physical aspects and keep dhyian on listening to dhun and nothing physical in body. . You have to just let it all happen without looking out for it.

[Guest Kita Aaai Rees]

It is very refreshing reading all of this, as I am nothing.. just wondering  'Kita Aaai Rees' .. all the gurmukhs here ..when are they doing there abyaas in the Amrit Vela ? like 2am or 4am .. and how many hours per day or week , and how long have you been doing it for .. years / months .. how did you start .. your struggle .. 

[BhagatSingh]

On 2016-04-03 at 1:11 PM, hsingh6 said:

sat veerjee,

Bairagan is soooooooo comfortable that it is hard to describe. your back stays totally erect with little effort, the arms are relaxed and you can really really sit for long hours. dont take my word for it, just try it.

best

Notice that all the people using it in the photos are old.

You don't want to rely on support when you are still young because you are very much capable of holding your body up, which seniors can no longer do. Seniors cannot physically hold themselves up with their muscles, you can.

 

So instead we should try to perfect our posture in order to remove unnecessary stress from any muscle. And we should strengthen all core muscles so that they can hold the body up without much effort.

 

This is why under Raj Yog (the type of meditation that people here are doing) there are traditions that involve physical exercise that accompany the meditation e.g. Hatha Yog. This physical exercise strengthens and purifies the body, and makes the body a strong base for higher level meditation.

[Guest skaur]

Wahegruruji!

I am glad I found this thread and amazing people who are close to Akaalpurakh. I can learn a lot 

When I was in school, late 90s, there was rainsabhai keertan on Baba Ajit Singh,s birthday. I remember Bhai Sadhu Singh, Dehradoon wale doing keertan and naam jaap.

That was the first time I had an amazing experience. For about 10 minutes I could not feel anyone around me (there was sangat in 100s) and I could not even feel the ground. I felt as I was in air with no one around me just Sadhu Singh ji reciting name of Akaal purakh!!

It is a moment when you in so much love with Waheguru that he embraces you and no one else remains!

[Sat1176]

Interesting explanation on Shunya/Sunn by Yogi Amandeep Singh.