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Shastar Puja In The Marine Corps


Kaljug
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bit strange someone who would argue so much that sikhee has nothing in common with muslim world would make direct connection between nihang rehit and american marines - renouned for their elevated spiritual and martial traditions LoL

just messing bruv biggrin.gif

Edited by Parchand
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Saying 'west' is hugely stereotyping. There are still many traditional combat systems in the west that have serious respect for their arts and tools, the US Army simply isn't one of them. People get confused with US military success, it clearly has more to do with their military budgets/capital investments than their soldiers, which is proven by the amount of wars they have lost (are loosing) and wiped under the carpet.

I do however know a White American practitioner of traditional Filipino arts who is an ex-Marine, who does worship his blades, I am not sure where he has picked up this ritual from, but will be sure to ask, I expect it must come from the Muslim Kali lineage he has learnt from, but this ritual practice has evaded me so far. I know the Moros/Indonesians/Malays believe that spirits exist in their swords...

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Most of the old school Gora FMA Grandmasters are ex military, SAS, Marines and Special Forces who were based in Philipines, Malaisia etc during conflicts. There is shastarpooja within FMA circles also, where they "cleanse" the weapon before making it their own, through ritual worship, training, sharpening and polishing the blades, and also they carry different types of taveets and talismans for protection.

Edited by Maha Singh
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Most of the old school Gora FMA Grandmasters are ex military, SAS, Marines and Special Forces who were based in Philipines, Malaisia etc during conflicts. There is shastarpooja within FMA circles also, where they "cleanse" the weapon before making it their own, through ritual worship, training, sharpening and polishing the blades, and also they carry different types of taveets and talismans for protection.

That is interesting stuff. I think that some form of Shastar puja do exist in all cultures. But ever since the industrial age started the concept of Shastar puja is greatly decreased.

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The fact that it takes a lifetime of training to become the ultimate swordsman, the finesse and expression, accuracy of movement, appreciation of timing and angles makes it the hardest but highest form of combat, this appreciation made warriors worship their weapons because they would spend so much time with them in order to master them, providing a natural form of pooja where the sword is revered and worshipped. A gun on the other hand is not a high skill to use, training through repetition of aiming and shooting will quickly let you get kills and so it isnt hard to become a competant marksman.

Its not so much the industrial age, when people stopped training in swordsmanship, their pooja to their weapons will also stop. Go to any real sword school, and you will find they all do some form of pooja to their weapons.

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  • 2 weeks later...

The fact that it takes a lifetime of training to become the ultimate swordsman, the finesse and expression, accuracy of movement, appreciation of timing and angles makes it the hardest but highest form of combat, this appreciation made warriors worship their weapons because they would spend so much time with them in order to master them, providing a natural form of pooja where the sword is revered and worshipped. A gun on the other hand is not a high skill to use, training through repetition of aiming and shooting will quickly let you get kills and so it isnt hard to become a competant marksman.

Looking at imagery of modern warfare on TV, it may not seem it. But shooting a rifle does take a lot of training and knowlege. Just as it is easy to swing a sword a kill someone; but to do it with skill takes practice and experience. Using any gun is exactly the same. You need to judge distance, wind speed and direction, elevation, whether the target is moving or not.

As for the shootist he needs to calm his breathing, get his posture/stance correct, align his body to the target and above all relax. All this in the heat of a battle.

I was talking to a USMC chap who had taught snipers at Mountain Warfare School in US once and he he told me that during competitions when firing down a range at distances of upto 1000m. A competent shooter will take 10 mins to prepare his mind and body BEFORE he even gets down to pick up his rifle! Once in position he will again take the same amount of time to build up his position and settle down - thats 20 mins to take a shot. The result is that they will get groupings literally couple of centremeters apart. Of course this will not necessarily work in combat, unless the shootist is a sniper or marksman because of the differing formats of combat, but the skill level is there.

You'd be suprised at the number of world class shootists (both soldiers and competitors) who practice yoga and meditation to help them.

Also you need to remember that soldiers train to survive, knowing that they will depend on their skills whereas martial artists - no matter how battle-orientated their art is - practice only to preserve knowledge and increase thier own personal skill levels, knowing that they may never use their knowledge in anger.

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The fact that it takes a lifetime of training to become the ultimate swordsman, the finesse and expression, accuracy of movement, appreciation of timing and angles makes it the hardest but highest form of combat, this appreciation made warriors worship their weapons because they would spend so much time with them in order to master them, providing a natural form of pooja where the sword is revered and worshipped. A gun on the other hand is not a high skill to use, training through repetition of aiming and shooting will quickly let you get kills and so it isnt hard to become a competant marksman.

Looking at imagery of modern warfare on TV, it may not seem it. But shooting a rifle does take a lot of training and knowlege. Just as it is easy to swing a sword a kill someone; but to do it with skill takes practice and experience. Using any gun is exactly the same. You need to judge distance, wind speed and direction, elevation, whether the target is moving or not.

As for the shootist he needs to calm his breathing, get his posture/stance correct, align his body to the target and above all relax. All this in the heat of a battle.

I was talking to a USMC chap who had taught snipers at Mountain Warfare School in US once and he he told me that during competitions when firing down a range at distances of upto 1000m. A competent shooter will take 10 mins to prepare his mind and body BEFORE he even gets down to pick up his rifle! Once in position he will again take the same amount of time to build up his position and settle down - thats 20 mins to take a shot. The result is that they will get groupings literally couple of centremeters apart. Of course this will not necessarily work in combat, unless the shootist is a sniper or marksman because of the differing formats of combat, but the skill level is there.

You'd be suprised at the number of world class shootists (both soldiers and competitors) who practice yoga and meditation to help them.

Also you need to remember that soldiers train to survive, knowing that they will depend on their skills whereas martial artists - no matter how battle-orientated their art is - practice only to preserve knowledge and increase thier own personal skill levels, knowing that they may never use their knowledge in anger.

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Good post Jattboot.

Adding to what you have said and Maha Singhs post, historically, archery is seen to be the apex combat art, in all martial cultures, but namely Japanese, Chinese and Indian - the medieval (and earlier) martial texts attest to this. No other martial art takes as much time, skill, resource to develop a highly skilled practioner. There are whole manuals written in all 3 traditions about the exercise, mental and spiritual develpment needed to be a supreme archer. Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself was most famed as an archer.

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My point was not that marksmanship doesnt have higher levels of skill, all forms of arts can be taken to whatever degree you wish, whether it be music, painting, dancing, fighting etc. My point was that after a small amount of training (6 months - 1 yr) a person can become competent in killing with a gun, whereas a sword takes longer to master because of the expression behind the art, body shifting, footwork, balance and co-ordination. Not taking anything away from the top marksmen at all, I can appreciate how much effort they put into their training.

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