Genie Singh Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 (edited) When we say nirvair in moolmantar we take this into ourself to be without hate. But what does that actually mean? Can we truly be without hate? Do we need to hate evil? What is evil? Is God truly without hate? If God didn't hate anyone why would he strike people down, why do we suffer in paap? If God hates no one why do people go to hell? If God doesn't hate anyone why is it that we have to learn and live Sikhi rather then it being instinctive like an animal such a spider can make a web? Some view that with that you hate what is evil and love what is good what is good and what is evil is subjected to a person when we try move past what is hate for evil for love for everything it is a big transition Can we Love evil? No? why not? if you want to be past not having hate.. then you move into the domain of love entirely However, Love is pure and divine life flowing out the heart. "loving" evil is a mental illness and a desire by ego! It's a desire that the ego manifests into your mind! It's an illusion. How about the perception that only we are good and everyone else is bad? But can't we say It's a false perception! EVERYONE is good and pure. It's the ego that puts evil thoughts in their minds that puts a cloud over the purity of their hearts. Edited February 25, 2012 by JatherdarSahib 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted February 29, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 Would you agree with "Love the sinner and hate the sin"? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
das Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 What is the source of Vair (Enemity/Hate) OR say why do we have hate anyone (good or evil)? HE is Nirvair (without hate) and we too are without hate IFF we kill our ego. Man minus ego is GOD. We hate because he think ourself different than the other but in reality we all are one. e.g Does our hand thinks that why should I give my hard-earning to other parts of body in other words he is selfish? If it thinks that way, our body will not be able to function as expected. Same way we suffer because we are selfish. We suffer because of our mind and its modification which in turn is dependent upon karmas. We suffer because we think ourselves different from the other subject and here lies the problem. We all (good and evil) are one. We could be (infact we are) creator of our own destiny if you know your mind and its modifications. If we don't want to study mind, karmas etc. then the simplest rule for happeniess is: Accept whatever God has for you and do your duty in unselfish way and skillfully. Pain is not in the objects, pain is when we attach ourself with the objects/persons etc. i.e Moh/Attachment. GOD has not asked us to develop Moh, HE has given us things for our better journey but we attach ourselves with objects so much and then suffer. e.g We go to a journey via train - during our journey we meet several people and develop love for some, and during we got very good luxury sleeper to travel. But when our destination arrives, we have to leave train and its luxuries and also have to leave people that we met. It is not possible to take sleeper and/or people with you once your destination is there. It is foolishness to attach/moh ourselves with the objects or people during the journey. Who is to blame here if we develop Moh/Attachment with the objects during the journey. God? No, it is us who developed attachments and there lies the cause of our suffering. e.g We don't feel actual pain if we're not attached to the subject. e.g We feel pain when some near one goes away from this world; but at the same time we feel happy when we kill germs of our body. So, basically, the pain/suffering are not with objects, it is with attachments. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Let us use the example of within rehat such as drinking sharab. Can we hate sharab? Should we hate sharabis? Can we Love Sharab? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
das Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) It depends upon the way you look at Sharab as well as Sharabi. Ideally, everything is GOD; HE is in everything including sharab and sharabi. We call sharab as bad because it cloudes our Bhuddi. Who forces us to do take sharab? Our Mind loves or hate sharab because of its previous habits (in this birth and in previous births). So, bottom line is it is Mind which loves or hate sharab. Now, would you love or hate your mind? Ideally, when our birthi is one with God, then there is no difference between paap and pun; sharab and good; good and bad. BUT untill our birthi is not that good, in other words, until we cannot see God in everthing, it is required to avoid anything (including sharab) that distrupts our spiritual journey. And in order to avoid such things, we've to train our Mind to avoid certain tendencies (like taking sharab), we've to tell our mind that sharab is not good for me. Now, if you call it "Hate sharab" then it is your way of training your mind to avoid such things. Once we are with God, then everything becomes God and when there is only ONE then whom to love and/or hate. Edited March 2, 2012 by das 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) That depends on our understanding of omnipresence. However with the mind there is more then 1 word for it budhi, man, mat, 3 huts. Intellect, minds desires, minds directive intellect. How about our memory, our processing in our mind and the structures of it from psychological, biological and physiological understanding of mind which we understand in philisophy that apply to our psychology. So in the immediate understanding of bad can we love bad? Aval allah noor upay kudrat ke sabh bande, ek noor te sabh jag upjay ... later on it says who is good and who is bad can we love that evil or bad? Can we Love Hitler? Can we love Auranzgeb? Can we love mir mannu? Can we love Ahmed shah abdalli? Edited March 2, 2012 by JatherdarSahib 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
das Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Would you love gold braclet and hate gold chain or vice-versa? Some would love chain but hate braclet or the opposite. But the wise person doesn't care because he knows that it is the gold in both the cases and it is just a matter of different shape and both could be redesigned to bracket or chain. In limited sense yes we would have to hate the things that lie in your spiritual way. Is this what you wanted to hear? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Not quite something I am looking to hear however I am looking to expand this. Can a spiritual person really choose some things come to them. Wouldn't they accept hukam and take it as it is? Or do we understand people are on different states perhaps which effects choices and reflected decisions plus mindstates. I wonder perhaps in Guru Gobind Singh's time did all the Sikhs hate aurangzeb for what he did and hate him as a person, did the hatred cloud the simran how did they detatch themselves would it be a paap to hate or wish death on auranzgzeb? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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