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Saachkhand/Jesus


SinghMunda
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Before saying anything, i would just like to say i haven't got the exact source, and am not entirely sure, but i've been told that my dad read a book, not sure who by, whether it's in english or punjabi, that said something about jesus not being good enough for Saachkhand, and that he's standing outside Saachkhand while Guru Nanak is in Saachkhand. I'll try to find the source if i can. but in the meantime i just wanted to know if anyone else has heard about this, and what people's opinions are. Saachkhand is supposed to be much better than heaven isn't it.

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jesus is definately not in saachkhand. he never did any meditation etc. therefore he could not have found then naam. i heard somewhere that jesus asked for the secret of naam off baba harnam singh.

What gives you certificate to bash other prophets???

All the prophets is one jot of vahegurooo....we are alll also one jot of vahegurooo... but those were realized ones and we are not.

------

moderator note: watch ur language neo :P

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um......was mohammed a prophet? most people would say yes.

i would diss him because he married a 6 year old child (ayesha) and murdered a PREGNANT woman because she made poetic verses that competed with him. he pillaged villages and encouraged a "them vs us" attitude. guru gobind singh says in bachittar natak that he was sent by god and was given all of arabia, but his own ego and filth took over and "set up a cult".

im not dissing jesus, im just saying why would he go to saachkhand if he hadnt obtained the naam? when he visited baba harnam singh he said "it is my request that all my followers join your panth"

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SSA

well whatever book your dad was reading should be doing good sales, thats only thing that i can understand other than that the author himself seems to be a confused personality.

nothing of that sort comes from guru granth sahib and if we can dream of going to sachkhand than comparing jesus with ourselves , there isnt really a comparison.

when you see life of jesus and other prophets they would be better sikhs than us.

they are above relgn , they dont need to do naam simran ritual because their whole life is reflection of god and they always remember god's name.

i cant see a point in making such comparisons ...

wjkk wjkf

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im not dissing jesus, im just saying why would he go to saachkhand if he hadnt obtained the naam? when he visited baba harnam singh he said "it is my request that all my followers join your panth"

I m not talkin about mohmaad but jesus here..

so can you tell the sangat where did u found the parallel between harnaam singh ji and jesus???? :?

any sources to back it up???

tell us more about it...

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baba harnam singhs book se kinehiya i think.

naam simran isnt a ritual, there are plenty of "pious" people who are calm, chilled, genereous etc but they still havent got the gift of naam. gurbani says when one obtains naam THEN they get mukti....where did jesus get naam from?

im not comparing us to jesus, as a person he was much better a person than i am. but he just didnt have a spiritual level. in general semetic religions are spiritually devoid (no offence to any xtians reading this).

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N30Singh: You need to control your anger. Humbleness is the key to become good sikh. We need to help our sikh brother and sisters through this site.

Let's get to the point of this discussion now.

It's in baba Harnam Singh's book 'Se Kanehaa?' - Life story of Baba Harnam Singh if im not mistaken and khalsa soulja is not wrong.

Source: http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Dunes/...ature/BHSJ.html

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Also read what Guru Granth sahib ji telling their sikhs:

SGGS Page 470

One who stubbornly follows his own mind shall suffer in the world hereafter. || 12 || SHALOK, FIRST MEHL: O Nanak, the soul of the body has one chariot and one charioteer. In age after age they change; the spiritually wise understand this. In the Golden Age of Sat Yuga, contentment was the chariot and righteousness the charioteer. In the Silver Age of Traytaa Yuga, celibacy was the chariot and power the charioteer. In the Brass Age of Dwaapar Yuga, penance was the chariot and truth the charioteer. In the Iron Age of Kali Yuga, fire is the chariot and falsehood the charioteer. || 1 || FIRST MEHL: The Sama Veda says that the Lord Master is robed in white; in the Age of Truth, everyone desired Truth, abided in Truth, and was merged in the Truth. The Rig Veda says that God is permeating and pervading everywhere; among the deities, the Lord's Name is the most exalted. Chanting the Name, sins depart; O Nanak, then, one obtains salvation. In the Jujar Veda, Kaan Krishna of the Yaadva tribe seduced Chandraavali by force. He brought the Elysian Tree for his milk-maid, and revelled in Brindaaban. In the Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Atharva Veda became prominent; Allah became the Name of God. Men began to wear blue robes and garments; Turks and Pat'haans assumed power. The four Vedas each claim to be true. Reading and studying them, four doctrines are found. With loving devotional worship, abiding in humility, O Nanak, salvation is attained. || 2 || PAUREE: I am a sacrifice to the True Guru; meeting Him, I have come to cherish the Lord Master. He has taught me and given me the healing ointment of spiritual wisdom, and with these eyes, I behold the world. Those dealers who abandon their Lord and Master and attach themselves to another, are drowned. The True Guru is the boat, but few are those who realize this. Granting His Grace, He carries them across. || 13 || SHALOK, FIRST MEHL: The simmal tree is straight as an arrow; it is very tall, and very thick. But those birds which visit it hopefully, depart disappointed. Its fruits are tasteless, its flowers are nauseating, and its leaves are useless. Sweetness and humility, O Nanak, are the essence of virtue and goodness. Everyone bows down to himself; no one bows down to another. When something is placed on the balancing scale and weighed, the side which descends is heavier. The sinner, like the deer hunter, bows down twice as much. But what can be achieved by bowing the head, when the heart is impure? || 1 || FIRST MEHL: You read your books and say your prayers, and then engage in debate; you worship stones and sit like a stork, pretending to be in Samaadhi. With your mouth you utter falsehood, and you adorn yourself with precious decorations; you recite the three lines of the Gayatri three times a day. Around your neck is a rosary, and on your forehead is a sacred mark; upon your head is a turban, and you wear two loin cloths. If you knew the nature of God, you would know that all of these beliefs and rituals are in vain. Says Nanak, meditate with deep faith; without the True Guru, no one finds the Way. || 2 || PAUREE: Abandoning the world of beauty, and beautiful clothes, one must depart. He obtains the rewards of his good and bad deeds.

Message of God changes with the time but still its not absurd.....

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For those of you who are interested in the Truth about the figure and story of Jesus should check out the following site:

http://www.medmalexperts.com/POCM/index_FLASH.html

I have looked into the figure of Jesus and his story and have come to the conclusion that he never actually existed.Check out the website and you will see that there many mythologies of godmen who were born of virgins and who died and then were ressurected.Here is an example, 500 years before the Jesus story, the story of the mythical Attis:

Attis was born of the Virgin Nana on December 25th. He was both the Father and the Divine Son.

Attis' worshipers at a sacramental meal of bread and wine. The wine represented the God's blood; the bread became the body of the savoir.

They were baptized in this way: a bull was placed over a grating, the devotee stood under the grating. The bull was stabbed with a consecrated spear. "It's hot reeking blood poured in torrents through the apertures and was received with devout eagerness by the worshiper...who had been born again to eternal life and had washed away his sins in the blood of the bull." [for more see Frazer, Attis, chapter 1]

Called "the Good Sheppard," the "Most High God," the "Only Begotten Son" and "Savior."

[in Rome the new birth and the remission of sins by shedding of bull's blood took place on what is now Vatican Hill, in our days the site of the great basilica of St. Peter's]

The Festival of Joy -- the celebration of Attis' death and rebirth

On March 22 a pine tree was brought to the sanctuary of Cybele, on it hung the effigy of Attis. The God was dead.Two days of mourning followed.

On the eve of the third day, March 25th, the worshippers turned to joy.

The above taken from http://www.medmalexperts.com/POCM/pagan_christs_attis.html

Check the site out, you'll be amazed.Also I recommend typing PAGAN CHRISTS into a search engine and see what you find.Remember, our Satguru weren't mythical miracle-makers.Sat Sri Akal. :D

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From that above link here is some interesting stuff--

Darshan

I was reading a in Se Kanehaa last night about Baba Harnam Singh having darshan of Jesus,

Mohammed and Priggu (I'm not sure I've got this last name correct, but he was some Rishi/Muni/Yogi) while in samadhi.

These were their comments:

Mohammed:

Guru Nanak has achieved what no one else could achieve in this world,

but the Sikhs are not taking advantage of this great achievement.

Rishi/Muni/Yogi:

Our Panthh is wrapped up in Jap Thap an continues to attain spritual

powers but we have never attained Amrit Ras which is what Guru Nanak

gave to the Sikhs

Jesus:

My only wish is that all my Panth go and follow Guru Nanak's

teachings.

Khalsa Soulja- I appolized the harsh words towards you but you should always provide refrence.

Thanks for forgiving me :oops:

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Sat Sri Akal:

Perhaps before making that comment about Jesus not being able to get into SachhKhand, one should read the words of Jesus himself. They can be found in the New Testament in the Four Gospels. Through those scattered quotes, one can figure out that Jesus was a very spiritually enlightened person.

And just because some person puts a quote in a book or website does not make it an irrefutable fact. Perhaps one should probe the author of the book (if still alive) to provide references to his material?

Finally, unless anyone here is a Brahm-Gyani and has visited SachhKhand and done a head count of who is there, do not make such assertions.

I am not a Champion of Christianity or anything. But I do hope that people will not engage in judging Saints and enlightened beings (or at least until we ourselves become equally enlightened) when it is based on one person's writing.

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I am not a Champion of Christianity or anything. But I do hope that people will not engage in judging Saints and enlightened beings (or at least until we ourselves become equally enlightened) when it is based on one person's writing.

very well said veer ji. :D

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Sat Sri Akal:

Perhaps before making that comment about Jesus not being able to get into SachhKhand, one should read the words of Jesus himself. They can be found in the New Testament in the Four Gospels. Through those scattered quotes, one can figure out that Jesus was a very spiritually enlightened person.

Here is "New Testament in the Four Gospels".

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_ntb1.htm

Note: We need to be aware of this that the ones call every saint on this earth Bram-Gyani never visited Sach Khand either. Internet is medium to express yourself in well manners. This site has been started to clear misunderstanding from the youth's mind not to stop them from clearing them. If they will ask questions then they will have the chance to learn from intelligent members of this site. Please, don't just throw everything under "slander" container and take away their chance to learn from members of this site.

** Let's help them by anwsering each question they have with our research and knowledge **

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Sat Sri Akal:

If my words felt harsh, I apologize. They were not meant to be.

Not at all and I appreciate your humbleness in every post you make but like I said we need to clear things for them otherwise they won't be able to make their mind. Also, this is youth site so questions can be naive but anwser will resolve their issues...:)

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Guest Javanmard

I have rarely found such a huge amount of idiocy, slander and blasphemy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :evil: :evil: :evil:

KhalsaSoulja your blasphemy will be punished and if there's someone who definetly will not get to sachkand for the next couple of centuries: it's you.

Jesus and Prophet Muhammad came from Akal Purakh and they returned to Akal Purakh. Your blasphemy against them is unpardonableMay the curse of God be on those who slander His saints and prophets!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gur bar akaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllll

Moderator's Note: Post edited due to slandering

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LOL

bachittar natak says that mohammed set up a CULT.....i would define cultish behaviour as marrying and consumating a marriage with a 9 year old, killing pregnant poets who opposed him (mentioned in the hadith) and taking concubines and looting villages and also rather cultish.....just like the hindu gods, mohammed begun pure (celibate, god-centred) and as soon as he got a taste of power degenerated into ego! im not dissing muslims here, but just compare quranic passages written early on and later when he had alot of power.

i think ill trust guru gobind singh ji on this one

whenever akal purakh sent someone down they were later infested with EGO its said quite explicitly really, just after the apnee katha section

tell me, how could jesus go to heaven if he never received the naam? if he did why didnt he show others how to get it? without meditation there is no salvation.

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