Guest Javanmard Posted July 31, 2003 Report Share Posted July 31, 2003 How valid do you think SGPC maryada is? Do you think it is validated or do you think it has no value at all? Do you follow other maryadas? If yes , why? Moderator's Note: Posts made to this thread have been deleted as they were not of any relevance to the topic, please stick to the topic. Thanks 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niranjana Posted October 19, 2003 Report Share Posted October 19, 2003 Jathedar Ji!!! Gur Fateh and congratulations on your appointment! The SGPC maryada is essentially a pick and mix of selected historical texts and references as per the discussions that followed the meeting and conventions held during the 1920's and 1930's. Please see the following link: http://www.sgpc.net/sikhism/introduction.asp How valid it is can be determined by its acceptance in the Panth, which if we view in conjunction with the existence of other Rehit Maryadas (Taksal, AKJ, Nishkam Sevak Jatha and so on)...however, the view that 'All of the people can't be wrong' is not something I share... ...access to all puratan maryadas is not easily available and what is available is often misquoted and/or distorted...this is something we need to look into as there do appear to many holes within the existing maryadas given the opposition each of them face from opposing maryadas and from institution... ...of coure, this could simply be seen as Man-Matt and the impact of Kaliyug...but is Gurmat following the SGPC, Taksal, AKJ or whatever...or is Gurmat following the Sri Guru? Forgive any foolish comments in the foregoing, I would be interested to hear the forum's view on Lalleshvari's questions and on my closing comments... SAT SRI AKAAAL! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihang Gargaj Singh Posted October 20, 2003 Report Share Posted October 20, 2003 SGPC MARYADA?!!!!?????!!!??....its not fit to bear the name maryada :twisted: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hari Posted October 20, 2003 Report Share Posted October 20, 2003 My mother does not like SGPC, she tells me they are anti-Sikh.If my mother says so, it must be true 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 SGPC MARYADA?!!!!?????!!!??....its not fit to bear the name maryada :twisted: Be constructive Bhaji. Let's not have statements without facts to back them up but discussion. Why do you believe that the Panth Pranvit Maryada is not worthy to be called a maryada ?. Which maryada is fit to be called thus and why ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 hari wrote My mother does not like SGPC, she tells me they are anti-Sikh.If my mother says so, it must be true Paradise lies at the feet of mothers: hadith of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr §ingh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 hari wrote Paradise lies at the feet of mothers: hadith of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) Hadith? God made earth like a carpet spread out…20:53 http://humanists.net/avijit/article/flat_earth_kasem.htm 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 what's your point :roll: :roll: :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 I think Bhaji was trying to illustrate that the Quran is hardly infallible. Gurfateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 well shall we initiate a new thread then :wink: . Is bhaji a scholar of Arabic and Islamology? :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 No, but as you consider yourself as one, why don't you enlighten us as to why the Quran is infallible? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 I never said I was a scholar of Arabic. I am a Sanskritist though I have followed some classes on classical Arabic grammar and have studied Islamic hermeneutics (mostly SHi'a and Sufi) my point is: Why discuss the validity of a sacred text if: 1. most people on this forum have not read it 2. have not studied Islamic exegesis (irfan) 3. are not used to dialectic discourse I only quoted the hadith because I found it beautiful. question: would you appreciate if the Sunni next door started questionning gurbani using his own logic. you're still a sweety pie :wink: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihang Gargaj Singh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 Can any of the people who have posted actually define the owrd maryada? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 there you go pyaara NIhang fresh from the dictionary: maryada (p. 1027) S mryAdA maryada, vulg. marjada, s.f. Limit, boundary, border, verge, frontier, bounds, confines; landmark, end, termination, terminus; -- the bounds or restraint of law, rule, or established usage; social code; custom; -- keeping within proper limits, propriety of conduct, decorum, decency, orderliness or guardedness of deportment, steadiness, straightforwardness, rectitude; reverential or respectful demeanour; respect, reputation, rank, station, dignity, honour: -- maryad-wan, adj. & s.m. (f. -vati), Observant of bounds or of propriety of conduct; observing the bounds of law or custom, &c.; -- respectful, of deferential or modest deportment; -- respectable, estimable, aristocratic, honourable, dignified. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gupt Singh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 the maryada does have holes in it, but i wouldnt say its a total mess. id like to see you do any better there are a few points of contention but other than that, considering how long the maryada is, i would say they didnt do too bad a job. before the 1900s everything was a mess so it did a job in unifying the panth to an extent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 well the only problem with that maryada is that it is a neo-SIkh copy of the 39 articles of the Church of England. compare the styles and contents... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 well the only problem with that maryada is that it is a neo-SIkh copy of the 39 articles of the Church of England. compare the styles and contents... Lallesvari There you go again. More hot air. Have fun. GurFateh Bikramjit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Javanmard Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 Some people like being slaves and sheep and follow rules blindly: SGPC is ideal for them.... other people have decided to go beyond... the rahit runs through their veins like a dynamic principle...they have destroyed the idol of mental slavery and are truly free to see things as they really are: Divine! They embrace pleasure, pain, joy, sorrow as doors to the Divine Some people have the maturity to live without slave rules others don't... :twisted: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 21, 2003 Report Share Posted October 21, 2003 Some people like being slaves and sheep and follow rules blindly: SGPC is ideal for them.... other people have decided to go beyond... the rahit runs through their veins like a dynamic principle...they have destroyed the idol of mental slavery and are truly free to see things as they really are: Divine! They embrace pleasure, pain, joy, sorrow as doors to the Divine Some people have the maturity to live without slave rules others don't... :twisted: Hot air. Lallesvari you don't need to get to a sauna, you can just sit in a room and repeat out aloud the stuff your post on here. Instant Sauna. Another confusing statement from our resident hippy Lallesvari. So the Rehat runs through your veins, how so since you weren't even born a Sikh and I doubt you could be classified as a Sikh under whatever Rehat you chose to follow. How is the SGPC Rehat slave rules and the Rehat, if any you follow a non-slavish one ?? Look at the list of the Sikh scholars who sifted through the various Rehat Namas to come up with the Panth Pranvit Reaht Maryada. The list is available at the link provided by Niranjana http://www.sgpc.net/sikhism/introduction.asp Compared to the knowledge of these scholars both you and I are but worms. GurFateh Bikramjit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narsingha Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Maryada...briefly... "mar" = death, the ultimate truth, Kaal, Akaal... "yaad" = to remember, recall, introspection, delve deeper maryada = contemplation of death, hence that which defines the way we live in order to acheive a great death ..that which defines the way in which we live our life. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: From Nihang Baba Udey Singh, present secretary of the Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa Budha Dal, and nephew of 96 Crori Akali Nihang Baba Santa Singh Ji, present jathedar (commander in chief) of the Panjvah Takht Shromani Panth Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa 96 Crori Budha Dal Chalda Vaheer: 'There was only ever one Panth [budha Dal]. Now, every one of the fragmentations claims to be the Panth. The Panth has always been one. Its form is one. Its work has always been the same; spreading dharam, fighting tyranny. Not for empires, states or governments. We do not want seats from Congress or the [s.G.P.C.] Akalis. It is a false Panth of tickets. You have to buy your way in. We do not recognise this S.G.P.C. Panth - we only recognise the Panth which has stayed with the ancient traditions.' (Udey Singh, transcript of a recording, 8-12-1995) source: http://www.sarbloh.info/htmls/sikh_akali17.html From Nihang Baba Ram Singh, Sanatan Sikh Shastar Vidiya Gurdev and Ayurved Master of the Akali Nihang Singh Khalsa Budha Dal: 'Their [the S.G.P.C.'s] aim is to be acknowledged as the supreme power meaning we are the Panth [sikh nation]. You [referring to the S.G.P.C.] cannot be Panth as your birth is of 1922. Sikhism [Khalsa] has been installed by the Guru for over three hundred years. Before this, Siri Hargobind Sahib and Baba Budha Ji have installed Budha Dal [as custodians of Sikhism]. You [s.G.P.C.] created by the British in 1922, how can you be the Panth? You can not be the Panth because Panth has some principles.' (Baba Ram Singh Nihang, transcript of a recording, 16-4-98) source: http://www.sarbloh.info/htmls/sikh_akali19.html Therefore, historically, S.G.P.C. has NO authority within Sikhi as defined by the Gurus, logically, S.G.P.C. maryada has NO stance (unless u happen to be a follower of British Raj-nurtured Sikhi) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidak Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 'There was only ever one Panth [budha Dal] ... Its work has always been the same; spreading dharam, fighting tyranny. Not for empires, states or governments. Narsingha, Talk is cheap - In the Panjab there are a number of individuals such as Piara Bhaniara and Ashootush NoorMehlia who have PUBLICLY burnt copies of the Guru Granth Sahib in a number of villages. Where are the Nihangs to fight this gross display of dishonour to the Guru Granth Sahib ? Or perhaps they don't mind, unless it happens to "Dasam Guru Darbar" or "Sarbloh Guru Darbar" ? It seems as though the Budha Dal in Panjab have exchanged their sarbloh karrey for "kach dian bangaan". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidak Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Its work has always been the same; spreading dharam, fighting tyranny. Not for empires, states or governments. Narsingha, Could you also explain the comment above in light of the following by Guru Gobind Singh, specifcally the nihang concept of "Raj" - does the Budhaa Dal believe that this Raj has been achieved ? "Tabh in bhinoh Gareeb navaj Shashtren keh adeehn heh raj Raj binah neh dharma chaleh heh Dharam binah sabh dhaleh maleh heh" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narsingha Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Stick to the issue sidak...SGPC Maryada.. sidak, try to avoid playing your usual broken record of Nihang bashing on the internet... Khalistanis will have u believe "Raj" within that couplet refers to "physical kingdoms", lands to rule over, countries, etc. Twisting meanings taken out of context to fit their own desires....manmat! If "Raj" in that couplet was, as Khalistanis claim, referring to "physical lands", etc, then, Guru maharaj would not have stated elsewhere within Gurbani that it is not the desire of a Sikh to seek "Raj" or "Mukti" (in this context, referring to "Raj" in the sense of "physical kingdoms", "rule", etc) You may wish to refer to someone who has had correct santhia from a traceable lineage of Gurdevs... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidak Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Stick to the issue sidak...SGPC Maryada.. sidak, try to avoid playing your usual broken record of Nihang bashing on the internet... Narsingha, Why don't you just answer the question instead of running around in circles. The issue I raised is equally as relavant - specifically, the role of the Budha Dal Nihangs in current day panjab in light of the public dishonouring of the Guru Granth Sahib. If you cant answer it in this thread, then start another one and do so there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narsingha Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 :roll: Throwing mud usually means some of it tends to stick to you too...mudwrestle with people who can indulge your fantasies :wink: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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