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Jagmeet Singh needs to be made Tankhaiya For his Letter asking for Weapons Ban


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16 hours ago, paapiman said:

That applies to your thinking too.

One cannot project his own mentality (warrior spirit in this case) on the whole community. If you do so, you are being selfish and just thinking from your own perspective, while ignoring what is best for the community.

As I have already mentioned, Daas loves weapons. If I lived in US (depending on the state laws), I would keep some on me and some in my vehicle for self-defense and the protection of the needy. But, if I expect all other Sikhs (based on our current situation) to behave in a similar fashion, I am just being plainly stupid.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

 

I think the anti-gun people's fear is blinding them. 

This is bigger than any one country. Ultimately we need to be aiming for the creation of a proficient force that is capable of independently helping/protecting our community on a global level. Being able to  conduct rapid rescue missions for trapped apnay anywhere in the world for example.

This will take time to develop (I'm talking a few generations at least). That's how we want to be thinking. Other communities have just this - look at Jews, Anglos etc.  It's pathetic that certain apnay have started sh1teing themselves at the very initial stage of this endeavour. In an increasingly unstable world, we want to be thinking like this. Who knows when we and/or our loved ones might very well be in need to such a thing?

Some fools are talking about starting some arms race - what these clowns haven't fathomed is that there is already an arms race going on in this respect - it's just that docile Sikhs have been brainwashed into not even contemplating competing in this in a cowardly, unengaged fashion. Shame on them. 

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Do you want handguns and rifles to fall into the hands of criminals, racists, terrorists, robbers, psychopaths, pedophiles, rapists, etc? You do realize that Canada is not a Sikh theocracy right?

Daas loves Shastars (old or modern), but I am against Shastars falling into the wrong hands. I live in Canada (not in a Sikh theocracy). We are a tiny "visible" minority in Canada. If weapons are lega

There is a huge difference between bravery/courage (lack of fear) and irrational behaviour   Bhul chuk maaf

Fantastic - so you regard people that disagree with you as fools, clowns, docile, fearful and shitting themselves??? How do we even further this conversation if this is the low level you wanna debate at ? 

By the way - now that you are amongst the brave, tough and non-brainwashed Sikhs who has seen the real dangers out there  - what are you planning to do in concrete matters for the panth to create such a proficient force ? And in terms of being shastardhari I take it that you are proficient in weaponry use ? Or are you just sittin on the side criticising everyone else but at the end of the day being as useless as you criticise every one else of being ? 

Edited by amardeep
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6 hours ago, amardeep said:

Fantastic - so you regard people that disagree with you as fools, clowns, docile, fearful and shitting themselves???

No not everyone, but certainly you. 

What the f**k do you know. 

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1 hour ago, dalsingh101 said:

No not everyone, but certainly you. 

What the f**k do you know. 

Well apparently not as much as you.

But would still be interesting to hear if you use all your profound knowledge and insigts on how the world is actually working, - you are not brainwashed after all - into doing something usefull for the panth. Or are you just as useless as the rest of us.

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On 9/1/2018 at 1:43 PM, amardeep said:

I’m out but you can continue with papiman who has raised some good points

Says a lot that you can't stick by your own words.

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LOL so what does it tell you? Let me guess: Something about me being afraid, docile, weak, brainwashed, clown, fool and shitting myself?  You seem to make up lot of stuff in your head on the basis of very little information you get. I guess that's why you kept failing to represent our views and instead just kept adding words in our mouths.. Challo... Each to their own.

And I take it that you're just as useless as the rest of us despite you having superior knowledge. Which actually just makes it worse since you should have a greater responsibility as you have superior knowledge. But instead you apparently just sit on the fence and criticize everyone for what they’re doing. But at the end of the day you're doing as little as everyone else. Challo.  Who says knowledge has to translate into actions?? That’s probably just overrated anyway.

 

Edited by amardeep
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^^

It don't look like you have anything of substance to say, and you're boring the living daylights out of me as well.

If anyone was doing anything, and they had even just half a brain - do you think they'd broadcast it over the net like some f**king dimwit. If you're useless and mentally weak - you live with it. Don't project your own issues on me.

If you've got nothing of value to say, I suggest keeping quiet. 

You should of left this debate when you said you was going to.

Maybe you should have converted to Islam years ago, when your mates pazzazed you with their faith? 

 

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Lol because youre not doing anything in real life apart from bickering like an old grumpy loser. If you had any good experiences and best practice  of things working you would have shared them ages ago.  You spend so much time talking trash about other people while lowering the standards of this forum with your American trailer trash language, that you ain’t gonna fool anyone pretending to be humble all of a sudden.   

I actually did respond with my views on this in a long post above. Perhaps you didn see it because you were busy trashing people that disagree with you.  

Edited by amardeep
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It's as simple as this. You're a big *****, who shat himself at the just the idea of people being armed. God knows how useless you'd be in any real situation. 

I guess growing up on the mean streets of Copenhagen  would do that to someone. 

And you can't tell anybody about lowering the standards of the forum. Under your prudish admin, you turned this place into a ghost-town.   

Edited by amardeep
Disgusting language
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Great. Back to the idea of people shitting themselves because they disagree with you.  You haven’t addressed any of my points earlier on responsibility and Sikh history.  Instead you just went on a rant of everyone else being clowns and fools. And that’s the kind of low level trash you contribute with nowadays.  

 

Well If you don’t like it here feel free to leave. You ran away like a spoiled insulted brat because we edited your post due to your disgusting American trailer trash language. You apparently think special rules apply to you and therefore felt insulted and left because we dared to edit your post. Not sure why you came back again. You used to contribute to the site with loads of good perspectives, translations and ideas but in the last few years you’ve just been grumpy and disgusting. It’s been downhill really for a good time. We’ve had several complaints on you but didn know if you’d act like a spoiled brat again  If we started editing your posts and therefore let you get away with it.. Challo do whatever you want. 

Edited by amardeep
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You know for someone whose asked me to proofread his dissertations a number of times (which you know damn well were improved big time as a consequence), and for someone who was continually asking me to translate stuff for him for his own projects, you seem to have become very uppity about your own language/communication skills when you criticise mine. I know exactly how 'smart' you are......

And I was asked to return to the forum by the original forum innovator to try and resurrect it, because it looks like your own prudish, boring style of moderating was burying the forum. That's the bitter truth.

I've been on this forum for a long time. It's always been a refreshing change to the stuffy, narrow minded alternatives.

To you, this thread must represent some sort of nightmare, but I'd say that it was quite successful in actually allowing real debate and free-thinking - something you seem to struggle with - or wish to confine to the ladida world of academia. Well, welcome to the real world where people have all kinds of conceptualisations, thoughts and ideas and communication styles- some of which will be very different to your own. 

You know damn well that I'm not illiterate or someone who struggles with intellectualism.  So if I (or anyone else) decides to talk about a topic with an open and free mind try not to have a hissy fit about it. Stop being a limiting factor, trying to control the forum and what gets said so much. The forum will benefit from this - not suffer. 

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On 9/2/2018 at 6:06 AM, dalsingh101 said:

Ultimately we need to be aiming for the creation of a proficient force that is capable of independently helping/protecting our community on a global level. Being able to  conduct rapid rescue missions for trapped apnay anywhere in the world for example.

Good suggestions, but again, they apply more to a Sikh theocracy, which does not exist currently.

Anyways, it would be interesting to hear the opinions of American Sikhs (the ones who were born and raised there) on this issue.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

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On 9/1/2018 at 1:14 PM, paapiman said:

The fear is for the safety of other Sikhs, especially the older folks and the ones who are more into the Saintly aspect of Sikhism. 

Also, add to the list females, children, teens and disabled people.

Imagine, a racist lunatic entering into a Khalsa school and killing scores of innocent Sikh children and that too, by a legal firearm. We definitely don't want that.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

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15 hours ago, paapiman said:

Imagine, a racist lunatic entering into a Khalsa school and killing scores of innocent Sikh children and that too, by a legal firearm. We definitely don't want that.

A "khalsa" school should have tyar bar tyar Singhs running it or at least protect it. So the whole idea of being victimised should be out of the question. 

It seems like the notion of your thinking about the Khalsa is a pointed pagh wala with a tied up beard that has taken"amrit"...also to add.. one who takes pride in being titled as a DR for completing phd

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On 9/1/2018 at 8:05 PM, amardeep said:

Also in terms of Sikh history, the shastardhari aspect adapts to society. Guru Hargobind armed the Sikhs and raised an army because it was needed for warfare. During the tenure of the next three Gurus this army was slowly by slowly decreasing and then once the need arose it was again reassembled by Guru Gobind Singh Maharaj. Guru Har Rai kept an army of 2200 soldiers (small compared to the army of Guru Har Gobind) but there is no indication of any standing army of significant size during the rule of Guru Har Krishan and Guru Tegh Bahadur Maharaj. So in essence, the shastardhari notion can adapt to the circumstances of society in terms of what suits the Sikhs, and the people at large, the best.

What was the duration between Guru Har Rai's charai to when Guru Tegh Bahadur become shaheed?

Is it not possible  that Guru Hargobinds army was present in Guru Gobind Singhs fauj? If so the "gupt" aspect really comes into play

Why would Guru Har Rai even keep an army? The one Guru who got so bhairagi from accidentally pulling a petal from a flower?  

 

Thanks and a big up to the admin to give me a quick approval..much appreciated with all my humility 

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@samurai2 - Sri Satguru jee (Seventh Master) kept an army (2200 horsemen), as it was an order from his grandfather, Sri Satguru jee (Sixth Master).

Also, when Sixth Master was passing the Gurgaddi, Seventh Master came in Bir Ras and asked if he wanted him to smash the tyrants. Sangat was very surprised as they used to think of Seventh Master as being very peaceful and loving (as you alluded). 

 

Bhul chuk maaf

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13 hours ago, samurai2 said:

And you need guys need to sort this format out. I quote on one page which gets deleted when i go to next page for a quote.. 

Admin sort this shit out

What browser are you using ? 

 

6 hours ago, samurai2 said:

What was the duration between Guru Har Rai's charai to when Guru Tegh Bahadur become shaheed?

Is it not possible  that Guru Hargobinds army was present in Guru Gobind Singhs fauj? If so the "gupt" aspect really comes into play

Why would Guru Har Rai even keep an army? The one Guru who got so bhairagi from accidentally pulling a petal from a flower?  

 

Thanks and a big up to the admin to give me a quick approval..much appreciated with all my humility 

It is possible but they would have to be really old then. Guru Har Rai had a small army that fought against the army of Aurangzeb during the succession wars with him and Darah Shikoh. 

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What people are saying about the perceived differences in our Guru's military actions can be explained as military strategy: to resist but build up sufficient forces and strength (and an adequate war chest) for the inevitable bigger battles. People kept training up. It's dumb to continually throw yourself against much bigger and better resourced adversary, you have to pick and choose battles that suit your own situation and resources in a very tactical fashion. That's exactly what they did.   Sun Tzu speaks of this.  

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21 hours ago, paapiman said:

@samurai2 - Sri Satguru jee (Seventh Master) kept an army (2200 horsemen), as it was an order from his grandfather, Sri Satguru jee (Sixth Master).

Also, when Sixth Master was passing the Gurgaddi, Seventh Master came in Bir Ras and asked if he wanted him to smash the tyrants. Sangat was very surprised as they used to think of Seventh Master as being very peaceful and loving (as you alluded). 

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Seems like you and amardeep are modern representations of those 'surprised' with Gurus actions

I asked the question cos those sant ras Gurus kept an army because of their previous  Gurus/Elders orders.. you people here call your self the sons of Guru Gobind Singh and Shy away from arms legalisation..??.. 

 

 

15 hours ago, amardeep said:

What browser are you using ? 

 

It is possible but they would have to be really old then. Guru Har Rai had a small army that fought against the army of Aurangzeb during the succession wars with him and Darah Shikoh. 

Crome on iphone

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Going back to the topic, no he doesn't need to be tankhaiya as he is not sikh politican, he is cdn politican who happen to be sikh. I've heard so much negative stuff against him, people should cut the poor guy some slack, he gets shafted right left and center. Lets talk about his policies not his person life. I find his policies too lefty for me for example as he wants to legalize all the drugs like Portugal. 

In western countries, no political party is perfect, lot of people are quite partisan and ideological driven ie- either you are Marxist, communist or right-fascist. Real progressive gov't should be quite flexible and fluid in their policies and should be also circumstantial. Like for eg- one should tighten lot of loose liberal laws and should be tough on crime but at the same time come up with rehabilitation programs in criminal justice system to reintegrate people who made mistakes in their life back in the society.  

 

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On 9/8/2018 at 12:27 AM, sarabatam said:

Going back to the topic, no he doesn't need to be tankhaiya as he is not sikh politican, he is cdn politican who happen to be sikh. I've heard so much negative stuff against him, people should cut the poor guy some slack, he gets shafted right left and center. Lets talk about his policies not his person life. I find his policies too lefty for me for example as he wants to legalize all the drugs like Portugal. 

In western countries, no political party is perfect, lot of people are quite partisan and ideological driven ie- either you are Marxist, communist or right-fascist. Real progressive gov't should be quite flexible and fluid in their policies and should be also circumstantial. Like for eg- one should tighten lot of loose liberal laws and should be tough on crime but at the same time come up with rehabilitation programs in criminal justice system to reintegrate people who made mistakes in their life back in the society.  

 

You can't have it both ways N30. The guy has specifically chosen a look that clearly harks back to pre-colonial period Sikh warriors, with all that encompasses,  but you're suggesting that he just happens to be Sikh and this has no relevance to his politics. 

The drugs issue is even more interesting from a historical context. From a Panjabi Sikh perspective, it looks like: outside of abstinence driven by self-imposed personal discipline, the plant based psychotropic pharmacopoeia of Panjab was NEVER EVER outright banned through governmental legislation like drugs are in western nations. People in Panjab have been using them in various ways for milenia including Sikhs, and we have early evidence of this in both internal sources like Sri Gursobha and Bhangu's Panth Prakash as well outside european accounts. Interestingly, the only case I found any analogous (if it is even that) government level bans (to western nations) was curiously during M. Ranjit Singh's reign when drugs were banned for prisoners in Lahore Jail (as per the statement of Honigberger who was the man charged with looking after the inmates medical needs). This ban on drug use was lifted by the british as soon as they annexed the region presumably to let the inmates destroy themselves swiftly, or to make them easier to control? 

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On 9/1/2018 at 1:04 PM, paapiman said:

There is a huge difference between bravery/courage (lack of fear) and irrational behaviour

 

Bhul chuk maaf

SIDHOU MUKH KAR LAREY JO SURA SAVA LAKH MEI LEYOUG PURA||

FACE THE ENEMY & THE GURU HIMSELF HAS ORDAINED THE POWER OF 1,25,000 FOR YOU||

 

https://www.manglacharan.com/home/three-paths-to-liberation-and-the-gobind-gita

 

Stop trying to force the path of Sant on men who do not wish it, esp with the help of Malesh||

 

Why do you care if people 'die senselessly'

 

1. Sikh Blood Exists to Be Spilled

2. There's Reincarnation

 

Veer Dalsingh & Bhagat Singh are here to handle it,

 

1. Lol the Idea of People Voting for Sikh Raaj

Shastran Ke Adheen Hai Raaj

 

2. Lol the idea of telling people to read Bani Daily instead of put it into practice Daily

 

Dalsingh It's dumb to continually throw yourself against much bigger and better resourced adversary

Disagree with this||


It's more FUN to fight bigger battles, and for that you need bigger armies|| :)

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾ।।ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ।।


 

 

 

Edited by starchpagg47
BRUAAAHHHHH
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On 9/2/2018 at 6:06 AM, dalsingh101 said:

 

I think the anti-gun people's fear is blinding them. 

This is bigger than any one country. Ultimately we need to be aiming for the creation of a proficient force that is capable of independently helping/protecting our community on a global level. Being able to  conduct rapid rescue missions for trapped apnay anywhere in the world for example.

This will take time to develop (I'm talking a few generations at least). That's how we want to be thinking. Other communities have just this - look at Jews, Anglos etc.  It's pathetic that certain apnay have started sh1teing themselves at the very initial stage of this endeavour. In an increasingly unstable world, we want to be thinking like this. Who knows when we and/or our loved ones might very well be in need to such a thing?

Some fools are talking about starting some arms race - what these clowns haven't fathomed is that there is already an arms race going on in this respect - it's just that docile Sikhs have been brainwashed into not even contemplating competing in this in a cowardly, unengaged fashion. Shame on them. 

https://www.manglacharan.com/home/call-to-arms-by-guru-gobind-singh-ji

They should go buy Bangles||

 

ਯਾਂਤੇ ਸਰਬ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸੁਨੀਅਹਿ । ਆਯੁਧ ਧਰਿਬੇ ਉਤੱਮ ਗੁਨੀਅਹਿ ।
The Guru then said to his Sikhs, "All of the Khalsa should listen [to this directive], carrying weapons is the highest action.

 

ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਕੇਸ ਬਿਨ ਪਾਉ ਲਖਹੁ ਨਰ । ਕੇਸ ਧਰੇ ਤਬਿ ਆਧੋ ਲਖਿ ਉਰ ।।੮।।
Those men who do not have Kesh [unshorn hair] or Shastars [weapons], do not recognize those men as full men. Those who have Kesh [unshorn hair], recognize those as half-men.
 
ਕੇਸ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਜਬਿ ਦੋਨਹੁਂ ਧਾਰੇ । ਤਬਿ ਨਰੁ ਰੂਪ ਹੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸਾਰੇ ।
Those who have adorned themselves with Kesh [unshorn hair] and Shastar [weapons], those men have attained their full form."

 

ਕਮਰ ਕਸੇ ਬਿਨ ਜੋ ਸਿਖ ਜਾਇ । ਤਿਸ ਪਰ ਰੁਖ ਨਹਿ ਕਰੈਂ ਕਦਾਇ ।।੧੦।।
Those Sikhs who went towards the Guru without wearing a Kamarkasa [waist band which holds weapons], the Guru would never look towards them.

 

 

Simple fact is, We're gonna have weapons because they are Sargun Form of Devi||

All Weapons are Legal, As They Are Sacred||

 

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