Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Wjkkwjkf 

this year when i went to india for the second time in my life i went to amritsar and was blessed to have darshan of baba avtar singh ji sursingh wale. Someone who i was traveling with (random) told me baba ji was the 12th jathedar of bidhi chand dal which was started by guru hargobind sahib ji. I felt so lucky to be in the presence of someone who had a lineage from guru sahibs time. After leaving for sri harimandar sahib during the journey a farladhari nihang singh who was traveling with us was arguing with the same guy saying baba avtar singh ji isn't  a descendant of baba bidhi chand sahib because baba bidhi chand sahib was not married. He went on to say baba bidhi chand sahibs last name was cheema and baba avtar singhs is chimba and that baba sahib singh kaladhari gave baba sohan singh permission to start a samparda in baba bidhi chand sahibs name. I am still learning and don't know much about this subject and it confused me a lot because everyone claims bidhi chand dal was started by guru hargobind sahib ji. Could anyone provide any sources to prove this? Or any record that shows baba bidhi chand sahib was married or had kids? I have tried to research it in many granths but found nothing. It would help me a lot ji bhul chuk muaf 🙏

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ਬਿਧੀ ਚੰਦ ਛੀਨਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਕਾ ਸੀਨਾ 

 

is the popular saying. Whether Baba Bidhi Chand was married I don't know.

No Bidhi Chand Dal was started by Guru HarGobind. Then the informal name of the Sikh army was Akal Sena. Only in later times did the Dal started getting names and organisation.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a bunch of liars after money and recognition. Avtar singh inherited everything that he has its common knowledge in dalpanth that baba santa singh used to openly call bidhichandiye prithichandiye saying they 'ate' all of the gurus golak money. They are insulting the blessings of mahapurakh baba sahib singh ji kaladhari by claiming to be around from the gurus time when it was budha dal who gave them their first nishan nagare and horses. Its a shame that these days so called 'sants' are so blinded by maya and ego that they 'forget' their origins.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/8/2019 at 3:55 PM, chatanga1 said:

ਬਿਧੀ ਚੰਦ ਛੀਨਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਕਾ ਸੀਨਾ 

 

is the popular saying. Whether Baba Bidhi Chand was married I don't know.

No Bidhi Chand Dal was started by Guru HarGobind. Then the informal name of the Sikh army was Akal Sena. Only in later times did the Dal started getting names and organisation.

If guru sahib didn't start baba bidhi chand dal why does everyone claim they did? If baba avtar singh ji is the 12th mukhi who are the first 9? I know of baba daya singh ji and baba sohan singh ji but can't find any historic record of the first 9 anywhere. I also want to apologise because I've only been amritdhari since hola mohalla 2017 and i don't understand why someone would lie about their lineage especially somebody as famous as baba ji. It makes me question the motives behind it and I'm nobody really but it would be very disheartening if true.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Jungkaur96 Bhen ji many people have even tried to spread lies about many popular sant mahapursh and their gurdwaras but they didn't know the consequences of the slander as mentioned in the 13th ashtpadi of sukhmani sahib. 

 

So don't stress yourself about it and ignore whatever you heard.

 

Its really good you have taken amrit its kirpa you have.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Jungkaur96 said:

If guru sahib didn't start baba bidhi chand dal why does everyone claim they did?

Guru HarGobind Sahib when arranging Akal Sena made Bidhi Chand as one of its commanders. It could be that this command continued with Baba Bidhi Chand's descendents until it became a formal jatha. Baba Bidhi Chand Dal was not a misl. Personally I think that it was the descendents of Baba Ji who carried on the traditions of Baba Bidhi Chand and it was eventually established as a chhouni. Equally it may just be that Budha Dal set up the chhoni (as all tarna Dal's can only be set up with their permission.)

 

Today there are many misls around Panjab, some of them are quite new, some of them have origins going back to times of Dal Panth.

These are some other Dals:

Tarna Dal, Mehta Chowk

Tarna Dal Baba Bakala

Tarna Dal Harian Bela .

These are all Nihang Chhounis.

 

Maybe next time you go Panjab, visit the Chouni and get some information?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/11/2019 at 11:26 PM, chatanga1 said:

Guru HarGobind Sahib when arranging Akal Sena made Bidhi Chand as one of its commanders. It could be that this command continued with Baba Bidhi Chand's descendents until it became a formal jatha. Baba Bidhi Chand Dal was not a misl. Personally I think that it was the descendents of Baba Ji who carried on the traditions of Baba Bidhi Chand and it was eventually established as a chhouni. Equally it may just be that Budha Dal set up the chhoni (as all tarna Dal's can only be set up with their permission.)

 

Today there are many misls around Panjab, some of them are quite new, some of them have origins going back to times of Dal Panth.

These are some other Dals:

Tarna Dal, Mehta Chowk

Tarna Dal Baba Bakala

Tarna Dal Harian Bela .

These are all Nihang Chhounis.

 

Maybe next time you go Panjab, visit the Chouni and get some information?

Bhaisahab i guess there is a lot of differences between the Dals/Jathebandis or the individuals who are at some position in the Dal. There is all the possibility that one individual may have malice towards the other. 

The followers of one Dal will claim that their Mukhi is of so and so Awastha, wakes up at 12-2 pm , does kesi isnaan and then the Nitnem,Das Granthi and so on. This is the standard measure they give to claim that the Mukhi is of high Awastha and also will add some miracles happening.

 

Hunn mainu Aap ji dasso, who is going to see which individual does what and how true is what is being said. I personally feel all the patronage which is being given to these organizations is based on faith and pure faith. 

 

My feeling is , with all that is being offered to them, are they ever questioned as to what have they done to solve the ongoing issues of the Sangat? How are they addressing the addiction problem? What education benefits can they provide in smaller Pinds ? How much parchaar is being done?

Are we just blindly placing money in the golak to maintain their attire and ego? We need to think .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 6 months later...

From Baba Bidhi Chands lineage comes the current Baba Bidhi Chand Dal. When Jathedar Baba Sahib Singh Ji Kaladhari was imprisoned, Baba Sohan Singh Ji(decendant of Baba Bidhi Chand) used to bring sarbloh bibiki food for Baba Ji and the Singhs. Baba Sahib Singh Ji then gave Nishans and Nagarey to start a new Dal(battalion) under Tarna Dal.

During the time of Maharaja Ranjit Singh Ji, Maharaja gave a lot of money and land to Baba Bidhi Chand Jis lineage hence why current dal is very rich.

Also currently Baba Bidhi Chand dal is in possession of Shastars of Baba Bidhi Chand and Sahib Sri Guru Hargobind sahib Ji.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/9/2019 at 11:03 AM, Gabbarsingh said:

Just a bunch of liars after money and recognition. Avtar singh inherited everything that he has its common knowledge in dalpanth that baba santa singh used to openly call bidhichandiye prithichandiye saying they 'ate' all of the gurus golak money. They are insulting the blessings of mahapurakh baba sahib singh ji kaladhari by claiming to be around from the gurus time when it was budha dal who gave them their first nishan nagare and horses. Its a shame that these days so called 'sants' are so blinded by maya and ego that they 'forget' their origins.

Never has Baba Avtaar singh said that the dal was started by Guru Hargobind sahib ji. You are free to speak fo Baba Ji about this anytime, instead of slandering a mahapurkhs name

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/11/2019 at 9:49 AM, Jungkaur96 said:

If guru sahib didn't start baba bidhi chand dal why does everyone claim they did? If baba avtar singh ji is the 12th mukhi who are the first 9? I know of baba daya singh ji and baba sohan singh ji but can't find any historic record of the first 9 anywhere. I also want to apologise because I've only been amritdhari since hola mohalla 2017 and i don't understand why someone would lie about their lineage especially somebody as famous as baba ji. It makes me question the motives behind it and I'm nobody really but it would be very disheartening if true.

Please read the my previous posts 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/8/2019 at 10:55 AM, chatanga1 said:

 

No Bidhi Chand Dal was started by Guru HarGobind. Then the informal name of the Sikh army was Akal Sena. Only in later times did the Dal started getting names and organisation.

Yea Jathedar Baba Sahib Singh Ji Kaladhari gave Baba Sohan Singh Ji the nishans and nagarey. Baba Avtaar singh Ji also says this as well. The lineage comes from Baba Bidhi Chand Ji and shastars such as Tegha of 6th Guru and Tulwar of baba bidhi chand have been passed in the family through generations

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 months later...
On 5/8/2019 at 7:08 AM, Jungkaur96 said:

Wjkkwjkf 

this year when i went to india for the second time in my life i went to amritsar and was blessed to have darshan of baba avtar singh ji sursingh wale. Someone who i was traveling with (random) told me baba ji was the 12th jathedar of bidhi chand dal which was started by guru hargobind sahib ji. I felt so lucky to be in the presence of someone who had a lineage from guru sahibs time. After leaving for sri harimandar sahib during the journey a farladhari nihang singh who was traveling with us was arguing with the same guy saying baba avtar singh ji isn't  a descendant of baba bidhi chand sahib because baba bidhi chand sahib was not married. He went on to say baba bidhi chand sahibs last name was cheema and baba avtar singhs is chimba and that baba sahib singh kaladhari gave baba sohan singh permission to start a samparda in baba bidhi chand sahibs name. I am still learning and don't know much about this subject and it confused me a lot because everyone claims bidhi chand dal was started by guru hargobind sahib ji. Could anyone provide any sources to prove this? Or any record that shows baba bidhi chand sahib was married or had kids? I have tried to research it in many granths but found nothing. It would help me a lot ji bhul chuk muaf 🙏

his surname was Chhina not cheema. Which can also be baba avtar singh's name and not chimba

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
On 4/30/2020 at 4:07 AM, Harbir Singh Brar said:

his surname was Chhina not cheema. Which can also be baba avtar singh's name and not chimba

exactly. and Shimba or Chimba is a term used for people from Tank Kshatriya background, not really a surname or khandan name.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 10 months later...

HBhai Bidhi Chand never married and had no children.Baba Avtar Singh is descendant of Baba Lal Chand;a nephew of Bidhi Chand.Lal Chand was a grocer in village Sursingh during Guru Gobind time.Lal Chand took part in battle of Bhangani in 1689 on Guru side. Descendants of Lal Chand were-Gurdial Chand,Hukam Chand,Jeoun Singh,Jaspat Singh,Bhag Singh,Labh SIngh,Natha Singh,Sohan Singh,Daya Singh and Avtar Singh.Bidhi Chand was born during Akbar’s rule in village Theh Chhina in district Amritsar.Bidhi Chand was a jat of Chhina subcaste.His father’s name was Wassan.He died in 1640 in Ayodhya.The name of village was changed to Chhina Bidhi Chand during Khalsa Raj on orders of Maharaja Ranjit Singh.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 11 months later...
  • 3 months later...

ਬਿਧੀ ਚੰਦ ਕੋ ਸੁਤ ਮਤਵੰਤਾ । ਲਾਲ ਚੰਦ ਕੋ ਕਹਿ ਭਗਵੰਤਾ ।
ਤੁਵ ਹਿਤ ਸੁਰਸਿੰਘ ਗ੍ਰਾਮ ਮਝਾਰੇ । ਭਾਗਮੱਲ ਸ਼ੁਭ ਸਦਨ ਸੁਧਾਰੇ ।
ਮੂਰਤਿ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੈਂਚੀਆਂ ਲੈ ਕੈ । ਤਹਿਂ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੁਤਿ ਰਹੁ ਸੁਖ ਪੈ ਕੈ ।

.......

..........

ਸਦਾ ਸਾਂਝ ਤੇਰੀ ਪੁਸ਼ਤੈਨੀ ॥
ਨਿਬਹੈ ਗੁਰ ਘਰ ਸੰਗ ਸੁਖੈਨੀ ॥

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Khalsa G said:

ਬਿਧੀ ਚੰਦ ਕੋ ਸੁਤ ਮਤਵੰਤਾ । ਲਾਲ ਚੰਦ ਕੋ ਕਹਿ ਭਗਵੰਤਾ ।
ਤੁਵ ਹਿਤ ਸੁਰਸਿੰਘ ਗ੍ਰਾਮ ਮਝਾਰੇ । ਭਾਗਮੱਲ ਸ਼ੁਭ ਸਦਨ ਸੁਧਾਰੇ ।
ਮੂਰਤਿ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੈਂਚੀਆਂ ਲੈ ਕੈ । ਤਹਿਂ ਮਾਤਾ ਜੁਤਿ ਰਹੁ ਸੁਖ ਪੈ ਕੈ ।

.......

..........

ਸਦਾ ਸਾਂਝ ਤੇਰੀ ਪੁਸ਼ਤੈਨੀ ॥
ਨਿਬਹੈ ਗੁਰ ਘਰ ਸੰਗ ਸੁਖੈਨੀ ॥

Welcome G. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/9/2019 at 4:03 PM, Gabbarsingh said:

Just a bunch of liars after money and recognition. Avtar singh inherited everything that he has its common knowledge in dalpanth that baba santa singh used to openly call bidhichandiye prithichandiye saying they 'ate' all of the gurus golak money. They are insulting the blessings of mahapurakh baba sahib singh ji kaladhari by claiming to be around from the gurus time when it was budha dal who gave them their first nishan nagare and horses. Its a shame that these days so called 'sants' are so blinded by maya and ego that they 'forget' their origins.

Well said Singh. Fake lineages are nothing new.

Zail Sin and Sanjay Gandhi even concocted a new name and lineage for Chowk Mehta Dera and falsely attached to it Dhan Dhan Baba Deep Singh Ji in 1977.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Singh2022 said:

Zail Sin and Sanjay Gandhi even concocted a new name and lineage for Chowk Mehta Dera and falsely attached to it Dhan Dhan Baba Deep Singh Ji in 1977.

Are you saying that Bhindran Taksaal is not connected to Shaheed Baba Deep Singh jee? Any evidence for that?

Are you aware of any other fake lineages within the Panth?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/24/2022 at 9:23 AM, paapiman said:

Any evidence for that?

Are you aware of any other fake lineages within the Panth?

The evidence is staring us the Sikh Panth directly in the face Ji.

Up until 1977 they were known as Jatha Bhindran (Chowk Mehta) when Sanjay Gandhi & Zail Sin deliberately re-christened the Jatha to try discredit the Anandpur Sahib resolution calls.

There is no connection between Chowk Mehta Dera to Dhan Dhan Baba Deep Singh Ji and Takht Sri Damdama Sahib.

Ask yourself Ji what connection could Dhan Dhan Baba Deep Singh Ji have with the ideology espoused in the video below:

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Singh2022 said:

Up until 1977 they were known as Jatha Bhindran (Chowk Mehta) when Sanjay Gandhi & Zail Sin re-christened the Jatha.

There is no connection whatsoever to Dhan Dhan Baba Deep Singh Ji and Takht Sri Damdama Sahib.

Jatha Bhindran is related to Gyani Sampradai, which was started by Shaheed Bhai saab Bhai Mani Singh jee.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...