Could Jesus hv reached Sachkhand ?

[GurjantGnostic]

43 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I disagree that the allegorical reference in Gurbani to "Ved Kateb" means the Bible (+ Quran + Vedas) are immune from criticism.

Ie if the Bible and the Quran outright condone Slavery then in my opinion we *have to* criticise the two main Slavemaster religions

I agree. It says they aren't false, but it doesn't say they're religous books...it doesn't say they're "Granths". It says they are not untrue. 

Black Isrealites say their scriptures were with the Levites. The bible is a history book, a book of acpocolyptic law, a little praise and wisdom in the middle, and their prophecy. 

So is it a verified as accurate, by our Guru, and is what the Isrealites also say it is? Sure. It's see above. 

And thus there are things to understand there. Like any other interest in those things. 

Ultimately does it matter? Nope and can we say who's in Sachakand and who will go? No, Gurbani says we cannot understand fully in fact. 

But if Jesus didn't either go, or return, or earn a final Sikh life? Outlook pretty grim for anybody. 

[GurjantGnostic]

I'm all about Sikhi bro. Just don't see any threat in Jesus being basically who they claim. So he's our Guru's son of some kind sent to help? Yeah we've heard all about Akal doing such.

We don't really have to weigh in one way or the other. 

It's not something that effects us. 

We just don't agree the only way to Akal is through Jesus. Moving on. 

We're probably side by side in Dharam Yudh. How could we not be?

Christians are fakes bro and actually satanists largely, and atheists, outside of some real sects and real individuals.

That's nothing to do with Jesus. He's with us bro. 

No matter how you cut it. And if someone thinks he never was, fine, just do Sikhi, but assuming he's real, which our Guru does attest to to whatever degree, he's clearly one of ours now if not before. 

[GurjantGnostic]

49 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

My understanding bro is that there is nothing the spiritually Mukht (as judged by the merit of their actions) have to do.

So the victims of Transatlantic + Islamic Slavery, the victims of the Holocaust, the Hindu victims of Islamic Genocide etc all get mukti 

I agree bro.

And..

A recurring theme is people getting sent back for a final life of Seva after getting that initial Mukte. 

Whether one calls it Sikhi or not, mainly, it requires essentially being a Sikh if not actually being a Sikh in the final seva phase. 

And we are aware of times when Akal gives full Mukte even to his animal creations. So we can only work the system, that we know gives the True results, and be happy when we see a being get a pass. 

[GurjantGnostic]

56 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I disagree that the allegorical reference in Gurbani to "Ved Kateb" means the Bible (+ Quran + Vedas) are immune from criticism.

Ie if the Bible and the Quran outright condone Slavery then in my opinion we *have to* criticise the two main Slavemaster religions

See. I know the Bible isn't a religion exactly. It's incomplete. Is this true of all three?

Well. Seems so. All broken or lost. Or subverted. 

But the history in the Veras is true. The history in the quaran is true, and the history in the torah is true. 

Although, I admit, studying deeply now with black isrealites, there is much more Dharam intact in that, than "christianity". 

[GurjantGnostic]

Just now, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I interpret the Gurbani that don't criticise religious books without understanding them first simply for the sake of antagonism.

But if we read them and, for example, see Slavery being condoned then that support for Slavery simply cannot come from God,

Correct. They arent God's book bro. We have that. They're something else. Which is why religion isn't working for people and hindustan is adharmi. That's not what those three things are exactly, and they're in a broken state. 

We have the Living Guru. Shabad Guru. 

[GurjantGnostic]

They're more like if someone had to try and make a religion out of Rehit, Ithias and Dasam Granth Ithias and they don't have their Guru Granth Sahib Ji. ....because they haven't existed in this Yugh, and we have the Bani for this Yugh. 

[GurjantGnostic]

Example. The vedas are true ancient history. Contemplating that does not provide Mukte or make you a good person. It is however not false. It's history bro. Ancient. 

The Dharam is gone from the Dharmis, we have to restore it. 

They have only history left. Actually. With some customs or "laws".  

[GurjantGnostic]

43 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I interpret the Gurbani that don't criticise religious books without understanding them first simply for the sake of antagonism.

But if we read them and, for example, see Slavery being condoned then that support for Slavery simply cannot come from God,

And I respect your opinion bro. Greatly. And we don't have to agree on everything to be solid allies and fast friends. We are both big enough to entertain a multitude of concepts. 

I don't say what I say because I think it's wrong, it's my best candid thought feeling on that today. It's really consistent because I don't change being candid ever. Truthful when I am in accord with it.

I also know that my thoughts my not be conventional, or even correct, so it won't surprise me to hear something different, or similar from you friend. Especially since you've been an actual Sikh itself far longer. 

But coming in the back door, and from somewhere else, what I can bring back home with me for the Paanth is from "foreign places". 

But the way that Gurbani makes sense to me, especially having heard from a Jacobite that the Bible isn't a bible...exactly...

In my opinion though they are serving as the record of peoples, from before Kalyug, that entered into Kalyug, and their truth is in their history, and the reason they serve as poor spiritual compasses is they aren't really. 

Obviously no Dharam can promote slavery, but a once Dharmi people, in apocolypse state, may descend to delve in it .. historically. 

 

[GurjantGnostic]

54 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I interpret the Gurbani you are referring to, to mean that we should't criticise religious books without understanding them first simply for the sake of antagonism.

But if we read them and, for example, see Slavery being condoned then that support for Slavery simply cannot come from God,

Your interpretation is sinking in too. I see how you conclude that. 

[GurjantGnostic]

And I want to qualify what I've said. Because when you hear Isrealites interact with the Torah in a Dharmic way, it is indeed mind blowing. It is the most real I've seen the bible used as a "religion" it's night and day difference. 

It's just... We know Only Guru Granth Sahib Ji is at it is. Nobody else has anything like it. No disrespect. 

A lot of the information that are in those three traditions, we keep written in other Granths, and Ithias, Vaaran, Rehit Maryada, etc. 

Which keeps Guru Granth Sahib Ji exactly what it is, Nirmal. 

[GurjantGnostic]

21 minutes ago, GurjantGnostic said:

And I want to qualify what I've said. Because when you hear Isrealites interact with the Torah in a Dharmic way, it is indeed mind blowing. It is the most real I've seen the bible used as a "religion" it's night and day difference. 

It's just... We know Only Guru Granth Sahib Ji is at it is. Nobody else has anything like it. No disrespect. 

A lot of the information that are in those three traditions, we keep written in other Granths, and Ithias, Vaaran, Rehit Maryada, etc. 

Which keeps Guru Granth Sahib Ji exactly what it is, Nirmal. 

Which is why you can do Hukamama with Guru Granth Sahib Ji and not get the advice to enslave someone or drink pee. 

That's why you can actually spiritually follow everything in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and emulate it. 

 

[GurjantGnostic]

As troubled as our brother paths, or other paths, are and have been, there are real ones in all camps. We will be shoulder to shoulder with the righteous of all, righteous traditions, we will also receive and use those born into adharam that disavow it and fall at the Charan of Satguru. Even a few atheists, when push comes to shove, will show they weren't actually atheist just mad at religion. 

Sadhsangat is diverse, very I'm sure. But... it's Sikhs, and people like Sikhs, because we and they are in harmony with Truth only when we're in Harmony with Truth. 

And the fact some of them make it, at least to come serve truly in Dharam if not Sikhi itself is incredible. Kabeer, Kabeer. 

[ipledgeblue]

 

I was thinking that since Jesus said ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?’ that made him lower level than Guru Arjan Dev ji's shabads.

However, just found out now that he could literally have just been quoting from Psalms, which is probably the closest to bani in the Jew tradition.

“Eloi, Eloi, Lama Sabachthani?” – Grace Evangelical Society (faithalone.org)

8 hours ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I interpret the Gurbani you are referring to, to mean that we should't criticise religious books without understanding them first simply for the sake of antagonism.

But if we read them and, for example, see Slavery being condoned then that support for Slavery simply cannot come from God,

 

8 hours ago, GurjantGnostic said:

See. I know the Bible isn't a religion exactly. It's incomplete. Is this true of all three?

Well. Seems so. All broken or lost. Or subverted. 

But the history in the Veras is true. The history in the quaran is true, and the history in the torah is true. 

Although, I admit, studying deeply now with black isrealites, there is much more Dharam intact in that, than "christianity". 

the ved kiteb aren't false, however they do not contain the complete truth either. that is how we can criticise them. 

[GurjantGnostic]

38 minutes ago, ipledgeblue said:

 

I was thinking that since Jesus said ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?’ that made him lower level than Guru Arjan Dev ji's shabads.

However, just found out now that he could literally have just been quoting from Psalms, which is probably the closest to bani in the Jew tradition.

“Eloi, Eloi, Lama Sabachthani?” – Grace Evangelical Society (faithalone.org)

 

the ved kiteb aren't false, however they do not contain the complete truth either. that is how we can criticise them. 

That makes sense. He is that person to the Isrealites. 

[GurjantGnostic]

Here's a good point to focus on. 

Jesus defeated Kalyug in forty days, sweating blood. 

Gruru Nanak Dev Ji did not even take notice. 

Which is why I think Jesus is who they say. 

About forty days slower than his father. 

[GurjantGnostic]

Christ by nature can be higher than any Devte, and still beneath Satguru. 

Shaheed are higher than Devte. Christ is a Shaheed also. 

Now christianity? Whew no lord. Save us from that lord. 

[GurjantGnostic]

12 hours ago, ipledgeblue said:

 

I was thinking that since Jesus said ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?’ that made him lower level than Guru Arjan Dev ji's shabads.

However, just found out now that he could literally have just been quoting from Psalms, which is probably the closest to bani in the Jew tradition.

“Eloi, Eloi, Lama Sabachthani?” – Grace Evangelical Society (faithalone.org)

 

the ved kiteb aren't false, however they do not contain the complete truth either. that is how we can criticise them. 

Wanted to come thank your for this perspective again. 

[GurjantGnostic]

20 hours ago, MrSingh1699 said:

Bro I interpret the Gurbani you are referring to, to mean that we should't criticise religious books without understanding them first simply for the sake of antagonism.

But if we read them and, for , see Slavery being condoned then that support for Slavery simply cannot come from God,

You too bro. Double thank even though I'm still on this status. 

[mahanpaapi]

[GurjantGnostic]

7 hours ago, mahanpaapi said:

There must be two mohammads like they theorize. 

The actual prophet that predates "islam".

And the pedo criminal criminal Kadija turned into mohammad. 

Because there's zero chance mohammad as we know is any light of anything. 

That or the pedo was included just to prevent violence. 

[GurjantGnostic]

7 hours ago, mahanpaapi said:

And pointing out mohammad is a pedo, and not a devte isn't slander. It's simple facts. 

[mahanpaapi]

It is upto you to believe, whatever you want!, utter words and act accordingly;

I would not believe in my low level understanding to tell me such things, rather Someone who came from Sachkhand, omnipresent, and resides in Sachkhand, ever heard Brahamgyani Kaa Sagal Aakar Brahamgyani Aap Nirankaar, Who knows Who is who and Who is where, and what He concludes is conclusive and authoritative for me, not what my mind tells me;  I am sure you are not above and beyond Him.

[GurjantGnostic]

4 hours ago, mahanpaapi said:

It is upto you to believe, whatever you want!, utter words and act accordingly;

I would not believe in my low level understanding to tell me such things, rather Someone who came from Sachkhand, omnipresent, and resides in Sachkhand, ever heard Brahamgyani Kaa Sagal Aakar Brahamgyani Aap Nirankaar, Who knows Who is who and Who is where, and what He concludes is conclusive and authoritative for me, not what my mind tells me;  I am sure you are not above and beyond Him.

Only explanation is two mohammads. Pedophelia and divine light are mutually exclusive. So perhaps we should investigate further this Prophet Mohammed, versus mohammed the pedo. They simply cannot be the same person, or there is no real mohammed. I'm not going to defer to certain rediculous assertions of "islam" just because they're a "religion". 

And if the real mohammed had his name stolen and smeared, and his text coopted? Makes him all the more saintly. 

But there is zero chance of living in Dharam with anyone that condones pedophilia, or slavery, or forced conversion, or kidnapping, or grooming, or necrophilia, or bestiality etc. 

We can I guess be cool over the pee drinking. I mean. That's not a deal breaker, it's just questionable and gross. 

And I know lovely muslims. I love good muslims. And that being said. Read above small and not necessarily complete list of what's wrong with islam. 

Oh crimes against non muslims not a crime.

As long as they resemble something more like the good muslims we read about in Gurbani, individually? Great.

But to be silenced, by the aggressive, fervent, dominance, of an evil system as is exists? That has zero respect for us.  Nope. Over it. 

[GurjantGnostic]

30 minutes ago, MrSingh1699 said:

There were not two Profit Muhammad's bro. Just one. Who sold innocent black women, men and children into slavery for his own financial profit as the Quran permits Muslims to do. Just one Profit Muhammad who kept sex slaves, committed terrorism and Genocide. Anybody who thinks that Slavemaster Pedophiles come from Sachkhand has clearly neither read the Quran or studied the Slavemaster Chomo Muhammad's depraved life as is well documented in the Quran and Hadiths.

Yeah bro if there's only one ..well..he ain't in Sachakand. Be lucky to even be manmukhi jeev. 

[GurjantGnostic]

I give the Brahmgiani the benefit of the doubt knowing if he did not include mohammed people would be injured. Only conceivable explanation by mymukh guided by Gurmukh.