SAadmin Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 my view is that the path to akaal is through unconditional love, whether someone finds that through sikhi, islam, another religion or no religion. Thats exactly my view too...oh guv jhaapi paa laie .... you tell them :hearme: ...after death- sikhi, islam, buddhism or any other relegion wont matter..because everything is united. I have read some cases of reincarnation where people were hindus in their previous lives and christian in this life...even suleman da ghost says it proper...after death there is such no thing dharma above bas everything is bas Ik OngkAR :D 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harmless Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 my view is that the path to akaal is through unconditional love, whether someone finds that through sikhi, islam, another religion or no religion. i guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this issue. Guv, Are you saying that Sikhi is inadequate as a religion? Otherwise why would you suggest that a Sikh must turn to another religion? If that was the case what was the reason for its (Sikhi)inception, differenct philosophy. a way of life which contradicts Islam to a very large extent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harmless Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 Thats exactly my view too...oh guv jhaapi paa laie .... you tell them :hearme: ...after death- sikhi, islam, buddhism or any other relegion wont matter..because everything is united. I have read some cases of reincarnation where people were hindus in their previous lives and christian in this life...even suleman da ghost says it proper...after death there is such no thing dharma above bas everything is bas Ik OngkAR :D In Semitic religions after death there is heaven and hell and no second chance (reincarnation) for those burning in hell for eternity. According to your wisdom all humanity regardless of religion does reincarnate, this is the essence of Sikh thought too. which for the Sikhs represents a whole scienctific truth. How can then any Sikh has the audacity to even suggest to another Sikh to turn away from Sikh path and follow any other? Is that not a biggest insult to the philosophy of Sikhism? You may agree with Guv, but Its like feeding poisoned and polluted apple to a starving child because searching for nutritious organic and healthy one requires effort and hardship. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guv Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 Guv, Are you saying that Sikhi is inadequate as a religion? no. nor did i insinuate that. Otherwise why would you suggest that a Sikh must turn to another religion? i never said he must turn to another religion. try reading through my posts again with a clear mind. If that was the case what was the reason for its (Sikhi)inception, differenct philosophy. a way of life which contradicts Islam to a very large extent. is there only one path to rab?... or many? this has gone completely off the topic now. if u wish to continue this discussion, please start a new thread. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 Harmless Jee, i always appreciate your posts though we disagree on certain issues. Im on this forum by choice. While i dont have much to contribute on spiritual topics i do read through them for my own learning and leisure. No one person can influence any decision i make and while i may have diverted from Sikhism to an extent dont feel the type of advice guv has given will make me give up completely. If i did not want to be here i wouldnt be . Im keen on hearing the views of all members here on any issue though do not necessarily take them all to heart. I think the same is true for most others. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaNaDiAn_jAtTi Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 Harmless Ji, from reading the posts I understand that you want to spread the message as sikhi as being the pure and most direct path to Waheguru.... I love sikhi, however I'm not amritdhari and at the moment am not contemplating it.... To me, as long as I have love for my God, as long as I treat His creations all equally and as long as I strive to be the best human being while meditating on his name, to me... that's my religion, that's my focus I use sikhi as a guideline as to how i should run my life... but my life does not center around the SGGS, even though it is our Guru, My focus is on God Himself, Akaal, Waheguru, Narayan, Allah.... whatever, whoever you may call Him... the all powerful entity which surrounds us and guides us through life.... I'm glad your into Sikhi, that's good, however I'm not to keen on the way you make it seem like the world's going to be damned if a person isn't a sikh, as according to you.... There are many paths to God, and all have equal opportunities of reaching Him if they focus on themselves and not others... It's up to the individual to decide how they want to get there... I hope I din't offend anyone, that is not my aim... just thinking out loud so to speak.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhi Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 How can then any Sikh has the audacity to even suggest to another Sikh to turn away from Sikh path and follow any other? Is that not a biggest insult to the philosophy of Sikhism? You may agree with Guv, but Its like feeding poisoned and polluted apple to a starving child because searching for nutritious organic and healthy one requires effort and hardship. if someone isn't satisfied with Sikhi, then who are we to stop them from forging their own path or adopting a new religion? we've been given a free will for a reason, Harmless. i suggest that we make use of it. and who are we to say that although Sikhi may be nutritious for us, that it must be nutritious for everyone else? we can't even see what is behind the veil of maya and what the grand plan of things are. all of us are on the way to One. we just have different paths. but we can't judge these paths as being universally good or bad. we can only speak for ourselves. I hope I din't offend anyone, that is not my aim... just thinking out loud so to speak.... even if u did, it shouldn't matter. but just to let u know, u made perfect sense. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sikh princess Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 I think you have all misunderstood Harmless veerji/penji Bhai Gurdas tells us that as Sikhs there is greater merit in us explaining a shabad of Gurbani to another Sikh than there is in us building seven temples of Gold dedicated to God. I take this to mean that it is incumbant on us to try and lead a Gursikh life ourselves as well as helping others to lead to lead a life according to Gurbani. 'Aap Japai avra Naam Japaveh' Gurbani tells us to contemplate on Waheguru ourselves as well as help others to do the same. If you do not consider yourself a sufficent Sikh that you cannot encourage and help a fellow Sikh live the Gursikh way then it is best to keep quiet otherwise you are just misleading that person. I did not reply to Jahan's post as I do not consider myself as sufficently a Gursikh that I can counsel him into Sikhi. Telling someone who is looking for guidence to 'set your own path or join another religion' is not the way a Sikh should be giving advice to a fellow Sikh. I know Jahan Veer is an intelligent guy and he won't be misled by what you wrote. But what of all the young kids that might be similarly confused as Jahan? If they approached their parents intent on falloiwng your advice what would the parents feel when the kids tell them they were advised to do this by a forum called 'Sikh Awareness'! Canadian Jatti i found you remark about your life not being centered around Guru Granth Sahib yet your focus is of God confusing. The Guru Granth Sahib is a way to approach Waheguru. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harmless Posted June 11, 2004 Report Share Posted June 11, 2004 . Jahan and Sikh Princess: you have both understood my point, SPOT ON! and Jahan Jee. I too appreciate your contributions to the discussions forum even though we donot always agree with one another All please read this particular post of Sikh Princess, her wisdom indeed in commendble! SP wrote: I think you have all misunderstood Harmless veerji/penji Bhai Gurdas tells us that as Sikhs there is greater merit in us explaining a shabad of Gurbani to another Sikh than there is in us building seven temples of Gold dedicated to God. I take this to mean that it is incumbant on us to try and lead a Gursikh life ourselves as well as helping others to lead to lead a life according to Gurbani. 'Aap Japai avra Naam Japaveh' Gurbani tells us to contemplate on Waheguru ourselves as well as help others to do the same. If you do not consider yourself a sufficent Sikh that you cannot encourage and help a fellow Sikh live the Gursikh way then it is best to keep quiet otherwise you are just misleading that person. I did not reply to Jahan's post as I do not consider myself as sufficently a Gursikh that I can counsel him into Sikhi. Telling someone who is looking for guidence to 'set your own path or join another religion' is not the way a Sikh should be giving advice to a fellow Sikh. I know Jahan Veer is an intelligent guy and he won't be misled by what you wrote. But what of all the young kids that might be similarly confused as Jahan? If they approached their parents intent on falloiwng your advice what would the parents feel when the kids tell them they were advised to do this by a forum called 'Sikh Awareness'! Canadian Jatti i found you remark about your life not being centered around Guru Granth Sahib yet your focus is of God confusing. The Guru Granth Sahib is a way to approach Waheguru 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhi Posted June 12, 2004 Report Share Posted June 12, 2004 i'm not one for arguments. but at the same time, i believe that there's a difference in forcing a religion onto someone and helping them understand what it's about. Sikhs haven't been commanded to go out and ensure that the rest of the world becomes followers of Sikhi, but rather that we do whatever it is we believe in with utter devotion to God and humility. yes, i understand that the solution to a problem such as confusion surrounding ur religion can't be solved by finding another religion. but if u're confused about ur religion, it seems to be wiser to try to learn about it. i wasn't trying to tell neone to abandon Sikhi for another religion. however, if there is a situation in which u have educated urself thoroughly about Sikhi and find that it doesn't appeal to u, u have the right to go ahead forge ur own path to God or even find another religion that suits u, although i doubt that it's possible. but then again, everyone is different and unique. if i have made a mistake in assuming that ppl should be responsible for whichever faith they choose to adopt in their life, please forgive me and continue on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaNaDiAn_jAtTi Posted June 13, 2004 Report Share Posted June 13, 2004 sikh princess bhenji, what i meant by my comment there is that I'm not for following ritualistic beliefs, which is what I see at the Gurdhwara, where they have certain prayers and events throughout the day centering around the SGGS... To me it is a book of knowledge which one must read and understand for themselves when they feel their at the right time in life to move on spiritually higher.... Therefore what i mean is that it is there as a reference for me.... I hope you understand that... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 I believe the purpose of the Gurdwara is to reinforce the Sikh traditions in their original form and also to serve as a community centre for Sikhs. It is not mandatory that you attend the Gurdwara but people do this by choice. I dont see how offering prayers at the Gurdwara is a 'ritualistic belief'. After listening to the ragis/gyanis it is only natural to offer prayers at the end of the ceremony. To me it is a book of knowledge which one must read and understand for themselves when they feel their at the right time in life to move on spiritually higher.... Something with such deep meanings as Guru Granth Sahib requires more than simply reading it. People have a habit of interpreting or bending things in such a way to suit themselves rather than adjusting themselves to fit in with what is being taught to them. The Guru Granth Sahib can only mean one thing, it cannot mean different things for different people. If so, then what truth is there in it? This is where Gurdwara comes in again, to ensure that Sikhs are following their religion truthfully and how it was intended to be (In my opinion). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaNaDiAn_jAtTi Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 However Jahan Ji, How often do you have the Granthi explaining what is in the SGGS... Most of the time, I see them give sakhis or stories that have nothing to do with the shabad itself. I mean stories are nice, it gives an example, yet it is not explaining the essence of the SGGS.... You can have someone describe what is in the SGGS, you can have someone teach you it all, but you cannot experience blissfulness through that person, you have to realise it yourself... And you if read the SGGS with a true heart and no prejudice, then I believe that in time all will be revealed to that individual.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 20, 2004 Report Share Posted June 20, 2004 Ok, you do have a point there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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