Disrespect of Sant Baba Ranjit Singh Ji Dhadrian Wale

[Har Naal Pyar]

I have read Shabad Hazare, it is beautiful hunna? But I don't think that's what you were saying.

OK seriously, I will try to reply in some more detail later but for now all I will say is that Black Goddess has had enough of people doing nindya of so-called sants.

These are people she has a lot of respect, that is why when everyone speaks ill of a so-called sant they need to be careful not to hurt anyone unnecessarily in the process.

LOL, she linked you to Taliban, maybe she meant Tapoban, that forum is crazy. OK so the sant title was being used freely during the 20th Century. I completely agree with the last point you have made.

But what are you against, the fact that there are hundreds of men in white or the fact that these men are referred to as 'sant'?

Just a comment on the side, regardless of what these men are called or what they wear, we cannot group them all together into one box.

Some of them may not be what you call a sant but they may be what you call a Bhai. Therefore, it is the individuals that we should attack and not everyone that wears white.

I don't know what your view is on this and so talking only generally here.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

[Guest]

stop singh ji,

for sake to end this debate on sants:

I would request to have a look at this thread:

http://www.sikhawareness.com/sikhawareness...opic.php?t=7637

Where i by blessing by guru and sant mandali crushed akj/tapopban propaganda article on sants.

[Black Goddess]

Thankyou Har Naal Pyar Jee, you're right, Im seriously fed up. StopSingh and his mates will never respect the opinion of those who believe in Sants, unfortunately people like this exist in the world too. I dont think his post deserves any more of my attention, keep me out of your hate campaign dude.

[Black Goddess]

BTW, I have read Shabad Hazare, dont assume you know my reading list and my opinion is still the same, go preach hatred elsewhere. You will not find any converts here.

[Har Naal Pyar]

I don't know where all of you are from but I was considering organising a sikh event.

I really think some ppl need to sit down together and have a debate about sants.

What we have at the moment is two sides fighting it out till their teeth split.

It's causing hatred, and to be honest it has created a divide, in fact b4 I speek I have to ask ppl if they are anti or pro sant. It is awful. Everyone needs to be more tolerant. Pro sant sikhs and anti sant sikhs BOTH sides need to understand where the other one is coming from and then 'discuss' it.

I don't know if anyone is interested in organising some sort of debate within the London Unis, if not forget it, otherwise u can PM me or reply here.

I think it is getting to be a bigger problem, more people are called sants and then more sikhs get up to criticise their actions. It is not benefitting anyone.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

[stopsingh]

BTW, I have read Shabad Hazare, dont assume you know my reading list and my opinion is still the same, go preach hatred elsewhere. You will not find any converts here.

Well done. I hope you understood who the term Sant was used for by Guru Arjun Dev Ji. It certainly was not used for a money grabbing youth with a dera in Patiala.

Who has been preaching hatred ? Do you suffer form some sort of mental condition which causes you to mentally believe people are preaching hatred if their views differ from yours and they do not think doing bhangra type moves in the hazoori of Mahraj is acceptable.

Next time you are in India take a trip to Metha Chowk (DD Taksal) and start doing your bhangra moves whilst giving the fateh salutation. The Singh there will soon put you right.

You are the one who is obsessed with the taliban and calling people thick because they have different views to you. Go take your warped obsessions to some other forum. Maybe the Nirankhari forums or the Gobind Sadan forum. They love people with warped mindsets plus they have a human "Guru" who runs the show .

[Guest]

Baba Stop Sian,

did u get a chance to look at this??

for sake to end this debate on sants:

I would request to have a look at this thread:

http://www.sikhawareness.com/sikhawareness...opic.php?t=7637

Where i by blessing by guru and sant mandali crushed akj/tapopban propaganda article on sants.

[Black Goddess]

Guru Sahib used the word for Baba Buddha Jee, now he was a Sant, which means Sants do exist, you said in one previous post that you believe only Guru Jee is Sant, none other, so how do you explain this?

Whats there to be jealous about ? Seeing as our Guru Granth Sahib Ji is our Sant then how could I be anti Sant ?

Har Naal Pyar Jee, StopSingh is too angry, he cant let this go, let him calm down and I will be happy to attend a meeting you organise on this. I am not going to retaliate to his posts anymore because he is already humiliating himself by lashing out at everyone who does not agree with his reasoning. Sat Kartaar.

[Har Naal Pyar]

I'm glad you have been mature about this and decided to end te debate.

Hopefully something will be organised through my contacts.... lack of them actually I dont have any but I'm hoping to organise something somehow it has to be done at least for the youth coming out of university about to get married and have children who they will pass this divide on to.

Everyone needs to be more tolerant and that means me you and Stopsingh.

Stopsingh would you be able to come if some discussion was organised?

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

[stopsingh]

Baba Stop Sian,

did u get a chance to look at this??

SatGuru N30,

I will look at it in the morning.

[x_suman_x]

i would just like to tell sikh_warrior that baba ranjit singh ji cant be following sant jarnail singh bhinderwale because he recently sat on a THRONE WITH A KALGI ON HIS DASTAR WHICH WAS TOTALLY AGAINST SANT JI'S TEACHINGS AND FURTHERMORE HE LET PEOPLE BOW DOWN TO HIM. WAS HE TRYING TO BE A GURU. SOMEONE OUGHT TO TELL HIM THAT GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI IS OUR FINAL AND ETERNAL GURU.

[challenge_everything]

why cant we get back to the serious topic of doing cartwheels around the darbar sahib in josh?

[Jaskurn]

Hey Everyone How are you doing?

I was doing a search on Sant Ranjit Singh Ji and came across this forum. I searched him on the net because I just watched this video about him. It shows how after returning from a trip to canada, he sits on his throne back in punjab with blue velvet material under his feet. He wears aqua coloured kurtha and to celebrate his birthday is accompanied with a kalgi on his head. He makes women, kids and men bow before him and touch his feet. Hi sits in fron't of a great painting behind him on the wall, not of any guruji but with a photo of himelf. He accepts, cars, haar's, rings and jewell's and many other gift. Seen twisted his moustache, he has also been heard talking on his mobile phone saying the following: "Je Kam Hojanda Hai, Te Vota Paa Deyanga"

He's also seen making jokes in reference to the panj piyare standing behind him...

For a guy that is going around preaching to sangat, that it is only the sri guru granth sahib that we should be bowing before...he's got issues..this is my personal opinion...I've got the video clip which was aired on canadian television and if anyone would like to see it add me mr_singh_au@hotmail.com This is different to the video of him showing just accepting gifts and stuff...this is a full explanation on his doings.

[stopsingh]

Jaskurn,

Upload the file somewhere for download, so everyone can see what was going on. I expect the pro sant nindya coetrie will be gunning for you now.

If it is the same birthday video as the other one on the net (without sound) then Ranjit Singh claims it is a few years old and not a recent video. He is now probably more media/pr savvy now and would not allow such videos to made.

[stopsingh]

Guru Sahib used the word for Baba Buddha Jee, now he was a Sant, which means Sants do exist, you said in one previous post that you believe only Guru Jee is Sant, none other, so how do you explain this?

Har Naal Pyar Jee, StopSingh is too angry, he cant let this go, let him calm down and I will be happy to attend a meeting you organise on this. I am not going to retaliate to his posts anymore because he is already humiliating himself by lashing out at everyone who does not agree with his reasoning. Sat Kartaar.

If actually bothered to read Shabad Hazareh then you would know who Guru Arjun Dev Ji used the word Sant for. It is obvious you have either not read the Shabad Hazareh or do not understand it.

If you read your posts it is easy to spot who is twisted, full of anger, ignorant of Sikh norms and unaware of Shabad Hazareh.

[Jaskurn]

Jaskurn,

Upload the file somewhere for download, so everyone can see what was going on. I expect the pro sant nindya coetrie will be gunning for you now.

If it is the same birthday video as the other one on the net (without sound) then Ranjit Singh claims it is a few years old and not a recent video. He is now probably more media/pr savvy now and would not allow such videos to made.

Download it from:

http://www.spread-it.com/dl.php?id=e95666a...82c8d519e6e5c14

[Black Goddess]

StopSingh, I will just have to stop replying to your posts, I believe Guru Sahib used the word Sant for Baba Budha Jee, you dont. I believe in Sants, you dont. End of story, simple.

I might be ignorant, but I was obviously worth your time and attention for a short while. I have no intention of discussing anything with you again, have a nice day.

[Guest]

SatGuru N30,

I will look at it in the morning.

still waiting :roll: :roll:

[Guest]

i would just like to tell sikh_warrior that baba ranjit singh ji cant be following sant jarnail singh bhinderwale because he recently sat on a THRONE WITH A KALGI ON HIS DASTAR WHICH WAS TOTALLY AGAINST SANT JI'S TEACHINGS AND FURTHERMORE HE LET PEOPLE BOW DOWN TO HIM. WAS HE TRYING TO BE A GURU. SOMEONE OUGHT TO TELL HIM THAT GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI IS OUR FINAL AND ETERNAL GURU.

suman ji just to clarify..those were not kalgi but those two golden type of khanda's on baba ranjit singh's dastar.

[Har Naal Pyar]

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

I am not defending anyone here and neither do I have the intention to do so but I think we need to look at the facts before we can type our opinions for the sangat to read.

First, he is not wearing a kalgi.

Second, he is NOT sitting on a throne- it is a manja with a pillow that looks like a throne but is NOT.

Third, he is not making anyone do anything-the bowing coming from the sangat is a voluntary act.

Fourthly, the colour a human being wishes to wear in Guru Ji's Darbar is his personal choice and although our favourite colour may not be green, we cannot accuse him of anything simply because he awoke in the morning and decided to wear a colour that some may find hurts their eyes.

Now, one view we could take is:

he was completely wrong to accept any gifts, it is anti-gurmat to accept gifts.

The other view we could take is:

this video is 2yrs old and perhaps he has now changed to something some of us would not be offended by.

etc.

Now that we have the facts I think we can safely form an opinion.

Ofcourse I have missed out so much, do feel free to add to the facts.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

[stopsingh]

still waiting :roll: :roll:

I thought you was going to prove with Gurbani that Sant can be used as a title by any one with a dera in Punjab. You just back up points made by me that the Sant title use in Sikhi started in the 20th century etc etc.

I found the following point (or non point) amusing. Just further backs the point case against most of these "baba".

>So what's a point? No Real Sant never say call me sant

You forgot to add that most dere wale "Sant" take great pride in getting thousands of posters printed for fly posting on which they allow the use of every title under the sun to elevate their status. Ranjit Singh takes great pride in using the sant title on covers of VCD, CD etc etc. So are they Real Sant ? or fake money grabbing charletans who will do anything to sell their wares.

[Guest]

I thought you was going to prove with Gurbani that Sant can be used as a title by any one with a dera in Punjab. You just back up points made by me that the Sant title use in Sikhi started in the 20th century etc etc.

I found the following point (or non point) amusing. Just further backs the point case against most of these "baba".

>So what's a point? No Real Sant never say call me sant

You forgot to add that most dere wale "Sant" take great pride in getting thousands of posters printed for fly posting on which they allow the use of every title under the sun to elevate their status. Ranjit Singh takes great pride in using the sant title on covers of VCD, CD etc etc. So are they Real Sant ? or fake money grabbing charletans who will do anything to sell their wares.

Dude lets cut the crap ok?

I want you to go to that link and refute my points one by one..... i have given references of sant- from bhai kahn singh nabha dictionary of siri guru granth sahib.. go on refute that.

I have emailed author of that stupid article.. i got no replies from him.. now you are walking off like that... be a singh and face the challenge !!!!!!!!!

GO TO THAT LINK AND REPLY MY POST LINE BY LINE IF YOU GOT JUICE !!!!!!

Otherwise i m going to lock this topic because of this topic being off-topic.

[stopsingh]

StopSingh, I will just have to stop replying to your posts, I believe Guru Sahib used the word Sant for Baba Budha Jee, you dont. I believe in Sants, you dont. End of story, simple.

I might be ignorant, but I was obviously worth your time and attention for a short while. I have no intention of discussing anything with you again, have a nice day.

Now it is a case of what you believe whereas you need sources and references from me to back up the fact that bhangra type arm raising is not an accepted norm in the Durbar of our Guru Ji. :shock:

How many times you said you are not going to discuss it further with me but then you post another reply. You are a person of great principles.

Come on provide pucca sources and references.

I hope you can take the time someday to read and understand Shabad Hazareh. It will teach you more than any dere wala "Sant" can teach you.

[Black Goddess]

Listen yeah, Im only posting because you cant stop replying to every single thing I say, when you do, I wont reply either, get it? I asked for sources from you because YOU started debating me, is that so hard to understand? You dont know who I respect and follow, you know nothing about me, instead of acting so childishly and attacking me, go do something worthwhile. If you wont take insults, neither will I.

As for shabad hazareh, I have my own interpretation, you have yours, you'll have to deal with the fact that I dont happen to agree with you.

You dont know me, dont attempt to know what my principles are, your recurring posts are revealing what principles you do not have though.

[stopsingh]

Dude lets cut the crap ok?

I want you to go to that link and refute my points one by one..... i have given references of sant- from bhai kahn singh nabha dictionary of siri guru granth sahib.. go on refute that.

I have emailed author of that stupid article.. i got no replies from him.. now you are walking off like that... be a singh and face the challenge !!!!!!!!!

GO TO THAT LINK AND REPLY MY POST LINE BY LINE IF YOU GOT JUICE !!!!!!

Otherwise i m going to lock this topic because of this topic being off-topic.

Please refrain from using language like "crap". You are meant to be an administrator not a 14 year old chav from Bicester. If street language is ok then can everyone use it ?

Big woh/bale balle you use Bhai Kahn Singh's work as a reference. I use Shabad Hazareh written by Guru Arjun Dev Ji as a source. Lets see out the two should I rely on what Guru Ji wrote or on what Bhai Kahn Singh Ji wrote. I think I will stick to what Guru Ji has written and rely on his use of the word Sant. Good to see you hold Bhai Kahn Singh Ji above Guru Arjun Dev Ji.

Go ahead lock the topic, do you think I seriously care if you lock the topic ? Nice attitude you have, happy with a debate until I ignore your feable/lame pro Sant rant in another thread.

You disagree with an article so it is stupid ? :shock: