angy15

Some Popular Rituals in Shri Hazoor Sahib Nanded .Are these Gurmat mariyada .How does Bhai Jaswinder Singh USA or any other would like to explain whats going on.

A common message to all the followers with different ideologies from Sant Jarnail Singh Khalsa:

Whatever discussion/ arguments we are discussing .The conclusion I would like to drive. - Its not Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs but Dhandrianwala Vs Taksal -There are different authors of Sikhs History .But some of them want others to stick to their narratives .The solution is to Standardize the historical text. I read an article where Bhai Harnam Singh Dhumma says Rehat Marayda of Akal Takht is just a draft its not final .So if consensus is not built on marayda differences is bound to arise. - As mentioned earlier there are two school of thoughts emerging 1. Sampardias based on traditional interpretation. 2. Sikh Missionary based on Prof Sahib Singh and other modern scholars. Both cannot claim that their narrative is the most accurate.ਜੋ ਸ਼ਬਦ /ਵਿਚਾਰ ਗੁਰੂ 'ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ' ਜੀ ਦੀ ਕਸਵੱਟੀ 'ਤੇ ਪੂਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਉਤਰਦੀ, ਉਹ ਸਾਡੇ ਵਾਸਤੇ ਸਵਾਹ ਹੈ. ਭਸੈ ਊਪਰਿ ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦੁ ਬੀਚਾਰੁ ॥ ਹੋਰ ਕਥਨੀ ਬਦਉ ਨ ਸਗਲੀ ਛਾਰੁ ॥ A tweet from Bibi Kiranjot has a message that "You cannot force us to see Sikhi the way you do".

That I cant answer. But Who is Bhai JAswinder Singh? Is he a mediator or does he represnt Akal Takht. Debating with him will result nothing .It might create more controversy.

Thanks Veerji for third option.Definately you can have neutral opnion. Before giving my opinion let me tell I am taking a neutral stance on this unlike like you .Final Decision is to be taken by Akal Takt No one is saying Guru Nanak is wrong. It is the faith & Belief of millions of Hindu and Muslims just like we have Sikhs Tirrath Yatra to Hemkund Sahib ,Darbar Sahib and other religious places What Dhadrianwale says abt tirath isaan is given in link below: Plz if you can find any anti Gurmat vichaar in this: Yes it can change for or against . I totally disagree that "they will believe anything that is said".Sangat have become more logical and Science Oriented .Gurbani has to be presented in that way .Not by telling Stories . This two interpetation is my opinion on why there is disagreement between the Two Side .Brahminical concept of spritualit y is the allegation which often Dandariwalla mentions in his Katha. If you take Gurmat meaning of reason and Faith it is Bibek Budh: Let me try to expain it in light of Gurbani Below is Shabad from Kabeer Ji . What Kabeer Bhagat ji says that people are churning the water with an assumption that it’s milk. It’s very imperative to understand in the light of gurbani that what is milk and what is water? Milk is Gurbani and all the falsely gians of world, which don’t lead to ONE are water. Gurbani (milk), when churned by Budhi enables it’s transformation into Bibek Budhi; which then leads to state of bliss.That’s why Gurbani always guides us for Shabad Veechar and understanding the shabad. ਐਸੋ ਅਚਰਜੁ ਦੇਖਿਓ ਕਬੀਰ ॥ Aiso Acharaj Dhaekhiou Kabeer || Kabeer has seen such wonders! ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੧:੧ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੪ Raag Gauri Guru Arjan Dev ਦਧਿ ਕੈ ਭੋਲੈ ਬਿਰੋਲੈ ਨੀਰੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ Dhadhh Kai Bholai Birolai Neer ||1|| Rehaao || Mistaking it for cream, the people are churning water. ||1||Pause|| ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੧:੨ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੪ Raag Gauri Guru Arjan Dev ਹਰੀ ਅੰਗੂਰੀ ਗਦਹਾ ਚਰੈ ॥ Haree Angooree Gadhehaa Charai || The donkey grazes upon the green grass; ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੧:੧ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੪ Raag Gauri Guru Arjan Dev ਨਿਤ ਉਠਿ ਹਾਸੈ ਹੀਗੈ ਮਰੈ ॥੧॥ Nith Outh Haasai Heegai Marai ||1|| Arising each day, he laughs and brays, and then dies. ||1|| ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੧:੨ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੫ Raag Gauri Guru Arjan Dev ਮਾਤਾ ਭੈਸਾ ਅੰਮੁਹਾ ਜਾਇ ॥ Maathaa Bhaisaa Anmuhaa Jaae || The bull is intoxicated, and runs around wildly. ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੨:੧ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੫ Raag Gauri Guru Arjan Dev ਕੁਦਿ ਕੁਦਿ ਚਰੈ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਪਾਇ ॥੨॥ Kudh Kudh Charai Rasaathal Paae ||2|| He romps and eats and then falls into hell. ||2|| ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੨:੨ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੫ ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਭਈ ਖੇਡ ॥ Kahu Kabeer Paragatt Bhee Khaedd || Says Kabeer, a strange sport has become manifest: ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੩:੧ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੬ ਲੇਲੇ ਕਉ ਚੂਘੈ ਨਿਤ ਭੇਡ ॥੩॥ Laelae Ko Chooghai Nith Bhaedd ||3|| The sheep is sucking the milk of her lamb. ||3|| ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੩:੨ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੬ ਰਾਮ ਰਮਤ ਮਤਿ ਪਰਗਟੀ ਆਈ ॥ Raam Ramath Math Paragattee Aaee || Chanting the Lord's Name, my intellect is enlightened. ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੪:੧ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੬ ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਗੁਰਿ ਸੋਝੀ ਪਾਈ ॥੪॥੧॥੧੪॥ Kahu Kabeer Gur Sojhee Paaee ||4||1||14|| Says Kabeer, the Guru has blessed me with this understanding. ||4||1||14|| ਗਉੜੀ (ਭ. ਕਬੀਰ) (੧੪) ੪:੨ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੩੨੬ ਪੰ. ੭ Let me ask you .When Guru Nanak visited mecca ,the priest told nanak to be carefull to not point his feet towards Kaaba while he selpt. Nanak reply was turn my feet where God was not. It is said the Kaaba turned wherever nanak feet turned? Do you believe that Mecca actually turned ?

The whole controversy is the interpretations of Gurbani .There are two schools of thought regarding interpretations of Gurbani 1. One is Traditionalistic interpetations which Sampardais follows and are sometimes Brahminical concept of sprituality 2. Other is Interpretation of Prof Sahib Singh ,Bhai Vir Singh etc which is based on reason and faith in the truth . The Sangat are free to follow whichever interpetations they like.No one can force anyone Nobody has the copyright on Guru Granth Sahib.No body has the right to threaten anyone. Ang Sang Waheguru

These clips cherry picked purposefully made to defame him. In what context Dhadrianwale said we should first listen the full tape and in which year he said this . Waheguru can be obtained by his Grace . ਕਰਿ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਆਪਣੀ ਜਪੀਐ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮੁ ॥: When the Divine Grace is manifest, one meditates on Amrit Naam .

Its a Panthic Issue , veechar/debate should be infront of akal takht between taksal and dandiyrianwala and let sangat decide . Even the Title of the Discussion is misleading "Dhadrianwala Vs Great Sikhs" It should be "Dhadrianwala Vs Taksaal"

But it can also be the other way he may be preaching gurmat in right sense which is attracting sangat.We can't question sangats intellect.

I feel it is taken out of context . Provide the Source??

Can you provide the source of this information?

if at all his videos are anti Gurmat let Akal Takht take action against him.He himself is saying in this video listen from 1:00.Let both side come face to face and discuss and let sangat descide.

check out the link below: https://www.sikhdharma.org/category/prosperity/prosperity-shabads/

You can love him or hate him.But he attracts big gathering.His Deewans attracts more sangats than Damdami Taksal or any other dera .I have attended one of his divans and i did not find his speeches anti gurmat though durning his speech he occasionally blames SGPC and Damdami Taksal for some past incidents otherwise there was no anti gurmat prachaar. If it all he is Guru Nindak or spoken against Gurmat let it come in front of Akal Takht and let it take a decision. Ang Sang Waheguru

This shabad brings prosperity and fulfills all desires. Recite or sing the shabad 11 times a day as a meditation for prosperity. This Shabad brings the joy of merging with the Divine and opens one to the infinite flow of prosperity by attuning the mind to the creative power of Infinity.

The Structure(in brief) which I follow myself: 1. Rise in the amrit vela (4:00 Am to 7:00Am). Move your Bowels ,bathing depends on the situation 2. Massage the body with oil especially nerve ending and joints. 3.Do 10-30 minutes stretching exercise to energize yourself .Relax for a while (You can customize series of exercise) 4. Do some pranyama exercise like kapalbharthi,Alom Vilom,Agni Sar etc 5.Meditation Posture: Sit in easy pose with spine straight.Hands on your knees in Gyan Mudra Focus: Eyes are closed and focused on third point Breath : Normal breath through nose Mantra: Chant Waheguru ,Waheguru and listen to the Mantra while Chanting. Time :7-11 minutes Inhale deeply and relax Satnam

Also other ways by which ,with Simran a devotee can know true way of life : 1. Holy Companionship 2. Contentment 3. Restraint of the Senses 4. Truth

A sakhi from Guru Nanak life: A Shaikh asked the Guru what religious denomination his head-dress denoted,and why he did not shave his head in orthodox fashion The Guru Replied: "When man hath shaved his mind he hath shaved his head Without shaving his mind he findeth not the way. Let him cut off his head and place it before his guru. if he resign his own wisdom,he shall be saved by the wisdom of his guru. To become the dust of the feet of all is to shave the head. Such a hermit appreciateth the words of the guru: That is the way in which the head is shaved,O brother."

Well this post to an extent clarifies abt what Gurbani says abt hair .and also what I am trying convey is Gurbani is a guide for us to turn inwards .It is not asking to belief something .Its ays if you love GOD it doesnt matter whether you have long hair, or no hair. Which what it makes it a universal teacher. Bhai Vir Singh defines ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ as: Satnam

Gurbani guides us how to turn inwards.Inward step can be taken only by an individual .its concerns only with you .Thats why Guru Granth Sahib is beyond a set of beliefs.It is upto the individual how he wants to take the steps.

Agreed Managing gurudwaras you need to have some rehat but can you deny a true seeker,or devotee specially from performing a kirtan just beacuse he has not taken amrit.

Are Amritdhari Sikhs only Rehatvaan Gurmukhs? O.k Agreed, so SGPC were right when Bhai Ghulam Mohammad Chand was denied to perform Kirtan ?

Then the very idea that sikh is auniversal religion becomes questionable.When the foundation stone of Harmandir shaib was laid down by a muslim saint.When it has four entrance representing entrance to all four caste.It was to show that anyone and anybody can come and gain spiritual wisdom irrespective of his situation . Above incident indicates that when we bound ourself with a belief system than a conflict is inevitable .When we have belief system we try to make it common everywhere trying to impose it on everyone. If we go by logic of SGPC quoted above then all Bhagats (15 bhagats), Bhatts (11 bhatts) are disallowed beacuse they have to prove that they are amritdhari. You can Allow Queen of England wear socks and a hat enter Darbar Sahib. We have reduced the Sikh religion into a set of believes. Religion cannot be abt belief system .Sri Guru Granth Sahib is a perfect example of it without any conflict. Satnam

Well in all our discussion we are missing role of SGPC.They are really letting our community down

But any translations(Hindi, Punjbai,English of Pran Sangli available online.