unbreakable

In fact after reading the text. It doesn't mention the creation of Nitnem or anything. 

It mentions that he altered Gurbani. 

Guys please put your input into this and if you can please cite sources aswell. 

11 hours ago, paapiman said:

The story of the curse given to Amar Shaheed Sriman 108 Baba Mani Singh jee is mentioned in Prachin Panth Prakash (Episode 93). It says that Baba jee made alterations to the saroop of Sri Aad Satguru Granth Sahib jee Maharaaj. This event occurs after Sri Satguur jee (Tenth Master) had merged into Akal Purakh.

Baba jee was a Gurmukh Brahamgyani, who had achieved the state of "Badeh Mukti". Sri Satguru jee (Tenth Master) had given him the boon that even if his body was dismembered, his spiritual state would not be affected. 

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

I found this

http://sikhinstitute.org/sgpp_ful_vol_2.pdf

however it doesn't mention what type of modifications or alterations he made

any further help would be of great help

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

A simple question. Who compiled the Nitnem. Who decided which banis to take and why specially those banis?

i have always heard from people that it was Bhai Mani Singh who compiled Nitnem and because he did this act of separating bani from Siri SatGuru Granth Sahib Ji, SatGuru Gobind Singh Ji told him he will meet his fate in a similar fashion. 

But I have been searching online for some sort of reference for this story and I can't find any. Also I can't find any source about who complied Nitnem banis. 

I am asking because we were discussing in our group and this topic came up. 

Hope someone here can help

waheguru Ji ka Khalsa waheguru Ji Ji fateh

OK maybe this is a real issue for those who pay to have akhand paths done?

Now that there are 25 bods who are doing path on your behalf , you need to pay so much more money.

in other words having akhand paths done is now a rich mans game.

(or am I just grasping at straws and looking for problems?)

just straws bruh, just straws....you opening a stable????

FRom what i picked up and understood

x amount of singhs to do japji sahib path

x amount of singhs to fo Akhand Path

x amount of sings as guards

x amount of sings to top up/ight jot,tuuf

x amount of singhs to do chor-e

Whether its an issue , what maryada shoud we follow ?

if one gurudawara is following one maryada , creating there own standards , another using there own , now recently 25 singhs ,

Shouldnt all gurudawaras follow one maryada ?

hence if someone/family want to do akhand path , they have these options , causes confusion , causes break up of the panth

I have seen maryada already defined as how akhand path shoud be done , bhog shoud be done , etc...

NEWSFLASH - panth is already broken (long topic)

Who will enforce this Maryada? What does the Sikh Rehit say on this?

problem with the maryada card is you will get loads of so called two penny scholars, (basically anybody who can hold a pen) saying "oh yes but, according to the records found in the british library, there was a witness, blah blah blah"....

This really is a non-issue.

What you should be saying is it necessary for Gurdwaras to have multiple akhand paaths starting simultaneously, i.e. 10 akhand paaths at the same time, or 20, etc.

I think you are making a issue out of nothing here, there are plenty more pressing topics which should be concentrated on, that are being ignored.

Muslims have a thing about breeding like rabbits, if we can't convert you, we will breed you out....

I feel sorry for their wives (sisters)...

i think it was 25 singhs.

I'd like to know what they were actually doing. I know that DDT recommend 5 singhs, all with their own duties. But i cant see what you would get 25 guys to do.

You would get them to do couple of hours each, I think the ddt 5 singh recommendation is the minimum, as anything less than that it would get tiresome

I don't know of all gurdwaras should adopt this policy, as they are doing what they feel is right.

As for practicality, isn't it better to have more people doing Akhand Paath Sahib than a few?

What panth will be split?

As for making sangat aware, I think they need to be made aware of more pressing matters, than 25 singhs doing akhand paath sahib.

I agree with your opinion, more parchaar should be done by explaining Gurbani to sangat, not just the juicy parts which make people emotional so that they part with their money.

I believe the sangat want to participate, but however, there is lack of education being given in all gurdwaras, right upto the holiest of holy, Harimander Sahib, Hazoor Sahib, etc. There is a myth that you have to be a Gyani or a Raagi to do this seva, i.e. somebody from joe public can't do it.

Its better to have more people doing Akhand Path sahib, as if a few people do the seva, then there is a problem of tiredness, etc, concentration, etc.

Its just an imnpression I get when listening to their talks esp if you listen to Harjaps immigration advice on youtube.

They both just coulnt care less about what others think of them.

If you are referring to Mr Bhangal not giving two hoots about his clients, then you are right. Ever been down to his office in Southall. Its a mini Royal Mint.

Didn't he win an award for "helping" his fellow punjabis??

Do they need donations? It looks like most major towns/cities in East Punjab could do with evening/night schools. This guys efforts could be replicated elsewhere.

KDSingh Ji what is the syllabus like for these evening schools?

You can try getting in touch with the editor who published the article for details. However, when it comes to donation, I personally prefer to give them in person.

brilliant story.

oh yeah i saw that program and wasnt very impressed with it, as it smacked of narrow-mindedness. The proof of Baba Wadhbhag Singh telling Dal Panth is that they brought him into Khalsa Panth as a result of it. Thye didnt go and find out and then take Tham Sahib back and then go and find BWS and give it him back.

I can't comment on the narrow-mindedness of the presenters, however it does raise questions for the Sikh Nation, re - Heritage, etc, history, etc.

I will send Sikh Channel another email..

It was ok, didn't really do anything for me though...but thats me..lol

Thanks for the replies guys,, i also thought in terms of "religion" the maiya bit is not that important so to speak....as suryadev paaji said which is what i have always understood that before perfoming any task blessings should be recieved by ganesh ji....

Yup, Ganesh is asked to bless the occasion, just like Sikhs do an Akhand Paath, although its not necessary in my personal opinion, as just love for Vaheguru should be sufficient enough. But we are humans and we all have our failings, doubts. In Snatan Dharam (Hinduism), there is a lot of "personalisation" of God, you can see this in the humanisation of the the murtis of what they think/believe God to be.

Asking for blessing is a good thing and should be done, as for the ceremonies, its good too, as it gets the family together.

the reason i asked this question because i heard of a sakhi (nothing to do with weddings/maiya) is that when the devis/devteh came to see guru nanak dev ji they offered haar(flowers) and rubbed sandlewood on his face/body, and for some reason this story popped in my head whilst observing the maiya tradition that maybe the people are imitating ganesh by rubbing tumeric on the bride/groom... sort of indirect blessing.. also the flower made design the bride/groom sit on is the "hindu" symbol....im just speaking from observation and have no knowledge on maiya as i cannot find anything on the internet, religious sikhs say it should not be practiced, and the older lot just say its a tradition...

To be honest, I wouldn't look too much into it. I am not surprised at these so called "sakhis". Honestly, I don't believe it, remember this is my personal opinion and belief, I am not a socalled book scholar, just a practical & realistic guy.

from my understanding most if not all "acts of tradition/rituals" are a watered down pratan/snatan "religious ritual"...

Yes and No, its like tracing the roots of Folk Songs. I believe some of these rituals are more cultural, i.e. tribal.

i suppose this is not the most important topic in my life but something which has always bugged me as to why we do it...personally have nothing against it and i would participate in the tradition my self..

I agree, its not really worth looking into, however knowledge which educates and clears and misconceptions is always good.

lol at converting response... sikhs are really para about the hindu dharm...

I find it to be the opposite. I find the Hindus get into a huffy puffy about the Sikhs, especially when they say they are not part of the so called "Hindu brotherhood". From my experience, its always the Hindus (and muslims) who can't handle that the Sikhs are an independant nation. They always use the "yeah but guru nanak was born into a hindu family"...this is when the party starts.

here is a link, there is plenty of info on-line, have you tried using google/bing????

http://en.wikipedia....ding_traditions

lol

No I did not and have not converted. just a 'joke' at the expense of those peeps getting hyper-excited at the spate of gurdwara mixed marriages these days. I'm 'amrit-shak', so is the missus.

yes like you've mentioned it is more of a cultural thing rather than religious. However i'll also say that I dont believe it to be manmat either.

Thats subjective and maybe in a another thread life..lol

Thats just brilliant. lol, I was getting all geared up to read "your story" of how you "found god"...lol

I'm lost. Could you explain?

about what?

From what Unbreakable mentioned, Ganesh Ji is worshipped whenever you begin a new journey/project, so that he may bless you with success/accomplishments in that matter. Hence you have peole doing ardas to him during weddings, start of a new job, moving to a new house etc.

Incidently, we had a stylised image of ganesh Ji on our wedding invites. Got some raised eyebrows and questions from families when they saw no gurbani tuks printed on the cards but an artistic symbol of Hindu god!!

(I just responded by saying that I've converted and we are having a mixed marriage in a gurdwara!! no-one tried to stop us BTW. lol)

However, there is no Sikh connection, other than a cultural one which changes from area to area. Scripturally, No connection whatsoever. Giving respect is another matter, following a certain "outside" ritual is another. I respect Muhammed, Jesus, Buddha, but that doesn't mean I celebrate Eid or Christmas....however on that note, Christmas has become more commercial..lol....I miss those good old days...anyone remember snowman, scrooge, etc..lol

Converted to what? Forgive me for asking, just curious, you know normal human behaviour.

I am intrigued as to why people convert, did you have a revelation? or simply convert to marry your partner?

Firstly, there is no connection per say between Ganesh Ji and Sikh weddings. (lets talk technical now)

However, there is a connection. Remember that pre-sikh days, even pre-islamic days, everyone followed their specific tradition or culture you can say. "hinduism" is a myth

However its not as simple as that, but it really is at the same time. When it comes to Snatan Dharam, I always think symbolically and allegorically. Its not what its made out to be in reality. Thats MY PERSONAL opinion, might be wrong, please correct me if I am wrong, I am open to criticism, etc.

Ganesh is worshipped in different ways depending on which part of the country you are in. However they all have one thing in common, he is the bringer of happyness, wealth, peace, etc. This was a "vardaan" a boon, given to him by his father, Shiv Ji I believe, in compensation for what he done to him. (you know cut his head off by mistake, then asked bramha to fix him up, etc)

When Ganesh comes, he brings his consorts or gifts with him, one of those is Laxmi, goddess of wealth.

Remember, we as humans, are very selfish and we only pray to have something material, we don't pray for anything else, well the vast majority.

As for Mayain or Batna

The mix of turmeric (normally tumeric, milk, oil, etc different areas of the country have different recipes). This mix has some good clensing properties.They are meant to make the skin shine.

Why make the skin shine, so that the bride and groom will be attracted to each other on their wedding night and make babies.

Try it, mix up a batch, slap it on your arm for 1 hour and then wash it off, it lightens your skin.

This is a cultural ritual all over India, Pakistan, Bangaladesh and some other parts of the world.

Hope that helps.

Mayian is pretty normal, its not a religious practise, more cultural and tribal. Like the Henna or Mendhi Ritual. Its all about preparing the Bride and Groom, dolling them up, so they look their best on their special day.

I think the last time this site was busy when that person (whose name we must not utter harjas kaur) started posting massive threads..etc...

plus, I think if people actually replied to posts, then we could get some activity going.

I prefer this forum to other forums

ok bye

*hurricane sandy whisks me away*

VaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa, VaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh,

I hope this topic raises some sort of constructive discussion here, where we can learn something.

This is a issue which is very close to everyone, as it involves you giving part of something which belongs to a complete stranger with whom you have no affiliation, most of the time this "something" is Money. Most of the time, only Money is asked for, very few organisations ask for skills of an individual, etc.

This is the case for all religious organisations, Islam, Hinduism, Judaism, Jain, Sikhi, Christianity, etc.

There is some sort of divine law which requires or in some cases warrants us to give to the needy and less fortunate.

I would like to discuss what Gurbani has to say about Dasvand, where this concept was mentioned, how it was born, who put it forward.

Some of the ways in which we are asked to donate are

- Donate your dasvand to

- Donate the Gurus dasvand to

- To attain Gurus happyness, donate to

- If you don't donate, you will be in Karmic Debt

- Sikhi will be finished if you don't donate

Another way in which it as this

How do you know that your dasvand will be used honestly, if it isn't then you will be held responsible and the bad karmic action will affect you too.

For example, we give money to a Baba (or organisation), but that baba (or organisation) doesn't use that money for the intended purpose. Because he didn't use it for the intended purpose, you will also be affected by his bad karmic action.

Now, lets say if you make all possible enquiries into where the money will go, you still will be held responsible.

In these incidents, YOU, the person donating, do not know about the hidden agenda of the baba (or organisation).

So question is, HOW ARE YOU RESPONSIBLE?

I first heard this from a Radha Soami in India around 7 years ago, where he was saying, if you donate your money to a poor man and he goes and drinks, then beats his wife up or dies, YOU will be HELD responsible. When I challenged him, he just kept to his line that you will be held responsible EVEN if you don't know.

After all of this, he said, So its better to donate to US as we will honestly spend your money.

So as we see, Psychological and Emotional blackmailing is used to make you feel guilty about something which "might" happen in the future. However if you give to them, then you are OK and NOTHING will happen to you.

Are these ways of making you feel guilty to take your money from you????

So, what does Gurbani say, specifically on Dasvand, Charity, Karmic Debt, etc.

Please Note - Sources and references must be given. No made up stories which are designed to make your feel guilty.

I'm still here. lol. although that counts for nothing..

I havent read anything about him fleeing and leaving women/anyody there, but certainly Tham Sahib was burnt, and when Baba Ji took sharan of Khalsa Panth, he took Amrit.

Also at Tham Sahib cows were killed and the Sikhs burnt nasir ali alive in revenge.

Yes, thats what I have read too. But according to that Show, the presenters claimed that when the muslims came and attacked Tham Sahib, instead of fighting, he fled and left even his followers. It was one of the Misl's that found out about Tham Sahib, avenged it.

But I don't know to be honest, maybe somebody else here can shed some light, with sources of course.

I will try and get sikh channel to upload that programme on sikh channel youtube website, which will probably take around 10 years..LOL

I am here- holding down the forth/torch of sikhawareness.com..!! hoping one day it be just like old times..may be i should retire and name a next sikhawareness gaddi jathedar (successor)

Sad really, I understand that peoples lives get busy, but we need to try and surpress those typical "panjabi" feelings and start reviving those Guru Khalsa Panth feelings and come back...

I spend most times going through the archives..lol.

by the way, you have a PM

Just wondering, where everyone is and what you good people are upto now in your life?

I am resurrecting this old thread to gain some more information on Baba Vadbhag Singh.

I don't know if anyone here was following the Sikh Virasat programme on Sikh Channel which was presented by Avtar Singh and Dr.Sadhu Singh.

They had one episode where they claimed that Baba Vadbagh Singh fled whilst Tham Sahib was being burnt, he left the women, etc there and fled into the hills. Tham Sahib's desecration was later avenged by the singhs. However the jury is still out as there are conflicting accounts.

I was wondering if somebody could shed some light on this.

Hopefully, I shall visit his dera in India, been meaning to go there, just out of curiosity.

Thank you..