singh2

You just keep the lies coming sir. The lying isn't helping you.

You have merit in what you say. These are a bunch of Gurnindaks. I have seen them how wrong ideology they are forcing down the throat of innocent young sikhs on SPN.

Inder Singh ji hiding under Singh2,

Guru Fateh.

Tell everyone the TRUTH here that you do not consider Guru Granth Sahib Ji as our ONLY GURU as bestowed to us by Guru Gobind Singh ji and also let them know that you did not know REHAT was mentioned in it till you were told about it.:-)

Regards

Tejwant Singh

Waheguruseeker

There is no hiding here. I have registerd with my name. The forum has already another Inder singh. Is whaeguruseekr your real name. You have been frequenting forums with roadrunner,roadruuner2, whaeguruseekr etc etc.

I have already stated in reply to your false propaganda that Only and Only SGGS is eternal guru for all sikhs. no sikh disputes that. You want me to post the relevant post here. But propagandist like you keep on creating imaginary issues like this to earn an ear. Stop doing this as every sikh considers SGGS as Our Guru.

Nevertheless second most important scripture for sikhs is Dasam Granth. What is your view on this?

We talked about khalsa rehat and that rehat along Gurmantra a sikh takes only from Panj piaras. have you done that. That is when sikhi satrts.

Only five,

Guru Fateh.

Reveal yourself. Stop hiding. :-) A Sikh does not hide. What are you afraid of?:-) I have no idea who you are but it seems you also ran away from SPN like Inder Singh who is hiding behind Singh2.:-)No one is bullying but your english comprehension is weak and it shows.:-) When you have something to say then please stop hiding yourself under some burka.:-)

Tejwant Singh

Nobody is hiding. We are calling a spade a spade. You are reading that.

Stop diverting the topic by labelling other with weakness at english. He is telling you what he thinks about you. neither did i run from SPN. I posted some verses for you to see about Naam simran. You never replied to those as it hit at the roots of your warped atheist ideology.

2. Creator of the Akal Takhat

Creator of akal takhat is Guru hargobind shaib and not Guru hargobind singh

So the bullying starts here aswell for Vaheguruseekr. Remember I told you i won't mind coming down the Las Vegas in a pm. We could have discussed all you liked then. Keep your Taliban mentality to yourself. If you take a good look at SPN, you will find out hypocrisy runs through there veins. Just look at the ads they have there. The anti-Gurmat people like this guy are praised there by the Admins

He is the greatest Gurnindak found on internet. He slanders Dasam bani. I invited him to come and see a 1698 manuscript copy that we have in N California. He turned it down.

When i satrted at SPN somebody sent me personal message saying that wahegurseeker is a punk and i should not discuss anything with him as he is a bully. I ignored that. When he had no arguement moderators chip in in his favour.

Look you guys i know you lot hav your own beef and have brought it over here, have got anything to post relating to this thread. if you do great, if not take your issues over the PM

I am still waiting for Guru Da Sikh to reply to my post earlier, in case he misses it i will post it is again here.

Guru Da Sikh i worte earlier

"Are you aware of why the debate on the Dasam Granth never took place, have you spoke to Prof Darshan Singh or Baba Hari SIngh Ji about it? I have, both state they did not take part in the debate due to Vedanti's Hukamnama not to debate on thsi topic. "

To which you replied

"Why are you making up stories anyway? Why not phone up Bhai Tehal Singh, President of the Gurdwara where this discussion / debate was going to be held, and he will tell you the TRUTH. He was the one who arranged for this to happen and was going to monitor it. He was the one who got up and asked Hari Singh to come back and join the discussion. He was the one who got up on the stage and denounced Hari Singh for stating the Jeonwala was not up to his level."

You accuse me of lying do you well what does this video show

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iif_6bBvm10...feature=related

What do they say within the opening minute. And as you can see in the video Sant Hari Singh Ji are still there along with Sant Baljinder Singh Ji of Rara Sahib. Again and again you lie and lie and a video shows the threads of your lies. This debate was lined up and had started but due to the sangat bringing up the Hukamnama BOTH Prof Sahib and Baba Ji stopped the debate as shown

If there is any sangat in Canada as BAba Baljinder sIngh Ji are there at present can they be asked about what took place at the location as well

Where have all the Missionaries gone>

Kam ji

WJKK

WJKF

These missionaries live in castle built out of lies and deceit. That is their profession. I have seen those videos and they prove this so called GDS a liar.

Incidentally we had a Akali Dal amritsar conference in Northern Califonia two weeks ago where Tehal singh also attended. I asked him what happened there as Rozanaspokesman was giving false news. he told me that sikhs in gurdwara did not want Darshan ragi to say anything.

You may be interested in some news item that i saw on IHRO discussion about your Guru kala afghana.

http://us.mg203.mail.yahoo.com/dc/launch?....d=bffudaq3h0cpa

yes u r right....... . we should prepare ourself against these rss activities to protect our sikhism

--- On Sat, 13/6/09, B.S.Goraya <kartarpursahib@ yahoo.co. uk> wrote:

From: B.S.Goraya <kartarpursahib@ yahoo.co. uk>

Subject: [iHRO] Even the touts feel shy to buy Mohali paper

To: sikhs_in_the_ bay_area@ yahoogroups. com, SikhSangat@yahoogro ups.com, sikhstudents@ yahoogroups. com, sikhupdates@ yahoogroups. com, SikhWomen@yahoogrou ps.com, SikhYouthRetreat200 1@yahoogroups. com, Southall_Sikhs@ yahoogroups. com, summerreligion@ yahoogroups. com, TorontoSikhCoalitio n@yahoogroups. com, UCLASSA@yahoogroups .com, UnitedNaujawans@ yahoogroups. com, WorldSikhs@yahoogro ups.com, yorksikhs@yahoogrou ps.com, sikh-youth@yahoogro ups.com, sanjha_punjab@ yahoogroups. com, sikhstudent@ yahoogroups. com, Sikh@yahoogroups. com, sikhsincalifornia@ yahoogroups. com, californiasikhs@ yahoogroups. com, SikhAtlantaDe@ yahoogroups. com, sikhism@yahoogroups .com, punj-aab@yahoogroup s.com, khalsacollegedelhi@ yahoogroups. com, SikhsSydney@ yahoogroups. com, iigs-family@ yahoogroups. com, kirtancentraluk@ yahoogroups. com, learning-zone@ yahoogroups. com, IHRO@yahoogroups. com, issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. .com, WideMinds@yahoogrou ps.com

Date: Saturday, 13 June, 2009, 8:17 AM

Even the touts feel shy to buy Mohali paper

Indian agencies like RSS are working from various angles in their nefarious designs to absorb Sikhism in the Hinduism. They believe if they can finish Budhism from Indian soil where does the tiny Sikhism stand? These stupid and rogues don't understand that what they are attempting, is in 21st Century and that too in the presence of advanced IT. Besides there being written word of Guru i.e the pious book Guru Granth Sahib which could be accessed any where in the world while the Budhism had no such document. Guru Nanak was alone but the Sikhs have millions of Guru Nanak in the shape of Guru Granth sahib where his unadulterated message of peace exists. But these scoundrels never stop and they attempt it at the cost of bread to crores of hungry mouths that sleep without food. They are the people who injected violence in the Sikh peaceful movement from 1948 to 1980.

It is the same very conspiracy that demolished our religious and historical monuments like the Fort Lohgarh Amritsar, Guru ke Mehal Amritsar, Chamkaur di Garhi, Thanda Burj Sarhind and many other hundreds of archaeologically important monuments. Because the otherwise most brave community of Sikhs are simple minded and the scoundrels infiltrates in their organizations and sabotage from within. It was part of the same very design that recently a Hindu sat on the seat of Guru Granth sahib and there were security men to protect him. Their aim was to demoralize the Sikhs. They don't know that this has been happening right from the days of Guru Nanak patshah and we reply at the appropriate time through our peaceful means.

Every community has black sheep and so are there the so called Sikhs who are ready to harm their own house for the sake of a few Rupees. We call them touts. It was part of this very design that ex CID men like Kala Afghana were projected to create confusion among the Sikhs. We congratulate the Khalsa Panth the way they thwarted moves of Kale and Peeley pilley of RSS. They were the people who challenged the very basic worship of Sikhs i.e nitnem the daily prayers of Sikhs and they propagated that Jaap sahib, Sawaiye and Chaupie sahib be excluded from Nitnem. Their whole idea was to confuse Sikhs because a confused person can be easily converted to the other thought.

It was part of that very game plan that the agencies saw that the touts launch a newspaper from Mohali. They pumped crores of rupees in this project. The voluminous paper entered the media market with a bang. It would openly abuse Sikh tenets. It never felt shy of ridiculing the Five Kakkars of Sikhism. Like on this 7-6-09 it published a news making a mockery of a Sikh house that has preserved the pious historical shoes of Guru Hargobind sahib at Jorha Sahib Gurdwara Sudhar Ludhiana.

Yesterday my newspaper hawker came to get payment for May month. A senior hawker, he would give me updates on newspaper circulation numbers. I met him after 6 months. "Sir, Mohali paper has miserably failed, it could not sustain, it has fallen rock bottom the dust of Amritsar, and only about 300 copies are received for Amritsar and suburbs." I took a sigh of relief. My estimate is there are about 10,000 touts in Amritsar and what is surprising even the touts feel shy to buy this paper. Sikhan da Guru barha dhahda ei.

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B.S.Goraya

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Inder Singh ji, as you ran away from the other forum , we have another opportunity to discuss Gurmat here.

You are the one who slanders bani of tenth master and yet you claim to discuss Gurmat. You are the one who does not believe in sikh rehat maryada and you want to discuss sikh issues.

You are the one who slanders naam simran and yet want to discuss Gurmat.

You are the one who disown Waheguru as Gurmantra and want to discuss Gurmat.

That really is out of order. Come on Admin, I for one want to see all the facts, and please cut the nasty bile ridden comments out from certain people here. Lets debate the issues and not the people, and find some common ground.

Randip

Why do not you put the questions for them. We can asnwer your questions one by one. You write that you have read Dasam Granth sahib.

Funny how your Khalsapanchayat group have heavy ties with Sikh Student Federation - who are avid supporters of Baba Jarnail Singh, who himself had complete faith in all of Sri Dasam Granth Sahib.

Everyone knows khalsa panchayat is a creation of congress. They have no ties with sikh students federation as Sikh students were the ones who beat them badly in Harmandir sahib complex as they were holding demonstrations( against maryada) in the complex.

If you post abuse there, like you have you get booted. Sikh2 aka Inder Singh posted personal comments that is why he is crying like you too. Maybe you guys can cry together?

Your mentor waheguruseeker has only one job and that is to preach anti gurmat views. Have you seen the language he uses on that forum. You have no spine to check him.

Given below is entire chhand in bachitra natak of dasam granth on the basis of which FAUJI call Mahakal a Hindu deity. Please read, analyse and see how deluded and childish is the arguement of Fauji.

ਭੁਜੰਗ ਪ੍ਰਯਾਤ ਛੰਦ ॥

भुजंग प्रयात छंद ॥

BHUJANG PRAYAAT STANZA

ਸਦਾ ਏਕ ਜੋਤਯੰ ਅਜੂਨੀ ਸਰੂਪੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਦੇਵ ਦੇਵੰ ਮਹਾ ਭੂਪ ਭੂਪੰ ॥

सदा एक जोतयं अजूनी सरूपं ॥ महा देव देवं महा भूप भूपं ॥

He, who is ever light-incarnate and birthless entity, Who is the god of chief gods, the king of chief kings.

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਨਿਰੂਪੰ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਾਣੰ ॥ ਕਲੰ ਕਾਰਣੇਯੰ ਨਮੋ ਖੜਗਪਾਣੰ ॥੩॥

निरंकार नितयं निरूपं न्रिबाणं ॥ कलं कारणेयं नमो खड़गपाणं ॥३॥

Who is Formless, Eternal, Amorphous and Ultimate Bliss. Who is the Cause of all the Powers, I salute the wielder of the Sword.3.

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਿਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਨਿਰਾਲੰ ॥ ਨ ਬ੍ਰਿਧੰ ਬਿਸੇਖੰ ਨ ਤਰੁਨੰ ਨ ਬਾਲੰ ॥

निरंकार न्रिबिकार नितयं निरालं ॥ न ब्रिधं बिसेखं न तरुनं न बालं ॥

He is Formless, Flawless, eternal and Non-aligned. He is neither distinctively old, nor young nor immature.

ਨ ਰੰਕੰ ਨ ਰਾਯੰ ਨ ਰੂਪੰ ਨ ਰੇਖੰ ॥ ਨ ਰੰਗੰ ਨ ਰਾਗੰ ਅਪਾਰੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ॥੪॥

न रंकं न रायं न रूपं न रेखं ॥ न रंगं न रागं अपारं अभेखं ॥४॥

He is neither poor. nor rich; He is Formless and Markless. He is Colourless, Non-attached, Limitless and Guiseless.4.

ਨ ਰੂਪੰ ਨ ਰੇਖੰ ਨ ਰੰਗੰ ਨ ਰਾਗੰ ॥ ਨ ਨਾਮੰ ਨ ਠਾਮੰ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਤਿ ਜਾਗੰ ॥

न रूपं न रेखं न रंगं न रागं ॥ न नामं न ठामं महा जोति जागं ॥

He is Formless, Signless, Colourless and Non-attached. He is Nameless, Placeless; and a Radiating Great Effulgence.

ਨ ਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ਨ ਭੇਖੰ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਗ ਜੋਗੰ ਸੁ ਪਰਮੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰਯੰ॥੫॥

न द्वैखं न भेखं निरंकार नितयं ॥ महा जोग जोगं सु परमं पवित्रयं॥५॥

He is Blemishless, Guiseless, Formless and Eternal. He is a Superb Practising Yogi and a Supremely Holy Entity.5.

ਅਜੇਯੰ ਅਭੇਯੰ ਅਨਾਮੰ ਅਠਾਮੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਗ ਜੋਗੰ ਮਹਾ ਕਾਮ ਕਾਮੰ ॥

अजेयं अभेयं अनामं अठामं ॥ महा जोग जोगं महा काम कामं ॥

He is unconquerable, Indistinguishable, Nameless and Placeless. He is a Superb Practicing Yogi, He is the Supreme Ravisher.

ਅਲੇਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਨਾਦੰ ॥ ਪਰੇਯੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰੰ ਸਦਾ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਿਖਾਦੰ ॥੬॥

अलेखं अभेखं अनीलं अनादं ॥ परेयं पवित्रं सदा न्रिबिखादं ॥६॥

He is Accountless, Garbless, Stainless and without Beginning. He is in the Yond, Immaculate and ever without Contention.6.

ਸੁਆਦੰ ਅਨਾਦੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਨੰਤੰ॥ ਅਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ਮਹੇਸੰ ਮਹੰਤੰ ॥

सुआदं अनादं अनीलं अनंतं॥ अद्वैखं अभेखं महेसं महंतं ॥

He is the Primal, Orignless, Stainless and Endless. He is Blemishless, Guiseless, Master of the earth and the destroyer of Pride.

ਖਗ ਖੰਡ ਬਿਹੰਡੰ ਖਲ ਦਲ ਖੰਡੰ ਅਤਿ ਰਣ ਮੰਡੰ ਬਰ ਬੰਡੰ ॥

खग खंड बिहंडं खल दल खंडं अति रण मंडं बर बंडं ॥

The sword chops well, chops the forces of fools and this mighty one bedecks and glorifies the battlefield.

ਭੁਜ ਦੰਡ ਅਖੰਡੰ ਤੇਜ ਪ੍ਰਚੰਡੰ ਜੋਤਿ ਅਮੰਡੰ ਭਾਨ ਪ੍ਰਭੰ ॥

भुज दंड अखंडं तेज प्रचंडं जोति अमंडं भान प्रभं ॥

It is the unbreakable staff of the arm, it has the powerful luster and its light even bedims the radiance of the sum.

ਸੁਖ ਸੰਤਾ ਕਰਣੰ ਦੁਰਮਤਿ ਦਰਣੰ ਕਿਲਬਿਖ ਹਰਣੰ ਅਸਿ ਸਰਣੰ ॥

सुख संता करणं दुरमति दरणं किलबिख हरणं असि सरणं ॥

It brings happiness to the saints, mashing the vicious ones, it is the destroyer of sins and I and under its refuge.

ਜੈ ਜੈ ਜਗ ਕਾਰਣ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਉਬਾਰਣ ਮਮ ਪ੍ਰਤਿਪਾਰਣ ਜੈ ਤੇਗੰ ॥੨॥

जै जै जग कारण स्रिसटि उबारण मम प्रतिपारण जै तेगं ॥२॥

Hail, hail to the cause of the world, saviour of the universe, it is my preserver, I hail its victory. 2.

ਭੁਜੰਗ ਪ੍ਰਯਾਤ ਛੰਦ ॥

भुजंग प्रयात छंद ॥

BHUJANG PRAYAAT STANZA

ਸਦਾ ਏਕ ਜੋਤਯੰ ਅਜੂਨੀ ਸਰੂਪੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਦੇਵ ਦੇਵੰ ਮਹਾ ਭੂਪ ਭੂਪੰ ॥

सदा एक जोतयं अजूनी सरूपं ॥ महा देव देवं महा भूप भूपं ॥

He, who is ever light-incarnate and birthless entity, Who is the god of chief gods, the king of chief kings.

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਨਿਰੂਪੰ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਾਣੰ ॥ ਕਲੰ ਕਾਰਣੇਯੰ ਨਮੋ ਖੜਗਪਾਣੰ ॥੩॥

निरंकार नितयं निरूपं न्रिबाणं ॥ कलं कारणेयं नमो खड़गपाणं ॥३॥

Who is Formless, Eternal, Amorphous and Ultimate Bliss. Who is the Cause of all the Powers, I salute the wielder of the Sword.3.

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਿਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਨਿਰਾਲੰ ॥ ਨ ਬ੍ਰਿਧੰ ਬਿਸੇਖੰ ਨ ਤਰੁਨੰ ਨ ਬਾਲੰ ॥

निरंकार न्रिबिकार नितयं निरालं ॥ न ब्रिधं बिसेखं न तरुनं न बालं ॥

He is Formless, Flawless, eternal and Non-aligned. He is neither distinctively old, nor young nor immature.

ਨ ਰੰਕੰ ਨ ਰਾਯੰ ਨ ਰੂਪੰ ਨ ਰੇਖੰ ॥ ਨ ਰੰਗੰ ਨ ਰਾਗੰ ਅਪਾਰੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ॥੪॥

न रंकं न रायं न रूपं न रेखं ॥ न रंगं न रागं अपारं अभेखं ॥४॥

He is neither poor. nor rich; He is Formless and Markless. He is Colourless, Non-attached, Limitless and Guiseless.4.

ਨ ਰੂਪੰ ਨ ਰੇਖੰ ਨ ਰੰਗੰ ਨ ਰਾਗੰ ॥ ਨ ਨਾਮੰ ਨ ਠਾਮੰ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਤਿ ਜਾਗੰ ॥

न रूपं न रेखं न रंगं न रागं ॥ न नामं न ठामं महा जोति जागं ॥

He is Formless, Signless, Colourless and Non-attached. He is Nameless, Placeless; and a Radiating Great Effulgence.

ਨ ਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ਨ ਭੇਖੰ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਨਿਤਯੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਗ ਜੋਗੰ ਸੁ ਪਰਮੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰਯੰ॥੫॥

न द्वैखं न भेखं निरंकार नितयं ॥ महा जोग जोगं सु परमं पवित्रयं॥५॥

He is Blemishless, Guiseless, Formless and Eternal. He is a Superb Practising Yogi and a Supremely Holy Entity.5.

ਅਜੇਯੰ ਅਭੇਯੰ ਅਨਾਮੰ ਅਠਾਮੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਗ ਜੋਗੰ ਮਹਾ ਕਾਮ ਕਾਮੰ ॥

अजेयं अभेयं अनामं अठामं ॥ महा जोग जोगं महा काम कामं ॥

He is unconquerable, Indistinguishable, Nameless and Placeless. He is a Superb Practicing Yogi, He is the Supreme Ravisher.

ਅਲੇਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਨਾਦੰ ॥ ਪਰੇਯੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰੰ ਸਦਾ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਿਖਾਦੰ ॥੬॥

अलेखं अभेखं अनीलं अनादं ॥ परेयं पवित्रं सदा न्रिबिखादं ॥६॥

He is Accountless, Garbless, Stainless and without Beginning. He is in the Yond, Immaculate and ever without Contention.6.

ਸੁਆਦੰ ਅਨਾਦੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਨੰਤੰ॥ ਅਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ਮਹੇਸੰ ਮਹੰਤੰ ॥

सुआदं अनादं अनीलं अनंतं॥ अद्वैखं अभेखं महेसं महंतं ॥

He is the Primal, Orignless, Stainless and Endless. He is Blemishless, Guiseless, Master of the earth and the destroyer of Pride.

ਨ ਰੋਖੰ ਨ ਸੋਖੰ ਨ ਦ੍ਰੋਹੰ ਨ ਮੋਹੰ ॥ ਨ ਕਾਮੰ ਨ ਕ੍ਰੋਧੰ ਅਜੋਨੀ ਅਜੋਹੰ ॥੭॥

न रोखं न सोखं न द्रोहं न मोहं ॥ न कामं न क्रोधं अजोनी अजोहं ॥७॥

He is Ireless, Ever fresh, Deceitless and Non-attached. He is Lustless, Angerless, Birthless and Sightless.7.

ਪਰੇਅੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰੰ ਪੁਨੀਤੰ ਪੁਰਾਣੰ ॥ ਅਜੇਯੰ ਅਭੇਯੰ ਭਵਿਖਯੰ ਭਵਾਣੰ ॥

परेअं पवित्रं पुनीतं पुराणं ॥ अजेयं अभेयं भविखयं भवाणं ॥

He is in the Yond, Immaculate, Most Holy and Ancient. He is Unconquerable, Indistinguishable, Will be in future and is always Present.

ਨ ਰੋਗੰ ਨ ਸੋਗੰ ਸੁ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਨਵੀਨੰ ॥ ਅਜਾਯੰ ਸਹਾਯੰ ਪਰਮੰ ਪ੍ਰਬੀਨੰ ॥੮॥

न रोगं न सोगं सु नितयं नवीनं ॥ अजायं सहायं परमं प्रबीनं ॥८॥

He is without ailment and sorrow and is ever new. He is Birthless, He is the Supporter and is Supremely dexterous.8.

ਸੁ ਭੂਤੰ ਭਵਿਖਯੰ ਭਵਾਨੰ ਭਵੇਯੰ ॥ ਨਮੋ ਨ੍ਰਿਬਿਕਾਰੰ ਨਮੋ ਨ੍ਰਿਜੁਰੇਅੰ ॥

सु भूतं भविखयं भवानं भवेयं ॥ नमो न्रिबिकारं नमो न्रिजुरेअं ॥

He Pervades in the Past, Future and Present. I Salute Him, Who is without vices and without ailments.

ਨਮੋ ਦੇਵ ਦੇਵੰ ਨਮੋ ਰਾਜ ਰਾਜੰ ॥ ਨਿਰਾਲੰਬ ਨਿਤਯੰ ਸੁ ਰਾਜਾਧਿਰਾਜੰ ॥੯॥

नमो देव देवं नमो राज राजं ॥ निराल्मब नितयं सु राजाधिराजं ॥९॥

I Salute Him, Who is the god of gods and king of kings. He is Supportless, Eternal and Greatest of Emperors. 9

ਅਲੇਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ਅਭੂਤੰ ਅਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ॥ ਨ ਰਾਗੰ ਨ ਰੰਗੰ ਨ ਰੂਪੰ ਨ ਰੇਖੰ ॥

अलेखं अभेखं अभूतं अद्वैखं ॥ न रागं न रंगं न रूपं न रेखं ॥

He is Accountless, Guiseless, Elementless and Blemishless. He is without attachment, colour, form and mark.

ਮਹਾ ਦੇਵ ਦੇਵੰ ਮਹਾ ਜੋਗ ਜੋਗੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਕਾਮ ਕਾਮੰ ਮਹਾ ਭੋਗ ਭੋਗੰ ॥੧੦॥

महा देव देवं महा जोग जोगं ॥ महा काम कामं महा भोग भोगं ॥१०॥

He is the Greatest of gods and the Supreme Yogi. He is the Greatest of the rapturous and the greatest of the Ravishing.10.

ਕਹੂੰ ਰਾਜਸੰ ਤਾਮਸੰ ਸਾਤਕੇਯੰ ॥ ਕਹੂੰ ਨਾਰ ਕੇ ਰੂਪ ਧਾਰੇ ਨਰੇਯੰ॥

कहूं राजसं तामसं सातकेयं ॥ कहूं नार के रूप धारे नरेयं॥

Somewhere He bears the quality of rajas (activity), somewhere tamas (morbidity) and somewhere sattva (rhythm). Somewhere He takes the form of a woman and somewhere man.

ਕਹੂੰ ਦੇਵੀਅੰ ਦੇਵਤੰ ਦਈਤ ਰੂਪੰ ॥ ਕਹੂੰ ਰੂਪ ਅਨੇਕ ਧਾਰੇ ਅਨੂਪੰ ॥੧੧॥

कहूं देवीअं देवतं दईत रूपं ॥ कहूं रूप अनेक धारे अनूपं ॥११॥

Somewhere He manifests Himself as a goddess, god and demon. Somewhere He appears in several unique forms.11.

ਕਹੂੰ ਫੂਲ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਭਲੇ ਰਾਜ ਫੂਲੇ ॥ ਕਹੂੰ ਭਵਰ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਭਲੀ ਭਾਂਤਿ ਭੂਲੇ ॥

कहूं फूल ह्वै कै भले राज फूले ॥ कहूं भवर ह्वै कै भली भांति भूले ॥

Somewhere He, taking the form of a flower, is rightly puffed up. Somewhere becoming a black bee, seems inebriated (for the flower).

ਕਹੂੰ ਪਉਨ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਬਹੇ ਬੇਗਿ ਐਸੇ ॥ ਕਹੇ ਮੋ ਨ ਆਵੈ ਕਥੋਂ ਤਾਹਿ ਕੈਸੇ ॥੧੨॥

कहूं पउन ह्वै कै बहे बेगि ऐसे ॥ कहे मो न आवै कथों ताहि कैसे ॥१२॥

Somewhere becoming the wind, moves with such speed, which is indescribable, how can I elucidate it? 12.

ਕਹੂੰ ਨਾਦ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਭਲੀ ਭਾਂਤਿ ਬਾਜੇ ॥ ਕਹੂੰ ਪਾਰਧੀ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਧਰੇ ਬਾਨ ਰਾਜੇ ॥

कहूं नाद ह्वै कै भली भांति बाजे ॥ कहूं पारधी ह्वै कै धरे बान राजे ॥

Somewhere He become a musical instrument, which is played appropriately. Somewhere He becomes a hunter who looks glorious with His arrow (in His bow).

ਕਹੂੰ ਮ੍ਰਿਗ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਕੈ ਭਲੀ ਭਾਂਤਿ ਮੋਹੇ ॥ ਕਹੂੰ ਕਾਮੁਕੀ ਜਿਉ ਧਰੇ ਰੂਪ ਸੋਹੇ ॥੧੩॥

कहूं म्रिग ह्वै कै भली भांति मोहे ॥ कहूं कामुकी जिउ धरे रूप सोहे ॥१३॥

Somewhere He becomes a deer and allures exquisitely. Somewhere He manifests Himself as Cupid`s wife, with impressive beauty.13.

ਨਹੀਂ ਜਾਨ ਜਾਈ ਕਛੂ ਰੂਪ ਰੇਖੰ ॥ ਕਹਾਂ ਬਾਸ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਫਿਰੈ ਕਉਨ ਭੇਖੰ ॥

नहीं जान जाई कछू रूप रेखं ॥ कहां बास ता को फिरै कउन भेखं ॥

His Form and Mark cannot be comprehended. Where doth He live and what guise doth He adopt?

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ਕਹਾ ਨਾਮ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਕਹਾ ਕੈ ਕਹਾਵੈ ॥ ਕਹਾ ਮੈ ਬਖਾਨੋ ਕਹੇ ਮੋ ਨ ਆਵੈ ॥੧੪॥

कहा नाम ता को कहा कै कहावै ॥ कहा मै बखानो कहे मो न आवै ॥१४॥

What is His Name and how he is called? How can I describle? He is Indescribable.14.

ਨ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਕੋਈ ਤਾਤ ਮਾਤੰ ਨ ਭਾਯੰ ॥ ਨ ਪੁਤ੍ਰੰ ਨ ਪੌਤ੍ਰੰ ਨ ਦਾਯਾ ਨ ਦਾਯੰ ॥

न ता को कोई तात मातं न भायं ॥ न पुत्रं न पौत्रं न दाया न दायं ॥

He hath no father, mother and brother. He hath no son, no grandson and no male and female nurses.

ਨ ਨੇਹੰ ਨ ਗੇਹੰ ਨ ਸੈਨੰ ਨ ਸਾਥੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਰਾਜ ਰਾਜੰ ਮਹਾ ਨਾਥ ਨਾਥੰ ॥੧੫॥

न नेहं न गेहं न सैनं न साथं ॥ महा राज राजं महा नाथ नाथं ॥१५॥

He hath no attachment, no home, no army and no companion. He is the Great King of kings and Great Lord of lords.15.

ਪਰਮੰ ਪੁਰਾਨੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰੰ ਪਰੇਯੰ ॥ ਅਨਾਦੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਸੰਭੰ ਅਜੇਯੰ ॥

परमं पुरानं पवित्रं परेयं ॥ अनादं अनीलं अस्मभं अजेयं ॥

He is Supreme, Ancient, Immaculate and in the Yond. He is beginningless. Stainless, Non-existent and Unconquerable.

ਅਭੇਦੰ ਅਛੇਦੰ ਪਵਿਤ੍ਰੰ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਥੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਦੀਨ ਦੀਨੰ ਮਹਾ ਨਾਥ ਨਾਥੰ ॥੧੬॥

अभेदं अछेदं पवित्रं प्रमाथं ॥ महा दीन दीनं महा नाथ नाथं ॥१६॥

He is Indistinguishable, Indestructible, Holy and Paramount. He is the Most Humble of the meek and Great Lord of lords.16.

ਅਦਾਗੰ ਅਦਗੰ ਅਲੇਖੰ ਅਭੇਖੰ ॥ ਅਨੰਤੰ ਅਨੀਲੰ ਅਰੂਪੰ ਅਦ੍ਵੈਖੰ ॥

अदागं अदगं अलेखं अभेखं ॥ अनंतं अनीलं अरूपं अद्वैखं ॥

He is Stainless, Imperishable, Accountless and Guiseless. He is Limitless, Blemishless, Formless and Maliceless.

ਮਹਾ ਤੇਜ ਤੇਜੰ ਮਹਾ ਜ੍ਵਾਲ ਜ੍ਵਾਲੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੰ ਮਹਾ ਕਾਲ ਕਾਲੰ ॥੧੭॥

महा तेज तेजं महा ज्वाल ज्वालं ॥ महा मंत्र मंत्रं महा काल कालं ॥१७॥

He is the Most Effulgent of all lights and Supreme Conflagration of all fires. He is the Supreme Spell of all incantations and Supreme embodiment of Death over all such powers.17.

ਕਰੰ ਬਾਮ ਚਾਪਿਯੰ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਣੰ ਕਰਾਲੰ ॥ ਮਹਾ ਤੇਜ ਤੇਜੰ ਬਿਰਾਜੈ ਬਿਸਾਲੰ ॥

करं बाम चापियं क्रिपाणं करालं ॥ महा तेज तेजं बिराजै बिसालं ॥

He holds the bow in His left hand and the terrible sword (in the right). He is the Supreme Effulgence of all lights and sits in His Great Glory.

ਮਹਾਂ ਦਾੜ੍ਹ ਦਾੜ੍ਹੰ ਸੁ ਸੋਹੰ ਅਪਾਰੰ ॥ ਜਿਨੈ ਚਰਬੀਯੰ ਜੀਵ ਜਗਯੰ ਹਜਾਰੰ ॥੧੮॥

महां दाड़्ह दाड़्हं सु सोहं अपारं ॥ जिनै चरबीयं जीव जगयं हजारं ॥१८॥

He, of Infinite Splendour, is the masher of of the boar-incarnation with great grinder tooth. He crushed and devoured thousands of the creatures of the world.18.

ਡਮਾਡੰਮ ਡਉਰੂ ਸਿਤਾਸੇਤ ਛਤ੍ਰੰ ॥ ਹਾਹਾ ਹੂਹੂ ਹਾਸੰ ਝਮਾਝੱਮ ਅਤ੍ਰੰ ॥

डमाडम डउरू सितासेत छत्रं ॥ हाहा हूहू हासं झमाझ्म अत्रं ॥

The tabor (in the hand of Great Death (KAL) resounds and the black and white canopy swings. Loud laughter emanates from his mouth and the weapons (in his hands) glisten.

ਮਹਾ ਘੋਰ ਸਬਦੰ ਬਜੇ ਸੰਖ ਐਸੰ ॥ ਪ੍ਰਲੈ ਕਾਲ ਕੇ ਕਾਲ ਕੀ ਜ੍ਵਾਲ ਜੈਸੇ ॥੧੯॥

महा घोर सबदं बजे संख ऐसं ॥ प्रलै काल के काल की ज्वाल जैसे ॥१९॥

His conch produces such a terrible sound that appears like the blazing fire of the Death on doomsday.19.

You guys invited Gurinder Mann to speak on stage in California.

How long are his hair?

Thank you very much.

Gurinder Mann admits his mistake and says he will grow hair one day. He does not say like jeonwala , hardev shergill of singhsabha that hair is not required to be kept by a sikh. Shame on you for twisting such a serious issue. Instead you should have clarified your position. Do you side with them?

I wish there was somebody here today (in physical body) with the same high morals and courage as Sri Guru Hargobind Singh ji, then Khalsa Panth wouldn’t be in the predicament of trying decide who its Guru is?

Is Guru harGobind singh ji a new guru of Guru da sikh?

Can you post a link or copy of the invitation sent out to this gang, like Khalsa Fauji has just done?

Sit back and chew it.

http://www.panthic.org/news/125/ARTICLE/3852/2008-01-31.html

Ragi Fails to Show Up for Challenge at Takht Sahib; Banned from Panthic Stages

Thursday 31st of January 2008

Panthic Weekly News Bureau

View more pictures of Panthic Conclave

Massive Conclave by Panthic Organizations and Scholars

Ragi Darshan Singh Fails the Panthic Challenge, Banned by Sangat

Takht Sri Damdama Sahib, Sabo-ki-Talwandi (KP) - At a historic convention, attended by representatives and scholars from dozens of prominent Panthic organizations, unanimous resolutions were passed condemning the recent ramblings by the controversial ragi Darshan Singh in which he had outrightly rejected the Bani of Guru Gobind Singh Ji.

The conclave was organized by Panthic organizations at Takht Sri Damdama Sahib, Sabo-ki-Talwandi on January 31st. The organizers had invited ragi Darshan Singh and his supporters to come to the venue to openly discuss the issues and concerns that they had over Dasam Granth with learned Sikh scholars in a civil manner. Past directives from Sri Akal Takht Sahib strictly forbid unnecessary criticism and debates on Dasam Granth, but allow the option for Panthic scholars to respond to those criticisms.

Ragi a No-Show

As expected, ragi Darshan Singh failed to show up for the discussion at the Takht Sahib convention. Instead, he took out a paid advertisement in a fringe newspaper further condemning the Dasam Granth and touting that even the validity of certain Nitem Banis (daily prayers) are in question.

These types of statements by the ragi have incensed Panthic organizations who attest that the Nitnem Banis written by Guru Gobind Singh Ji are a vital part of the Sikh Panth's Rahit Maryada and do not need any debating by such faithless cynics. They criticized Darshan Singh for not showing up for the Panthic challenge, and labeled him a mere ‘paper tiger’ and hollow puppet of anti-Sikh forces.

While the conference was open to everyone from all sides of the Dasam Granth debate, not a single representative from the ragi camp showed up for the challenge—proving that they could not discuss these issues with the Sangat face-to-face. Scholars present at the conclave brought more than 150 historical and contemporary references in support of Dasam Bani, just in case the cynics wanted to review the material themselves.

During this convention, the following resolutions were passed by the Panthic organizations under the aegis of the Takht Sri Damdama Sahib :

1) All Panthic Jathebandis and Sikh Scholars present at the convention held on January 31, 2008 at Sabo Ki Talwandi denounce the efforts of Prof. Darshan Singh Ragi to malign the status of Sri Dasam Granth.

2) The convention feels that by not attending the debate, Prof. Darshan Singh has accepted his defeat in the challenges posed by Panthic Jathebandis. His absence from the conference proves that he is promoting wrongful propaganda against Sri Dasam Granth Sahib. This further exposes the double standards of Prof. Darshan Singh as in past he has released various recordings of shabads from the Sri Dasam Granth. Such hypocrisy remains a mystery for everyone.

3) The convention held today appeals to the Sikh Sangat residing in Punjab and foreign countries to refrain from communicating with such selfish ‘preachers.’ It is also being pressed that the Delhi Sikh Gurdwara Management Committee refrains from allowing such charlatans to convey misinformation from Gurdwara Sahibs.

4) Sikh masses present at the convention are open to discuss the contents of Sri Dasam Granth with individuals ignorant on the topic at any time in future.

The Sikh organizations requested that the controversial ragi not be allowed to utilize Panthic stages at any Gurdwara Sahib worldwide and have also further requested that he be summoned by Sri Akal Takht Sahib for his blasphemous behavior.

Speakers and Scholars at the Convention

More than a dozen scholars from various Panthic organizations spoke on this occasion, in support of Guru Gobind Singh's Bani,. Universally, they condemned the ragi's recent comments on Dasam Bani, and requested action be taken by Sri Akal Takht Sahib according to Panthic norms and guidelines.

Jathedar Nandgarh addressing the Panthic Conclave

The speakers included :

Jathedar Giani Balwant Singh Nandgarh (Takht Sri Damdama Sahib) - Jathedar Balwant Singh was the first speaker to address the conclave at this historic Takht. He declared that ragi Darshan Singh’s use of derogatory language against Dasam Granth would not be tolerated by the Panth, and then gave permission for the scholars to address the Sangat.

Bhai Gopal Singh (Swami Brahdev) - In his speech, Bhai Sahib took exception to ragi Darshan Singh misquoting the Gurbani of Gur Ram Das Sahib Ji in a recent advertisement where he refers to those who believe in Dasam Patshah’s Bani as lost manmukhs. Darshan Singh had paid the ex-communicated Spokesman newspaper editor Joginder Sahney to print an advertisement in which certain Gurbani panktis were misquoted. Bhai Gopal Singh then shared the real interpretation of those panktis with the Sangat and stated that it was individuals such as Darshan Singh who are misguided and not the Sangat.

He then shared verses from Bachittar Natak and Chritropakyan with complementary verses from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji that have the same central theme and message. He concluded his lecture, by listing the names of scholars and intellectuals with university degrees in connection to Dasam Granth from various universities.

Note : Bhai Gopal Singh’s is often referred to as Swami Brahdev, which was his original name. He took Amrit at Sri Akal Takht Sahib during the 1980’s on behest of Baba Avtar Singh of Badhni-kalan when Darshan Singh was the acting Jathedar.

Dr. Anokh Singh - Spoke on the correlation of the concept of Miri-Piri between Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and the Dasam Granth with regards to the correlation between Sri Harmandir Sahib and Sri Akal Takht Sahib. He stated that saroops of Dasam Granth have historically existed at the Sikh Takhts and are both symbols of Khalsa ‘s Miri.

Note : Dr. Anokh Singh is also a close realtive of Baba Gurbachan Singh Khalsa Bhinderanwale.

Giani Sher Singh Ambala Ji Nihang – Giani Ji presented to the Sangat copies of commercial cassettes released by Prof. Darshan Singh containing Bani from Dasam Granth. Giani queried the Sangat, "why did ragi Darshan Singh profit from selling the Bani of Dasam Granth?" He asked, if the Sangat is now being called misguided RSS agents for reciting Dasam Patshah’s Bani, was Prof. Darshan Singh also an RSS agent when he was profiteering personally from the same verses of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s Bani ? Was Prof. Darshan Singh also being paid by the RSS as he is now accusing us of doing? He further challenged to debate the ragi anywhere he wanted in the future.

Giani Sher Singh Ambala also made a startling allegation that during the 1980’s ragi Darshan Singh used to recite Kirtan in a style that would appeal to the youth so they would join the Kharkoo Singhs (freedom fighters) of that time, and then used to report information about those youths to the intelligence agencies and the police.

Bhai Ratinder Singh Indore (GURSIKH Organization) – Bhai Sahib presented Hukmanas from Dr. Ganda Singh’s famous book “HukamNamas” which refer to Bhai Gurdas Ji II in at least three HukamNamas. Ragi Darshan Singh has repeatedly stated that Bhai Gurdas Ji II has never historically existed. Bhai Sahib also stated that the notion of labeling Dasam Granth as an RSS granth is truly irrational. Bhai Sahib stated that Krishan in Krishana Avtar is referred to as a keet (insect) and shown as a characterless drug addict. In Rama Avtar, Ram is shown in a similar manner along with being a ruthless and merciless king who eliminated his rivals by any means possible. Why would the RSS promote a Granth that is so critical of these demigods, Bhai Sahib questioned.

Bhai Sahib further stated that it is the RSS who truly wants the Sikhs to reject Dasam Granth, since it is harmful to them not to us. It is the critics who are the ones that are pleasing to the RSS. He noted an example of the ex-communicated writer Bhag Singh Ambala who also wrote against Dasam Granth. Bhag Singh Ambala was a known admirer of Krishan, and after reading Krishana Avtar, Bhag Singh complained that Guru Gobind Singh Ji would never write anything against Krishan, so this could not be His Bani.

Bhai Gurbakhsh Singh Mohali - Spoke on the technical aspects of Dasam Granth, the numbering of verses, and many missing portions. Bhai Sahib queried that if the Dasam Granth was the work of ‘Brahmins’ then why did not those clever Brahmins give us complete scriptures? It is an historic fact that Bhai Mani Singh Ji compiled the works of Guru Gobind Singh Ji into a single volume, and noted that some portions were not available or missing, due to the loss the Panth incurred during the evacuation of Anandpur Sahib.

Dr. Anurag Singh - Noted that some of the stories mentioned in the charittars have also been mentioned in Islamic and Sanatan scriptures, and therefore have a historic basis. They have been presented in Charitropakhiyan for guidance purposes. In a dare to test his actual knowledge on Gurmat, Dr. Anurag Singh challenged that if ragi Darshan Singh is a true scholar then I request him to accurately identify 11 differences within Yoga and Sikhism as referenced in the 27,28,29,30 pauris of Japji Sahib.

Baba Baljit Singh Damdami Taksal (Dadu Sahib Wale) – Bhai Sahib also spoke on the glory of Dasam Granth and chastised those who are challenging it’s authenticity. He requested that strict action be action against those individuals.

Bhai Mohkam Singh Ludhiana (Akhand Kirtani Jatha) - Bhai Sahib stated that it is shameful for ragi Darshan Singh to allege that if we believe in Dasam Bani, then we do not respect Guru Granth Sahib Ji. He countered, that in 1978 Singhs from the Akhand Kirtani Jatha and the Damdami Taksal sacrificed their lives for the sanctity of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, and they were ready to do that again if the need arises. He asked ragi Darshan Singh and his missionaries if they could show a single sacrifice they had made for the sanctity of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Note: Bhai Mohkam Singh's brother Bhai Gurcharan Singh became Shaheed in 1978 during the Nirankari Vaisakhi Massacre.

Other speakers include :

Bhai Amrik Singh Singh Damdami Taksal, and Bhai Gurdev Singh Damdami Taksal, and Bhai Nagar Singh represented the various Nihang Singh Dals who all spoke on the significance of Dasam Granth and recommended strict action against those who criticize it.

Videos of all speakers will be uploaded in next week’s issue.

Clarification: It is from Amrit Kirtan attributed to Dasam Patshah, Sri Guru Gobind Singh ji. And you consider every literature attributed to Dasam Patshah as Dasam Granth.

No it is not. This question was asked from kala afghana when he stayed at a sikh's house in california. Singh asked him this question. Kala afghana replied the word is from Sarb loh granth. Singh had copy of sarb loh granth with him. He told kala afghana to show him where it is.

Kala afghna was confused. he had never seen Sarbloh granth in his life. He got angry. He has not seen even Dasam granth.

I don't know, a lot of the Dasam Granth seems to be reworkings of pre-existing mythology/folk stories.

For all we know the collection could be literature from the time of Guru Gobind Singh including compositions by him as well as others he commissioned?

For instance the Chandi sections are apparently reworkings of Markandeya purana.

Can anyone also explain why the Chadhi stories are provided in both a Panjabi version as well as Braj ones please? Could this not indicate a desire to make such literature accesible to the masses?

Hikayats

HIKAYAT is the title given to the eleven tales, in Persian verse but in GURMUKHI letters, in the Dasam GRANTH, immediately after the Zafamamah. The title `Hikayat` does not occur in the actual text, but most of the tales have a verse, coming after two or three invocational lines in the beginning, which contains the phrase ` hikdyat shumdem` (we have heard the story of...). Hikdyat, being the plural of Hikdyat (story, tale), is adopted as the title for these tales. Each tale is meant to emphasize a moral lesson. The subject matter of the tales is in keeping with the literary taste and style of medieval India and ranges from the romantic and chivalrous to the fantastic and the macabre. Six of these eleven tales are Hindi tales retold in Persian. Hikayat 4 is Chritra 52 of the Chritropdkhydn, where an intrepid ran? defeats the obdurate Raja Subhat SINGH in battle in order to marry him. Hikayat 5 is the Persian version of Chritra 267. Some other stories from Chritropdkhydn have likewise found their way into these hikdyat. All the verses as well as hikdyatsare numbered, but hikdyat one is not traceable. The first talc which comes after the Zafarndmah is numbered two. Some scholars have suggested that Zafamamah proper should be treated as hikdyat number one while others give number one to the first four verses occurring at the beginning of hikdyat two. These verses arc in praise of God and are mainly in Sanskritised Braj.

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Hikayats

Stick to the topic of pen names of guru sahib. You can start another thread for other compositions of dasam granth.

Anti dasam granth people need to prove if belief system of poets Ram and shyam was different than sikh thought. If their belief is in line with sikh thought then these are pen names of Guru sahib. If in doubt read invocations where these names come.

I never heard about the part about him locking door on nihungs but he didn't go to Akaal Takht because Akaal Takht never called him. It was just Dhumaa and other nihungs thugs who were calling him. These also said they would kill Jaswinder if he shows up at Akaal Takht. Like I said before, why should he go when there was just going to be gundaa gardee? You said it yourself that there were thousands of these nihungs and dhummas. What did you need thousands for? I have no clue about the 2nd incident. Also, Dasam Granth Vichar manch Faridabaad just gave a challenge to debate. Take you 96 year old nihung baba from 96 crore budda dal to debate in Faridabaad. Those guys are always ready.

ਬੀਬੀ ਬਸੰਤ ਕੌਰ, ਫ਼ਰੀਦਾਬਾਦ

ਮਲਕੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਚੈਲੰਜ ਨੂੰ ਕਬੂਲਦਿਆਂ ਕਿਹਾ, ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਕਿਸੇ ਵੀ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਉਪਰ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਮੰਚ ਵੱਲੋਂ ੧੧ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦਾ ਪੈਨਲ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਕਰਣ ਲਈ ਤਿਆਰ ਹੈ। : ਸ. ਉਪਕਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ

(ਬੀਬੀ ਬਸੰਤ ਕੌਰ, ਫ਼ਰੀਦਾਬਾਦ)

ਹਰੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਰੰਧਾਵੇ ਦੇ ਚੇਲੇ ਅਤੇ ਬਾਦਲ ਦਲੀਏ ਮਲਕੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਅਖਬਾਰਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ “ਪੰਜ ਤਖ਼ਤਾਂ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਕਿਸੇ ਵੀ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਉਤੇ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥੀ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਖੁਲ੍ਹੀ ਬਹਿਸ ਦਾ ਚੈਲੰਜ” ਇਸ਼ਤਿਹਾਰ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਸ਼ਨ ਉਤੇ ਪ੍ਰਤੀਕਰਮ ਕਰਦਿਆਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਸਮਰਪੱਤ ਜੱਥੇਬੰਦੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਮੰਚ ਇੰਟਰਨੈਸ਼ਨਲ ਦੇ ਕਨਵੀਨਰ ਸ. ਉਪਕਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਵਿੱਚ ਦਰਜ਼ ਬਾਣੀ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਦੁਬਿਧਾਵਾਂ ਦੇ ਹਲ ਲਈ ਵਿਚਾਰ-ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ ਨਾ ਕਿ ਬਹਿਸ। ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਨਿਉਯਾਰਕ ਵਿਖੇ ਹਰੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਰੰਧਾਵੇ ਅਤੇ ਪ੍ਰੋਫੈਸਰ ਦਰਸ਼ਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਹੋਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ-ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਨੂੰ ਸ਼ੁਰੂ ਹੋਣ ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹੀ ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਦਾ ਇਹ ਕਹਿ ਕੇ ਭੋਗ ਪਾ ਦੇਣਾ ਕਿ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਇਸ ਦੀ ਇਜ਼ਾਜ਼ਤ ਨਹੀਂ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਤਾਂ ਇਸ ਸਾਰੀ ਘਟਨਾਕ੍ਰਮ ਪਿੱਛੇ ਸਾਧ ਰੰਧਾਵੇ ਦੀ ਬਹਾਨੇਖੋਰੀ ਹੀ ਜਾਪਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਦੇ ਜਿਸ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮੇ ਦਾ ਸਹਾਰਾ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਸਾਧ ਰੰਧਾਵਾ ਵਿਚਾਰਾਂ ਕਰਣ ਤੋਂ ਭੱਜ ਉਠਿਆ, ਉਹ ਸਨ ੨੦੦੦ ਦਾ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮਾ ਸੀ ਜਦਕਿ ੨੦੦੬ ਦੇ ਨਵੇਂ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਜੋਗਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਵੇਦਾਂਤੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥੀ ਪਹਿਲਵਾਨਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਤੱਤ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਦੇ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਜੁਆਬ ਦੇਣ ਲਈ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮਾ ਜਾਰੀ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਲਈ ਹਰੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਰੰਧਾਵਾ ਅਤੇ ਉਸ ਦੀ ਜੁੰਡਲੀ ਜੋ ਨਿਉਯਾਰਕ ਵਿਖੇ ੨੫ ਮਈ ਨੂੰ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਦਾ ਸਹਾਰਾ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਛੱਡ ਗਏ ਸਨ ਉਹ ਭਗੋੜੇ ਹਨ।

ਸ. ਉਪਕਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਜਿਹੜਾ ਹਰੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਰੰਧਾਵੇ ਵਾਲਾ ਨਿਉਯਾਰਕ ਵਿਖੇ ਹੋਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਬਹਿਸ ਨੂੰ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮਨਾਮੇ ਦਾ ਸਹਾਰਾ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਛੱਡ ਆਇਆ ਤੇ ਆਖਦਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਵਿਸ਼ੇ ਤੇ ਬਹਿਸ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਰੋਕ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਹੁਣ ਕੀ ਮਲਕੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਅਤੇ ਹਰੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਰੰਧਾਵੇ ਨੇ ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਤੋਂ ਪ੍ਰਵਾਨਗੀ ਲੈ ਲਈ ਹੈ? ਜਾਂ ਆਪਣੀ ਸ਼ਾਖ ਬਚਾਉਣ ਲਈ ਸਿਰਫ ਇਸ਼ਤਿਹਾਰਬਾਜ਼ੀ ਕਰ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ। ਸ. ਉਪਕਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ, ਨੇ ਸਰਦਾਰ ਮਲਕੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਚੈਲੰਜ ਨੂੰ ਕਬੂਲਦਿਆਂ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਬੰਧੀ ਕਿਸੇ ਵੀ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਉਪਰ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਮੰਚ ਵੱਲੋਂ ੧੧ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦਾ ਪੈਨਲ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਗੋਸ਼ਟੀ ਕਰਣ ਲਈ ਤਿਆਰ ਹੈ ਜੇਕਰ ਇਸ ਦਾ ਸਿੱਧਾ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਰਣ ਟੀ. ਵੀ ਚੈਨਲਾਂ ਰਾਹੀਂ ਕਰਵਾਉਣ ਦਾ ਪ੍ਰਬੰਧ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾਏ ਤਾਂ ਜੁ ਸੱਚ-ਝੂਠ ਦਾ ਨਿਬੇੜਾ ਸਿੱਖ ਸੰਗਤਾਂ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਸਾਮੂਹਿਕ ਤੌਰ `ਤੇ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾ ਸਕੇ।

http://thesikhaffairs.org/contact.html

Fauj

This gang was invited to damdama sahib where there was a conference held for this purpose. Nobody showed up. What debate these idiots will have when they ask why there is no mention of khalsa initiation in dasam granth.

Why do you say namaste?

He has wished you correctly. Your organization Singhsabha or better call it anti-singh sabha say that keshas are not required for a sikh. They keep keshas because of cultural tag and not as rehat. ask me reference?

"I don't want to get into aatmaa concept now or what aatmaa means."

What are you talking here? Your gang of atheists do not believe in atma and you are talking about atma.

That is next point of contention with you guys as you guys interpret SGGS ji in a totally different and anti gurmat way.

They have only translated it, the article is by Piara Singh Padam.

The irony is that randip does not know who is Paira singh padam.

Fauji

Remove khalsa from your name as it is unsuitable for you. Why did not you reply my post that unmasks your earlier claim about rehatnama of Bhai Dya singh ji. It is reproduced below

quote

Rehatnama of Bhai Dya singh ji does mention five banis for a khalsa. These are Japji sahib, Jaap sahib, Chaupai sahib, swaiyes and anand sahib. It is right on first page itself.

inder Singh, I know you can't debate because you aren't allowed to. You are doing your job very well to be honored but bring you game to live debate.

Inder singh is living abroad for the last over 30 years and is a qualified professional. He need not stoop to the level of your ill educated ilk who have neither formal education nor any spiritual strength. He is not a saleable commodity like policeman kala afghana , Darshan ragi and jeonwala.

Jaswinder SIngh gave an open challenge that anyone who proves Dasam Granth to be the work of Guru Gobind SIngh Ji will get 1 crore rupees in victory. How come no one has accepted his challenge? What is the problem? Spokesman is always ready to put headlines related to dasam granth to get something done. Why don't you get your scholars and tell them to issue statement. There will be gentlemen ready to debate your hand picked dudes.

A typical lie by so called misiionary nastic. This jaswinder singh agreed to debate the issue at akal takhat. Date and time was fixed. he never turned up and neither he had the courtesy to inform them that he was not coming.

Understandable but weren’t the likes of Sainapat, Nand Lal, Daya Singh, Chaupa Singh, etc. also there? Didn’t they also take Amrit with other Sikhs? Before calling other ridiculous and childish, look at own comments first also.

Rehatnama of Bhai Dya singh ji does mention five banis for a khalsa. These are Japji sahib, Jaap sahib, Chaupai sahib, swaiyes and anand sahib. It is right on first page itself.