kaur @ gurus feet

wjkk,wjkf

although it is rare & prehaps shouldn't be, there are / have been a few women who have stood in for the seva of paanj piaarai; though they are few & far between.

remember the ppl doing this seva are a representation of the paanj piaarai, not the paanj piaarai themselves.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

in responce to guv;

there was a band of 50 sikhs camped out... when one of their look outs saw an army of a few thousand moghuls heading their way. the singhs were hugely outnumbered, so they used their wits & took off their kacchere & put them out so that from a distance they looked like tents. when the moghuls could see them they thought there must be at least 500 sikhs in front of them, got scared & turned away!!

:?

i beg to differ; kachere wern't used as tents, the singhs hung up spare ones to look as if they were drying, as they did with their kichere after having ishnaan [wash] hence the opposition thought there were more soldiers at the camp then there actually were.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

...clap ur hands?!...

show it to who? things shouldn't be done for 'show' especially when its concerning sikhi. its important to be sincere. a relationship with your guru is a very personal one.

concerning physical appearance, we have been blessed with a very distinct identity; Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji wanted His singhs to be visable in crowds of thousands, which has been achieved; we've been blessed with a beautiful roop.

if you have piaar for sikhi then begin by showing it through doing your paath, trying to understand it, be a chardi kalaa person & attempt to change small things about yourself to encapsulate sikhi.

probably a failed attempt to approach your question; let me know.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

agree with Steel Bangle & truthsingh paaji. well said. this isn't a very easy topic to approach but i think u've both hit the nail on the head.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

dear Undergroundsikhi,

Sikhi was there b4 Guru Nanak

Guru Nanank Dev Ji is the founder of sikhi; how do u come to the conclusion that sikhi was there b4 Him? :?

don't mean to be picky, im genuinely interested.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf.

i've got to be complicated & say that i don't prefer any one style of kirtan; i can listen, enjoy & hopefully gain from a whole scope of styles; for me the style doesn't have as much of an effect on my appreciation - whats important & usually out of this world, is when the satsangat sing with their heart. the tune, then seems to become irrelivant.

:wink:

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf.

thank u so much for sorting the truth from the myths.

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

i agree that we should never paint everyone from any community with the same brush, as my veer stated previously. every basket as a few bad apples as well as good ones.

though i will say this; i don't treat anyone differently, i always approach everyone with respect. BUT subconsciously i have got a barrier esp. when it comes to ppl of the muslim faith, solely because from my past observations i have recognised that the vast majority have a secret agenda that has been drilled into them as kids till they're grown; the supremacy of their own religion & the fact that they supposedly get a ticket straight to heaven if they convert just one person to Islam in their life time.

want an example?

* having a relationship with a girl then when the time comes of marriage to state they have to convert to Islam & the kids will be taught according to that faith.

Up to now no ones messed with me, probably because its obvious i'm gonna live & die trying to become worthy of calling myself a member f the 'khalsa paanth' & stating my father to be 'Guru Gobind Singh Ji'

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

i've really have had enough of this topic, has any of this squabbling actually helped u Sikh Soulja? :? At the end of the day a person will do what they want reguardless. hence we fall into the many cycles of lifetimes due to karam.

u may be blind to the truth or u might b ignoring / refusing it; but don't distort sikhi / gurbani teachings to suit ur own opinion. i've mentioned this b4 & can't stress it enough.

wot's there left to say?

...

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

dear maha akal;

You said it you treat them with same "respect as bros, sisters, mum and dads"

What about the one you marry? what happens then?

reguarding this question all i have to say is the following:

the point of treating sum1 with same respect as a bro / sis simply means to treat them with a certain amount of curtesy & putting up certain restrictions to ur involvement with them ( ie u wouldn't flirt with ur own bro or sis would u?! :shock: ) obviously this boundry doesn't apply to ur spose (husband / wife) but that is only with one special sum1.

Where your evidance we can'nt enter "premarital activities b4 marriage"

reguarding the evidence needed from which my conclusions have been drawn plz pay attention to jasaa veer jis 2 posts on page 2 of this descussion as he explains it very well:

both post dates on Sat May 03

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

completely agree with u kaur1699 panji.

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

hmm, a sikh is wat/who i am, and panjabi is about where my family originate from... both go hand in hand...

i agree with u kaur1699,

but in my heart i give more importance to sikhi. the main reason i give my origins respect r the following reasons;

*my gurus walked that ground, we have history there reguarding gurdwarai etc.

*the amount sikhs sacrificed for that country eg fighting for freedom from the british empire.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

answering ur question in ur earlier post about what the RSS r:

the RSS r not sikhs;

RSS stands for 'Rashtriya Sawayamsevak Sangh'. they r a hindu-nationalist organisation, clearly NOT sikhs.

they r dangerous ppl who distort sikhi, trying to merge it into hindu rituals.

below is an extract i got from www.akj.org:

it may b a little long but i have taken & compied the most important parts, plz take the time out to read it.

Shame of Bradford Vaisakhi - Sikhs are hindus - Sewa Atta (president of Leeds Rd Gurdwara )...

... In what was a pre-planned move the route of the nagar keertan which visits all Gurdwaras in Bradford, was deliberately changed only 36 hours before the nagar keertan. The route changed was specifically done by Sewa Atta, president of Leeds Rd Gurdwara to ensure that the nagar keertan stops at the Hindu mandir of bradford...

...It should be noted this is not any normal mandir, but what is commonly known as the most right wing Mandir in Uk...

...During the Nagar keertan, yesterday, these same RSS fanatics were allowed to put floral necklaces around the Panj Pyares, even though in their own literature, they state the milk of a cow is higher than amrit from the Panj Pyares. They then did Hindu jakaras, "Ram Ki jai",...

...Then most shamefully of all they were allowed by Sewa Atta and his cohorts to sprinkle water and petals over the Sahib Siri Guru Granth Sahib...

...The RSS leaders were grinning wide for after many years of trying they finally managed to get the Nagar keertan to come to their militant mandir creating a Precedent...

origin: forum :Disgusting and sad (if true)

[a later post in this forum confirms this to be true.]

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

couldn't agree with u more Harps.

with all of these divisions in sikhi, prehaps its better to not have a 'khalistan'; these divisions would make an already extremely difficult job [if done successfully] close to impossible.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

Seva is all about giving of urself

simple, precise & beautifully written.

u've caught the essence of seva in just a few simple words.

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

dear N30 S!INGH

there is a difference between sangat and sat-sang???

after asking around i withdrew these definitions

sangat: group of ppl

satsangat: congregation focusing on bani / kirtan / talking about sikhi

satsang: the bani / kirtan

so by being a part of a satsangat u will achieve satsang. :wink:

therefore u r completely right, satsangat is more important then sangat.

thanx 4 stating that theres a diff. 4give my ignorance.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf.

wjkk,wjkf

dear maha akal.

That worked back in the old days when you was just given someone to marry but now the way arranged marriges are now I believe it does not apply now.

:?

we're not chattin about marriage, we're chattin about relationships with the opposite sex which arn't innocent ie girlfriend / boyfriend.

gurbani states what mannerisms we r meant 2 treat the opposite sex with, plz look at my earlier reply.

1. No halal meat

2. No tobacco

3. No cutting your hair

4. No adultery

So wheres the problem with going out with someone you like?

veerji, i say this with the utmost respect 2 u;

believing in sumthins relavence is your opinion & i can respect that. but accept bani / the gurus teachings for what they r. don't purposely pick & choose to try & justify ur thoughts if they don't comply.

once again, i say this with respect, not venom; so plz accept it as constructive critism as oppose 2 anythin negative from my part.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf.

i agree with the most part of what my veer N3O S!NGH states.

however veer i don't agree in particular this statement that u made;

but inorder for you to do ...you need to be alone.. that is a must... that is a really really must!!!!!!!!!!...

we've been told that sangat is VERY important. i can tell u 4rm experience that when im alone at home & decide to do a bit of simran / kirtan, i can neva experience the same anand (peace/fulfilment) as when there are a few people around me.

take simran for example; play the simpliest tune but concentrate on the pronounciation of 'waheguru' once everyone begins 2 sing 2gtha, emphasising on the same place & become 1 voice... 8) waheguruuuu... 8)

this atmosphere can neva b created without that sangat.

---->@

answering Sikh_Soulja; i agree that ppl a disrespecting the khanda, & cheapening it by makin it a 'fashion item,' ur also right in stating that we lack knowledge & these things need 2 b rectified & taught to the sikh generation of 2mro...

...paaji, look in the right places & things look a lot different. :wink:

bhul chuf maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

2 answer ur question i'll refer back to my greeting;

"waheguru ji ka khalsa, waheguru ji ki fateh"

translated this means the following;

The Kings' [God] servants, the Khalsa chosen Ones, belongs to the Glorious Master [God] He is the truth & Truth triumphs now.

Its the will of our father Guru Gobind Singh Ji that the khalsa was born; i have no worries about sikhism surviving the ages. sikhi has already survived a great deal & is recognised for its practicality.

For instance our gurus have stated things that were later scientifically proven ie that there are millions of stars / planets in the universe which was contrary 2 popular belief.

I think we shouldn't worry about what 2mro will bring, but instead face what challanges us as individuals, as well as an community & with guru jis bakshish, conquer it.

hope this helps! :wink:

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

i'll put this as clearly as i can;

firstly all our gurus all got married; they all lived by being our example of the way to conduct ourselves.

maharaj sggs ji states, that by living within society & carrying out our duties [ie raising a family, doing our nitnem] u effectively gain more bhagti then the yogis who live away from society to devote their lifetime to nothin but bhagti. 8) :wink:

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

its about guru jis bakshish;

i can't stress enough how important it is to have piaar for sikhi;

there are so many unneccassary divisions within sikhi; we end up battling with the ppl who we should be standing with, shoulder to shoulder; about the correct rehat. :cry:

our relationship with our guru is a personnal one, in which no other can take affair in.

i took amrit a few yrs ago; & only decided to do so only the nite b4... sumthin clicked & made sense to me... i know for a fact that i have made many mistakes & probably have not even lived one day doing everything correctly thus personifying sikhi. but how many among us can say they do?

ur heart needs to be in the right place; u need piaar.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

prehaps it's not the amount of gurdwarai we should be concerned about, but rather the ppl who r meant 2 b lookin out 4 it ie the committee members.

i've had a few brushes with some members; just by simply requesting sumthin that should/n't be done automatically. the outcome of these efforts r fruitless.

gurdwarai generate a lot of money but i'm afraid 2 say that i'm very sceptical about whether 100% is used for the good of the sangat, i think it is more realistic to state that majority of committe members 'sponge' off of it. :x

:cry: plz 4give my negativity; but i'm in 2 minds whether to name & shame these ppl or to let them be... :cry:

i'll finish by saying:

weeds can't be cut; but need to be pulled out by their roots; but if ur neighbour hasn't delt with their weeds; the seeds will blow ova & replant themselves.

...i'm not sure if this problem can eva b truely sorted :cry:

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

i drink blood

wot?! :shock:

y do u do that?!

will u plz elaborate & 4give my ignorance.

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf

dearest khalsa ji,

I think its a good thing to have a girlfriend.. in my experience, the guru himself gives you a girlfriend and the guru himself protects you from crossing a limit.

im almost 100% certain that guru has written nothin pro girlfriend / boyfriend relationship;

i think u've misinterpreted bani which states that after marriage, the couple is "one soul in two bodies" rather then being seperate & individual.

plz correct me if im wrong.

wjkk,wjkf

wjkk,wjkf.

if u want a straight answer, then here it is;

no :!:

we r told to conduct ourselves in a specific way;

~>treat our elders with the same respect as we do for our parents

~>treat ppl of our own age with the same respect as bros / sisters

~>treat youngsters with the same respect as we would our own daughters / sons.

its common knowledge that we should not enter any marital activities b4 marriage, so y do ppl think that its ok to date? :?

this is probably wot u guys don't want 2 hear, but its the word of the guru.

bhul chuk maaf

wjkk,wjkf