Guest Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Hanuman was gifted kachera is also written by Sant ji in book (Pg. 62 of Gurbani Paath Darshan) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh123456777 Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Which book did sant gurbachan Singh write? Never mind n30 paaji just said it Edited April 12, 2015 by Singh123456777 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh123456777 Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Hanuman was gifted kachera is also written by Sant ji in book (Pg. 62 of Gurbani Paath Darshan)is there anything wrong with this? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Why did you keep asking me the source and now you say is there anything wrong with it? I am off this thread, both of you show no signs of willing to learn. I have disproven Gurbachan Singhs many fake claims which he merely copied from older books without researching but you guys think its okay. Might as well believe Guru ji did atam hatya because Gurbilas says so. whats wrong with it :/ WJKK WJKF 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 * Guru might have married multiple women but Gurbachan Singh is saying something baseless without any historical evidence. Many Babas are known to sprout such stories out of nowhere to encharm the masses. There is no logical explanation for an 11 or 13 year old boy marrying 7 sisters. And what were the ages of those girls then? The fact is not about question the Gurus but questioning people making false claims about the Gurus without any historical evidence, so many centuries later. During those times, child marriages were common. A girl would be married at a very young age but she would stay with her parents till she matured. Then, the in-laws would come to receive her. There is reference to it in Gurbani too. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh123456777 Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Why did you keep asking me the source and now you say is there anything wrong with it? I am off this thread, both of you show no signs of willing to learn. I have disproven Gurbachan Singhs many fake claims which he merely copied from older books without researching but you guys think its okay. Might as well believe Guru ji did atam hatya because Gurbilas says so. whats wrong with it :/ WJKK WJKFi asked is there anything wrong with what sant Ji wrote by saying hanuman was gifted a kashehra 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Why did you keep asking me the source and now you say is there anything wrong with it? I am off this thread, both of you show no signs of willing to learn. I have disproven Gurbachan Singhs many fake claims which he merely copied from older books without researching but you guys think its okay. Might as well believe Guru ji did atam hatya because Gurbilas says so. whats wrong with it :/ WJKK WJKF Bro, don't get agitated. You need to explain what is wrong with Sri Hanumaan jee wearing a Kachera, which was gifted to him by Sri Ram Chandar jee? Brahmins and yogis also kept kesh before Satguru jee came to this earth in human form. So, what's all the fuss about? Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 12, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 * Gurbachan Singh lied regarding Muhammad, the audio is straight on the link (to this very forum) I posted. He just reiterated what he read somewhere, without actually researching it. He did same when making tall claims about bhagats reincarnating. God willing, I will try to find the truth regarding this matter. Srimaan 108 Sant Gyani Gurbachan Singh jee Khalsa Bhindrawale can never lie. Even an ordinary person is scared to tell a lie. Here, we are talking about a Brahamgyani. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) I get the impression you are fairly young and have been subject to a lot of cultural influence that put women beneath men. So you look purposely to interpret Sikhi as also putting women beneath men. I can tell in your wording and tone that you consider yourself above me simply because you have male genitalia. I don't consider myself above you at all. In fact, you are a way better person than me. Dogs and cats like me, are born and die everyday. Having said the above, Gurmat cannot be changed to suit to human weaknesses such as sexual pleasures, drug pleasures, food pleasures, praise pleasures, etc Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 12, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I have a question for you bro. What is the arth of this tuk according to you? socY soic n hoveI jy socI lK vwr ] 'Sochai soch' has several meanings, some say its 'thinking, thought' others say soch as in sucham 'outer purity'. But these are the akhree arths of that tuk. If you follow the above akhree arths, why don't you follow the akhree arth of the below mentioned tuk. ਸੂਹਾ ਰੰਗੁ ਵਿਕਾਰੁ ਹੈ ਕੰਤੁ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ਜਾਇ The red color is vain and useless; it cannot help you obtain your Husband Lord. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 But these are the akhree arths of that tuk. If you follow the above akhree arths, why don't you follow the akhree arth of the below mentioned tuk. ਸੂਹਾ ਰੰਗੁ ਵਿਕਾਰੁ ਹੈ ਕੰਤੁ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ਜਾਇ The red color is vain and useless; it cannot help you obtain your Husband Lord. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Its fundamental mistake to apply gurbani updesh across the board without the contextualization, relative bachan specific to historical-uthanka or updesh to jaigaso based on their state of mind: Lal rang is also mentioned in gurbani as sign of love- Lal rang tis koi laga jis vadbhaga One is dyed in color of lord loves(inner) outer lal(lali),by great good furtune male kadae na hovaie neh lagaie dagga This color is never mudddied, no stain ever sticks to it If sikhs are staunchly against red, then how come they don't do two things: 1) remove red color rumalaie from sri guru granth sahib ji 2) have so much bhang just like shiv so "manmati color"- red as color of blood in their veins can turn into blue. You see you cannot run away from red color, can you? its in our blood veins..hell we embody it as long as we have this body 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnSikhGirl Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Pappiman, but you are saying that because you have a penis you believe yourself more entitled to do things than I am. How could the Gurus work so hard to remove all discrimination against caste, etc., make the statement that everyone are equal, while still condoning discrimination based on gender? Because like it or not, barring anyone from anything based merely on what parts they have in their pants, is discrimination. It's no different than telling someone they can't do something because of their skin colour or caste. Wouldn't this make the Gurus hypocrites? I for one, do not believe the Gurus were hypocrites! Gurbani says God resides in ALL equally. It even specifies the divine light is within the male and female equally. It goes even further to state that God IS the male and God IS the female! Using your logic, a slave should be happy if he's given a piece of food and should never want freedom... Because hey he was given something he didn't have before and other slaves don't have food. Nevermind that what he wants is to be free and seen as equal to his captors. He should just be happy that he was given "some" rights. Anyone can see how this is just plain wrong. So why is it never wrong if it's women that are the ones being discriminated against?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Its fundamental mistake to apply gurbani updesh across the board without the contextualization, relative bachan specific to historical-uthanka: Lal rang is also mentioned in gurbani as sign of love- Lal rang tis koi laga jis vadbhaga One is dyed in color of lord loves(inner) outer lal(lali),by great good furtune male kadae na hovaie neh lagaie dagga This color is never mudddied, no stain ever sticks to it If sikhs are staunchly against red, then how come they don't do two things: 1) remove red color rumalaie from sri guru granth sahib ji 2) have so much bhang just like shiv so "manmati color"- red as color of blood can turn into blue. Good question bro. God willing, I will try to find out the answer for it. There is a sakhi which states that, once tenth master wore a red turban and was looking very handsome. There was a lady who got sexually attracted to Satguru jee. Maharaaj had to jump out of the window to escape. After that, he declared that Singhs should not wear red clothes. I will try to find the video link for it. The sakhi was narrated by a Mahapurakh. With regards to red rumallay, as I had said earlier, we cannot apply Gurbani tuks to Satguru jee. Satguru jee can do whatever he wants. Like for example, Satguru jee wore gold ornaments, but Khalsa is not suppose to wear Gold. Secondly, Satguru jee had multiple wives, but we are not allowed to practice polygamy. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 12, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Pappiman, but you are saying that because you have a penis you believe yourself more entitled to do things than I am. I am not entitled to more things than you, as I am myself a big sinner. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 With regards to red rumallay, as I had said earlier, we cannot apply Gurbani tuks to Satguru jee. Satguru jee can do whatever he wants. Like for example, Satguru jee wore gold ornaments, but Khalsa is not suppose to wear Gold. Khalsa is given raaj, jog its raj-rishi panth not just rishi(celibate-jatt/sat) panth. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Khalsa is given raaj, jog its raj-rishi panth not just rishi(celibate-jatt/sat) panth. I agree with you. But there is no compulsion for a Sikh to accept a raaj. If a Sikh wants to stay ascetic, he can do so. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 12, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I agree with you. But there is no compulsion for a Sikh to accept a raaj. If a Sikh wants to stay ascetic, he can do so. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Yes off course as i said earlier- Bhai dya singh ji in his rehtinama classify lifestyle of sikh in three different categories- gristhi(rajogun/satogun), behingum(satogun) and akaali nihang(rajogun/balance of satogun/tamas)-soorme to prevent sikhs falling from same pitfalls as many other dharamis sharia panthis have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Its fundamental mistake to apply gurbani updesh across the board without the contextualization, relative bachan specific to historical-uthanka or updesh to jaigaso based on their state of mind: Lal rang is also mentioned in gurbani as sign of love- Lal rang tis koi laga jis vadbhaga One is dyed in color of lord loves(inner) outer lal(lali),by great good furtune male kadae na hovaie neh lagaie dagga This color is never mudddied, no stain ever sticks to it If sikhs are staunchly against red, then how come they don't do two things: 1) remove red color rumalaie from sri guru granth sahib ji 2) have so much bhang just like shiv so "manmati color"- red as color of blood in their veins can turn into blue. You see you cannot run away from red color, can you? its in our blood veins..hell we embody it as long as we have this body I think suhaa rang is dark red while laal rang is red. Two different terms have been used. There are different types of red color. Correct me, if I am wrong. Wahguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Gurbachan Singh lied about Muhammad, basically copying his Katha from Bansawlinama. Gurbachan Singh lied about the kakkaars -copying it from the Daya Singh Rehatnama. Gurbachan Singh lied about Guru Har Rai having 7-8 wives (which has no historical basis whatsoever). Gurbachan didn't double check his facts he just reiterated what he read in 'puratan granths'. Secondly i posted tuks where apparently red is praised as Neo put it. Why don't you start giving a special treatment for red? Because even me and neo know that red being positive in bani doesn't make it a holy color, same way it doesn't make it any worse or bad in negative shabads. Thirdly, how absurd does that story of Guru Gobind Singh wearing a red turban sound. For 230 years no Guru wore a red turban ? And my main point, the woman got aroused but Guru stopped Singhs from wearing turbans? That sounds same as men getting sexually aroused by seeing women without much clothes BUT INSTEAD of controlling their eyes and senses THEY force them to wear purdah/niqab, which is condemned in Gurbani and Sikhi. The Guru would have told the women to control their eyes, doesn't matter if a man wears a red turban or not. Its about the eyes & senses, doesn't matter if you wear a niqab or bikini, a red dress or a black dress. You can get aroused even by a woman wearing hijab if your niyat and mann is not strong. Edited April 12, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Now jumping around differentiating between suha and lal... But the below tuks show that both Lal and Suha can be used positively. ਲਾਲ ਭਏ ਸੂਹਾ ਰੰਗੁ ਮਾਇਆ ॥ Instead of the pale color of Maya, I am imbued with the deep red color of the Lord's Love. ਮਃ 1 ਲੋਕਾ ਵੇ ਹਉ ਸੂਹਵੀ ਸੂਹਾ ਵੇਸੁ ਕਰੀ ॥ O people: I am in red, dressed in a red robe. ਮਃ 3 ਲਾਲ ਰੰਗ ਪੂਰਨ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਬਿਧਾਤਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ The Love of the Red Beloved, the Architect of Destiny, is perfect. ||1||Pause|| ਮਃ 5 ਲਾਲ ਰੰਗੁ ਤਿਸ ਕਉ ਲਗਾ ਜਿਸ ਕੇ ਵਡਭਾਗਾ ॥ One is dyed in the color of the Lord's Love, by great good fortune. ਮਃ 5 ਬਿਸਮ ਬਿਸਮ ਬਿਸਮ ਹੀ ਭਈ ਹੈ ਲਾਲ ਗੁਲਾਲ ਰੰਗਾਰੈ ॥ I am wonder-struck, wonder-struck, wonder-struck and amazed, dyed in the red color of my Beloved. ਮਃ 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Sant gyani gurbachan singh bhindranwale usually gave references to puratan rehitnamas when he quoted it. I know this because i am going through puratan japji sahib teeka by sant gyani gurbachan singh bhindranwale, lot of puratan granths and rehitnamas names are cited in the foot notes. so I am fairly certain he didn't lie on anything as far as scholarly citation academia is concerned. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Hanuman might have worn a Kachehra so what? Chandi might've had long kes, so did Jesus? But its wrong when you say Hindu deities came and gave a thing each to the Khalsa in 1699. The whole Sakhi is fake because Sikhs had Kes since the times of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Secondly they were shasterdhari even prior to the Khalsa sajna (evident from hukamnamas etc). So why would Chandi etc come in 1699 to give Kes if Sikhs were already having Kes? These are all flaws but Gurbachan was no scholar, he was a priest nirmala who blindly believed all he read... Or most of it. Comeon there is not a single historical basis for his Katha about Muhammad stealing works of a Hindu Sadhu. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Hanuman might have worn a Kachehra so what? Chandi might've had long kes, so did Jesus? But its wrong when you say Hindu deities came and gave a thing each to the Khalsa in 1699. The whole Sakhi is fake because Sikhs had Kes since the times of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Secondly they were shasterdhari even prior to the Khalsa sajna (evident from hukamnamas etc). So why would Chandi etc come in 1699 to give Kes if Sikhs were already having Kes? These are all flaws but Gurbachan was no scholar, he was a priest nirmala who blindly believed all he read... Or most of it. Comeon there is not a single historical basis for his Katha about Muhammad stealing works of a Hindu Sadhu. Does Srimaan 108 Sant Gyani Gurbachan Singh jee Bhindrawale explicitly say that these Kakkars were given to Khalsa by Hindu Deities or does he explain the history behind the kakkars? There is a big difference in both of them. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 12, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Thirdly, how absurd does that story of Guru Gobind Singh wearing a red turban sound. For 230 years no Guru wore a red turban ? And my main point, the woman got aroused but Guru stopped Singhs from wearing turbans? That sounds same as men getting sexually aroused by seeing women without much clothes BUT INSTEAD of controlling their eyes and senses THEY force them to wear purdah/niqab, which is condemned in Gurbani and Sikhi.The Guru would have told the women to control their eyes, doesn't matter if a man wears a red turban or not. It sounds absurd to you, not me. It was also narrated by a Gurmukh/Mahapurakh. Is there any scientific evidence to prove that color has no affect on the mind? Its about the eyes & senses, doesn't matter if you wear a niqab or bikini, a red dress or a black dress. You can get aroused even by a woman wearing hijab if your niyat and mann is not strong. You cannot compare a society where women are dressed modestly (from a male perspective) to a society where you have half naked women roaming around. Obviously, for a jagayasu, former will help him grow spiritually. Once you reach Brahamgyan, it is a different story. It is very easy to talk like a Brahamgyani, but very hard to walk the talk. Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh Edited April 13, 2015 by paapiman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paapiman Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Now jumping around differentiating between suha and lal... But the below tuks show that both Lal and Suha can be used positively. ਲਾਲ ਭਏ ਸੂਹਾ ਰੰਗੁ ਮਾਇਆ ॥ Instead of the pale color of Maya, I am imbued with the deep red color of the Lord's Love. ਮਃ 1 ਲੋਕਾ ਵੇ ਹਉ ਸੂਹਵੀ ਸੂਹਾ ਵੇਸੁ ਕਰੀ ॥ O people: I am in red, dressed in a red robe. ਮਃ 3 ਲਾਲ ਰੰਗ ਪੂਰਨ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਬਿਧਾਤਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ The Love of the Red Beloved, the Architect of Destiny, is perfect. ||1||Pause|| ਮਃ 5 ਲਾਲ ਰੰਗੁ ਤਿਸ ਕਉ ਲਗਾ ਜਿਸ ਕੇ ਵਡਭਾਗਾ ॥ One is dyed in the color of the Lord's Love, by great good fortune. ਮਃ 5 ਬਿਸਮ ਬਿਸਮ ਬਿਸਮ ਹੀ ਭਈ ਹੈ ਲਾਲ ਗੁਲਾਲ ਰੰਗਾਰੈ ॥ I am wonder-struck, wonder-struck, wonder-struck and amazed, dyed in the red color of my Beloved. ਮਃ 5 Color definitely has an impact on human mind. Please read the information in the link below. http://www.colour-affects.co.uk/psychological-properties-of-colours Waheguru jee kaa Khalsa Waheguru jee kee Fateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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