CdnSikhGirl

So you mean Singhnis can dress in skimpy clothing and show all to the world?? LOL This is news to me! I always thought modesty was expected! No I mean I was TOLD modesty is expected! Why are the sampardas (of which some of you on here are very devout to) claiming that ALL jewelry are a no no if historically Singhnis could wear 10 pounds of gold? Why is modesty preached if historically Singhnis dressed like tramps? (yes, showing your entire stomach and having barely enough fabric to cover your boobs is dressing trampy). Sorry but it is... its proven time and time again women wearing next to nothing (especially in the boobage area) creates objectification of women. In other words, if it's visible men will look and they WILL ogle.

The photo I posted the Singh is wearing kacheras... and the turban style is Nihung style... in fact nihung Singhnis have always tied dastars. I agree, the skimpy choli is not becoming of a Singhni. She looks like a bimbo showing off her body. And rehetnamas ALL are clear that kesh must be covered at all times, so even if a SInghni chooses not to tie turban (as per SRM being optional) then she should still cover with a chunni. However as I posted above, both taksal maryada and nihung maryada explicitly state it's required of both males and females to tie a keski / dastar. Whether or not they do it consistently is a different story. But ALL of the Nihung SInghnis I know tie dastars and were told they were required to when they took amrit.

Akal Takht Sahib would disagree...along with the Panj Pyaras I took amrit from! (have a read about women masands who had authority to initiate via charan amrit) Anyway different topic...look closely at the painting I posted. It's not hair... It's definitely a keski. Guru Gobind Singh Ji's 52 Hukams: 35 Dastaar binaa nahee rehnaa| (doesn't say only men, so women too are required) "Each candidate for Baptism be made to wear kachhehra, tie hair in a topknot and cover the same with dastaar; wear Sri Sahib (i.e. Kirpan) in Gaatra (shoulder belt). Then he/she should stand with folded hands. (Rahitnama Bhai Daya Singh Ji) Taksal Maryada: For the respect of your hair, two turbans are to be tied, tying each layer one at a time. There should be a small turban tied underneath and a larger one tied above this. Women must not plait their hair and should keep their hair tied in a bun/top-knot, in order to respect your Kesh a small turban should be tied. The Nihang Bibian are dastaardhari, and many contend maintain the original form and discipline of the Khalsa. Their Nitnem Gutka defines that every Gursikh man and woman (Singh and Singhni is the wording used) should have a blue keski in their hair. Okay now let's see what you have as weight on this issue!

I take it you are against Singhnis wearing turbans... That photo above you can't tell if she is Sikh or Hindu.... so much for standing out. Not only that, she appears to have a nose piercing which is a big no no after taking Amrit. Rest of jewelry is also debatable as some sects rehet maryada even is against jewelry at all. Here is a historical painting showing a keski on the woman. This depiction the woman looks much more like a Sikh. Wearing bana and keski and no nose piercing and no belly showing from skimpy choli and a mountain of jewelry and makeup. Since the Gurus advocated that 'naam' is our jewelry, I find it strange that Sikh women would have been made up like painted dolls. I think this painting below is much more accurate:

Yes I have seen this too... recently even. My friend is Ramgarhia background and her Father really wanted her to marry another Ramgarhia. Why? If caste was removed then why does it matter? Good thing my husband's family was not into this thinking at all. Or else I'd be considered untouchable having no caste LOL. Actually his family treat women as equal too. There is no expectation of men having higher status or respect. And even Panj Pyaras where we took Amrit declared women too can do any position men can in Sikhi (including Panj Pyaras). I am thankful Kashmir Sikhs seem to be very open and inclusive. I'll just say the truth... Sikhi TEACHES equality of everyone including gender. Some don't follow it however...

oh lol. Different time zones :)

Actually due to the fact that many confuse us with Muslims it HAS come up. I did this event last year and was asked why I converted when women are treated inferior... They assumed Sikhi was a sect of Islam. But even outside of mistaken identity we have our own issues with gender equality and I know it will come up. Because they genuinely want to know how I could covert to a religion where I would have less rights and equality than *supposedly* Christianity (if only they knew what the bible says about women)... Anyway I can't avoid it. All I can do is answer that the religion does teach equality and equal rights but not everyone practices it (due to culture influence etc)

The display is tomorrow. Everyone will have shoes and at least the military members will have headdress so their heads will be covered. I could do it so that if they want to see I can hold the page open for them to see, instead of letting them handle it themselves. Of course that might cause more negative feelings... the idea is to show all the positives and educate the public. After all the conversations on here, I don't know what to answer when they will ask the inevitable question about men / women and equality. I want to say yes. And most websites say Sikhi sees both as equals. That there are no extra restrictions on women, nothing reserved for only men etc. But then after conversations on here, it's apparent that at least some Sikhs see women as inferior, including impurity with menstruation wrt seva, disallowing women to be one of Panj Pyaras, telling wives they must see their husband as 'God' (parmeshwar) and that the husband has higher status than the wife. That wives must be obedient (but husbands never have to be obedient to their wives). etc. Limitation of seva at Darbar sahib etc. So I don't know really what to say and being female I know I will be asked especially being a convert. I used to declare very confidently that yes men and women are seen as equals, until I started seeing that other Gurdwaras and specific groups do not treat women as equal at all. It's even been suggested on here that being born in a female body is a punishment for karma and is considered a 'downgrade' to a male body. So what do I say when people ask?? Do I continue to confidently say women and men are equal in Sikhi - Do I say that Gurbani and Sikhi teach that we are all equal but *some* do not practice it? Or do I say that it's a misnomer that Sikhi sees everyone as equal and instead women are seen in a lower position to men?

It is obviously being done for respect... however if it comes to a point of blankets for SGGSJ or blankets for a person in need who is suffering in the cold... then what do we do? What would Guru Nanak Dev Ji do? I'm not saying not to do these things. But what I am asking is, do we do these things at a higher importance than helping someone in need of those same things?

As part of a military event, I have gotten the Gurdwara involved to do a table / display. We will have posters (mostly Sikh in WW1-WW2 etc. And some pamphlets on what Sikhi is. I also have an extra kirpan, gatra, simrana, kara, kanga etc. I will bring for the table. My question is, would it be a bad idea to bring a nitnem gutka? Keeping in mind the public (DND military personell and their families) will be there. On the one hand, I worry about people handling it but on the other hand if they can see for themselves what is contained in the banis, it goes a LONG way to understanding and seeing that Sikhi is not in any way violent etc. (since we all know that Sikhs are often wrongly misunderstood in this area). The one I have extra here is the Sacred Nitnem one with transliteration and English along with the Gurmukhi. IDERD = International Day For Elimination of Racial Discrimination

What does this mean?

I can't say for UK for sure but I can speak about Canada but the process will be the same. I was just married in India in Sept 2015. If you are gori (Caucasian) and marrying a Punjabi Sikh under anand Karaj you will first need to change your name officially in your documents to last name Kaur. This is because of a hukamnama from 2007 from SGPC. They want to be sure that anyone not born into Sikhi is actually serious about following Sikhi because anand Karaj can only be between two Sikhs. Also make sure you register your marriage right away with the registrar of marriages where you are (under new anand marriage act --- unless Jammu Kashmir then it's a bit more complicated. You will require this proof of marriage - both the marriage agreement (registration) and the marriage certificate. You get the certificate after the agreement is registered. Without this paperwork UK will not give your spouse permanent residence. You will also need other proof of established relationship like photos, past Indian visas etc to show it wasn't a one off thing ( which indicates scam for green card type of thing). They want to see you two have been together for awhile in a genuine relationship. Also photos from the marriage, invitations, etc. Especially photos with your families involved. That way they know your family is supportive. Less chance it will be a scam if your family is participating in the wedding. Mother than that there is a lot of papers for the actual application. But that's where UK and Canada may differ in their process.

I don't think that the instruction to see every girl as a sister (or male as brother) is supposed to be literal. I think it's more that when you meet someone don't sexualize them. Consider them 'as' you would consider a sister... That is to say get to know their personality - get to know them. Consider them as a human instead of a walking vagina. Obviously you have to find someone who you have a deep connection with and that involves getting to know someone on a deeper level than if they were literally a sister. It's an entirely different dynamic. If there is noting there then don't marry. But it is possible to do this without sexualizing them.

Paapiman will never be married. He thinks women are disgusting and beneath him.

Awesome point! Those who are against eating meat but condone dairy are big huge hypocrites! Exactly... there shouldn't be a war between male / female at all! It's sad that religions are still trying to place limitations on one gender or give preference to the other under the guise of religion. Unfortunately when people are trying to tout said limitations and restrictions on one gender as a religious requirement then it very much DOES belong on a religious forum, or else change will never happen. In the case of what I posted it directly to show how teaching that wives must be obedient to husbands, causes a LOT of harm! Until and unless the men see their wives as their equal, they will NEVER treat them on an equal level and abuse WILL happen. The way to solve it is to remove the teaching of inequality / superiority of one over the other. Its the same as discussing the atrocities ISIS have committed you can't discuss how ISIS is in the wrong unless you understand what they have done. This is a far cry from posting porn involving feces.

Wow Paapiman really has no idea about menstruation of he thinks that pic of the statue is in any way representative! Women maybe lose less than 1 ounce of blood over their entire cycle. Enough to fill a tablespoon.... That statue is covered by enough red paint to look like a massacre! Second there are hygiene products including internal ones. Someone wearing one of those internal ones you would NEVER know they were menstruating!! And finally Gurbani actually speaks against any idea of impurity and says only clean are those in who's mind the lord abides. Our gurus tried to remove this idea of impurity... Your mind is what is a disgusting act... Limiting people because of a biological function they have no control over. Shame on you. I am not surprised this is dera mentality and brahaminism. Goes right along with thinking women are not even fully human and are downgraded of male bodies or that women need to be reborn in a male joon to be luberated. sootak is a Hindu concept. If you want to be Hindu then be Hindu. To me there is nothing wrong or disgusting about any body function. Just use common sense for hygiene. I'm really sad that there are Singhs who think like this. You might cringe at a natural function... I cringe at the likes of you. Gurbani says meditate on him every day. We are supposed to read from SGGSJ every day. Some people have saroop of maharaj in their home. If they live alone and are a woman then what?? EVERY saroop is equal! This is nonsense. The reason men have to wash after ejaculating has nothing to do with dirtiness of the semen. Its because it was a sexual act Which can be associated with kaam. Menstruation has nothing to do with kaam. You mean to tell me a male who just ejaculated because of a sexy dream or watching porno etc can just wash up and then do seva of SGGSJ like it didn't happen, but a woman who is just experiencing a normal biological function given to her by Waheguru to create life, without having had any sexy thoughts or kaam involved, should be barred from that seva? THAT is what is disgusting act to me. Paapiman would be the same person who would bar a homeless man from reading Gurbani because he can't afford clean clothing etc. To me this is wrong. Gurbani is for everyone. Ask yourself, do you think the Gurus in human form would have avoided women menstruating and say they couldn't see that woman till she stopped bleeding? The human Gurus did not elevate themselves to some standard like a Brahman priest who couldn't bear to be around downtrodden and dirty things. No, the Guru Nanak put himself on the level of the beggar, and homeless person. He served humanity.... now SGGSJ is our eternal Guru and you want to dictate who can approach when Guru Nanak would have accepted ANYONE.

Probably because that was entirely different context. It was a case that shows how dangerous the whole 'wives must be obedient to their husbands' thing can actually be because it was a case of marital sexual abuse. Husband forcing wife into obedience to comply. And I wasn't descriptive anyway except to say that's what he was forcing her to do. And it was not meant to entice people into looking at disgusting videos for kicks. And it's a whole different level sexually speaking than eating feces!!! There is an entirely different thing when someone narrates a situation that happened to show that it's bad or illustrate a situation or circumstance than it is to post links and titles of videos made for nothing more than fetish / shock value. Maybe I have been too sheltered...

I REALLY did NOT need to know that! Admins... can we please close this thread. It's disgusting and does not belong on a religious forum! btw this is a PRIME example why I have a hard time believing charitars were meant to have some deep spiritual meaning. THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS. People don't need disgusting ideas put in their heads that they may NEVER have had prior! Then they start looking at disgusting videos (maybe out of curiosity at first) then they start doing it more and become addicted to it. Humans easily become attracted to anything which is Taboo... simply because it's taboo! I refuse to be part of it! I am not coming into this thread again. And admins... please... this is inappropriate IMO.

Really I am surprised *and appalled* that some members on here actually watched disgusting videos. You are all creeping me out. The people who make those videos do it for attention. They WANT you watch those disgusting things. @GurpreetKaur why did you even load those videos? Why even search for stuff like that? I have no idea what's on those videos you guys posted and I never will. Because I refuse to pull them up on google and watch them! Not interested at all! @Gunahgar bodily functions are just bodily functions. There is nothing inherently disgusting about them. There is nothing that needs to be revered or worshipped. They are just biological necessity to achieve an end. Menstruation is no more gross than semen. In reality neither are. And neither are something to be revered either. They are like skin, and eyes, and hearts. Only Waheguru should be revered and worshipped.

I always thought Gurbani says that THIS is our chance. THIS lifetime. It's not concerned about some future lifetime... what we have here and now is our chance. Otherwise, you start over again. When you can finally attain a human body again, will you even remember? Will you feel the same drive toward spirituality? Will you waste away that life? As when you enter that life you will start again with amnesia... So don't waste this one in hopes of some future life. --------- ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ਦੁਪਦੇ ॥ Āsā mėhlā 5 ḏupḏe. Aasaa, Fifth Mehl, Du-Padas: ਭਈ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ Bẖa▫ī parāpaṯ mānukẖ ḏehurī▫ā. You have been blessed with this human body. ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਮਿਲਣ ਕੀ ਇਹ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਰੀਆ ॥ Gobinḏ milaṇ kī ih ṯerī barī▫ā. This is your chance to meet the Lord of the Universe. ਅਵਰਿ ਕਾਜ ਤੇਰੈ ਕਿਤੈ ਨ ਕਾਮ ॥ Avar kāj ṯerai kiṯai na kām. Other efforts are of no use to you. ਮਿਲੁ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਭਜੁ ਕੇਵਲ ਨਾਮ ॥੧॥ Mil sāḏẖsangaṯ bẖaj keval nām. ||1|| Joining the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, vibrate and meditate on the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||1|| ਸਰੰਜਾਮਿ ਲਾਗੁ ਭਵਜਲ ਤਰਨ ਕੈ ॥ Saraʼnjām lāg bẖavjal ṯaran kai. Make the effort, and cross over the terrifying world ocean. ਜਨਮੁ ਬ੍ਰਿਥਾ ਜਾਤ ਰੰਗਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਕੈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ Janam baritha jāṯ rang mā▫i▫ā kai. ||1|| rahā▫o. This human life is passing away in vain, in the love of Maya. ||1||Pause|| ਜਪੁ ਤਪੁ ਸੰਜਮੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਨ ਕਮਾਇਆ ॥ Jap ṯap sanjam ḏẖaram na kamā▫i▫ā. I have not practiced meditation, penance, self-restraint or righteous living; ਸੇਵਾ ਸਾਧ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇਆ ॥ Sevā sāḏẖ na jāni▫ā har rā▫i▫ā. I have not served the Holy Saints, and I do not know the Lord, my King. ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਹਮ ਨੀਚ ਕਰੰਮਾ ॥ Kaho Nānak ham nīcẖ karammā. Says Nanak, my actions are vile and despicable; ਸਰਣਿ ਪਰੇ ਕੀ ਰਾਖਹੁ ਸਰਮਾ ॥੨॥੨੯॥ Saraṇ pare kī rākẖo sarmā. ||2||29|| O Lord, I seek Your Sanctuary - please, preserve my honor. ||2||29|| ------- ALSO ----- ਗੁਰ ਸੇਵਾ ਤੇ ਭਗਤਿ ਕਮਾਈ ॥ Gur sevā ṯe bẖagaṯ kamā▫ī. Serving the Guru, devotional worship is practiced. ਤਬ ਇਹ ਮਾਨਸ ਦੇਹੀ ਪਾਈ ॥ Ŧab ih mānas ḏehī pā▫ī. Then, this human body is obtained. ਇਸ ਦੇਹੀ ਕਉ ਸਿਮਰਹਿ ਦੇਵ ॥ Is ḏehī ka▫o simrahi ḏev. Even the gods long for this human body. ਸੋ ਦੇਹੀ ਭਜੁ ਹਰਿ ਕੀ ਸੇਵ ॥੧॥ So ḏehī bẖaj har kī sev. ||1|| So vibrate that human body, and think of serving the Lord. ||1|| ਭਜਹੁ ਗੋੁਬਿੰਦ ਭੂਲਿ ਮਤ ਜਾਹੁ ॥ Bẖajahu gobinḏ bẖūl maṯ jāhu. Vibrate, and meditate on the Lord of the Universe, and never forget Him. ਮਾਨਸ ਜਨਮ ਕਾ ਏਹੀ ਲਾਹੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ Mānas janam kā ehī lāhu. ||1|| rahā▫o. This is the blessed opportunity of this human incarnation. ||1||Pause|| ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਜਰਾ ਰੋਗੁ ਨਹੀ ਆਇਆ ॥ Jab lag jarā rog nahī ā▫i▫ā. As long as the disease of old age has not come to the body, ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਕਾਲਿ ਗ੍ਰਸੀ ਨਹੀ ਕਾਇਆ ॥ Jab lag kāl garsī nahī kā▫i▫ā. and as long as death has not come and seized the body, ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਬਿਕਲ ਭਈ ਨਹੀ ਬਾਨੀ ॥ Jab lag bikal bẖa▫ī nahī bānī. and as long as your voice has not lost its power, ਭਜਿ ਲੇਹਿ ਰੇ ਮਨ ਸਾਰਿਗਪਾਨੀ ॥੨॥ Bẖaj lehi re man sārigpānī. ||2|| O mortal being, vibrate and meditate on the Lord of the World. ||2|| ਅਬ ਨ ਭਜਸਿ ਭਜਸਿ ਕਬ ਭਾਈ ॥ Ab na bẖajas bẖajas kab bẖā▫ī. If you do not vibrate and meditate on Him now, when will you? ਆਵੈ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਭਜਿਆ ਜਾਈ ॥ Āvai anṯ na bẖaji▫ā jā▫ī. When the end comes, you will not be able to vibrate and meditate on Him. ਜੋ ਕਿਛੁ ਕਰਹਿ ਸੋਈ ਅਬ ਸਾਰੁ ॥ Jo kicẖẖ karahi so▫ī ab sār. Whatever you have to do - now is the best time to do it. ਫਿਰਿ ਪਛੁਤਾਹੁ ਨ ਪਾਵਹੁ ਪਾਰੁ ॥੩॥ Fir pathuṯāhu na pāvhu pār. ||3|| Otherwise, you shall regret and repent afterwards, and you shall not be carried across to the other side. ||3||

Also keep in mind that ultimate reality is ONE in other words there is only ONE universal consciousness. Our separateness is illusion of Ego. The DOER the experiencer behind every entity is one and the same. There is only one consciousness. Meaning nothing is done by us. Page 813, Line 9 ਕਰਨੈਹਾਰੁ ਨ ਬੂਝਈ ਆਪੁ ਗਨੈ ਬਿਗਾਨਾ ॥੧॥ Karnaihār na būjẖ▫ī āp ganai bigānā. ||1|| The fool does not understand the Creator Lord; instead, he thinks that he himself is the doer. ||1||. Guru Arjan Dev So is it this state of amnesia of our true self who has forgotten who the doer is? If the same consciousness pervades ALL then there is free will... But it's the free will of the creator. Our built up false ego identity or haume is illusion. Essentially we are (all collectively) ONE. For more info: http://www.gurbani.org/articles/webart161.htm

Do you guys REALLY need to talk about this??? It's a very few sick sick people who are deranged who do these things these abuses to animals!!! There is obviously something wrong with these people and they need to be locked up! We don't need to analyze what they do. Better not even knowing.

Again... I think I am going to hurl... excuse me while I grab a bucket to puke in! Also, this is HUGE case of animal cruelty!

Guest Ji I think regards to the reference the other Guest Ji was speaking about the reference the book Paapiman posted. Not the Gurbani tuk talking about only a brahamgyani can know the state of a brahamgyani. I see what the other guest means... If nobody can know except those in that state then the only way anyone else could know is if that person in that higher spiritual state shared it with others. But the book paapiman posted says not to share. So how does someone become labelled a Sant?? Does the Sant say "I'm a Sant" to others? Or do others say "hey this person is a sant"?? If it's the Sant saying they are then they are obviously sharing with others speaking about their spiritual achievements (the book paapiman posed says not to). If it's others declaring it then how can those others know if the spiritually elevated person never told them??

...I think I am going to hurl...