sarabatam

2 minutes ago, BhagatSingh said:

Why are you splitting this into 3 schools of thought when it is actually one school of thought.

In Gurbani, it states that there is non-dual oneness of Consciousness or Being Hari ji that appears as Hari-Maya (or Shiv-Shakti) and that everything that is perceived is coming One Universal Vibration (Aum), that is "uttered" by Hari ji.

The Oneness Advait Consciousness appears as Dual Consciousness and Energy, and it is through the vibration of the Onkar.

That is all one perspective in Guru Granth Sahib.

Totally agree, well put and well understood ~IkOngkar~

@Mekhane'ch Jannat 

Love to get more inputs from @Lucky @Sat1176 @paapiman 

Thanks for your reply veer, can you please see the post below based on my understanding if its accurate?

Correct me if i am wrong

According to various aspects of divine, divine and spiritual school of thoughts, creation came into existence via three different perspectives/aspects of divine/divine-

1. Advait- Non dual Awareness/Consciousness -Non Duality 

2.  Consciousness and life energy dual play- Shiv-Shakti

3. Resonance of Sound -OM/OAN/ONG/ONGKAR

1. Non dual Awareness/Consciousness (Advaita/ Advait-Vashivanism/Kashmiri shaivaism etc)

Gurbani talks about this perspective:

2. Consciousness and life energy-dual play (Shaivism- Shiv-shakti)

Gurbani talks about this perspective as well:

ਖੰਡਾ ਪ੍ਰਥਮਿ ਮਨਾਇਕੈ ਜਿਨ ਸਭ ਸੈਸਾਰ ਉਪਾਇਆ ॥

Khaandaa Parthami Manaaeikai Jin Sabha Saisaara Aupaaeiaa ॥

At first the Lord created the double-edged sword and then He created the whole world.

ਚੰਡੀ ਦੀ ਵਾਰ - ੨/੧ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ

ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਬਿਸਨੁ ਮਹੇਸ ਸਾਜਿ ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਦਾ ਖੇਲੁ ਬਣਾਇਆ ॥

Barhamaa Bisanu Mahesa Saaji Kudarti Daa Khelu Banaaeiaa ॥

He created Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva and then created the play of Nature.

Jaha dekhan taha Ravi rahe, Shiv Shakti ka mel - wherever I look I see Ravi (Sun, light and radiance) of the union of Shiv and Shakti (Consciousness and Energy)

3. Resonance of Sound -OM/OAN/ONG/ONGKAR ,

Many yogi traditions talks about sound of OM creation came

Gurbani talks about this perspective from Oangkar whole creation came:

outhapath paralo sabadhae hovai ||

Creation and destruction happen through the Word of the Shabad.

sabadhae hee fir oupath hovai ||

Through the Shabad, creation happens again.

Ongkar Bhrama Utpat ||

Ongkar Kiya Jin Chit ||

Ongkar Saiyel Jug Paie ||

Ongkar Vaid Nirvaie ||

Oankar ('the Primal Sound') created Brahma, Oankar fashioned the consciousness,
From Oankar came mountains and ages, Oankar produced the Vedas,
By the grace of Oankar, people were saved through the divine word,
By the grace of Oankar, they were liberated through the teachings of the Guru.
— Ramakali Dakkhani, Adi Granth 929-930

Ongkar aad kathni anad, Khal Khand Khyal Gurbar Akaal || (Jaap sahib)

Thanks for contributing veer, here are some more quotes from gurbani:

maajh mehalaa 3 ||

Maajh, Third Mehla:

auqpiq prlau sbdy hovY ]

outhapath paralo sabadhae hovai ||

Creation and destruction happen through the Word of the Shabad.

sbdy hI iPir Epiq hovY ]

sabadhae hee fir oupath hovai ||

Through the Shabad, creation happens again.

All aspects (shabad-ong/shakti-Khanda-inner life force-shiv-shakat ) are correct in their right as realities of creations are perceived differently by different school of thoughts/aspects of divine within gurbani, where gurbani says from shabad whole creation came -there gurbani is talking from shabad (oan/ong sound vibration) aspect of akaal purkh and where gurbani says from khanda(double edge sword) - whole creation came, there gurbani is talking from aad shakti/inner life force-shiva shakti aspect of akaal purkh and without awareness/surat there is no experience of creation whether shabad aspect of creation or life force-shiv shakti aspect of creation, refer to sargun nirgun nirankar asthpadi in sukhmani sahib.

Love to get input from  @Lucky, @Sat1176, @Paapiman, @BhagatSingh

5 hours ago, ragnarok said:

Not sure about general cases but Suleiman was allowed to remain outside his body before it was born. Did he go into his new body before it was born or as it was born?

 

Good point, i am more curious about general cases. I think if we go by gurbani wisdom below, we can say awareness is primordial but then question that arises how primordial is breath? Are we getting into sun -afur state prior to creation? In my view, in the body they came in the same time. I am not sure?

Here is another interesting snippet from japji sahib teeka by sant gyani gurbachan singh ji bhindranwale of pancha ka ek guru ek dhyan on different types of parman. Correct me if i am wrong i think parman means example and in the screenshot below is shown shabad parman (example from gurbani such as mahavak /mantar etc) and partakth parman (self evident, self experiential parman are the highest). I highlighted the important ones below

Million dollar question what came first- how creation came to be ?and also what came first- breath or consciousness/awareness in the body?? Chicken or egg question? lol

Your thoughts?

Couple of points-

- SGPC approved this movie before, did through analysis provided recommendation which were followed  thoroughly has a approval from sgpc both old committee and new committee at current, signed by all scholars in SGPC

- If some people find it offended, don't watch it or ignore it but if you think by banning or doing protest, blocking hwy and other tactics is way to go, its counter-intuitive this will increase curiosity in people, its actually more advertisement of the movie,  remember - controversy sells!!

Just like if you strictly enforced everything is forbidden,  make things trivial or controversial for kids outlaws on kids, kids will revolt eventually in their life, will explore whatever is banned for sake of curiosity, rebel back whether watchin tv, fashion, cell phones. Look at the lives and scandals of amish life style, orthodox jews, church pastors

-Provide detailed analysis with strong rebuttal , why one shouldn't watch this movie and leave it up to the readers

- I do have a point i want to make. I watched movie- badla made on sant jarnail singh bhindranwale, there is a scene of sant jarnail singh bhindranwale coming on to maharaj darbar, they showed huge parkash aura on sant ji in maharaj darbar where aura parkash on sri guru granth sahib was virtually missing in contrast with sant ji parkash in same scene. Same people who endorsed badla movie have a problem with nanak shah fakir as well. 

This is good video from director of Nanak shah fakir, lots of great points, decide it for yourself:

I agree with your point. However, poverty levels in ontario especially living affordability in GTA out weighs gradually increased min wage. People who are living close to poverty line or those who can hardly afford food and housing need solutions now than waiting for gradual increase. Yes tim hortons cut lot of benefits, but they also received lot of back lash due to that. Ontario gov't made example out of these organization. I think it was good move. BC announcing $14 gradually, it just not enough, if you are working at minimum wage and try to live in vancouver area or even resort area-whistler no way you can afford rental housing let alone owning any kind of property. I was just in vancouver last weekend, went through greater vancouver area to go to UBC , it just not affordable for students to work at min wage and study live close by UBC, i dont know how they survive on min wage working at star bucks, second cup or blend cofee.

By the way, countries like australia they already at $17.70 per hour

Please share your experience so it increases faith and bhavna.

Lets talk provincial Ontario Elections, its only 9 weeks away. Who you guys voting ? Hope its not too personal to ask? Which party and why?

I haven't decided yet, I be voting either liberals or ndp for couple of reasons:

1. Universal pharma care

2- Free day care

3 free dental

4. Minimum wage to $15 next year to address low income families across the board

5. Serious infrastructure investment- high speed rail between toronto to windsor travel time 1 hr 30 mins only.

Sorry bit late too the party, here is jordan peterson assessment of that interview above:

Nice share, you may want to update the attached as pdf as i had to download the file and then rename to extension .pdf.

1 hour ago, amardeep said:

I traced the sakhi to the Suraj Prakash, its on page 304 - it says in the beginning you should stay away from two of them

http://www.ik13.com/PDFS/Raas5.pdf

Good research work !!

Four types of Conversations/discussion-

1) Heth - Where you listen to someone because you know they have more kamai and more knowledge than you. You are humble when listening. This also applies to school.

2) Vaadha - Where you actually do your research and share to positively add to a conversation constructively. Even if there is disagreement, you should not hurt another's feelings or prove that you are better.

3) Jalapa - Where you say stuff to put the other down. Try to make yourself look good.

4) Vitaardha - Where you keep talking and don't listen to anyone else (the majority of us).

*** This is from a sakhi where some pundits asked Guru Hargobind Ji what type of conversations are allowed. Guru Hargobind Ji said a Gursikh only takes part in the first 2 types of conversations. ***

Don't under mine peaceful means it was same peaceful means Sikhs for justice used in states that got modi visa revoked and black listed in USA before he became pm of India 

21 minutes ago, paapiman said:

As Canadians, we must respect the laws of our country, but we should not forget Sikh ethics and values too, which includes picking up arms, when all peaceful means have exhausted.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

What peaceful or legal means was used against sidhu here in context within candaian judical system?

Let me answer that for you: NONE

Diplomatic pressure, influencing media narrative, going through UN- human right abuses all these peaceful resistance should have been enough.

14 hours ago, paapiman said:

Beating of Ujjal Dosanjh was against Sikh principles, but we need to get more details on Malkiat Sidhu's character before making that call. If he was a tyrant, then the attempt on his life will conform to Gurmat.

Additionally, Malkiat Sidhu was later assassinated by Sikh revolutionaries in India. There must be a reason behind it.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Whatever the reasons are, I think these points below should trumph any justifications:

1. If there is violent declaration of wars on sikhs in india by state sponsor terrorism, it should be dealt with resistance in india against state sponsor terrorism

2. Coming to foreign country in this case- canada, using it services an anchor or base to wage violence war against india its not only wrong  on so many levels- respecting laws of this country but its illegal.

Good question , love to get more details on this. Mind you, jaspal atval was also accused of beating of ujjal dosanjh. We as peaceful sikhs should condemn both incidents, they also seems highly suspicious play right into hands of RAW, intelligence agencies to discredit any kind of peaceful separatist movement.

Ever wonder why peaceful separatist movement are so difficult to penetrate? Because they are peaceful, public opinion cannot be swayed, as soon as there is violence, boom public opinion are divided, it looses credibility.   

Hindu nationalist and equally Sikh, Christian, Muslim Buddhist, shinto all kind of right wing type nationalist should listen to this.

Thats good to know. I was watching movie -badla made on sant bhindranwale, there is a scene of sant bhindranwale coming on to maharaj darbar, they showed huge parkash aura on sant bhindranwale in maharaj darbar where aura parkash on sri guru granth sahib was virtually missing in contrast with sant ji parkash in same scene ...its same new age taksalis have issue with nanak shah fakir. Bunch of hypocrites if you ask me !!