Mehtab Singh

Comments being true or false is an individual's personal opinion, and personal opinions don't always have to be right. They are (as mentioned in another thread) like pudhz.

spot on

Who are you to call him ram raeeya? The Ragmala issue still remains unsolved (although many have their own presumptions and opinions...now I wonder how many will turn this into a Ragmala thread) within the panth like other issues. Also, where have I held him higher than Guru Sahib? Do you read stuff thats not visible? Is that how you read Bhai Sahib's works? Well, no wonder! Plus there is something called pre-conceived notion. Meaning if you have decided to condemn someone, no matter who/what they are, you will just condemn them and thrust your opinion over everything else. Therefore, since you have made up your mind to put Bhai Sahib down (like you gonna be successful!!), no matter what anyone tells you about him, your opinion won't change. I have given you links, and you can get more books by him if you are interested. Read them if possible. I don't need to go into the fact as to how many people's lives have changed just by reading about his life and experiences. He continues to be an inspiration and role model even 43 years after his akaal chalana. There are loads of haters out there who say bs about the way he passed away, and some even go to the extent of predicting his after-life according to their own biased and messed up presumptions, and think they are brahmgyanis and can see what happened to him after his akaal chalana. Forgive me for saying this (and this is not directed towards veer "challenge everything" or anyone else in particular), but the only reason I see for some people's antagonism towards Bhai Sahib is a feeling of intimidation that they feel, as they themselves don't have a similar spiritual personality to look upto, and so find every possible chance to throw insults at Bhai Sahib. Good luck satisfying your ego and hiding your insecurity !!! The fact that the light is too bright and hurts the eyes isn't the light's fault, is it? I have said enough. This isn't the first time someone threw mud at Bhai Sahib's personality (read other threads). Any amount of nindya isn't gonna change the truth, no matter how hard a hater tries. My last post (just in this thread)

seeeee i remembered !!!!!!!!!! :wink: MAY GURUJEE KEEP U ALWAYS UNDER HIS NADAR enjoy n have a blast !!!!!!!!!!!

I agree with Gabbar. Its funny how Gurujee at some instances calls Himself lowest of the low in Gurbani, and some supposed Sikhs like to call themselves "Sant". A true GurSikh like Sant Jarnail Singh Jee Khalsa Bhindranwale (yeah I am calling him Sant coz he was one) never liked anyone calling him Sant, and today its like a first name.

http://www.tapoban.org/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=18828&t=18828 From March of 1975 to September of 1976, the Sikh Sangat of Amritsar did the seva of 1500 hand-written saroops of Sree Guru Granth Sahib that had been brought from Pakistan. The Sangat would change the rumaallay covering Guru Sahib and also wipe every ang of the saroop with a cloth. From one of these saroops, a mysterious letter was found, written by a Sikhi bibi to “My beloved Gurdev Mata jeeoâ€. The letter was filled with extreme spiritual longing and love. Who knows what state this letter was written in? It writes about separation from Guru Sahib, but who knows how or why this separation happened? Although the person who put the letter in the saroop had made an error, it seems to be an error made in innocence. Reproduced below is that letter: A Letter to My Mother, Guru Sahib By Unknown In Soora, March 1976 Translated by Admin www.tapoban.org Ik Oankaar Sat Gurparsaad, Jalandhar 18.12.48 Sreematee Poojneek (worthy of worship), my beloved Gurdev Mata jeeo, Please accept the greetings of you slave, as I place my head upon your sacred feet. My beloved Gurdev jeeo, I don’t understand or know whether I should call you mother or whether I should call your father or Satguru or Gurdev. My beloved Mata jeeo! It is my plea that eight days have now passed since I have been separated from your feet and have seen your sun-like glowing face. Forgive me, I could not write you. My beloved Gurdev jeeo! How can I tell you the reason for not writing? You know what is inside of everyone. You know what is in the heart. My beloved Mata jeeo! In these past seven days, I held the pen five times to write you a letter, but I don’t know why, every time I started to write, my hands would begin to tremble and the pen would fall. I have seen the reason for this now, and it is all my grave sins. My beloved Gurdev jee, I have seen it for myself that when I wait for your darshan either at my home or at your feet, my mind’s state is different. I mean, in my heart I would have so many thoughts that when my Gurdev Mata jeeo meets me, I’ll speak on this matter or I will bow in such a way. Many other thoughts like this would come, but when I come before your charan, I forget everything. My beloved Gurdev jeeo, my heart is always longing for your darshan, but I don’t know why I cannot even see you in my dreams. My beloved Mata jeeo, forgive my faults and take me into your feet. Forgive, me, this sinner, and take me into your feet. Don’t look at my flaws. Please bless this beggar. I have no one else but you. My beloved Gurdev jee, it is my request, over and over again, that you not look at my faults, and you give me the love of your charan and the gift of your naam.

For those engaging in playground discussion... Timar Agiaan to Ujiaaraa Bhai Sahib Bhai Randheer Singh Jee : http://www.akj.org/skins/default/books.php?ch=1&bookid=6 Amrit Ki Hain - The Meaning of Sikh Baptism Translated by: Dr. Trilochan Singh Jee Bhai Sahib Bhai Randheer Singh Jee : http://www.akj.org/skins/default/books.php?ch=1&bookid=2 Vaaheguroo Simran Bhai Sahib Bhai Randheer Singh Jee : http://www.akj.org/skins/default/books.php?ch=1&bookid=7 check these out (as in read them) before u pass immature statements

You just have to diss him without reading a single word written by him, don't you? I feel extremely sorry for you. You have my sincere sympathies LOL ps : Just to make you happy, Hazur Sahib was one of the Takhats that gave him the title of Bhai Sahib.

http://www.tapoban.org/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=18772&t=18772 I was reading a book about the travels of Guru Nanak and it says that there are a number of shrines of Guru Nanak in the Muslim world. The books is by SS Kohli It claims, "At Madina, religious discussions were held with the Guru by Imam Ghaus, Imam Ashraf and Imam Azim who ultimately bowed before the Guru with great veneration. A house of Nanak Pir of Wali Hind exists at Madina at a distance of about three miles from teh burial place of the Prophet." In Iraq, it is said that "Even today there are several disciples of Guru Nanak in Iraq. These people live on the banks of the Tigris river, partiuclarly in the cities of Al Kut and Baghdad. They are called Sobi and generally they are gold-smiths by occupation. They are experts in their trade. They keep long hair and do not cut their beards and remember the Guru by names of Baba Nanak or Baba Nana." In Egypt: "It has been leart that a platform of Nanak Wali still exists in honour the vist of the Guru in the Suburban area of Cairo...[sikh soldiers] saw a platform towards the south of the town of Kaikai which was stated to be the place where teh Master had met the Sultan and that the Sikh soldiers had congregation and sacrement there". In Uganda: At a distance of about 12 miles from the Tapora Station, there is a memorial in honour of the visit of Guru Nanak in the hilly forests. At a distance of about 24 miles from Kampala, there is a villge names Bab Nanika after the name of the Guru where the sprin commemorates teh visit of the Guru which was the result of his blessings. It is said that ther is no other spring in the vast area." Syria: It is said that there is a mosque here named mosque of Wali Hind near the mosque of Baba Farid" Uzbekistan: There is a Dharamsala in memory of the Guru. It is said that the Sikhs installed the holy Granth in this Dharamsala in AD 1858. Up to Bukhara several Sikh merchants are found, but byeond that there are very few. Another town named Karmine was said to be visted by the Guru near the town of Vakand. The poeple of this place are only devoted to Guru Nanak Wali Hind and his discipline. Then the Guru visited Karshi. The memorial of Nanak Qalandhar is situated to the south of the town. In Samarkand, the people of this place still hold him in veneration and worship the Asa (staff) of Nanak Kalandhar. A village in the area named Narata was visited by the Guru there is a sping of the Guru at this place on a hill. The people remember the Guru mostly as Pir Wali HInd. Some of the remember him as Nanak Qlandhar. The keepers of this memorial say that in AD 1826 the Emir of Bukhara attacked the Emir of HIssar (in Uzbekistan) he was defeated in the first battle, but when he prayed at teh sprin of Nanak Pir, he was successful in the next attempt. IN the area around Ura Tybe people are disciples of the Guru and do not talk of any other preceptor except Wali Hind. Afghanistan: In Gharuka, 25kos from Kabul, It is said that the sand gaters in teh form of a mount during the day and spreads out during the night. Early in the morning the noise of the horses' hoofs is heard. The music is also heard during the night. There is a Sikh temple at Gharuka in honour of the vist of the Guru. In Hazara, the disciples of the Guru in the area are known as Murid Nanaki. It is said that because of the faith of the people, the impression of the Panja (hand print) of the Guru is seen on the Prasad.

I think the Bhagwad Gita (which I have read one-third, i.e 6 outta 18 adhyayas...was a kid then) and Upanishads (haven't read any of them) are probably the main source of knowledge in Hinduism and are minus all the weird practices that were born later on. There is also the Srimadbhagwat which has stories from Krishna's life and how the world was made etc. Dunno much bout the puraans. All these gyaan filled scriptures talk about the One Formless Infinite Lord and don't stress on any physical attribute.

This does make sense. I had Shia room mates from Uttar Pradesh state in India and they said that there were loads of Hindus in their village and neighbouring ones who would take part in Ashura (10th Muharram) and mourn the martyrdom of Imam Hassan and Imam Hussein. Personally I think Shia and Sufi aspect of Islam are the only ones that make sense to me.

post edited...dont wanna be responsible for the death of a scum bag when he dies after reading severely harsh language and dont want kids to be familiar with cuss words mods...plzzzz lock this dam thread and ban this dog calling Gurujee a fraud eh? say that on a Singh's face...ur body bag will be ready for u Mod's Note: This thread has been locked as the questions asked have been answered. It is not being deleted as a number of members have given detailed answers and we don't want to loose that information.

Thanks

Thanks! . I actually forgot to mention that . Wait, I don't know if I knew it, so thanks again!

The janeu is a symbol of caste superiority, and Sikhi has always been against caste system. Yet, Guru Tegh Bahadur Jee sacrificed His life for religious freedom (tilak janju rakha prabh taa ka). The fact that Guru Hargobind created Guru ki maseet is another example of how tolerant the Gurus were of other faiths. And about udasis, I never came across any kind of antagonism from any Sikh towards udasis. The point is that Gurujee wasn't against any religion or way of worship ever at all, in the sense that they believed in freedom, and preached the futility of fake rituals and superstitions. Thats the reason that inspite of being against the caste system, Gurujee still "defended" it when it was being threatened by someone who was forcing his way of life as Sikhi doesn't believe in forcing one's beliefs down someone's throat. But that doesn't mean you actually support or follow their way, do you? You just advocate their freedom to follow and practice it, right? Gurujee on one hand built a mosque because He respected the Muslim's right to religious freedom, and yet in Gurbani Bhagat Naamdev Jee said "Hindu anna Turku kaana", what do we draw from that? My friend please don't confuse tolerance with support. As far as Jail Chithhiyaan and Undithi Duniya (haven't read this one full yet) are concerned, I don't remember reading any place that non-Sikhs were destined for hell. Also, I don't know if you read the Punjabi or English version (I can't read Gurmukhi very well so am relying on English one) , because firstly the English version uses really heavy words (too heavy for me atleast ), and secondly I am not sure if the translation captures the entire essence of the original work although its one hell of a good job, but then again original is original. Not that I am trying to defend anything you didn't understand in the book, but thats just what I feel. As for Sikhs and sachkhand, well, I am no one to say or decide who goes where after death. Sikhi teaches acceptance and I am perfectly happy following that. Bhai Sahib was definitely of higher avastha than any of us here (unless there are hidden members who don't or hardly post ), and so if he said that GurSikhs go to sachkhand (like you stated), then all I can say is that one needs to look at the deeper meanings behind it and not judge the words literally to be fanatical or hateful (No I didn't say you are doing so). Manmukhs like me can't explain it to respectable seekers like yourself, because we are not at his level (I know I am not, can't say the same for you).

really? very easily fair enuff ???

Round Dunno

And what about this : How can you call someone who eats meat a Sikh ? Bhai Sahib was the only Sikh (well atleast the only Sikh I heard of) who was given the highest honor by all 5 Takhts for his contribution to the panth. He spent 16 years in jails under British rule but never wavered from Sarbloh Bibek (a joke for some "Sikhs"). Before passing such statements, have you read even half of a book (out of the multitudes of books) written by him?

Amazing responses by Bhai Balbir Singh Jee and N30 veer. 1. Why did all 10 gurus only marry within their Khatri caste? An intercaste marriage by any of the Gurus would have encouraged more Sikhs to do so. This has been answered already, and beautifully. 2. Why were all 10 gurus of the Khatri caste background ? 7 of the last 10 were direct descendents of the same Sodhi line of Khatris. What method was used to choose the next Guru ? Taken from : http://members.dancris.com/~sikh/chap05.html Mind you! It was earned, and not intended to be kept in the same family! 4. I support intercaste marriage because everyone is equal. On that same basis (Sikhism) I support Interreligious marriage too. Why are so many Sikhs against Interreligious marriage? What is their reason? Everyone is equal according to the Guru Granth Sahib. If it is for the fear of losing a Sikh to another religion then let me remind those Sikhs that in the Guru Granth Sahib it says that there is more than 1 path to God. Equality as talked about in the Guru Granth Sahib refers to equality of all mankind. Guru Granth Sahib's teachings on caste/creed/race equality do not apply to the Indian subcontinent alone. See this : http://sikhawareness.com/sikhawareness/vie...light=52+hukams It is Gurujee's hukam that Sikhs should intermarry! 5. Why do Sikhs continue to use their surnames or list their caste names as surnames when all Sikhs have been instructed to use just "Singh" and "Kaur" ? Already answered. 6. Did Guru Nanak Sahib ever claim to be a messenger of God or in contact with God ? How do we know that what he said was true or not ? How do we know that he was not just reforming Hinduism by mixing in some islamic elements ? Did you ever hear of the tuk "Jaisi meh aaye Khasam ki bani, taisda kari gyaan veh Lalo", meaning "As the Divine Word comes, so I speak it". Gurujee didn't make up His own theories. It was direct word of God. 7. What proof is there that what Guru Nanak Sahib preached was the word of God ? Was it merely blind faith of Indians who will believe in anything ? I just answered it. 8. If Guru Gobind Singh was truly a messenger of God then why would he cry and feel sad when the Sahibzadas were killed? His own message says to not get attached to worldly things. If he truly were a messenger of God he would have given his own life to save others in the same way Jesus Christ did much earlier. This also has been answered. And by the way, its one thing to give your life, and another to sacrifice your father, mother, kids, and beloved followers. Thats what Guru Gobind Singh did! 9. Why has Sikhism not spread outside of Punjab and Punjabis ? Yes, there are some non-punjabis that convert. On the whole the overwhelming majority of Sikhs are Punjabi & most don't follow it. I have found Sikhism to be too ritualistic, rigid and unreal of a religion to live with in the year 2004. Check this out : http://www.searchsikhism.com/writers.html Oh no! Its Christians appreciating Sikhism! What do we do now! Also to add to your info, a Christian once said "You Sikhs will all go to hell. Why? Because we Christians had only one Jesus Christ and we are out to convert the whole world. You have had thousands of Jesus Christs and yet you never brought about any awareness about your religion." 10. Why is haircutting not allowed? Please give a proper reason. Listen to katha by Gyani Sant Singh Jee Maskeen ar www.proudtobesikh.com , under the heading Gubani Vikhia Sahit on the right hand side. Its entitled Kakaar. 11. Why is Kosher meat not allowed to be eaten by Sikhs? Again I want a proper answer.People have their own views about meat and Sikhism. Those who believe that non-Halal meat is allowed, this is what they have to say : Muslims eat Halal meat. Guru Gobind Singh Jee wanted His Sikhs to not fear anyone but Waheguru, and so (they believe) it was told not to eat Halal meat as a sign of defiance to the Mughals. 12. Why is there no reference to Jesus Christ in Guru Granth Sahib ? If ever there was a prophet to have a legitimate claim to being a messenger of God it is Jesus Christ. We can say the same about Guru Sahibaans. But then again we are more accepting than a majority religion who claims heaven as their dad's property and condemns everyone else to hell. If that makes them happy, go ahead and dance to the Bhangra tunes you find! baedh kathaebee bhaedh n jaathaa || The Vedas and the Bible do not know the mystery of God. Guru Nanak Dev Ji Raag Maaroo 1021 What can the poor Vedas and Bibles do? People do not understand the One and Only Lord. ||6|| Guru Nanak Dev Ji Raag Bhairao 1153 13. How can Guru Granth Sahib be regarded as the "word of God" when all of it's contents are just 1 big compilation of holy men with the same ideology ? There are some like Bhagat Kabir who has some of his baani in Guru Granth Sahib and the other half of his baani is not included.Guru Arjan Dev Jee while compiling Adi Granth rejected a few saints whose Bani was not in accordance with Gurbani. Only what was God's message was included. Why wasn't half of Kabir Jee's Bani included? That only Gurujee knows! 14. Why is there so much importance placed on the Gurus themselves? They are not God. Sikhs all over the world have pictures of the Gurus & often worship those pictures. Thats THEIR mistake. Gurujee never asked to be worshipped. Bachittar Natak explains everything about Gurujee. Before leaving this world, the Guru had ordained,"If any one erects a shrine in my honor, his offspring shall perish." 16. What is the position of Sikhism on Abortion ? Strictly forbidden! 18. Why are there gurdwaras which are only there for specific castes ? Shouldn't gurdwaras be open to all? Again, you are blaming the mistake of a few people on the entire religion! 19. Why did Guru Gobind Singh (As stated in his own words in Dasam Granth) worship such Hindu gods like: Ram, Bhavani Devi, Sun God and demigod Inder ? This sounds very hypocritical. On the one hand his message is of One god and on the other he worships multiple incarnations of God . "I do not accept Ganesha as important. I do not meditate on Krishna, neither on Vishnu. I do not hear them and do not recognize them. My love is with the Lotus feet of God. He is my protector, the Supreme Lord. I am dust of his Lotus feet." (Guru Gobind Singh, Krishna Avatar) 20. If Sikhism truly believes that there is more than 1 path to God then why do Sikhs get upset at others who leave Sikhism for other religions out of their own free choice? It is simply a matter of choice. Who is asking you to NOT leave? Go ahead! And for the rest of your life, condemn those who don't follow your way of religion. For the rest of your life, feel free to SELL your beliefs to others like what most are doing already. For the rest of your life, sin 7 days a week and confess every Sunday (like thats gonna wash em off...lol). Here is more knowledge for you : http://www.sikhs.org/relig_se.htm I have a lot of respect for Jesus Christ. I also recently watched Passion of the Christ and started respecting him even more. But it made me wonder, that our Gurus and shaheeds faced million times more pain, yet didn't utter a sound in grief. Jesus did say at one point "Oh Lord why have You forsaken me!" And what did Guru Arjan Dev Jee say? "Tera keeya meetha laage, Har Naam padarth Nanak maangey". "Your Will seems so sweet. Nanak begs for the gift of your name."

jail chithhiyaan = amazing undithi duniya = will freak u out (not read full) others...still to read

WAHE GURU JI KA KHALSA, WAHE GURU JI KI FATEH. I belong to a Gursikh family; I beg to submit before you that I have an ANTIQUE GURU GRANTH SAHIB. It’s Height, Length, breadth, is only ONE (1) inch. Its Edge’s are polished in Gold. It has all 1430 pages of the said HOLY BOOK. It can be read only with the help of Magnifying Glass. This type of GURU GRANTH SAHIB is available in the MUSEUM of GOLDEN TEMPLE AMRITSAR. But that too is incomplete. This GURU GRANTH SAHIB has been in our family for Generations. I decided to sell this HOLY GURU GRANTH SAHIB. I request you to please use your contacts in Gursikh family or GURUDWARA SAHIB in helping me to sell this HOLY GURU GRANTH SAHIB. I am not quoting any price because you know this GURU GRANTH SAHIB is PRICELESS. Your cooperation in this matter would be highly appreciated. WAHE GURU JI KA KHALSA, WAHE GURU JI KI FATEH YOUR’S INDER PAL SINGH, LUCKNOW (U.P.) INDIA. E-MAIL: singpal@hotmail.com PHONE: 94154 59219

no no...not at all offended...but come on this thread started off only as a joke (seemed so to me)...and since there has been news going around about a "sant" (ahem ahem...i didn't take any names) being allegedly blamed for certain immoral actions (although nothing has been proved yet), i juz thought of mentioning certain "pre-requisites" needed to be a "sant" in light of the fact that some fake "sants" (again, not naming anyone) have been known to have certain ...ummm..."needs"...and so only as a matter of humour i asked gabbar if he had those...ummm..."needs"...thats all peace!

true NO

I have heard that its not actually a Bani, but a collection of shabads that bring happiness and are also protection shabads (rakhiya de shabad). But its so amazing and does bring loads of peace to the mind. Its said to be recited when one has a physical or mental ailment. Some people even say to keep water when you recite it and drink it after. And yeah, its best when recited at Amrit Vela. ok enuff of my blabbing..someone shed more light (use energizer batteries in your torch)

Nobody asked if there was a qualification to be an Amritdhari. Plus he asked whats to be done to be a "Sant". He didn't say "Sikh Sant" did he? A Sant can be from any religion, but an Amritdhari is always a Sikh (unless there is an Amrit ceremony in another religion by the same name that I don't know of). Also, this thread started out as a joke and no one is pointing fingers at any particular "Sant". If anyone wants to stereotype all Amritdharis, be my guest! ps : I thought drinking alcohol was one of the 4 bajjar kurehits. The dude is no more an Amritdhari if he drinks. BEEP! You can't call him Amritdhari!