das

Could you please upload this file again as soon as possible. I'll be really thankful to you.

These days on etc, one clipping is coming of Bhai Gurpreet Singh, do anybody have the links of his shabads. It's very good. das

I think it was 25th August 1975.

I heard this in Gurdwara where one person was giving speech on Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's life. This is the first time I heard of this cyanide event. I am NOT questioning that how could Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji do this. Off course Brahmgyani is GOD, so they can do it. It's not a big deal for them. The only concerned thing is why nobody other than that person is aware of this. The person who was giving speech was also wrong on Baba Ji's Sarer chadan de date. So, I think to check this event also. Neo, your comments on this. I think you're in England too. das

Yesterday in Gurdwara, one person mentioned the following event in England while Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji (Rara Sahib Wale): One person from sangat asked Sant Ji ke is it true that: ਬਿਖਿਆ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਬੂਝੈ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਸੁਜਾਣੁ ॥੪੮॥ At this Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji said ke: "YES, it is correct". Then the other person asked BabaJi to eat a cyanide and let him know the taste of cyanide. Baba Ji took that capsule and took out the powder from it and said ke: "This is very less. Give me more". So, ultimately Baba Ji took 6 or 7 cyanide capsules with Milk and said: "It's taste is bakbaka/tasteless". Is this event true? I know that on this website there are many from England. Is anyone aware of this event? das

After seeing all the previous posts of Balbir Singh Ji for the last few months, it looks like you are doing Naam Simran (or whatever you call it with some/all/none shabads). I think you might have reached at some point where you feel that you are right and Guru is telling you to do so....... because you might have experienced some spiritual things (actually, some powers etc.). They are distracting you from your actual path, Maya does different things to keep you seperated from GOD................I do NOT think that anyone who is doing TRUE Naam Simran could say the things like you are saying. This is the result of following something as told by someone and then experiencing some minor stuf (part of spiritual journey)........there are some places along the journey where Waheguru(now do not start debating that why calling Him Waheguru) gives you something which could result in deviatation from your TRUE path. So, kindly come out of that shell......Waheguru is still far away, but always the nearest. das

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji ke Fateh, The Guru of Guru Nanak Dev Ji is Nirankar HIMSELF. And at the same time Guru Nanak Dev Ji is Nirankar HIMSELF. Read/Listen to know about How, When, and Why there is a need for Nirankar in Guru Nanak Dev Ji roop to have Guru in form of Nirankar. Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to take isnan in Vayen nadi and did not come out after 3rd chube in river. Guru Ji came out of that river after 3 days. During that time Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to Sachkhand. In Sachkhand Nirankar (which is Guru Nanak Dev Ji) asked Guru Nanak Dev Ji that HE sent Guru Nanak Dev Ji to earth for "Naam Japaon" vaste, but Guru Nanak Dev Ji has not started this till now. At this Guru Nanak Dev Ji replied that: Maat Lok de marada/rule ha ke Without Gurmukh updesh karan de authority nahi ha. All the avatars till now do have Guru and I do not want to break that. Due to this I am here at Sachkhand and please be my Guru and do updesh me. At this Nirankar said I am your Guru and uterred Mool-Mantar (till Gurparshad) to Guru Nanak Dev Ji and at the same place Guru Nanak Dev Ji ne Sodar de pauri ve uchari. After returning from Sachkhand or say coming out of river, Guru Nanak Dev Ji starting 4 udasis* for the welfare of man-kind. Actually, there are various other things: what happened inside Sachkhand and how Guru of Guru Nanak Dev Ji is Nirankar and Nirankar is Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Kindly listen to Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji da deewan from following link. Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji has explained this in detail. These kind of things could not be find in books or granths. Only Sant/Brahmgyanis can explain all this becuase they are ONE with ONE. So, I request you all to invest 1.30 hour to listen this deewan..........lots of information. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji da Sachkhand Jana http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/0...hkhand.Jana.mp3 If you don't agree with this, then instead of saying bad to Sant/Mahatma, say Waheguru and don't post anything bad. Udasis: Guru Nanak Dev Ji travelled to 4 directions at 4 different times and these are called Udasis. Thus Guru Nanak Dev Ji went on 4 udasis. bhul chuk de mafi das

I am neither innocent nor pretending to be innocent or saintly. You have limited the Sharia word only to the Muslims. Anyways, let's leave this topic.

Thanks javanmard for reminding that I'm pindu, it's nice to hear from someone about our roots. Moreover, from your sweet comments in last message it reflects that you're very sensible and knows how to interact with a pindu. May GOD be always by your side. ਪੜਿਆ ਅਤੈ ਓਮੀਆ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ ਅਗੈ ਵੀਚਾਰੀਐ ॥ The accounts of the educated and the illiterate shall be judged in the world hereafter. ਪੜਿਆ ਅਣਪੜਿਆ ਪਰਮ ਗਤਿ ਪਾਵੈ ॥੧॥ whether educated or uneducated, obtains the state of supreme dignity. ||1|| ਸੋ ਪੜਿਆ ਸੋ ਪੰਡਿਤੁ ਬੀਨਾ ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦਿ ਕਰੇ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ ॥ He alone is educated, and he alone is a wise Pandit, who contemplates the Word of the Guru's Shabad. das

What is Shariat in Spiritualism? Shariat is to follow certain rules/rehat IN ORDER TO purify the Bhud because pure Bhud is first requirement in order to reach GOD. Here Sharia is NOT some set of rules defined by Muslims. Shariat exists before muslims. Even Muslim's core shariat according to rohane school is 5 Namaj, and not their defined shariat. The shariat defined by Muslims do NOT allow anyone to have a GURU in physical form. But without GURU no-one can get Mukti. There are some steps to reach Waheguru Shariat is the first level/step when someone wants to meet GOD. This is the admission to a ruhane school and NOT the final goal. The main reason to follow Shariat is: Bhud nu shud karna so that before further step our Bhud is pure/shud. In Sikhism, shariat is NOT just taking Amrit, it is taking Amrit AND doing 5 banis path everyday. If we're NOT able to purify our Bhud by following Shariat, then what's the use of Shariat. After all, levels are designed so that a student can make a slow and steady progress towards their goal. If Bhud is purified, then there will be NO wars. All the religions are like schools/colleges whose main aim is to teach public "How to reach GOD from WHOM we are seperated" and all schools do have 4 levels (Shariat, Trikat, Marfat, Hakikat). Moreover, in Sutanpur, Guru Nanak Dev Ji said to Kazze that: "If you see Khuda in everyone, then you are Muslim, and if you see Ram in everyone, then you are Hindu." It means that a true Sikh should see Guru Nanak Dev Ji in everyone, if not then we're not true sikh. But one can see this way ONLY after reaching 3rd stage which is called Marfat. Marfat is the stage under which one gets the ability to understand the Nirgun Parmatma. I have NOT even got admission in ruhane school in this birth i.e NOT in Shariat. So, there is lot more to do in order to be ONE. Bhul chuk de mafi das

I fully agree with Neo bhaji. I don't want to say anything which could make me Nindak, but these days many (NOT all) granthis/scholars are preaching only 1st level (Shariat) and the followers (people who appreciate them) of them are most rigid. They are like: Only Sikhi is the way to GOD, No sawarg, No narak, No feet touching of Sants. Some of them are even mocking Sants/Brahmgyanis on stages. But the fact is Manjle Trikat and other levels after that are NOT possible without true Sant/Brahmgyani. Some facts: 1st class (Manjle Shariat) - In Sikhism it is take Amrit and do path of 5 Banis. In Muslims, it is 5 Namaj. In Hindus, it is 3 Sandea. 2nd class (Manjle Trikat) - It is Naam Abyaas through Brahmgyani. 3rd class (Manjle Marfat) - Atam Gyan. Nirgun de sooj bhuj (Understand the Nirgun Parmatma/Waheguru). 4rd class (Manjle Hakikat) - Jev/Soul merges with GOD. This parchar could only be done by true Sant/Brahmgyani. I again salute you for what you said and the way you said. Bhul chuk de mafi das

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh, I'll be thankful to anyone who can post Guru Nanak Dev Ji photo (close up face) by Sobha Singh as soon as possible. I need it to be at-least 1024 X 768. das

These things are mentioned in Vedas and Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's deewans. For further information: 1. Listen to all available Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's deewans. Babaji used to tell many of these things in their deewans. There are lot many many deewans of Babaji which do NOT have print/audio/video copies. Most of these things can be found in Guru Granth Sahib Ji, we only need to understand with the help of Puran Sant. Puran Sant can explain the actual meanings of all tuks as well as the place, situation, time under which each tuk is created. 2. How Universe was created: http://www.bharatadesam.com/spiritual/vishnu_purana.php 3. http://veda.harekrsna.cz/encyclopedia/ 4. http://www.encyclopediaofauthentichinduism.org/articles.htm But be aware that modern scholars of vedas explain the vedas in very different form as our modern day scholars explain Guru Granth Sahib Ji. das

In total, there are 4 types of Pralayas: 1. NITYA PRALAYA : This takes place every moment, when the atoms that compose the various forms in the universe unite and disperse. e.g Birth and Death of animals, humans etc. 2. NAIMITTIKA PRALAYA : This takes place during Brahma's night in which the three worlds (Bhuh, Bhuvah and Suvah) continue to exist but are made uninhabitable. The souls of individuals also continue to exist to be reincarnated in the next daytime of Brahma. During that period Brahma holds within himself all the beings of the material and the celestial worlds in a suspended state and sleeps. 3. PRAKRITA PRALAYA : It takes place when Brahma completes his 100 years of life span. It is the change of the universe from its present to a latent condition and its dissolution in unmanifested nature, in which no evolution can take place until the dawn of a new manvantara. In this condition of dissolution, the Jivas remaining unliberated lie in a dormant state and get manifested again in the next creation. 4. ATYANTIK PRALAYA : All forms, space, Maya, and time are absorbed into God and God alone remains. All 5 elements merged as follows: Earth->Water->Fire->Air->Sky->Maya->GOD/WAHEGURU. Anyone who actually merges with GOD can be said to be blessed with ATYANTIK kalyan because there is NO coming back to anything once merged with GOD. Now, some of the mathematics is as follows: The time of each yug is as follows: Satya-yuga: 1,728,000 human/solar years OR 4,800 demigod years OR 4 charanas. Treta-yuga: 1,296,000 human/solar years OR 3,600 demigod years OR 3 charanas. Dvapara-yuga: 864,000 human/solar years OR 2,400 demigod years OR 2 charanas. Kali-yuga: 432,000 human/solar years OR 1,200 demigod years OR 1 charanas. 1 cycle of 4 yugs = 1 Mahayug 1 day of Brahma = 1 Kalpa = 1000 Mahayugs = Life span of other devtas = 12,000 years of Devas = 14 manvantara periods each one lasting 71 Mahayugs A day of Brahma equals (14 times 71 mahayugas) + (15 x 4 Charanas) = 994 mahayugas + (60 Charanas) = 994 mahayugas + (6 x 10) Charanas = 994 mahayugas + 6 mahayugas = 1000 mahayugas Brahma Life span = 100 Brahma years = 311 trillion and 40 billion human years One interesting fact is that: 1 human year = 1 day of Demigods (6 months day and 6 months night) When the sun is in the southern side of the universe (summer in the Southern Hemisphere), the demons have day and demigods have night, and vice versa when the sun is in the Northern Hemisphere. During our one human year, the devtas sleep for 6 months and danav wakes for that 6 months, and during the 6 months when devtas wake - denav sleeps. The above might explain why some very old people say that good deeds done in particular month carry more fal/fruit/reward as compared to other months. Same thing as in taking bath during Amrit vela has more importance than during day. According to Puranic accounts, we are now in the twenty-eight yuga cycle of the seventh manvatara period of the present day of Brahma. Brahma is in 51st year of his life span. One more thing is that first 10,000 years of Kaliyug has increased Bhagti Influence. This is mentioned in mentioned in "Brahma Vaivarta Puran". Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji also mentioned that after some years of Kaliyug, all the tiraths of this world will cease to function, which mean they will NO longer provide good to visitors because the devtas providing the good will abandom the tiraths. Babaji has also confirmed that the current life of Kaliyug is around 5000 years. bhul chuk de maffi das

Whether a person is Sikh/Hindu/Muslim/Christan/or belongs to any other religion, every human-being is subject to his/her karma 100%. BUT yes, karma CAN be cancelled or destroyed by true Guru's grace and True Guru is NOT the property of only Sikhs and even true Guru is not met without previous good deeds. Whosoever (any religion), comes in true Guru's feet can be saved from his karma. -------------------------------- ਕਰਮ ਧਰਤੀ ਸਰੀਰੁ ਜੁਗ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਜੋ ਬੋਵੈ ਸੋ ਖਾਤਿ ॥ The body is the field of karma in this age; whatever you plant, you shall harvest. -------------------------------- ਕਰਮੀ ਆਵੈ ਕਪੜਾ ਨਦਰੀ ਮੋਖੁ ਦੁਆਰੁ ॥ By the karma of past actions, the robe of this physical body is obtained. By His Grace, the Gate of Liberation is found. -------------------------------- ਬਿਨੁ ਗੁਰ ਕਰਮ ਨ ਛੁਟਸੀ ਕਹਿ ਸੁਣਿ ਆਖਿ ਵਖਾਣੁ ॥੭॥ Without the Guru, they are not released from their karma, although they speak and listen and preach and explain. -------------------------------- ਜਿਨ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਸੇ ਵਡਭਾਗੀ ਪੂਰੈ ਕਰਮਿ ਮਿਲਾਵਣਿਆ ॥੩॥ Those who meet the True Guru are very fortunate and blessed; through perfect karma, He is met. --------------------------------- ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਬਚਨਿ ਜਾਗਿਆ ਮੇਰਾ ਕਰਮੁ ॥ Through the Guru's Word, my good karma has been awakened. --------------------------------- bhul chuk de maffi das

The link in my previous message are NOT html pages, these are MP3 audio files. It should automatically play in Windows media player WITHOUT downloading. If you are in India and using dialup, then I guess that sometimes it won't play because of slow speed. Actually these deewans are from: http://www.gurmatveechar.org and then goto Katha section and then click "Sant Ishar Singh (Rara Sahib Wale). It will present you a list of around 166 deewans divided in 4 pages. But if you have high speed internet, then you can paste the following WHOLE text (NOT just the blue colored text) below directly in browser and it should play in media player. Do same for all deewans: START copying from http and till mp3 http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...Dia.Jugtiaa.mp3

If you are seriously interested in understanding some great things including the things in the previous message, then the proper way is to learn it from Sants/Brahmgyanis and NOT from a normal person like me. I do NOT know anything. I may present the topics according to my budh and soch. I would suggest you to listen the following selected deewans of Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji if you are not from people who have allergy from Sant/Brahmgyani as according to them it is against Gurmat. If you or anyone don't like the concept of Sant/Brahmgyani, then you are requested NOT to write/say/soch nendea. After listening the deewan you will be more than happy and satisfied. I'm still learnign from deewans. Under each link, the topics are mentioned which are covered in that particular deewan. In all deewan you will be able to listen the Gurbani tuks for the covered topics. Deewans of Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji NOTE: Don't click on Deewan links, instead copy the whole link and paste that in new browser. ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S....Mekhe.Jana.mp3 Knowledge covered: - What is GOD - Types of Avatars ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S....da.Senwaad.mp3 Knowledge about: - 3 roops of Waheguru: Nirgun, Sargun, Verat ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S....Jaandeh.Ji.mp3 Knowledge about: - Effect of 1 sec of saying Waheguru - Precendence of naam, isnan, satsang. - Initially Guru HAVE to be considered as GOD - To meet Waheguru: 3 things are necessary: Simran, Dhayan, Gyan. For details listen. ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...Dia.Jugtiaa.mp3 Knowledge Covered: - Simran diyan Jugtiaa/Techniques of Naam Simran ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...i.Gopala.Ji.mp3 Knowledge about: - Why Guru jee ne Gurbani rache - Types of gatti/salvation with full details - Heaven is not permanent and one should NOT desire that and problems in heaven - Types of Bhagti ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...aribi.Avey).mp3 Knowledge covered: - Types of Pride/Hankar, - Worship of what? - What is Mukti? - "Waheguru Gur-mantar ha, jap hume khoe" ------------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S.....Jay.Aayaa.mp3 Knowledge covered: - Gurbani vecharne has MORE importance than Gurbani parne (for those who say that katha and so called kache bani is not valid) ----------------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...u.Naal.Meyl.mp3 Knowledge about: - How many kuls/generations are blessed who does Bhagati - What body is made up of: 2 things (Asthol sareer which is made up of 5 basic elements, and Susham sareer which is made up of 17 elements....listen for details) ---------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...hu.Di.Sakhi.mp3 Knowledge covered: - Who is Sant/Brahmgyani - Lachan of Sants), - Salvation for different kind of people - Bhagats can replace GOD's bachan ---------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...ey.Paatshah.mp3 Knowledge covered - Importance of Namaskar - Which thing is important in each yug: e.g puja, yag - Why sometimes reading Gurbani does NOT induce nasha ---------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...hkhand.Jana.mp3 Knoweldge covered: - Guru Nanak Dev Ji was Nirankar HIMSELF. - If Guru is necessary (or say if Naam from Guru is necessary), then who was Guru of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. ---------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S....Daya.Singh.mp3 - Guru Gobind Singh da Tuhi Tuhi likhna on many pages - What to forget - Death occurs when 4 things reach - Khalsa is created with GOD's hukam - Crowd during Guru Gobind Singh Ji's deewan was around 60,000-70,000 - Only forty were left from all the crowd when the Guru Gobind Singh came outside with Panj Payaras...and these 40 are known as CHALI MUKTE - 3 Amrits: Khande da Amrit or Sanskar Amrit, Naam Amrit, Gyan Amrit ----------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...at.Da.Divan.mp3 Knowledge covered - 3.5 crore masand/holes in body - For those who says that if RAAB wants then we will do path.... 4 types of kirpa: Ishvar kirpa, Guru kirpa, Shaster kirpa, and Apne aap kirpa..........Ishvar kirpa is human birth, Guru, Shaster kirapa is Gurbani de kirpa as Gurbani guide us and also guides us to go to Sant, Guru Kirpa is Sant ne method/jugti dase, so you have all 3 kirpas, and then do 4th kirpa yourself.....after all these 4 kirpas, jevan ve safal ho javaga. ----------------------------- http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...m.Di.Mehmaa.mp3 Knowledge covered: - 2 things that a person faces in Satsang: Susti and Khayal da edhar udhar jana. And ways to overcome this. - Importance of Naam according to Bhai Gurdas Jee. - Totol of 3.5 crore tirath in this world, among them 68 are main. - According to Guru Nanak Dev Ji which Name of GOD should be uttered as asked by pandats - Ruhane/Spiritual school have 4 classes (Vast knowledge) ------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S....Walo.Sakhi.mp3 Knowledge covered - RAAB is inside us, but is inside 5 layers. One needs 2 things to find that: Brahmgyani who knows where is RAAB and a key obtained by Brahmgyani to open that 5 layers. In other words RAAB is inside 5 kosh. Ann Kosh, Pran Kosh, Man Kosh, Vegyan Kosh, Anand Kosh. Here key is Naam da abyaas which Brahmgyani gives. - Baba Fareed was following sherat for 36 years and din't want to visit any Brahmgyani, but after spending 36 years then he has gone to Brahmgyani and attained RAAB. ------------------------------ http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...dhaar.Karna.mp3 Knowledge covered: - Dharam de char/4 paar haan: Raja, Tirath, Brahman, Sadhu. - RAAB tu ucha RAAB da NAAM ha as told by Guru Nanak Dev Ji to Gorakhnath. Also, listen the reason. - Examples of RAAB da NAAM RAAB to ucha ha. - Everything can be obtained by: Naam, Dan, Isnan. ------------------------------ bhul chuk de maffi das

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh In the following I might have gone off-topic but may be its helpful to understand Naam/Gurmantar/Waheguru. All the creation (crores and crores of universes, Khands etc.) exists because of the continued resosance of Naam. Starting from the creation of everything this resosance is going on and will go. If this resosance is stopped, then the whole creation will be destroyed. Infact GOD created everything by with one shabad. Naam is within us. I agree with Neo that during Amrit Sanchar, Panj Payaras give us a shabad which will in turn awake that Naam from within us. Panj Payaras (supposing that one of the Panj Payaras has already attained the last stage of spiritual path) also give a technique which have to be followed with that shabad. With technique Brahmgyan can be attained. Naam is same as always. Naam within us and Naam given by Panj Payars IS same. Now, Naam that helps us to merge with GOD have to be followed by a technique which could ONLY be given by Sant/Brahmgyani/Who is one with GOD (I am NOT talking of a person whom sometimes we refer to Brahmgyani if he looks like one from outer clothes). Actually, in order to meet Waheguru 3 things are necessary: Simran, Dhayan/Concentration, and Gyan. Simran should be of Gurmantar/Waheguru with a technique [bakhery Bani (with tongue), Madma Bani (in throat), Pasanty Bani (in heart), Para Bani (in nabi) etc. but these techniques should be given by Sant/Brahmgyani according to one's adekar]. Dhayan hunda a Guru saroop da. Now, some people say that Guru in physical form is NOT allowed. It's NOT black and white. I agree that our eternal Guru is Guru Granth Sahib Ji. But one needs "Dhayan Dharna" while doing simran and Nirankar is without saroop. How could we put our "Dhayan" on Nirankar? For example: If someone wants to take nishana on sky, then he/she needs something in sky to dhayan, otherwise sky is gap. We need to "Dharan Dharna" of GURU/Teacher (who is already one with GOD) and after sometime when birte becomes susham then Nirankar da dhayan ho janda ha. The above mentioned Dhayan is NOT out of context thing, it's told by Guru Arjan Dev Ji when sangat asked Babaji "Kis da dhayan karna chaheda ha/To whom should be concenterate on while doing simran". In Guru Granth Sahib Ji on page 864 as follows: ਗੁਰ ਕੀ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਮਨ ਮਹਿ ਧਿਆਨੁ ॥ ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਮਨੁ ਮਾਨ ॥ ਗੁਰ ਕੇ ਚਰਨ ਰਿਦੈ ਲੈ ਧਾਰਉ ॥ ਗੁਰੁ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਸਦਾ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੧॥ ਮਤ ਕੋ ਭਰਮਿ ਭੁਲੈ ਸੰਸਾਰਿ ॥ ਗੁਰ ਬਿਨੁ ਕੋਇ ਨ ਉਤਰਸਿ ਪਾਰਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ Here Babaji is referring to Guru (true Sant/Brahmgyani) in physical form because GOD is Nirakar (without shape and does not have feet). For example: Naam is a ship that can take us to other end which is across this sansar samundar. The other end is Waheguru. Now, one needs Malah/Guru/Teacher/Brahmgyani (person who drives the Naam rupe boat), but that malah should know the place where he is taking the people and also must have good arms so that he can drive the chappu. Boat cannot go to other shore without Malah. Same way "Waheguru/Naam/Gurmantar" simran without Guru won't be able to help us to reach GOD. Reaching GOD and attaining some gyan or attain a place in heaven is entirely different. Doing simran without Guru may help us to bring good things, Ridhian-Sidhian and can help us to reach the true Guru. Waheguru/Naam da simran WITHOUT Guru may lead us (by GOD) to a true Guru who will in turn help us to meet GOD. for example: Baba Fareed did very hard bhagati for 36 years without the guidance of physical Sant/Brahmgyani because he was the follower of Shareat and Shareat does not allow any Guru in physical form, but after 36 years he has gone to Brahmgyani and thus attained GOD. True Guru/Sant/Brahmgyani cannot be find out by us, GOD leads us to them in reward of our good deeds of several previous births and not just one. Lucky are those whom GOD has provided the guidance of Brahmgyani. We should try to do as much path/gurbani as we can do, because every second counts, we might meet the GOD in next janams. A person who is doing lot of paths/simran in this birth, but not enough to meet Waheguru. Death and re-birth for that person is like reading a book and while doing that goes to sleep, when he again wakes up start reading from that page where he left. It's NOT something like in every human birth you have to restart your karam book. bhuk chuk de maffi das

http://www.gurmatveechar.org/audio/katha/S...hkhand.Jana.mp3 All the following questions are answered in the above mentioned deewan. Questions: 1. Was Guru Nanak Dev Ji Nirankar Himself? 2. If yes, why Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to Sachkhand (and NOT heaven) for 3 days? 3. Why Guru Nanak Dev Ji started major preaching ONLY AFTER coming from Sachkhand. What GURU was waiting? 4. According to Guru Granth Sahib Ji, Guru is must in order to merge with GOD. Then who was the GURU of Guru Nanak Dev Ji? 5. What Nirankar said to Guru Nanak Dev Ji? 6. Mool-mantar is till "Gurparshad" OR till "Nanak Hose bhe Sach"? 1. YES, Guru Nanak Dev Ji was Nirankar suroop Himself. 2. Because there are certain things that Nirankar in Guru roop has to fulfill. 3. Because there are certain things that Nirankar in Guru roop has to fulfill. 4. Even though Guru Nanak Dev Ji was Nirankar suroop Himself, there was NO need to have Guru, BUT there are certain rules that has to follow. 5. Mool-mantar is till "Gurparshad" that Nirankar himself given to Guru Nanak Dev Ji. The above answers are very short, but for detail listen to Baba Ji's said deewan starting from 30 minutes. NOTE: According to Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji: Mool-mantar is till "Gurparshad", BUT Mahatma/Sant/Brahmgyanis ask people to receite it till "Nanak Hose bhe Sach" because of the betterment of people. I do NOT remember the deewan name where Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji mentioned this.

You are correct shaheediyan veerji that Gurbani read in Raag have very deep effect (physically, emotionally, and spiritually)..........Neither I was comparing Raag vs Dharna nor was raising questions that why Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not read in raag.............my sole point was: There are some persons who say that reading dharna is manmukh/against Gurmat............they say that any person who is reading Kachi Bani/Dharna is against Gurmat and is not a Sikh. This is wrong. That questions were aimed at them (whose who call dharna as manmukh) asking them if Kirtan without Raag or Dharna is manmat, then what about reading Guru Granth Sahib Ji without Raag and discussing the Sikh history. So, the bottom line is anything which discusses HIM/GOD is good.......it could be in the shape of raag kirtan, dharna, gurbani reading, preaching of GOD, simply discussing in sangat, or just like we're discussing now etc. etc............ and naturally every way has its own points......just like saying Waheguru Waheguru at third eye has much more power as compared to saying by tongue.......here Waheguru is same, but only the place where HIS dhayan is done is different............here we can't say that saying Waheguru with tongue is of NO importance...........The real thing is remember HIM at all the times. bhul chek de maffi das

First things first that I am NOT a scholar, i do not know anything, i am here (in this world) because I was unable to do what GOD wanted me to do. That's the reason HE sent me to this world in order to merge with HIM. I'm sorry if my post was something out of this thread. My point was: NOT to say that scholarly work is not necessary. I was saying that scholarly work alone can't be the ONLY determining factor for a Samparda. Raag to dharana I salute and respect you that you prefer raag. There is nothing equal if you are aware of raag and you can play and understand the raag. But it does NOT mean that dharna is nothing. Dharna/Kachi bani: According to some: everything that is not included in Guru Granth Sahib Ji is kachi bani. Can they shed some light on: Why we discuss ithas of shahibzade and other Sikh ithas, that's not included in Guru Granth Sahib. Why don't we read Guru Granth Sahib Ji in raag as Guru Granth Sahib Ji is written in Raags. Anything that discuss one GOD IS good and takes us micro-step near to HIM. Even a thought that: "I should say Waheguru" is good and takes us one step nearer to GOD. How are brahmgyani's automatically scholars???? explain this to me Firstly, I canNOT explain anything......who am I to explain? Learn this from Gurbani. First thing according to Gurbani: "Brahmgyani aap Nirankar" According to Gurbani, there is NO difference between Nirankar and Brahmgyani. So, therefore naturally, GOD/Brahmgyani knows what vidiaya HE created. Here Brahmgyani is NOT a merly easy word which we even use on Gurdwara stages to represent a kirtanea/kathakar. Faith is based on reality? You are 100% correct here. But can a nemana ask, what is reality? The reality is GOD himself. Everything else comes from the combination of maya and just a illusion. Is there anything permanent? Is there any home in this entire world which didn't face death of a family member? What is permanent? how do you know they are one jyot. who said that one jot is....... We can learn these things from a Sant/Brahmgyani. I am hesiting to write the following that I leant because I know many learned modern scholar will not accept this. Guru Nanak Dev Ji will take birth 84 times during kalyug. 11 times as Gurus, 71 times as Saints, and rest as a ___. (i don't remember the third type). Here please no long debates, don't worry , we all will know this once we are out of this 5 element body. Do numbers make up Sikhi? In different cases: Yes and No. We need 5 payaras in order to give amrit to shardhalo. Here number matters, why? Guru Gobind Singh Ji has said that when there is ___ million khalsa, I will hand over the teasure to them. This treasure is said to be in __ river. Sorry, I don't remember the exact number and place. Here also number matters. But we start indulging into numbers all the time, and does not move a step further to GOD, then what's the use of knowing that GOD is ONE in number. Here numbers does not hold value. Some saints say sach khand is a place, others say it is state..... What I understood from Sant/Brahmgyani is that: Sachkhand is a place as well as state in certain terms. It depends upon on how we differentiate between place and state. Is Air a state under which we breathe OR Air is a place (surrounding earth) where we go to take breath? Sachkhand is the highest place where GOD resides (not in the terms of where GOD physically live.....HE lives in everyone also.....we don't have to go anywhere because GOD is within us......it's hard to explain.....I can't put this into words).......one do NOT have to travel by any means to reach Sachkhand....One can visit the Sachkhand through the dasam dwar. Now, if one has reached the Sachkhand during meditation through the dasam dwar, then we can say that it's just a state because physically (physical according to dunave/worldly point of view) the person is here. The things are entirely different once we're outside of this limited body. Brahmgyani is the one who has already merged with GOD, know where exactly is Sachkhand, which route is best to reach GOD in today's environment. How could a scholar who has just read millions of books regarding Sachkhand and GOD, but have never visited a place guide us for GOD? In each yug, there are different ways to attain GOD. In previous yugs, people were having very very long ages. They were very strong. They did hundreds of years tapasaya through Parayanam. But in Kalyug, Guru Nanak Dev Ji told us Naam marg because of kalyug's envirnoment. It's NOT that Guru Nanak Dev Ji rejected Parayanam, it's just Naam marg is feasible is kalyug. We won't be able to do tap in kalyug. So, same way naam diyan techniques can only be learnt from a Sant because everything in this world becomes easy with a technique. Without technique the same thing is hard. We need to go to Sant/Brahmgyani in order to learn the actual truth, and NOT to scholar. I don't want to enter in argument, but the ultimate reality is GOD and we all will came to know of it one day. Some have already learnt, some are learning, some are beliving, some are waiting to learn. And regarding the roots of Nirmale, Udasi and so on......including ourself is ONE which is GOD..........everything comes from GOD and goes into GOD. Just wait and watch. I don't have even the 0% knowledge, I am a learner, so bhul chuk de maffi. das

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh, I think that it's better to think about the reason why GOD send Saints at various times before coming to argument about Nirmale tradition. The time at which Sant Attar Singh Ji, Sant Baba Karam Singh Ji Hote mardan wale came to this world, it was the time when most of the Sikhs were moving away from Sikhism. Some were converting to Hinduism, some to Christians. If at that time, Saints have taught the ayurdeva, vedas, and other scholarly stuff, then do we think that a normal person could have understand that? I request everyone to look at the figure/count of Sikhs before Sant Karam Singh, Sant Attar Singh Ji, and Sant Isher Singh Ji and then after they left for Sachkhand. The important point is Saints are here to guide this world towards true ONE GOD, and NOT to sustain the previous traditions. They may or may not follow the traditions. Guru Gobind Singh prepared baptized Sikhs (Khalsa), Guru Nanak Dev Ji never started Sikh baptism. Secondly, it's NOT that some Sants don't know various languages, have knowledge of vedas etc..... they do have all knowledge (because a Sant/Brahmgyani is one who have attained GOD and have Brahm gyan).....but the thing vidhaya/knowedge is supposed to benefit the person, but if a normal person cannot understand the vidhaya, then what's the reason to write the deep granths.....Sants duty is to lead people on GOD's path and NOT to write and study themselves. SCHOLAR: The one who STUDIES many many books, granths, literature. SANT/BRAHMGYANI: The one who attains all knowldege from the creator himself. All the knowledge came directly from the creator. They don't need to study in order to know something. Sant/Brahmgyanis are automatically Scholars, but the vice versa is NOT true. Moreover, it may also happen that one Sant from same samprada may write Granth, and the other might not. If we say older Sants did this, but modern don't does this, then we are wrong. THEY ARE ONE JOT. All our 10 Gurus is ONE jot and that same jot is also present Sant Attar Singh Ji, Sant Baba Karam Singh Ji, Sant Isher Singh Ji. If we manmukh people say Guru Nanak Dev did this, but Guru Gobind Singh Ji this, then we are wrong. And whatever a Sant/Brahmgyani does, it is understandable only to HIM. He might do the things in different way. Who are we to raise the questions?? Before anything Nirmale, Sant, Brahmgyani etc. etc. etc. etc. .............they are one with GOD, where everything ceases to exist. There is only GOD and everything else is false. bhul chuk de maffi das

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh, Does anyone has downloadable shabads of Bhai Jasbir Singh Khanne Wale? If yes, please let me know the link. I will be thankful to you. Thanks das

Recently, some of us are raising questions regarding Sants/Brahmgyanis....or who is the correct successor of Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji. [highlight=red:2cfef8c4b1]1.[/highlight:2cfef8c4b1] Both Sant Kishan Singh Ji (Chota Maharaj) and Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji has same Murshad (Sant Attar Singh Ji). After Sant Attar Singh Ji left for Sachkhand, both Babajee came to Rara Sahib which was a small jungle at that time. Sant Kishan Singh Ji told Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji that: I can do seva of construction, langar, cows etc., but you do the preaching. That's the reason ke: Sant Kishan Ji did all the seva of construction of building when only 2 or 3 rooms were made in Rara Sahib. Then Sant Kishan Singh Ji take care of other construction and langar and Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji take care of the preaching the message of humanity to the people. I don't remember the name of the book, but it is specified in one of the Baba Isher Singh Ji's book. [highlight=red:2cfef8c4b1]2.[/highlight:2cfef8c4b1] Jarg Sahib da Gardwara was opened with the blessings of GOD. In 1953 during one deewan of Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji at Jarg, Baba ji said ke there should be a Gurdwara at thing kind of place. So, after Baba's Sachkhand jana, one sevak of Baba ji donated 8 acres of land in Jarg to build the Gurwarara at Jarg. Moreover, everything in this universe occurs because of some bahana/excuse........for example: person's death occurs only when the 4 things come together: Ann jal mukh jave, Pran mukh jan, ohe place aa jave, ohe banat ban jave (Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji) That person has to die, but some excuse should be there for dunave loka vaste. So, the point is that Gurdware has to built up in Jarg, but at the decided time, place, and by particular person. And by some bahana/excuse Gurdwara was build in Jarg. [highlight=red:2cfef8c4b1]3.[/highlight:2cfef8c4b1] Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji once instructed Jathedar Sant Baba Mohinder Singh Ji to take care of my 2 heras/diamonds: Baba Amrik Singh Ji, and Sant Baba Bhupinder Singh Ji. For Jathedar baba ji, Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji said number of times that he has attained everything. And Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji specifically asked Jathedar Babaji to preach people. At this Jathedar Sant Baba Mohinder Singh Ji requested ke Baba jee I don't know the kirtan. That's the reason in all the diwans of Sant Baba Mohinder Singh Ji, Baba ji only does katha and kirtan was done by Baba Amrik Singh Ji and then by Sant Baba Bhupinder Singh Ji. [highlight=red:2cfef8c4b1]4.[/highlight:2cfef8c4b1] In all my years, I never heard Sant Baba Bhupinder Singh Ji saying that we will make people forget Rara Sahib. Sometimes, it happens that Sant/Brahmgyani says some thing in their mooj which means entirely different things, but our limited brains could not recognize that. Moreover, who are we to comment on Brahmgyani or who should have gaddi???? Brahmgyani is here to help us to meet One Waheguru. If we are thristy and we need water, does it matter from which sea the water came?? I think that the answer is NO. Our only concern should be remove our thrist. In our case, our thrist is Waheguru which can only be removed by someone who has already met Waheguru and this someone is Brahmgyani/Sant. We would NEVER be able to understand why a particular Sant/Brahmgyani did some particular thing(which might seem wrong to our chote mat)......but "Brahmgyani Ke Gat Brahmgyani Jane".....we should have a deep faith. Faith is very very very important in Sikhi. It is faith of Panj Paraye on Guru Gobind Singh Ji that they offered their heads to Guru Gobind Singh Ji. I wish to touch feet of ALL the Sants/Brahmgyani of All sampardas because ਸੰਤ ਕੀ ਧੂਰਿ ਮਿਟੇ ਅਘ ਕੋਟ ॥ Millions of sins are wiped away by the dust of the feet of the Saints. (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page-188, Line 19) So, as a rule do NOT ever say anything bad about Sant/Brahmgyani and NEVER to test Sant/Brahmgyani because ਸੰਤ ਕੀ ਨਿੰਦਾ ਨਾਨਕਾ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਅਵਤਾਰ ॥੧॥ One who slanders the Saints, O Nanak, shall be reincarnated over and over again. ||1|| (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page - 279, Line 13) ਸੰਤ ਕਾ ਨਿੰਦਕੁ ਪਰਮੇਸੁਰਿ ਮਾਰਾ ॥ The slanderer of the Saint is cursed by the Transcendent Lord. (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page - 280, Line 2) ਸਾਧ ਕਾ ਨਿੰਦਕੁ ਕੈਸੇ ਤਰੈ ॥ How can the slanderer of the Holy Saints be saved? (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page - 875, Line 12) Infact ninda te bure kise de ve nahi as Bani tells us: ਨਿੰਦਕੁ ਜਮਦੂਤੀ ਆਇ ਸੰਘਾਰਿਓ ਦੇਵਹਿ ਮੂੰਡ ਉਪਰਿ ਮਟਾਕ ॥ The Messenger of Death comes to slaughter the slanderer; he beats him on his head. (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page - 1224, Line 14) ਨਿੰਦਕੁ ਮੁਆ ਉਪਜਿ ਵਡ ਤਾਪੁ ॥੨॥ The slanderer died after contracting the deadly fever. ||2|| (Guru Granth Sahib Ji - Page - 199, Line 12) Now, some people say, we know that he is not a true Sant. Do we think that we are johary (person who tests diamond)?? Do we have the capability to test any Sant/Brahmgyani?? I do NOT think so. Only a true johary can tell the difference between true and false diamond, but a sweaper won't be able to tell the difference. We are the sweapers of Guru's Darbar, let's do our work with sincerity. So, please stop raising questions about ANY Sant/Brahmgyani. das

That's great kam bhaji. I'll wait for that day when the entire audio Vikhaya of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is available for listening. It's great seva....May GOD be always by your side. das