Sherni-E-Punjab Posted July 12, 2003 Report Share Posted July 12, 2003 Lately, or otherwords for like the past for gosh knows how long, there is been a dispute over "castes." ...Everyone these days goes its punjabi culture and not sikhi..And as far as I am concerned I believe punjabi culture and sikhi are two different things? Why are we trying to abolish it then?? ..Just leave alone punjabi culture and let it live.. :roll: :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 Gurfateh Culture is man-made, Religion is a revelation from God. Culture is beneficial when we use religious ideals to establish it. With regards to 'caste', the following revelation has been given to us by our beloved Guru's, hope this helps 'Know people by the light illuminating them and do not ask their caste' - Guru Nanak Dev Ji 'Caste has no power in the next world, only the humble are exalted there. It is only the good who are honoured for their good deeds' - Guru Amar Das Ji 'The caste of all mankind is one and the same' - Guru Gobind Singh Ji Bhul Chuk Dee Khima Gurfateh Gurpreet 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shere khalsa da Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 a sikh is a amritahri person and thats that. If a person is amritdhari then the caste system becomes irrelevent, anything else(monay) cant really be calling themselves sikhs can they when they got cut hair (or smoke/drink) simply cos its against what guru gobind singh ji said a sikh should be which is keeping the panj khakar and keeping Reht- unless u do this then u gotta call urself a panjabi or whatever and so the caste system kicks in 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GABROO KHALISTAN DAH Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 the new punjabi culture (here onwards said as NPC) is mess'd up,...punjabi culture the original one wuz true sikhi, and ankh... but the NPC needs its booze drinking, drug snorting, caste feeling ass kicked yes kicked out of this world and no DONT" LEAVE IT alone, its hindu maath 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsb Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 i love how anything we don't like can just be blamed on the hindus or brahminism...very convenient..it's never our fault 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogroup singh Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 Actually when I see comments like that where we hide our faults and throw everything on others it doesn't make sense to me. Hinduism is world's old religion and still alive. Just look at Sikhism we're just 500 years old and have all the qualities to become world's religion but we are not even able to keep the ones are Sikhs. Now fault is our but we just want to blame others for our own faults. Who brought caste system to Sikhism? Hindus? Who is following caste system in Sikhism? Hindus? Gurus and Sikhism has not failed but we are not fully dedicated to adopt their teachings. We have developed jathas and cults within Sikhism and after 500 years of sikhism's exisiting we still need anwser that who is Sikh... It makes me really sad... Sikh Gurus or Sikhism is not against any religion or faith. Sikhism is against fake rituals and abusrd teachings. Sikhism is not something which we should use to throw our frustration because that way we just belittle our religion. Sikhism is for everyone. This is the reason that whoever is done reading Guru Granth Sahib has great respect for Sikhism. Hinduism has two major wrong teachings and one is caste system and another one was injustice to woman. If they take out these two and stop following Manu Smiritu blindly then it has all the qualities to be called best spritual path. Guru ji opposed blind rituals like caste system and disrespect to women they didn't say that Vedas or Hindus are evil. Here is evidence to back up my points. MARU, FIFTH MEHL: Page-1083 O slave of the inaccessible Lord God Allah, forsake thoughts of worldly entanglements. Become the dust of the feet of the humble fakeers, and consider yourself a traveller on this journey. O saintly dervish, you shall be approved in the Court of the Lord. || 1 || Let Truth be your prayer, and faith your prayer-mat. Subdue your desires, and overcome your hopes. Let your body be the mosque, and your mind the priest. Let true purity be God's Word for you. || 2 || Let your practice be to live the spiritual life. Let your spiritual cleansing be to renounce the world and seek God. Let control of the mind be your spiritual wisdom, O holy man; meeting with God, you shall never die again. || 3 || Practice within your heart the teachings of the Koran and the Bible; restrain the ten sensory organs from straying into evil. Tie up the five demons of desire with faith, charity and contentment, and you shall be acceptable. || 4 || Let compassion be your Mecca, and the dust of the feet of the holy your fast. Let Paradise be your practice of the ProphetÃÂs Word. God is the beauty, the light and the fragrance. Meditation on Allah is the secluded meditation chamber. || 5 || Page-1084 He alone is a Qazi, who practices the Truth. He alone is a Haji, a pilgrim to Mecca, who purifies his heart. He alone is a Mullah, who banishes evil; he alone is a saintly dervish, who takes the Support of the LordÃÂs Praise. || 6 || Always, at every moment, remember God, the Creator within your heart. Let your meditation beads be the subjugation of the ten senses. Let good conduct and self-restraint be your circumcision. || 7 || You must know in your heart that everything is temporary. Family, household and siblings are all entanglements. Kings, rulers and nobles are mortal and transitory; only GodÃÂs Gate is the permanent place. || 8 || First, is the LordÃÂs Praise; second, contentment; third, humility, and fourth, giving to charities. Fifth is to hold oneÃÂs desires in restraint. These are the five most sublime daily prayers. || 9 || Let your daily worship be the knowledge that God is everywhere. Let renunciation of evil actions be the water-jug you carry. Let realization of the One Lord God be your call to prayer; be a good child of God ó let this be your trumpet. || 10 || Let what is earned righteously be your blessed food. Wash away pollution with the river of your heart. One who realizes the Prophet attains heaven. Azraa-eel, the Messenger of Death, does not cast him into hell. || 11 || Let good deeds be your body, and faith your bride. Play and enjoy the Lord's love and delight. Purify what is impure, and let the Lord's Presence be your religious tradition. Let your total awareness be the turban on your head. || 12 || To be Muslim is to be kind-hearted, and wash away pollution from within the heart. He does not even approach worldly pleasures; he is pure, like flowers, silk, ghee and the deer-skin. || 13 || One who is blessed with the mercy and compassion of the Merciful Lord, is the manliest man among men. He alone is a Shaykh, a preacher, a Haji, and he alone is God's slave, who is blessed with God's Grace. || 14 || The Creator Lord has Creative Power; the Merciful Lord has Mercy. The Praises and the Love of the Merciful Lord are unfathomable. Realize the True Hukam, the Command of the Lord, O Nanak; you shall be released from bondage, and carried across. || 15 || 3 || 12 || Page 1049-1050 PRABHAATEE: If the Lord Allah lives only in the mosque, then to whom does the rest of the world belong? According to the Hindus, the LordÃÂs Name abides in the idol, but there is no truth in either of these claims. || 1 || O Allah, O Raam, I live by Your Name. Please show mercy to me, O Master. || 1 || Pause || The God of the Hindus lives in the southern lands, and the God of the Muslims lives in the west. So search in your heart ó look deep into your heart of hearts; this is the home and the place where God lives. || 2 || The Brahmins observe twenty-four fasts during the year, and the Muslims fast during the month of Ramadaan. The Muslims set aside eleven months, and claim that the treasure is only in the one month. || 3 || What is the use of bathing at Orissa? Why do the Muslims bow their heads in the mosque? If someone has deception in his heart, what good is it for him to utter prayers? And what good is it for him to go on pilgrimage to Mecca? || 4 || You fashioned all these men and women, Lord. All these are Your Forms. Kabeer is the child of God, Allah, Raam. All the Gurus and prophets are mine. || 5 || Says Kabeer, listen, O men and women: seek the Sanctuary of the One. Chant the Naam, the Name of the Lord, O mortals, and you shall surely be carried across. || 6 || 2 || PRABHAATEE: First, Allah created the Light; then, by His Creative Power, He made all mortal beings. From the One Light, the entire universe welled up. So who is good, and who is bad? || 1 || O people, O Siblings of Destiny, do not wander deluded by doubt. The Creation is in the Creator, and the Creator is in the Creation, totally pervading and permeating all places. || 1 || Pause || The clay is the same, but the Fashioner has fashioned it in various ways. There is nothing wrong with the pot of clay ó there is nothing wrong with the Potter. || 2 || The One True Lord abides in all; by His making, everything is made. Whoever realizes the Hukam of His Command, knows the One Lord. He alone is said to be the LordÃÂs slave. || 3 || The Lord Allah is Unseen; He cannot be seen. The Guru has blessed me with this sweet molasses. Says Kabeer, my anxiety and fear have been taken away; I see the Immaculate Lord pervading everywhere. || 4 || 3 || PRABHAATEE: Do not say that the Vedas, the Bible and the Koran are false. Those who do not contemplate them are false. You say that the One Lord is in all, so why do you kill chickens? || 1 || O Mullah, tell me: is this God's Justice? The doubts of your mind have not been dispelled. || 1 || Pause || You seize a living creature, and then bring it home and kill its body; you have killed only the clay. The light of the soul passes into another form. So tell me, what have you killed? || 2 || And what good are your purifications? Why do you bother to wash your face? And why do you bother to bow your head in the mosque? Your heart is full of hypocrisy; what good are your prayers or your pilgrimage to Mecca? || 3 || You are impure; you do not understand the Pure Lord. You do not know His Mystery. Says Kabeer, you have missed out on paradise; your mind is set on hell. || 4 || 4 || PRABHAATEE: Hear my prayer, Lord; You are the Divine Light of the Divine, the Primal, All-pervading Master. The Siddhas in Samaadhi have not found Your limits. They hold tight to the Protection of Your Sanctuary. || 1 || Worship and adoration of the Pure, Primal Lord comes by worshipping the True Guru, O Siblings of Destiny. Standing at His Door, Brahma studies the Vedas, but he cannot see the Unseen Lord. || 1 || Pause || With the oil of knowledge about the essence of reality, and the wick of the Naam, the Name of the Lord, this lamp illluminates my body. I have applied the Light of the Lord of the Universe, and lit this lamp. God the Knower knows. || 2 || The Unstruck Melody of the Panch Shabad, the Five Primal Sounds, vibrates and resounds. I dwell with the Lord of the World. Kabeer, Your slave, performs this Aartee, this lamp-lit worship service for You, O Formless Lord of Nirvaanaa. || 3 || 5 || 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GABROO KHALISTAN DAH Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 jsb yes it is our fault tha's what hindu maath m'ns, hindu mind, it does'nt m'n hindus fault fuggggg 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogroup singh Posted July 13, 2003 Report Share Posted July 13, 2003 The term "Brahminical" is usually associated with the ritual-obsessed form of vedic religion and the related caste repression. It is a standard construct in the historical narrative of subcontinent. It has got nothing to do with a person belonging to "Brahmin" caste as such and includes all paradigms and persuasions that justify decadent vedic religious and social practices. A person belonging to lowest caste showing respect for these paradigms and persuasions would as much be labeled "Brahminical". And all Jats, Khatris, Ramgarihas , etc who show respect to these paradigms, conveniently ignoring Sikh injunctions against them, are as much "Brahminical" . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K4ur Posted July 14, 2003 Report Share Posted July 14, 2003 okay...... "Panjabi Culture" = Kalyug Sikhi = God/Truth Bub byeeeeeeeee 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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