Hark Posted December 24, 2023 Report Share Posted December 24, 2023 In this video here, around 3:30/4:00 you can clearly see christian figures, and hindu gods. Here is a clear picture of it. This is in the "The Espanola Gurdwara"/ I think also "Hacienda de Guru Ram Das Gurdwara" The owners of sikhnet I think, (pretty sure) are a crucial part to this gudwara. Now my question is, is this allowed? Is this a different sect of sikhism? There is also a post about this online about a statue with flowers on it outside the gudwara. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 25, 2023 Report Share Posted December 25, 2023 On 12/24/2023 at 12:08 AM, Hark said: In this video here, around 3:30/4:00 you can clearly see christian figures, and hindu gods. Here is a clear picture of it. This is in the "The Espanola Gurdwara"/ I think also "Hacienda de Guru Ram Das Gurdwara" The owners of sikhnet I think, (pretty sure) are a crucial part to this gudwara. Now my question is, is this allowed? Is this a different sect of sikhism? There is also a post about this online about a statue with flowers on it outside the gudwara. The Bible is as confirmed as the Vedas in Gurbani. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hark Posted December 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2023 I think you misunderstood my question. Why is there hindu gods and christian figures in gudwaras? To my knowledge, this isnt allowed right..? Or am I wrong? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 26, 2023 Report Share Posted December 26, 2023 2 hours ago, Hark said: I think you misunderstood my question. Why is there hindu gods and christian figures in gudwaras? To my knowledge, this isnt allowed right..? Or am I wrong? Some people probably argue if any images at all are allowed. But if these images are presented according to Gurmat I can't see how they're offensive. Sikhi itself says that God has been part of this Dharam vs aDharm the whole time. Those are Dharmi images. We affirm things about everyone in that mural. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 26, 2023 Report Share Posted December 26, 2023 Now if you ask them about the mural and their explanation isn't Gurmat? Rejected. If they're targetting hispanics, Mary being center makes sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 26, 2023 Report Share Posted December 26, 2023 Think about the implications of these Ang. ਤੁਧੁਧਿਆਇਨਿ੍ਹਬੇਦਕਤੇਬਾਸਣੁਖੜੇ॥ tudh dhiaaini(h) bedh katebaa san khaRe || The followers of the Vedas, and the Bible, standing at Your Door, meditate on You. Guru Arjan Dev Ji in Raag Gujri - 518 ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬਕਹਹੁਮਤਝੂਠੇਝੂਠਾਜੋਨਬਿਚਾਰੈ॥ bedh kateb kahahu mat jhootte jhoottaa jo na bichaarai || Do not say that the Vedas, and the Bible are false. Those who do not contemplate them are false. Bhagat Kabeer Ji in Raag Prabhaatee - 1350 What's the Bible's message? We confirm it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hark Posted December 31, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2023 Ah, ok I see. Thank you 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premi Posted December 31, 2023 Report Share Posted December 31, 2023 On 12/24/2023 at 8:08 AM, Hark said: In this video here, around 3:30/4:00 you can clearly see christian figures, and hindu gods. Here is a clear picture of it. This is in the "The Espanola Gurdwara"/ I think also "Hacienda de Guru Ram Das Gurdwara" The owners of sikhnet I think, (pretty sure) are a crucial part to this gudwara. Now my question is, is this allowed? Is this a different sect of sikhism? There is also a post about this online about a statue with flowers on it outside the gudwara. On 12/26/2023 at 12:28 AM, Hark said: I think you misunderstood my question. Why is there hindu gods and christian figures in gudwaras? To my knowledge, this isnt allowed right..? Or am I wrong? These 'Sikhs' in the US are misrepresenting Sikhi, they are no good and possibly 'feds' as @PAL_07 would say. It definitely is NOT allowed. Our Gurus or Puratan Sikhs never directed us to mix our faith with others On 12/26/2023 at 3:03 AM, GurjantGnostic said: Some people probably argue if any images at all are allowed. But if these images are presented according to Gurmat I can't see how they're offensive. Sikhi itself says that God has been part of this Dharam vs aDharm the whole time. Those are Dharmi images. We affirm things about everyone in that mural. I believe images are allowed but not involving other faiths. You cannot straddle two boats to make your journey, there is no place in Sikhi for Christian or any other religion's imagery in our Gurdware. No place. On 12/26/2023 at 12:50 PM, GurjantGnostic said: Now if you ask them about the mural and their explanation isn't Gurmat? Rejected. If they're targetting hispanics, Mary being center makes sense. If 'targeting' Hispanics they should do street parchaar and do it outside the Gurdwara. We are not supposed to be some hippy 'new age' faith. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 31, 2023 Report Share Posted December 31, 2023 8 hours ago, Premi said: These 'Sikhs' in the US are misrepresenting Sikhi, they are no good and possibly 'feds' as @PAL_07 would say. It definitely is NOT allowed. Our Gurus or Puratan Sikhs never directed us to mix our faith with others I believe images are allowed but not involving other faiths. You cannot straddle two boats to make your journey, there is no place in Sikhi for Christian or any other religion's imagery in our Gurdware. No place. If 'targeting' Hispanics they should do street parchaar and do it outside the Gurdwara. We are not supposed to be some hippy 'new age' faith. Agree about 3h0. Our faith validates aspects of other faiths. Their prophets, devi devte, texts etc to varying degrees. Guru Saibhan approved the Bible and didn't critique Christ or the Bible. At all, unlike say the vedas and devi devte. So Biblical imagery is Sikh imagery when presented from a Gurmat POV. The inclusion of Mary isn't non Gurmat at all. See miracle at zeitoon for cross reference. Now what 3ho says about that mural? Total non gurmat bs I'm sure, but that's true of all murals they make. They tell an ungurmat story. But to ask if images are okay and which ones is technically a seperate topic. How they parchar? Agree 3h0 totally wrong. They also still receive most daswandh, daan if that, from the ignorant masses of the Paanth. And the inclusion of Guru approved imagery isn't the problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 31, 2023 Report Share Posted December 31, 2023 Remember who told y'all sihknet and many other sites are Sikhnet and Nesbits cults respectively? Remember the all white woman panj pyare doing amrit in London you all flat out went blind to? All Sikh imagery, not Gurmat, wayyy worse than Gurmat use of Mary. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted December 31, 2023 Report Share Posted December 31, 2023 On 12/26/2023 at 8:23 AM, GurjantGnostic said: Think about the implications of these Ang. ਤੁਧੁਧਿਆਇਨਿ੍ਹਬੇਦਕਤੇਬਾਸਣੁਖੜੇ॥ tudh dhiaaini(h) bedh katebaa san khaRe || The followers of the Vedas, and the Bible, standing at Your Door, meditate on You. Guru Arjan Dev Ji in Raag Gujri - 518 ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬਕਹਹੁਮਤਝੂਠੇਝੂਠਾਜੋਨਬਿਚਾਰੈ॥ bedh kateb kahahu mat jhootte jhoottaa jo na bichaarai || Do not say that the Vedas, and the Bible are false. Those who do not contemplate them are false. Bhagat Kabeer Ji in Raag Prabhaatee - 1350 What's the Bible's message? We confirm it. Reread that and think about the entailments. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premi Posted January 3 Report Share Posted January 3 On 12/31/2023 at 6:27 PM, GurjantGnostic said: Guru Saibhan approved the Bible and didn't critique Christ or the Bible. At all, unlike say the vedas and devi devte. I think critique of Vedas and Devte would be more as that was culturally relevant whereas Christianity was not really present at that time in Indian culture 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GurjantGnostic Posted January 3 Report Share Posted January 3 6 hours ago, Premi said: I think critique of Vedas and Devte would be more as that was culturally relevant whereas Christianity was not really present at that time in Indian culture If Sikhi was earthly maybe. Guru Saibhan are Ajooni or became Ajooni. That's a universal commentary. Guru Nanak Dev Ji went and dressed down the Pope. You or I may be ignorant or have cultural bias but Guru Saibhan deal in Truth period. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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