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QUICk QUESTION WE ARE IN THE PROCERSS OF REVAMPING OF Maharjee's room. The home is pretty small, so the room is not that big. I was reading about Baba Isher fron Nanaksar he said that if there is no space for an evening ret place that the prakash manji should be the size of a bed and Guru jee should be kept there. Please let me know your views!!

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Got this from chardikalah singh(nanaksar sangi) at gursikhijeevan.com

i am a sangee of nanaksar and i believe i may help you. Nanaksar is special

for the way it does the guru ji's sewa and guru ji is treated actually like the kings of kings and the great ruler of all the universes because he himself is the god.

1)the cot should be built new. and no one should ever have slept over it.

it should be properly cleaned. Its size can vary from 5"10 feet to 6 feet.

because we are worshipping guru as the body of real guru himself. so the normal size of our body varies between that. that's why the size of cot should be that.

Or another important rule for the size of cot is that when guru ji is placed in the middle of the cot .there should be a width of about one hand on all the four sides of guru ji.

2)there should be a thin mattress placed over the bed which we call (talai)in punjabi. then a white sheet of (latha) over that .

3) as we wear clothes also the clothes are to be worn to guru ji. the clothes should be according to weather.

the complete maryada you can find in the " ANAND CHAMATKAR" .

I HAVE TOLD YOU THE BASIC MARYADA.

4) guru ji should be served food four times. and the food should be prepared with utmost purity.respect, devotion and love.

breakfast in the morning.

then at 12 noon ,lunch.

snacks at evening or tea.

and milk at night.

5) while going into guru ji 's room and sitting on tabya you should always

observe 100% physical purity and then mental purity will come automatically with guru ji's kirpa . your clothes should be clean. and you should take bath before going in there if you have gone to toilet.

6)during winters appropriate provisions should be there to provide warmth to guru ji and vice versa in summers.

i hope rest you would have read from the book.

when i was indi awe also used to have guur ji and we used to do sewa like that.

and i swear if you do sewa like that with love and devotion without any ego you can one day have the darshan of guru nanak sahib .

because when my father used to do sewa like that he had the vision of shahhed singhs guarding the gate of the room and even heard the voices of guru ji.

and then one day his power of sukhmani sahib and sewa started automatic jap of waheguru inhis heart.

but he was not able to offer food to guru ji abd due to decline in sewa and our coming to canada his simran stopped . so i will warn you that you have got a golden chance of doing sewa of guru ji a.d only those people who ar blessed by the god himself are able to do his sewa.

so good luck and keep up the good work.

singh

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4) guru ji should be served food four times. and the food should be prepared with utmost purity.respect, devotion and love.

breakfast in the morning.

then at 12 noon ,lunch.

snacks at evening or tea.

and milk at night.

How does that work?

6)during winters appropriate provisions should be there to provide warmth to guru ji and vice versa in summers.

3) as we wear clothes also the clothes are to be worn to guru ji. the clothes should be according to weather

CAn maharaj jee go ill?

What do you mean by appropreate provision?

What I understand from that is - warmer Rumalla, if not, does GUru Maharaj jee get ill :roll:?

. so the normal size of our body varies between that. that's why the size of cot should be that.

I think we need to understand that Guru Maharaj should be treated with OUTMOST RESPECT, with new/clean Rumalle etc

THo treating it as a body is a bit wrong :)

I thought it was - JYOT GRANTH WICH

Sarir PANTH WICH

bhull chukk maaf

GurFAteh

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i dont get you people. If someone is least respecting siri guroo granth sahib with pure sharda and prem people whine and cry (understandable) and if someone does... people still whine and cry by asking questions like can maharaj can jee go ill?? . May be for you thats what it seems like but not for premi. He/She is serving guroo maharaj ji with full prem and sharda.

Nanaksar beleive siri guroo nanak dev sahib nirankar and 9 forms of guroo nanak are hazara-Hozoor in siri guroo granth sahib sahib . Thats why we call it living guroo.

Its famous saying: Prem Diiiii Khaieda, Premi Hiiii Jannaie.

What a screw up world we live in!!!!!!

vahegurooo serenity please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cry: :cry:

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I agree with you Neo Ji. The Sewa done of Guru Ji at Nanaksar is unrivalled and no one can match the intensity of the Sharda and Prem involved in Guru Ji's Sewa done by Babaji. Mr Singh Ji, no offence, but please bear in mind that we cant reach the level of Pyar Babaji had for Guru Sahib, so it's unfair to roll your eyes at his level of Sharda. It was because of Babaji's Sharda that Guru Sahib is not locked away in cupboards (cos the Sareer is in the Panth after all). I remember reading once Maharaj was taken on a Nagar Kirtan on the Palki Sahib and Babaji stopped the procession in the middle and said, why is there no one doing Chaur Saheb over Guru Ji? He said, so much dust is getting on the Angs of Guru Maharaj, he scolded the Granthi and said would you be able to take someone throwing dust and dirt into your eyes?! We can only learn how to do Sewa of Guru Ji from such enlightened Mahapurukhs.

Also, you know the Sewa of Guru Sahib in Hazoor Sahib and Nanaksar is done the same way. Baba Nand Singh Ji did (Gagar Di Sewa, brought water from afar to wash the floor of the Sachkhand) for 12 years!

The Sachkhand (vasai Nirankar) is the place where Guru Ji is kept only in Nanaksars, I think Rara Sahibs (correct me Neo Ji if Im wrong) and Hazoor Sahib. You should see the lightweight Palkis in other Gurughars for Guru Ji, even though they get so much money from the Sangat. Proff Darshan Singh said why do you have a Palki for Guru Sahib, a Palki is when you're taking someone someplace, for travelling, Guru Sahib should be kept in Sachkhand. These things we miss, only Mahapurush tell us the correct Maryada.

Also, in main Nanaksar, the Sewadars cannot wear pjyama's with their Choley because Babaji said everytime you go to relieve yourself you have to wash your hands and feet up to your knees, this was how much care was taken to keep everything clean, for Guru Sahib. Sadly, this level of Pyar and Sharda is being lost. I see people at weddings with their backs towards Guru Ji, whats the point of saying Guru Ji is our living Guru when we don't bother. I wonder if Guru Ji was there in human form, whether people would act that way.

We should learn from the examples of Sewa done by Mahapurush, not only them, I would hope that learning from anyone who takes extra care when doing Maharaj's Sewa. Baba Isher Singh Ji used to take Guru Sahib to Simla during the summer months, the way we take our families to cool places to spend vacation time. He used to say, Guru Ji is more than our family member, shouldn't we do the utmost for them? He used to climb 8 floors of steps with Guru Sahib on his head to take them to the topmost floor where it was windy in the summer also. The point is NOT whether Guru Ji has a sareerak form (human) or not and whether we should stop caring about certain things, the point is that whilst doing this Sewa WE are gaining something, we are lacking Sharda, these actions help cleanse our sins. Guru Ji doesn't need us doing anything, WE need to do it for our Manmukh and Paapi minds, and we should consider this a blessing and a part of Guru Ji's grace for presenting us with this opportunity, instead of debating on how much is needed.

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4) guru ji should be served food four times. and the food should be prepared with utmost purity.respect, devotion and love.

breakfast in the morning.

then at 12 noon ,lunch.

snacks at evening or tea.

and milk at night.

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

N30 you said

If someone is least respecting siri guroo granth sahib with pure sharda and prem people whine and cry (understandable) and if someone does... people still whine and cry by asking questions like can maharaj can jee go ill?? . May be for you thats what it seems like but not for premi. He/She is serving guroo maharaj ji with full prem and sharda.

Yes but, when some hindus are praying to their statutes, some of them are doing it with full prem and charda! is it right though?

Also, the time they take to make that food the could acutally use that time to do more effective things, like feed a poor person who actually needs the food?

Mr Singh, i think you are right for questioning, without questioning practices sikhs would be more messed up than they are now.

Guru Nanak questioned the Hindus when they practiced rituals, it should be in our nature too to question practices. So again N30 you gotta see where Mr Singh coming from, hunna ?

Question: is bring the Guru Granth Sahib ji food to eat practical and within the teachings of Guru Sahib ?

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Yes but, when some hindus are praying to their statutes, some of them are doing it with full prem and charda! is it right though?

Bhagat Dhanna worshipped a stone idol and saw God in all. His example has been given in Bhai Gurdas Ji's Varan, is the Gurbani wrong? Was Guru Ji protesting against the people who were doing rituals with empty hearts, or against those with full devotion who had a right to perform them (Dhanna?).

Also, the time they take to make that food the could acutally use that time to do more effective things, like feed a poor person who actually needs the food?

What is a more effective way of utilising your time then preparing food for Guru Ji. Are you saying all those GurSikhs who prepared food with Sharda for Guru Ji during their lifetimes and afterwards could have utilised their time more effectively, regardless of whether Guru Ji did Bhog of that food? What do you think they should do? Criticise people's Sharda and Prem on Sikh forums instead?

Mr Singh, i think you are right for questioning, without questioning practices sikhs would be more messed up than they are now.

There is questioning, which Mr Singh Bro is always welcomed to do, and crticism based on a narrow mind, the kind you display.

Guru Nanak questioned the Hindus when they practiced rituals, it should be in our nature too to question practices. So again N30 you gotta see where Mr Singh coming from, hunna ?

So we should question Mahan GurSikhs (Mahapurush's) like Baba Nand Singh Ji too, when all he did was worship Guru Granth Sahib, as commanded by Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Do you question Babaji?

Question: is bring the Guru Granth Sahib ji food to eat practical and within the teachings of Guru Sahib ?

Babaji once gave an answer to a silly question like this in their lifetime. He said we can take the example of a piece of land. The Earth doesn't need cultivation, looking after, it's not asking you to look after it. We need crops from the Earth, so we must look after it, sow it with seeds, cultivate it and irrigate it. To gain something we must do Sewa of the Earth, similarly we need to do Sewa of Guru Ji, to gain their blessings and grace.

SamosaSingh Veer Ji, a Manjee is fine, I asked two Nanaksar Gurughar about the correct Maryada about keeping Guru Ji at your house, and the GurSikhs said it would be fine to use a Manjee Sahib, as long as it is clean, well kept, and big enough.

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i dont get you people. If someone is least respecting siri guroo granth sahib with pure sharda and prem people whine and cry (understandable) and if someone does... people still whine and cry by asking questions like can maharaj can jee go ill?? . May be for you thats what it seems like but not for premi. He/She is serving guroo maharaj ji with full prem and sharda.

Veer here I think you missed a major point of my post -

we need to understand that Guru Maharaj should be treated with OUTMOST RESPECT, with new/clean Rumalle etc

Nanaksar beleive siri guroo nanak dev sahib nirankar and 9 forms of guroo nanak are hazara-Hozoor in siri guroo granth sahib sahib . Thats why we call it living guroo.

So do I....

i was jus askign why Maharaj jees bir is treated as a HUMAN BODY

as they say the Rummeh should vary the by the temp,

why so?

Does Guru jee feel cold, If he does that means he can become SICK, i dont think u got my point :roll:

Its famous saying: Prem Diiiii Khaieda, Premi Hiiii Jannaie.

What a screw up world we live in!!!!!!

vahegurooo serenity please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cry: :cry:

I respect what they do, but still don't understand why..

ps u still didn't explain the 4 meals :?

I agree with you Neo Ji. The Sewa done of Guru Ji at Nanaksar is unrivalled and no one can match the intensity of the Sharda and Prem involved in Guru Ji's Sewa done by Babaji.

I do not doubt, as I know NanakSar vale to massive Seva for Guru Maharaj :)

Mr Singh Ji, no offence, but please bear in mind that we cant reach the level of Pyar Babaji had for Guru Sahib, so it's unfair to roll your eyes at his level of Sharda. It was because of Babaji's Sharda that Guru Sahib is not locked away in cupboards (cos the Sareer is in the Panth after all).

well, thats my POINT, why on EARTH is then Guru jees Bir treated as a BODY!

yes, it should be treated with OUTMOST RESPECT

but why treated like a body i still do not conprehend :?

I remember reading once Maharaj was taken on a Nagar Kirtan on the Palki Sahib and Babaji stopped the procession in the middle and said, why is there no one doing Chaur Saheb over Guru Ji? He said, so much dust is getting on the Angs of Guru Maharaj, he scolded the Granthi and said would you be able to take someone throwing dust and dirt into your eyes?! We can only learn how to do Sewa of Guru Ji from such enlightened Mahapurukhs.

Bhenj, thats very true, and very much bedbi to let Maharaj jeees bir get DUST, but thats not cause Guru he will cough, but tis because of DISRESPECT.

I think Guru jee should be treated with OUTMOST RESPECT as meantion before :)

Also, you know the Sewa of Guru Sahib in Hazoor Sahib and Nanaksar is done the same way. Baba Nand Singh Ji did (Gagar Di Sewa, brought water from afar to wash the floor of the Sachkhand) for 12 years!

The Sachkhand (vasai Nirankar) is the place where Guru Ji is kept only in Nanaksars, I think Rara Sahibs (correct me Neo Ji if Im wrong) and Hazoor Sahib. You should see the lightweight Palkis in other Gurughars for Guru Ji, even though they get so much money from the Sangat. Proff Darshan Singh said why do you have a Palki for Guru Sahib, a Palki is when you're taking someone someplace, for travelling, Guru Sahib should be kept in Sachkhand. These things we miss, only Mahapurush tell us the correct Maryada.

Also, in main Nanaksar, the Sewadars cannot wear pjyama's with their Choley because Babaji said everytime you go to relieve yourself you have to wash your hands and feet up to your knees, this was how much care was taken to keep everything clean, for Guru Sahib. Sadly, this level of Pyar and Sharda is being lost. I see people at weddings with their backs towards Guru Ji, whats the point of saying Guru Ji is our living Guru when we don't bother. I wonder if Guru Ji was there in human form, whether people would act that way.

Bhenji, as meantioned above by you,

yes Maharaj SHOULD be treated with OUTMOST RESPECT, whether in human form, or in form of Shabad :)

We should learn from the examples of Sewa done by Mahapurush, not only them, I would hope that learning from anyone who takes extra care when doing Maharaj's Sewa. Baba Isher Singh Ji used to take Guru Sahib to Simla during the summer months, the way we take our families to cool places to spend vacation time. He used to say, Guru Ji is more than our family member, shouldn't we do the utmost for them? He used to climb 8 floors of steps with Guru Sahib on his head to take them to the topmost floor where it was windy in the summer also. The point is NOT whether Guru Ji has a sareerak form (human) or not and whether we should stop caring about certain things, the point is that whilst doing this Sewa WE are gaining something, we are lacking Sharda, these actions help cleanse our sins. Guru Ji doesn't need us doing anything, WE need to do it for our Manmukh and Paapi minds, and we should consider this a blessing and a part of Guru Ji's grace for presenting us with this opportunity, instead of debating on how much is needed.

:bow: :bow: :bow:

If its being done because of RESPECT, and SHARDA, then fair enough, thats good answer for me,

but if its like

'GUru jee nu Thand laag jo gi, Garm Rumalla es karke Pana e'

then I feel thats wrong cause IN THAT CASE GUru jee is beign treated like an idol :cry:

Mr Singh, i think you are right for questioning, without questioning practices sikhs would be more messed up than they are now.

Guru Nanak questioned the Hindus when they practiced rituals, it should be in our nature too to question practices. So again N30 you gotta see where Mr Singh coming from, hunna ?

N3O veer,

if you feel its all obvious, think about a MOORAKh like me, who doesn't knwo the answers..

after all its a Q & A section

Im sorry that I asked a simple question - I must say :(

Bhagat Dhanna worshipped a stone idol and saw God in all. His example has been given in Bhai Gurdas Ji's Varan, is the Gurbani wrong? Was Guru Ji protesting against the people who were doing rituals with empty hearts, or against those with full devotion who had a right to perform them (Dhanna?).

Well bhenji, If Im not mistaken are you not contradicting yourself now :? ?

Before you said some 'streams are blcoked or move slowly'

Bhagat Dhanna jees 'stream of Idol worshipping wasn't too slow, orelse he wouldn't be a Bhagat like he is :bow:

There is questioning, which Mr Singh Bro is always welcomed to do, and crticism based on a narrow mind, the kind you display.

As I said..Im sory If I ahve offended anyone by Question,

bhull ho gei :)

Babaji once gave an answer to a silly question like this in their lifetime. He said we can take the example of a piece of land. The Earth doesn't need cultivation, looking after, it's not asking you to look after it. We need crops from the Earth, so we must look after it, sow it with seeds, cultivate it and irrigate it. To gain something we must do Sewa of the Earth, similarly we need to do Sewa of Guru Ji, to gain their blessings and grace.

SamosaSingh Veer Ji, a Manjee is fine, I asked two Nanaksar Gurughar about the correct Maryada about keeping Guru Ji at your house, and the GurSikhs said it would be fine to use a Manjee Sahib, as long as it is clean, well kept, and big enough.

:bow:

regardiing '4 meals' would that be Bhog?

but what about people, who work, and hence can not do so, can only do so in the morning and afternoon :?

bhull chukk maaf

GurFAteh

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Criticise people's Sharda and Prem on Sikh forums instead?

please read post carefully before commenting, you should as a 'Moderator' should know the difference between QUESTIONS and CRITICISM!

There is questioning, which Mr Singh Bro is always welcomed to do, and crticism based on a narrow mind, the kind you display.

Why do you have to get personal, your supposed to moderate, ! not JUDGE!?

Babaji once gave an answer to a silly question like this in their lifetime

'silly question' - Miss Khalsa, please this isa questions and answer zone, again as a moderator why are you calling our questions silly? we asked the questions out of curiousity, now your calling them 'silly', you might aswell SHUT DOWN THE QUESTIONS SECTION, your comments undermine the existance of this thread. Please reconsider your approach.

Its getting too personal, ill stop there

Sorry

Harpreet

Ps Mr Singh - question all you can!

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No offence, but I dont need to stop questioning you just because Im moderating here. As you said, all questions welcome, all opinions welcome from members and moderators. I stick to my above points, if you have anything in relation to those which need answering then feel free to post. We aren't talibanistic on this forum, and we allow everyone their say, whether it is criticism or questions. Show me one thread I have locked without valid reason before commentating on how I should act according to your rules.

Mr Singh Veer ji, I love reading your posts and questions, so Harpreet is a little confused, as I was not referring to your post at all. Veer Ji, when I said some streams are slow, I meant it in the general sense in terms of religious rituals carried out by people with no devotion. Those few drops of water in the blocked streams maybe representing the devotion of Bhagat Dhanna Ji, you get what Im saying Ji?

I have a 'question' for Harpreet. If 'feeding' the Guru Granth Sahib Ji is akin to idol worshipping, then why do we do Bhog of Karah Parsaad?

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Guys!!!!!!!!

This is a sensitive topic...

From what it seems like Mr singh made a scarstic comment about will guroo maharaj be ill if we dont do it??

So me and kaur ji thought he is ridiculing maryada of takin care of guroo maharaj instead of asking a simple question why???

But its all clear now, he made a post and clarify.

I m sowwie to mr singh if i was harsh but we shouldnt make scaristic comment on maryada that is goin for 300 yrs.. praticised by hazoor sahib and now by nanaksar.

This type of discussion happened in last year camp here in toronto where some self porclaimed scholar so called western modern sikhs of today almost gave the idea that its ok to wear chappala (joti) while taking guroo maharaj ji in extreme weather conditions. Lot of so called moderate sikhs agreed with him. We shouldnt change maryada to comfort yourself.

Guroo maharaj is not only living guroo by words but by actions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Real example is sant baba nand singh ji maharaj got pratak darhsan of guroo nanak sahib nirankar through rummalie of guroo granth sahib ji. We should be inspired by him so that we as worthless worms can also meet guroo nanak sahib nirankar at this life ..merge with that super-cosmic soul. :)

I appolize if i offended anyone....since this is a senstive topic.. please think twice before asking questions.. think before if its a question or form of criticism which is ridiculing the puratan maryada.

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The original title of the thread was GGS Seva, if i where to comment further on Ms Khalsa's comments it would not be of any benefit to the Singhs original question and the forum generally, as they are off topic and rather personal.

Sorry Singh, couldnt help you

Harpreet

Ps Ms Khalsa check your personal message box.

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Miss Khalsa,

So what you are saying is that if we do not have space for a "sukhasan palang" just a huge size manjee would be fine? Sorry I just need clarification before I actually go out and by all this stuff. Which Gurughars did you ask? Thanks for replying to the actuall question posted!!!

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1)the cot should be built new. and no one should ever have slept over it.

it should be properly cleaned. Its size can vary from 5"10 feet to 6 feet.

because we are worshipping guru as the body of real guru himself. so the normal size of our body varies between that. that's why the size of cot should be that.

Or another important rule for the size of cot is that when guru ji is placed in the middle of the cot .there should be a width of about one hand on all the four sides of guru ji.

Why don't we get a King Size bed instead? The way the discussion is going in this thread I would assume that you would prefer a big comfortable bed that would be to Maharajs liking?

2)there should be a thin mattress placed over the bed which we call (talai)in punjabi. then a white sheet of (latha) over that .

Were there mattresses during Guru Gobind Singh's time?

3) as we wear clothes also the clothes are to be worn to guru ji. the clothes should be according to weather.

Really? Maybe we should get a wind breaker and jakets made out of wool during winter times and light T cotton shirts for during summer?

the complete maryada you can find in the " ANAND CHAMATKAR" .

I HAVE TOLD YOU THE BASIC MARYADA.

4) guru ji should be served food four times. and the food should be prepared with utmost purity.respect, devotion and love.

breakfast in the morning.

then at 12 noon ,lunch.

snacks at evening or tea.

and milk at night.

What should the menu be like? What about Stakes and eggs in the morning, a big Burrito for lunch and maybe some 'chow mien' for dinner? As for snacks how about soups and salad? Should we like make sure the foods served are healthy by making it fat free with the correct amounts of nutrients and minerals? What about 'Powerbars'?

5) while going into guru ji 's room and sitting on tabya you should always

observe 100% physical purity and then mental purity will come automatically with guru ji's kirpa . your clothes should be clean. and you should take bath before going in there if you have gone to toilet.

Did the Sikhs in our Gurus times behave like this? Did they like shower and anoint themselves with nice smelling perfuems before they met the Sikh Gurus? Did the Gurus get angry or refuse to meet a desciple who was unclean?

6)during winters appropriate provisions should be there to provide warmth to guru ji and vice versa in summers.

You mean to say the Guru feels cold during the winter and hot during summer? Should we also place a heater and AC beside the SGGS?

Who makes or made these rules? Were these rules prescribed by our earlier Gurus? Maybe there is some sort of Hukam?

May be for you thats what it seems like but not for premi. He/She is serving guroo maharaj ji with full prem and sharda.

Serving with full 'prem' to the point one's actions is similar to a mentally deranged person? How is this different from those Hindus who pour milk and honey over Lord Shivas statue when they pray to it?

Sahaljleen Kaur Khalsa wrote

Bhagat Dhanna worshipped a stone idol and saw God in all. His example has been given in Bhai Gurdas Ji's Varan, is the Gurbani wrong? Was Guru Ji protesting against the people who were doing rituals with empty hearts, or against those with full devotion who had a right to perform them (Dhanna?).

Excuse me but isn't Sikhism AGAINST idol worship and silly rituals? Didn't Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself proclaim that he is an 'idol breaker'? Are you advocating that we should pray to a stone? BTW in supporting your argument, you should stop referencing to Bhai Gurdas or any other Baba or Bhai. They may be respected Sikhs but they are not a Guru thus they are NO authority on Sikhism.

What is a more effective way of utilising your time then preparing food for Guru Ji.

This is merely your opinion which if you ask me is not much.So we should spend 24/7 preparing food for SGGS?

There is questioning, which Mr Singh Bro is always welcomed to do, and crticism based on a narrow mind, the kind you display.

Ahem...excuse me but the last time I checked this was a forum for discussions on Sikhism. Who are you to judge who is narrow minded and who is not? Who made you judge?

So we should question Mahan GurSikhs (Mahapurush's) like Baba Nand Singh Ji too, when all he did was worship Guru Granth Sahib, as commanded by Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Do you question Babaji?

Wrong. Guru Nanak and the other Gurus NEVER advocated that Sikhs should be 'worshipping' the SGGS. Where does it state that Sikhs must worship the SGGS? I challenge you to prove me wrong. Your statement is ludicrous. Nobody even 'worshipped' any of the living Gurus and now you are advocating that Sikhs should worship the SGGS.

Babaji once gave an answer to a silly question like this in their lifetime.

Babaji was not Guru so whatever he said means zilch to all Sikhs. He may have been a respected figure but when did he become an authority on Sikhism?

Do you question Babaji?

Hell yeah!! Who is he? Who appointed him ad hoc Guru?

No offence, but I dont need to stop questioning you just because Im moderating here.

Excuse me but shoudn't a moderator remain impartial?

We aren't talibanistic on this forum, and we allow everyone their say, whether it is criticism or questions.

You are sure as hell acting like one.

Show me one thread I have locked without valid reason before commentating on how I should act according to your rules.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news to you but it has happened in this forum before (not by you) and if you ask me the behaviour of that moderator was quite disgraceful.

What about online versions of thr SGGS? Do we do the same? Do we like put 'parshad' near our PC's? Or if we have a CD version, should we treat it the same way we treat SGGS?

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Why don't we get a King Size bed instead? The way the discussion is going in this thread I would assume that you would prefer a big comfortable bed that would be to Maharajs liking?

Good suggestion, King size bed would be perfect, don't you think?

Were there mattresses during Guru Gobind Singh's time?

Dunno. I don't think there was any internet either, so maybe we should stop using that too.

Really? Maybe we should get a wind breaker and jakets made out of wool during winter times and light T cotton shirts for during summer?

How pathetic, is sarcasm the only way you construct your argument?

What should the menu be like? What about Stakes and eggs in the morning, a big Burrito for lunch and maybe some 'chow mien' for dinner? As for snacks how about soups and salad? Should we like make sure the foods served are healthy by making it fat free with the correct amounts of nutrients and minerals? What about 'Powerbars'?

Why do we do Bhog of Karah Parsaad if Guru Ji does not accept our offerings of food? Once again, your inadequacy in constructing a rational argument is clear after reading your sarcasm filled lines above.

Did the Sikhs in our Gurus times behave like this? Did they like shower and anoint themselves with nice smelling perfuems before they met the Sikh Gurus? Did the Gurus get angry or refuse to meet a desciple who was unclean?

No, but if you have the means to do so, should you not do it anyway? Are you going to stop having baths and washing your hair just to prove your point when going to the Gurudwara, when you know out of respect of your Guru you should go to do Darshan after cleaning yourself? That is if you consider Guru Granth Sahib Ji as your Guru, doesn't seem so after reading the drivel you've just posted.

You mean to say the Guru feels cold during the winter and hot during summer? Should we also place a heater and AC beside the SGGS?

Did you not READ my post, or were you just hoping to pick out things you could attack with your sarcastic remarks? God doesn't need us, and the Guru doesn't need our Sewa, we need to do the utmost, bearing in mind we have more technology and resources to do better Sewa, so WE achieve something. Compare it to the example of the piece of land which doesn't need anything, but to produce crops you must work hard at looking after it and cultivate it! Do you ever read other people's posts?

Who makes or made these rules? Were these rules prescribed by our earlier Gurus? Maybe there is some sort of Hukam?

Who made the rules for you to wear clothes and not prance around naked? It's self respect, and the 'rules' you say WE made up are made to maintain the RESPECT of our Guru Ji.

Serving with full 'prem' to the point one's actions is similar to a mentally deranged person? How is this different from those Hindus who pour milk and honey over Lord Shivas statue when they pray to it?

The Lingam is a stone. The Guru Granth Sahib contains the BANI of the Guru's, the word of God, that is the difference.

Excuse me but isn't Sikhism AGAINST idol worship and silly rituals? Didn't Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself proclaim that he is an 'idol breaker'? Are you advocating that we should pray to a stone? BTW in supporting your argument, you should stop referencing to Bhai Gurdas or any other Baba or Bhai. They may be respected Sikhs but they are not a Guru thus they are NO authority on Sikhism.

Do you read anything about Sikh History? Bhai Gurdas Ji's Varan were considered the 'KEY' to the Guru Granth Sahib Ji by our GURU. Is that not enough evidence for you? You have some serious reading to do mate. Well, the Punj Pyarey are not 'the Guru' in your definition, so should we disregard their Hukam at the Amrit Sanchaars?

This is merely your opinion which if you ask me is not much.So we should spend 24/7 preparing food for SGGS?

Do you realise people do Langar Di Sewa almost 24 hours at Guru Ghars even today? Did you know Bhai Nand Lal Ji (Scholar) spent so many years washing dirty dishes in the Langar during Guru Gobind Singh Ji's time? Does it not befit your great character to do any Sewa Mr Jamuka?

Ahem...excuse me but the last time I checked this was a forum for discussions on Sikhism. Who are you to judge who is narrow minded and who is not? Who made you judge?

Ever moderator judges whether a post is full of any intelligence or mere sarcasm and baseless attacks without sources.

Wrong. Guru Nanak and the other Gurus NEVER advocated that Sikhs should be 'worshipping' the SGGS. Where does it state that Sikhs must worship the SGGS? I challenge you to prove me wrong. Your statement is ludicrous. Nobody even 'worshipped' any of the living Gurus and now you are advocating that Sikhs should worship the SGGS.

Depends on your definition of worship mate. You seem to think its only pouring milk over Lingams and empty rituals devoid of love. Worship can be many things, it can be bowing to Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Do you not bow to your Guru? That is a form of worship. You can't challenge me when you do not even have the correct definition.

Babaji was not Guru so whatever he said means zilch to all Sikhs. He may have been a respected figure but when did he become an authority on Sikhism?

Oh, and I supposed you have no ego at all, so we should consider you are? The way you're going on, it seems as if you have it all figured out. It means zilch to you, because you're brain is clouded by anger and sarcasm. Remove that veil and try to understand what being respectful and open minded is.

Hell yeah!! Who is he? Who appointed him ad hoc Guru?

First I've heard of anyone appointing him Guru, maybe you did? Question all you like, I've yet to read what the questions are exactly.

Excuse me but shoudn't a moderator remain impartial?

Does impartiality include allowing you to say whatever you want about Sikhs worshipping their Guru out of respect and allow you to consider Bhai Gurdas as just a 'Baba' without any say in Sikhism? I think not.

You are sure as hell acting like one.

You're acting like a spoilt little child.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news to you but it has happened in this forum before (not by you) and if you ask me the behaviour of that moderator was quite disgraceful.

Well if you haven't got the guts to name the person and explain how it was not justified to lock that topic, then you are just as bad us really.

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Baba nand singh ji maharaj who did pratak darshan of guroo nanak sahib nirankar. He did pratak darshan because he had sharda towards guroo maharaj ji thast why he got pratak darshan. Guroo ji was soo happy with baba ji service. That guroo nanak sahib ji used to come to baba ji every day until baba ji last breath because his prem bhagats used to prepare food for him.

I think thats a only difference between we (who love critisize shardha, tryin to make everything logical to fit into their western minded thinking) and Baba Nand singh maharaj who did pratak darshan of guroo nanak sahib nirankar???

If we cant learn from the people who got prabhu praptri (Darshan of guroo maharaj ji) then we cant learn from anyone.. just keep bringing.. me think this. me think that.. and spent rest of your life saying "me" "me" thats my beleif... and die with the ego and i m sure true purpose of your life will be fullfilled.

Take care.

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Mr Singh Veer Ji, apologies if I offended you, forgive your sister :(

Harpreet - check yours.

You can't ask me for an apology, I'm ur lil bro,

Bhull ho gei :oops:

Baba nand singh ji maharaj who did pratak darshan of guroo nanak sahib nirankar. He did pratak darshan because he had sharda towards guroo maharaj ji thast why he got pratak darshan. Guroo ji was soo happy with baba ji service. That guroo nanak sahib ji used to come to baba ji every day until baba ji last breath because his prem bhagats used to prepare food for him.

I have a question regarding 'Partakh Darshan'

I get for some reason very offended when people Say ' I had partakh darshan of Guru Gobind SIngh jee'

May I ask Is Guru Granth Sahib jee not our Guru today :shock: ?

I onceheard in prof Darshan Singh jee's Katha where he said

'If Guru Gobind SIngh jee would Give me darshan I would NOT bow, why?

Because he has giving GURGADDI TO GURU GRANTH SAHIB JEE MAHARAJ

he is our GURU. MY GURU. YOUR GURU.!

Whats the necessty of partakh Darshan?

want to speak to the Guru?

take Hukam

I am very hurt

and Im sorry if I've offended anyone, as my intention is in NO WAY to slander anyone

bhull chukk maaf

GurFateh

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