DSG

Fantastic stuff , looked at Dr Gurnam Singhs Sikh Musicology , its even got the raags , the shabads and the notations , superb!!

I dont see it as a problem , but if it is claimed that all the content of Dasam Granth is by Sri Guru Gobind Singh ji , and the shortfalls highlighted as explained in the authors booklet that it isnt , I think thats what the author is trying to put across , especially when he highlights the episodes regarding the explicit male/female relationship , openly use of Bhang and many more .

In my opinion if the authors research and comments are valid , and he states that the Dasam Granth is a mixture of several books and compiled into one in 1897. With the explicit description of male/female relationships , description of openly using of Bhang I find it hard to believe its the writing of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji . May be its my limited understanding and in order to understand its true meaning one needs to be at a certain level of Gian / Spirituality, but as a novice reading the authors comment about not all of Dasam Granth is written by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji , the detail expressed , to be honest its shocking to read.

Hi GSSB Fantastic idea , I think it would be good to have a story written about Sri Guru gobind Singh Ji , especially one that is flowing , can capture the persons mindset so that he/she can envisage the scene being described . I think this would be inspirational , motivational and yet at the same time it will be the truth. When I listen to some katha , take Bhai Sahib Pinderpals Chamkaur the Gauri katha , its fantastic how he captures the detail where one can envisage what he is saying , obviously there is an element of expanding the scene , making up certain dialogue according to their understanding in order to capture the audience, but the overall goal is to inspire,motivate the sangat without actually losing its authenticity. Now doing the same in a Novel , i think would be really good and I would read it. I think it would be great for kids , as my personal experience when reading bed time stories by Santokh Singh Jagdev , they are great as a starter , but I think need expanding as kids ask some many questions and having a Novel which would have a beginning a middle and an end would be fantastic.

Wahe Guru Ji Ka Khalsa Wahe Guru Ji Ke Fateh Piaree sangat Ji ,I came across a booklet which explains ALL OF THE DASAM GRANTH IS NOT SIRI GURU GOBIND SINGH JI's The booklet ( English part of it) has been scanned and attached to this thread . May be N3O can ask Giani Sher Singh Ji I know this topic is a bit of a delicate subject , any thoughts authenticity of the authors findings dgscan0001.pdf dgscan20001.pdf

I dont think any protest is a waste of time. In india as mentioned , its very corrupt. If someone stands up for thier rights they are put down , arrested , tortured , so for the sake of this people back in India dont want the "hassle" of them their parents being wrongly tortured just becuase they speak up. (NO JUSTICE ) I think the main problem is that all the attrocities happening in India are not being portrayed across the globe . This is where we are lacking , how do we get all the media involved , so that these things can be highlighted. if it costs then lets pay ( we pay for Nagar Kirtans , more are being done this year its not cheap). I think the people in punjab need to be educated especially in the pends the most vunerable. Their mentality needs to be changed at the moment its , how can i make a quick buck from you , or rip you off , so my pockets full. I think each gurudaware in the pend should have a computer server which can access a central location which information from anywhere around the world can be uploaded to. Any news good or bad , fed to each Gurudaware then the Gianis responsibility or even sangats ( choose some sikhs which will not be sold easily) they then educate the sangat as what is the truth. My parents went to india ( jandiala) , when protests were happening in the UK re Prof Bhullar , in that pend , they were not aware what was happening at all. If you look at the program on BBC2 where people from the UK go and do the same job abroad e.g. last week it was a binman from london going to thailand ( i think) doing the same job ,, cut a long story short , the guy from the uk made a difference the government bucked up their idea and gave the binmen a proper cart for carrying rubbish , stopped people dumping waste .., the point being if we all knock on the door be wherever you are i think it will make a difference forcing the government to make a change whether they like it or not.

http://www.panthic.org/articles/5500 Very bad indeed , no media coverage , no protests nothing Can we not put something on youtube?

Waheguru ji ka khalsa Waheguru ji ke fateh Do we need nagar kirtans ? ( this year i've seen announced ( especially in the uk). Nagar kirtan in slough , southhall, wolverhampton,leeds,illford,walsall,telford Views please .

Reading ( dont laugh) Bed time stories ( Guru Arjan Dev ji) Bed time stories ( Guru Tegh Bahadar ji) by Santokh Singh Jagdev Problem I have is I cant find any books ( in English) which have "flow" about them when reading especially sikh Sakhis , ( dont know if you know of any good ones) ...they seem to start off good but then break up the flow , trying to capture the scene all goes away hence dont want to carry on reading,

Piaree Sadh Sangat Ji WAHE GURU JI KA KHALSA WAHE GURU JI KE FATEH Waheguru has blessed us with a little bit of seva , which we would like to share with the sangat. SIKHAID charity help out people in the poorest areas around the World It is run 100% by volunteers form all back grounds , all funds raised are used 100% for the cause , some volunteers forsee the camps and spend their own money for flights and accommodation. World health organisation say :- there are approximately 39 million blind people in the World This will increase to approx 79 million if not checked 90% of the problems are in developing countries 80% can be cured/prevented SikhAID setup camps , recent venture was last November /December where a volunteer foresaw the camp , approx 500 people were screened , 119 referred for cateract operation. Along side the eye camp , Dental camps are run ( started in 2010) again by volunteers who have shipped over the equipment , some young kids have not even seen a tooth brush. Also mental health and well being workshops are being setup , last year a conference was held with NHS ( Nationla Health Service) explaining to them especially in the asian,punjabi,Sikh community theres no help availble , for example any domestic issues in the househeld our elders tell us to sweep under the carpet or tell us it will be ok ,overtime this builds up and eventually explodes and causes all sorts of mental & health problems. We are asking for help off the NHS , setup camps in Gurudawaras, visit homes etc... so that sangat and tell somebody and seek help/guidance Much much more can be done .. Piaree Sadh Sangat , lets make people aware , the more awareness the more help can be provided. Seva can be in many forms , some will donate, some will do physical seva , some inform others etc.. any which way we can please help On new years eve , SikhAid volunteers setup a stall at GuruNanak Gurudawara smethwick high street ,and Dhesmesh Gurudawara Lozells ..... The main point was making the sangat aware so that could make others aware . Some much piare(love) was shown by the sangat it was unbeliveable , all wahegurus going. SikhAid are holding a classical music charity event in Birmingham Adrian Boult hall on Saturday 16th Februray 2013 start 6pm . All money raised will go the the causes .. If you can come along please do so ( if you require tickets , please let me know cost of one eye operation is about £20 , ticket costs are £15 , £20 family of 4 £40 ( 6yrs-18yrs) , snack & drink is included) If you want to help out, donate , please send your email address / contact details , Please see poster and website below :- http://www.justgiving.com/Sikh-Aid-International-Appeal http://www.sikhaid.org/ https://www.facebook.com/sikhaidinternational Thank you

I dont think its a non issue , if we dont have any rules , regulations , standards to follow then I see different gurudawara ( probably are already) doing there own thing , and who ever likes it for some reason will follow that , hence creating their own following. If it started with A then got changed to A B then A B C then A B C D then A B C D E who knows where it wil end up . is it too ate ? is it worth it ? will it make any difference ? I think its not too late , and is worth setting standards and will make a difference for the next generation , as i have had young ask questions what is a maryada Gurudawaras should follow , ( i'm confused my self ) How should Gurudawaras follow rules and regulations ? What rehit/maryada should be folowed ?

FRom what i picked up and understood x amount of singhs to do japji sahib path x amount of singhs to fo Akhand Path x amount of sings as guards x amount of sings to top up/ight jot,tuuf x amount of singhs to do chor-e Whether its an issue , what maryada shoud we follow ? if one gurudawara is following one maryada , creating there own standards , another using there own , now recently 25 singhs , Shouldnt all gurudawaras follow one maryada ? hence if someone/family want to do akhand path , they have these options , causes confusion , causes break up of the panth I have seen maryada already defined as how akhand path shoud be done , bhog shoud be done , etc...

Wahe Guru Ji Ka Khalsa Wahe Guru Ji Ke Fateh I was watching the Sangat Channel , where there held a 25 Singh Akhand Path sahib . I'm not too sure how the 25 Singhs were involved , just caught the latter part , where an explanation was done about jot , toof , and water What are the Sangats views on 25 Singh Akhand Path ? Should all the Gurudawara , homes adopt this maryada ? Is it practical ? Is it splitting the panth ? Is it actually making sangat more aware ? In my opinion , the focus should be done more on explanation of Gurbani , making us understand , making the sangat participate ( obviously with showing as much respect as possible to Guru ji) Any htoughts ?

K-Kaur I went to Namdhari temple in Birmingham to learn the Dilruba on Thursdays for a while , the teacher then was Gurch , who vocally was very good , and in the same class taught the Vaja and dilruba , his brother the tabla , it was a one to one kind of lesson , so if you go be prepared to wait for your turn I thought he was good in the sense he could teach , theres a lot of very good players but cant teach , ..... he will teach you the basics , how to sit , bow properly , arch your hand etc... ( which alot of teachers dont tell you ) .... then practice your basics , make it your foundation , when going to the lessons , show what you have learnt , then he will fine tune your technique ............ in that sense i thouhgt he was very good .. ( These Lessons were free then ( approx 2years ago now , i assume they still are) Harjinder SIngh Lallie teaches on Sunday Mornings( 7am-8:30am) at a school in Birmingham near Birmingham University He is very organised and structured , dont know much about his teaching techniques Ranbir Singh ( shocked to hear the news ) , practically was very good , made you practice non stop , techniques wise didnt tell me much , just told me to keep playing so didnt know whether holding of the bow , arm movement etc was correct or whether i was adopting a bad habit ,,,, but overall in his lessons you felt you had a good workout . There was ( dont know if there still is) in Namdhari Temple ( Gurmukh) was organising a Dilruba class ( there was a fee for this , but not much ) Hope this helps , if you need their numbers / emails let me know i'll try to dig them out ...( send me a personal message )

I think this is a difficult one to tackle , if its the path the Granthi has chosen , then he/she needs money to make meets end and should be paid a reasonable wage , BUT then does it only become a job for them , do their duties 9-5 /whatever and then signoff , as i believe doing seva. paid/unpaid at a place of worship is a very big responsibility , you have to have the passion to improve , educate by means of dialogue with the sangat .

Hang in there bro , Waheguru will definitely help you , have faith , listen to this beautiful shabad ...., We all have our ups and downs , we have to be strong , remember waheguru , talk to waheguru in whatever way form you want , Waheguru will definitely help you , if listening to Gurbani can cure cancer , i'm ceratin waheguru will help your cause . Everytime you start feeling down or have doubts listen to Kirtan , listen to the shabad attached below . Tu mera rakha sabni thai Ta bho keha kara jiyo You are my Protector at every place then why should I have any fear? Tumari kirpa te tudh pachana Tu meri ot tu hai mera mana By Your Grace, I have realized You. You are my support, You are my honour

In the article it mentions a sikh wearing a kirpan , ohers might take it of the person and use ....... so the problem is not a Sikh wearing the Kirpan , the problem is others who will first attack the sikh , to take away the Kirpan and use it ............ so who should be banned ?

Beautiful shabad , i think explains it Tu mera rakha sabni thai Ta bho keha kara jiyo You are my Protector at every place then why should I have any fear? Tumari kirpa te tudh pachana Tu meri ot tu hai mera mana By Your Grace, I have realized You. You are my support, You are my honour

Let me add this is my view re jatka may be wrong may be right , only wahegur knows , Amritdahri Sikh gets up in the morning has a bath/shower does nit nem goes to the gurudawara does seva helps the needy, community learns bani learns Kirtan THEN he says oooh i need some meat man , let me get jhatka meat hmmmmmmmmm It dont make sense at all , I believe doing nit nem , seva etc.. your mind will automatically tell you , i dont need that stuff , will put you off meat eating We then start comparing ourselves to our Gurus ,( they did that they did this ) which again i think is wrong , we cant even contemplate / compare ourselves to the guru period.

Theres someone i know had a similar experience in the sense they were told they won £250,000 and they needed a deposit of £300 before they could release the money . After a lengthy conversation , they person they called told them to deduct the £300 from their winnings and post the cheque with the remaining amount .

I think the biggest problem is , our so called leaders be them politicians , SGPC leaders or whoever in India are not supporting the Sikhs one bit , because 1. If you look at prisonerwelfare.com site , where the young who are standing up , going to rallies to stop the Dera wallies , Police target them , arrest them for no reason , punish /torture them , put them in jail , charge them on false grounds etc...... these people have no backing of any leaders in India , so are kept in prison for X amount of years , and if any stands up for them , they are also put through the same cycle of punishment .... therefore the Dera Wallies can do whatever they want and get away with their actions . 2. News againt Sikhs/Sikhism is not shown on local channels in India so public are unaware of any injustices to the Sikh people , if someone trys to , the channel is closed down. I think we need to be smart , use the system , together knock on the Prime ministers door in masses , to get a law passed that anyone or thing doing beadi bi of Sr Guru Granth Sahib Ji , should result in Maharaj ji's saroop taken away from the place ( if this is done , you can guarantee the dera will have no foundation to stand on or preach and will fizzle away )... When rallying people in India need to have media present , which can be shown on air in all countries via you tube or other means . SGPC will not act , we need to educate the sangat , all media in UK join forces run under one umberella and start preaching , as Punjabi Radio already has a presence in Punjabi ,Sikh Channel has a presence in Punjab also( sadly footages can only be shown on the Sikh Channel in the UK , but its better than nothing) Educate the sangat , give aid to the needy , get them back on track so that they only follow Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji I know its easy for me to write these few words , but in reality only the people in India can guide us , help us understand what steps we should take , how people have tried and now are in Jail waiting for trial , how Police arrest the young and innocent, no one is listening , therefore only option they have left to lead a peacful life is keep quiet , go with the masses sadly in todays era is the dera Wallies .

Viewing the central news link , its coming across as if the protestors blatently attacked the Gurudwara and that the protestors were not willing to sit down and discuss the resolution with the other party. Was that the case ? How come , its always the protestors that get bad name ? I remember the Bezti play at rep theatre in birmigham , with similar outcome . Why dont the protestors have an interview with the media explaining what issues are ? Any one else attended the protest , and care to sched any light on what happened ? If it is the same minority of people stirring up trouble , should the sangat not be made aware ? The protestors intentions are good , but somehow in the eyes of the media , they are to blame ? especially in the forth coming events i.e. 5th june , if the turnout is 125,000 what steps are in place to inform the sangat that it MUST be a peacful demonstration so as not to give the Sikhs a bad name , yet again .

http://wahegurusimran.org/?p=986

Remove sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji from this "so Called Gurudawara" and see how long they will last ..... problem solved

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itkWd1JTUmw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNA-kYIxGoM&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLAsP-5tp60&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rq94Riv2Hrs&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo9ybJNiQdw&feature=related