Katha From Malton Gurdwara

[samosasingh]

Dear Friends,

I have been following the katha coming from Malton Gurdwara on ATN of Nanak Parkash by Giani Ranjit Singh.

The katha is very inspiring and we learn a lot about Guru jee's life and times and it motivates us to try and change ourselves. I am trying to change myself and further understand Sikhi, but I find when I have questions, who am I to discuss it with? So I thought of asking you to help me sort out an issue (shankaa) I have about:

Giani jee seems to be concentrating at this point on if you do simran have faith you will be cured of your wordly problems. He also goes on to give a few stories of people who have called him and told him there own experiences of faith in Guru and there problems have been solved. For ex someone who was cured by cancer, another was stopped from commiting suicide, others have gained wealth and prosperity, etc, etc

The thing is should this type of "simran for personal gain" be propogated? There are equal number of people who have also done simran/paat for a certain cause and they haven't achieved it (I am one of them and I know many others who are in the same boat). When we propogate "Karaj Siddhi" from simran and then don't end up achieving that certain thing it leads to a severe loss in faith and in gurbani. I have experienced this loss of faith at times and now doubt whenever someone says simran cures worldy problems as it didn't work for me and lead to more frustration.

In one story of a person in calgary then had Guru jee prakash in the home and they couldn't have a child. The lady became depressed and tied a rope around her neck to committ suicide, she said if you are the true Guru then give me a child or I will take my life. She then felt someone forciblt remove the rope from her neck and then had a child exactly 9 months after this incident. I know of another family who have the same child issue and have done many paaths and have Guru prakash at home, but have had 2 misccarriages, and are on the verge of loosing faith totally. Why does this faith work for some and not for others?

Also how do we know that what we are asking for is the right thing? We may ask for something we want, but it may not be the right thing, we get all motivated that simran cures all problems and do simran, then we don't achieve that certain thing and a loss of faith starts to set in or you do get the thing but it comes with such hardship that you are left shattered. Who is there to give advice to us before we make our decisions? I don't get how Gurbani helps you in this way.

I am having trouble moving beyong this point in my thinking, could you pls provide some guidance, maybe I am not seeing this from the right angle.

[Mithar]

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Edited June 21, 2011 by Mithar

[samosasingh]

The thing is, is that nobody gives any guidelines while doing katha. So for an everyday person you just assume if you do simran with faith it will solve the problem. Why is it that these kathakaars don't give you the full picture? It becomes very difficult to know all of the small details.

[Xylitol]

my understanding is doing simran cuts down the karam that causes the problem in the first place. but if the paap karam is huge, it would take a lot longer to fix, and so people lose faith b/c they lose patience.

[Mithar]

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Edited June 21, 2011 by Mithar

[Mithar]

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Edited June 21, 2011 by Mithar

[dalsingh101]

I find the concept of spirituality/religiosity leading to the fulfillment of worldly/material desires strange. I know people can cite x, y and z to prove this is okay in our faith but even then.

In Japji Sahib we read 'Hukam rajai chalna Nanak likaya naal', then what we seem to have is people who are unable accept what this hukam has dealt them, who then try and use bani in a way I think is very similar to how people use talismans to achieve specific objectives or changed circumstances. It is classic religion. Like praying to the sky to get rain for your crops. Going further, this belief that religion can effect material outcomes is what is frequently behind Panjabis running after flannah timka dehra baba who promises prosperity or sons/children.

It just seems very slippery.

More so when we view our itihaas and see, far from the easy life, Sikhs of old endured unbelievable pressure and horrific circumstances as a result of adhering closely to the faith.

What is even more striking is how often you see people who seem humble and decent and appear to follow the faith - blatantly have hard times. Then you get people who get up to all manner of things considered wrong according to the faith, who seem to have a never ending streak of luck. Life's funny like that. lol

Edited May 21, 2011 by dalsingh101

[Xylitol]

giani thakur singh ji once mentioned in his katha that (sometimes) when God wants to bring someone near, they often suffer dukh, and when someone is janam is going to go to waste, when they are going to remain faar from God, they often have great sukh!